Disturbing financial statistics

[disneysteve]

Wow. So many replies while we were out spending money - LOL! Seriously, we went to an outlet center near our house and picked up some bargains on clearance and a produce market where prices are about 40% less than the supermarket where we stocked up on fruits and veggies for the week.

Mrs. Pete - Other than the fact that my folks only had 2 kids, you described my late 60's, early 70's childhood as well. Funny how similar they all were.

DisFlan - I agree that everything is relative. I'm also in the "top 5th income percentile" but you'd never know it by looking at how we live. Compare us to my peers making similar incomes and you'd think we were the disadvantaged ones. We've chosen to live at this level and put our money into savings and charitable giving just like you guys. By the way, the median income in the town where I work (not the town where we live) is $23,421, so I see those struggles too.

crisi- I grew up with a similar situation. My dad was a self-employed accountant. No employer-provided health insurance. No pension plan. He paid it all and had to make his own way for retirement. He died in '92 but left my mom in good shape. She has not had to go to work and has been able to continue a comfortable but thrifty lifestyle.

HaleyB - I think we are on the same page with everything.

imsayin - I had to laugh when I read your post about turning down the phone upgrade. We've done the same thing many times. When we were finally forced to upgrade our phones last year for technical reasons, my only question of the clerk was, "Which phones are free with our service?" We had 2 or 3 to pick from and chose from those. We never even considered anything that we'd have to pay for. So we don't have a camera or Internet access or MP3 players. But we can make and receive calls just fine.

Do you know that worldwide people spent $4 BILLION just on downloadable ringtones last year? Talk about a disturbing statistic. Imagine what good work that $4 billion could have done elsewhere.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

When we were finally forced to upgrade our phones last year for technical reasons, my only question of the clerk was, "Which phones are free with our service?" We had 2 or 3 to pick from and chose from those. We never even considered anything that we'd have to pay for. So we don't have a camera or Internet access or MP3 players. But we can make and receive calls just fine.

I do this too. Hubby got a new service for us (we have since switched to our old service). Both times he wants me to go look at phones. Orur conversation goes something like this:

"can it call people and can people call me?"

"Yeah--but it does all this other cool stuff, too."

"Okay---but if I dial a phone number, will it call someone?"

"Yes--but this phone also takes pictures"

"Okay--does your phone?"

"No"

"Okay, then I don't need that option."

"Okay, how about this phone then".

"Does it call people and can people call me".

This goes on and on.

I don't know what a blackberry is, I don't really want to know what a blackberry is.

All i know is my phone does indeed call people and people can call me. And supposedly I can send text messages too--however I sent one to the wrong person today (meant for hubby) and then sent him a blank one. I think I'll stick to calling people for a chat.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Do you know that worldwide people spent $4 BILLION just on downloadable ringtones last year? Talk about a disturbing statistic. Imagine what good work that $4 billion could have done elsewhere.

They pay for this?

Doesn't the phone come with ringtones?

 

[dvcgirl]

They pay for this?

Doesn't the phone come with ringtones?

lol...yep, but people actually pay for the latest and greatest ringtones...songs, stuff like that.

 

[DMRick]

When we were finally forced to upgrade our phones last year for technical reasons, my only question of the clerk was, "Which phones are free with our service?" We had 2 or 3 to pick from and chose from those.

I've got the same phone I got many years ago. The only ring choices are loud and not loud, and vibrate LOL. I haven't had a phone contract in 4 years. I am due, but last time I went it, I was a wreck, just looking at the phones. I want a flip phone that does nothing, but they are hard to find. Everyone they showed us, did text, downloaded ringers and games and took lousy pictures. The guy finally wandered away from us, and we wandered out the door! Grands will be a simple phone (although it will do text), and I hate even looking for one for her.

 

[dvcgirl]

I'm guilty. I'm getting a cellphone for my soon to be 13 year old granddaughter. I'm paying for the phone and the first card. I think this will be a real eye opener for her, because I could just add her to my phone, but then she'll have no sense of cost/responsibility. So I think she'll be asking for lots of phone cards for her birthday and other occasions, unless she quickly figures out that the phone hanging on the wall is a much better thing, than all her money going for cell calls. I suspect it won't be long, til the phone is set aside, and maybe used just for emergencies.

Part of me understands this. If we had young teens I'd probably succumb to buying the child a cell phone for safety purposes, and so I could always check up on them

Good idea not adding her to your plan...teens can talk....a whole lot .

 

[crazelion]

But here's the thing....somewhere in this conversation you'd have to ask....why do they stay in those jobs? I understand that there are only a certain amount of jobs in the country and not everyone can be the CEO of a corporation. But for example, I don't really think many people go into Walmart looking for a cashier's job expecting to support a family. If they are, well, they're going to come up far short.

Also, let's face it, there are lots and lots of people who aren't motivated, aren't "go-getters", whatever you want to call it. They'd rather stay in a job and complain because it's the easier of the options in front of them. There are so many opportunities out there for all of us...to go to school, to improve ourselves and make a better life for ourselves and our families. Even if you decide not to go to college or for some sort of skills training, well, there's just plain hard work. Get into a company and work your way up. If you can't go any further without that degree and you'd like to move up....go to school. And some people simply don't want to put in the work it takes to make that better life.

I hate break this to you dvcgirl but I have a college degree and would not have dream I would be working 3 part time jobs because I can't get full time job.

Just because someone works for that amount money does mean they uneducation don't have skills. I have plenty of skills just getting someone to hire me is the problem. I have sent resumes and cover letters the last 3 years yet to get a full time job.

4 years of Food Service management experince

10 years of retail experince

Degree Information systems End- User Support unmovitate my foot. I work hard for my money run circles around my co-workers.

 

[dvcgirl]

I hate break this to you dvcgirl but I have a college degree and would not have dream I would be working 3 part time jobs because I can't get full time job.

Just because someone works for that amount money does mean they uneducation don't have skills. I have plenty of skills just getting someone to hire me is the problem. I have sent resumes and cover letters the last 3 years yet to get a full time job.

4 years of Food Service management experince

10 years of retail experince

Degree Information systems End- User Support unmovitate my foot. I work hard for my money run circles around my co-workers.

What do you hate to break to me? I said that there are lots of people who are not motivated. Obviously you aren't one of those people. Best of luck finding a full time job.

 

[PrincessKitty1]

Just cause I used to do stats... Most people are not average. Usually, when talking sociologically (for things like "average income") we talk median. That means half the people are above the average and half are below - but that doesn't mean most sit at average. The number that happens most frequently is called the mode, but that is the most frequently occurring number, in most populations its a small part of the whole.

Not that I disagree with your point - the median family income in the U.S. is around $60,000. That means half of the people out there make less than $60,000, half make more. 20% make less than $18,500. 5% make more than $157,176,

Here is the quintiles, its really facinating - and honestly kind of scary:

http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032005/hhinc/new05_000.htm

Very interesting website! Where do you see that the median income is around $60,000? I'm seeing a figure of $44,389 for 2004.
http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032005/hhinc/new02_001.htm

 

[Julia M]

Part of me understands this. If we had young teens I'd probably succumb to buying the child a cell phone for safety purposes, and so I could always check up on them

Good idea not adding her to your plan...teens can talk....a whole lot .

We bought a third cell phone for the kids to use as needed. Oldest ds (13 1/2) rides his bike places....I like knowing he has it. Since I work, and my schedule can change, I like being able to touch base after school, if I'm running late for pick up, for example. But he's not the kind of kid to call friends and such.

Now dd on the other hand.....I'm sure she'll need a pay as you go phone, because I see her using it alot more. She'd love a cell phone now (in 5th grade) and she has at least two girls in her class that already have one. but I won't do it, not even a prepay one. It's not about the money.....I don't think it's appropriate. If I think she needs it, she can use our family extra one (the one her brother usually carries)

Julia

 

[Free4Life11]

Very interesting website! Where do you see that the median income is around $60,000? I'm seeing a figure of $44,389 for 2004.
http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032005/hhinc/new02_001.htm

Well the median income IS $44,389, but that's just the "middle" figure.

The mean (or average) income is $60,528.

Another figure is the GDP (Gross Domestic Product) Per Capita, which is around $44,000 for 2004.

 

[Temair]

If anyone wants to get out the same old rat race of never having any money. Check out dave ramsey and his latest book "Total Money Makeover". He has a website. What he talks about is just common sense that no one follows anymore. We paid off over $10,000 in debt, Saved up a $10,000 EF, and saved $5000 for our Disney Vacation. All this in less than 6 months. We are going paid for including dining plan and $1000 cash for spending.

 

[DisFlan]

I've got the same phone I got many years ago. The only ring choices are loud and not loud, and vibrate LOL.

You sound like me! I've kept my old, klunky analog phone with a $15 a month charge for service. No contract - if I use it, I pay for it. I rarely use it. It's mostly just for emergencies on the road. It has two options - on and off. I have a choice of one "ringtone". My son and his wife rib me about it constantly. But I love the low cost! I'll hang on to it as long as I can - or until the cell gods finally nuke analog service.

DisFlan

 

[rigs32]

We paid off over $10,000 in debt, Saved up a $10,000 EF, and saved $5000 for our Disney Vacation. All this in less than 6 months. We are going paid for including dining plan and $1000 cash for spending.

Yes, but that's $25k in six months over and above your basic expenses. A lot of people only have that amount per YEAR to pay for everything.

 

[disneysteve]

Yes, but that's $25k in six months over and above your basic expenses. A lot of people only have that amount per YEAR to pay for everything.

So? The fact is that Temair previously probably would have spent that 25K elsewhere. I'm sure it took some significant lifestyle changes to accomplish that turn-around. It certainly wouldn't work to that degree for someone making a lot less, but then someone earning a lot less doesn't need a 10K EF and probably wouldn't/shouldn't be spending 5K on a Disney vacation.

Temair - I think its great that you turned things around like that, and especially that you were able to do it so quickly. Sounds like that light bulb really went off brightly for you when you saw how you were handling your money before vs. how you could be handling it.

rigs32 - Don't forget that debt isn't just a problem for low wage earners. As my OP points out on this thread, one third of workers earning over 75K/year live paycheck to paycheck. Debt problems affect people in all income brackets. I think anyone who manages to get themselves out of debt deserves a pat on the back.

 

[staceyfe]

Now dd on the other hand.....I'm sure she'll need a pay as you go phone, because I see her using it alot more. She'd love a cell phone now (in 5th grade) and she has at least two girls in her class that already have one. but I won't do it, not even a prepay one. It's not about the money.....I don't think it's appropriate. If I think she needs it, she can use our family extra one (the one her brother usually carries)

Julia

ITA with the next to the last sentence here. My DS9 is already asking for a cell phone, probably because he sees other kids with one. If I give it to him (which I absolutely will not) what would that be teaching him? Just what this thread has been discussing: The "keep up with the Jones' syndrome". No, I think it's extremely important to teach kids that there's more to life than material possessions. It's what's gotton so many people into financial trouble. Like what Steve said, think what that $4 Billion spent on ringtones could have done if spent on something else?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

You sound like me! I've kept my old, klunky analog phone with a $15 a month charge for service. No contract - if I use it, I pay for it. I rarely use it. It's mostly just for emergencies on the road. It has two options - on and off. I have a choice of one "ringtone". My son and his wife rib me about it constantly. But I love the low cost! I'll hang on to it as long as I can - or until the cell gods finally nuke analog service.

DisFlan

I wish on and off were the only choices.

My hint on what the easiest phone currently on the market if you need a new one--whatever they are offering free when you are due for a new contract.....if I need a new phone that is (the last one made it to the washing machine--and did recover...but never quite the same. I was quite content with keeping it forever). Usually those are the lowest of what they offer--but they are still cadillacs to me. Although--I just stick to the geo metro features.

 

[PrincessKitty]

Well the median income IS $44,389, but that's just the "middle" figure.

The mean (or average) income is $60,528.

Another figure is the GDP (Gross Domestic Product) Per Capita, which is around $44,000 for 2004.

Thanks--I missed the line on the webpage on the mean--but Crisi's point (if I'm not mistaken) was that the MEDIAN tends to give a more accurate picture of the population.

 

[DMRick]

No, I think it's extremely important to teach kids that there's more to life than material possessions. It's what's gotton so many people into financial trouble. Like what Steve said, think what that $4 Billion spent on ringtones could have done if spent on something else?

Shucks, I'm giving it to her because it'll be fun for her. I love to buy the kids (with parents permission) stuff they would not get from their parents. I suspect it will also be a learning tool..those calls can get mighty expensive...she'll be learning young to make decisions..phone calls, or that cool sweater?

 

[nbodyhome]

My phone fell into the toilet a few months back, and only vibrates - but I haven't replaced it yet. I don't like wasting money since I can still use it. I'd get a tracfone if I didn't need it for work.

I was thinking about my uncle, who raised 11 kids (he died in 1994). He taught them all about money, and they are now all doing well. He was very frugal, and would go to thrift stores and buy a bunch of clothes and bring them home, letting the kids take whatever fit for themselves. He also had 4 of my cousins buy a house together when in college, and they each took out their portion of the principal as they left the home (teaching them the value of money). The last cousin ended up staying there with his new wife (at the time). I would have loved to have a family where I learned about money, he was frugal but left my aunt plenty enough to live on, as well as a house worth a lot of money.