Disney's Price Increases are obscene....

[TLSnell1981]

And is Disney one of those businesses?

I hate to be the harbinger of doom, but if people are so against capitalism and free enterprise, the US is certainly the wrong place to be living.

Anti capitalism...not at all. But, decline in quality, less service (and pride), and higher prices... DEFINITELY! Unfortunately, that's what gives capitalism a bad name.

Alas, fee schedules insure, that everyone charges the same price, regardless of the quality of service...not a good thing either.

There should be a balance. Disney gets away with it and they do. Too bad..IMHO

 

[TLSnell1981]

Please tell us how the dollar is not shrinking. Current inflation data shows an approximate 3% inflation rate. In the past 5 years the cumulative inflation rate is approx. 13%.

I did not say there was no inflation. A 2-3% annual rate of inflation is normal in a relatively stable economy. I said that the dollar is not weak relative to other currencies, which it isn't. It's quite strong at the moment.

Not strong, just not as weak... And, that is only a small part of the bigger picture.

 

[WDSearcher]

The point you are missing is that it is not about " having our cake and eating it too". It is about a question of value. Many of us, maybe not all but many, would not be complaining if the value was still the same. IF the parks kept up maintenance, if rides weren't down and I'm not talking scheduled refurbs, if they weren't cutting length and creativity of parades and firework shows (think DHS and Illuminations), if the food quality wasn't hit and miss while prices increase, if there were still as many characters and photographers and "magical" extras, if you could count on a clean and well kept room, if you could have some of the specialties and variety back in the Concierge lounges, if the fast pass lines weren't so variable (presuming this is temporary though), and so on so forth then I would happily pay an increase. I may even be willing to shell out more if the value and quality were there and consistent. What takes the "magic" out of it for some of us is experiencing a trip full of the above issues all the while being asked to pay more for less.

And yet ... it is 11 months, 2 weeks and 6 days until your next WDW vacation.

 

[WDSearcher]

I hate to break it to you, but you aren't OWED a pay raise just because your cost of living has gone up.

Thank you for that.

I'm a Disney CM too, and I'd love a pay raise. I've had mine put on hold a few times because the union CMs get guaranteed raises, while those of us in non-union roles have to depend on income and earnings a little more. The fortunes of the Walt Disney Company do not rest solely on the backs of the theme parks -- a price increase at the parks is mostly to boost the bottom line for investors, not provide raises for CMs. If WE all get raises this year, it's far more likely to come from "The Avengers" than the parks.

 

[mill4023]

Yes - I actually budget for everything in my life...however....same passes this year will cost $330.00 MORE than the same APs last year.....That's quite a golf ball to swallow...

You make roughly $40,000 per month and you are really bothered by an additional $300 for this year's AP's?

Somehow I just don't think I'd be worried about a $300 difference if I made that much.

 

[North of Mouse]

Well, I wish we could have said the same thing. We walked all the way to Thunder Mountain only to find it closed 3 times, Space Mountain broke down on us once, we chose MK as the park to go to on our last day so my son could play the Sorcerers of MK game and wouldn't you know it was down (all morning!!). Due to the rain, not Disney's fault but frustrating, our Fantasmic show started and then was cancelled (after they told us in was just going to start late) and it seems like they could have offered us passes for the next night show after all that waiting, the Indiana Jones show we saw was missing the exciting exploding truck part, we waited an insanely long time to see Soarin and our seat was right next to a large spot on the screen, a belt broke at Blizzard Beach that brought up the toboggan rafts so those slides couldn't be used, one time the monorail stopped for a bit and it wouldn't have been so bad but the A/C wasn't working in our crowded car at the time. One of our rooms had a buzzing refrigerator and wasn't cleaned that well (the room not the refrigerator). We called about the refrigerator but on the second day just decided to unplug it. We had to get up early to get to the CL to get breakfast unless you were ok with a bagel since they didn't always replenish the croissants or other pastries, we had two nights (and I didn't hit everyone so not sure about others) where our CL apps were exactly the same, and we had one restaurant experience that was less than desirable and another that was so-so at best. I noticed more than one messy bathroom but it was late at night at the parks so maybe that is why. We would sometimes return to use a FP and there was a line to get into the FP line which appeared longer than the standby, however, we did learn that this was misleading but not until we walked away a few times... None of these things alone are showstoppers or ruined our trip but it is a little much in a one week trip and I guess i have a bit of sour grapes because of it (and these are just specific things that happened on top of the expected construction, rehabs, crowds, etc. but altogether they do really impact the "magic"). It is just sort of a bitter pill to swallow that now I also have to pay more for a childs AP as well as mine or for tickets for the family.

Now....we did still have an enjoyable trip and made some good memories. However, it doesn't mean there weren't issues and I do think value and expectations are changing overtime. Yes, we will go back, but maybe just once a year and/or we will also change the way we visit. I do hope the Disney I originally fell in love with comes back to life and that there is a focus on truly caring about the experience of all visitors and not just focusing on the new visitor and that they catch up on maintenance and construction.

OK, I have said more than enough, and will try to go back to being positive. However, right now when people ask about going I have a hard time saying "you really must go" and am instead saying "I would wait a year or two".

Wow, sorry you had such a less than enjoyable time - you need really bad I don't remember ever having a vacation where anything but minor issues occurred. As a pp said, I'm old enough to remember some things there that I wish would still be the same, but I just take it in stride. I also remember (as was also posted) when groceries were automatically taken to your car, windshields washed, oil checked, etc. plus a lot of other bonuses at different businesses that we took for granted then. But, I guess my point is that so many people hold Disney to a much higher standard. Everything is different than it used to be, a lot of it not for the better. Again, though, we started going to Disney when it was just the MK ('72) and there were very few options for dining, or anything else for that matter. We "grew" with Disney and have loved every vacation we've taken and all the improvements, additions, etc. that have been added. Yes, the prices are high, and keep going up, but so is everything else (example : fuel for cars, homes,etc.). We, personally, do not begrudge that, and no, we are not rich (far from it), but we are retired and have always used our $$'s conservatively, and invested even when we could have used the extra $$'s right then. I guess, after all this rambling, I don't quite understand the complaints about Disney (just include ALL other businesses,etc). A lot of younger people just do not remember ALL the services that have gone away and seem to focus on what Disney COULD be doing. I respect that, but we focus on what is there and how much pleasure and relaxation it brings us and don't listen to the negativity Hope everyone can have some good vacations there

 

[eliza61]

You make roughly $40,000 per month and you are really bothered by an additional $300 for this year's AP's?

Somehow I just don't think I'd be worried about a $300 difference if I made that much.

LOL. I just finished reading an article that said 80% of NBA ballplayers are broke 6 years after leaving the nba.

That's because they too don't worry about the "300" bucks that always add up to 300,000 bucks. remember the old saying how the grand canyon was created by a small river of water?

My salary is good but my wealth comes from me worrying about each and every dollar that comes into my grubby little hands. My parents had a saying "you're rich when you're money works for you, not when you work for your money". Since I work like a mule for my salary, whether my salary is 4 dollars a month, 40 bucks a month or 40K a month, I know where each dollar goes to.

You really think rich people don't track their money? that's also why lottery winners always have such a hard time maintaining their good fortune.

 

[TLSnell1981]

LOL. I just finished reading an article that said 80% of NBA ballplayers are broke 6 years after leaving the nba.

That's because they too don't worry about the "300" bucks that always add up to 300,000 bucks. remember the old saying how the grand canyon was created by a small river of water?

My salary is good but my wealth comes from me worrying about each and every dollar that comes into my grubby little hands. My parents had a saying "you're rich when you're money works for you, not when you work for your money". Since I work like a mule for my salary, whether my salary is 4 dollars a month, 40 bucks a month or 40K a month, I know where each dollar goes to.

You really think rich people don't track their money? that's also why lottery winners always have such a hard time maintaining their good fortune.

Excellent post!

 

[disney_bob]

My salary is good but my wealth comes from me worrying about each and every dollar that comes into my grubby little hands.

Sure, being mindful of your money is great... but at your income level it probably helps your wealth more that in one month your "grubby little hands" get 80% of what an average family gets in an entire year. "Good" is a bit of an understatement

 

[wbeem]

I'd offer that if Parks and Resorts have done well during the year, and are contributing to solid performance, that alone would justify a pay raise for the CMs at WDW.

When you own or are hired to run a business, you can make that decision. In Disney's case, the only people they owe are their shareholders. Bear in mind that the stock represents more than just parks and resorts. One line of business may be doing well, but also have to compensate for other lines that are suffering. All of that goes into the stock price - whether it seems fair or not.

Also, Disney isn't known for paying high wages. According to my friends who work there, it pays about industry average or BELOW. There are other perks, but salary is not the biggest draw to working for Disney.

 

[wbeem]

Those at the top get their pay raises and bonuses, even when their corporations don't make money. Even as they scale back on employees and make the workers double-up and triple-up on what their job duties used to be. Then there's the hidden pay reductions, like increased health insurance co-pays, reduced hours, less employer 401k contribution matching. I believe the working class is owed a pay increase. You Betcha!

Then you're quite mistaken. A job is worth what the market will bear. You could be a cashier at Disney and only be paid the going rate for cashiers as long as you hold that job. If you're there for 20 years doing the exact same job as someone fresh off the street, you haven't contributed any value that isn't easily replaced. Therefore, you aren't OWED a pay increase.

It's silly to think that the amount of time you've spent doing a job is worth more money just because you've hung around. If you want more pay, add more value.

 

[wbeem]

Thank you for that.

I'm a Disney CM too, and I'd love a pay raise. I've had mine put on hold a few times because the union CMs get guaranteed raises, while those of us in non-union roles have to depend on income and earnings a little more. The fortunes of the Walt Disney Company do not rest solely on the backs of the theme parks -- a price increase at the parks is mostly to boost the bottom line for investors, not provide raises for CMs. If WE all get raises this year, it's far more likely to come from "The Avengers" than the parks.

Exactly right! It's about value for the shareholders. Obviously, Disney can't provide that value in its parks if it can't attract employees due to low wages. However, as long as there is a fresh line of people willing to work at the wage offered, there isn't much incentive for Disney to increase the wages for existing park workers - unless those workers do something to increase their value.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

At least with WDW I can point to fantastic new offerings I get with price increases...new lands, new shows, new rides, new resorts, new restaurants etc.

I mean it is a fact that WDW has MORE entertainment now that at any point in it's history and those that say otherwise are just flat out wrong.

Compare that to other price increases I must swallow like Verizon raising my DVR box rental fee 10%... or Allstate rasing my homeowners insurance 20%... or gas prices rising 25%.... with zero change in service or product offered.

I could list out many more examples to make this point. Inflation sucks.

Blame Alan Greenspan and Ben Bernanke.

 

[mefordis]

If I made over half a million dollars a year, I wouldn't sweat it.

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2011/10/19/what-percent-are-you/

Being local to Orlando - I have kept Annual Passes for my family of 6 for at least 10-years. When visiting the parks, we spend a whole lot more - drinks, food, we somehow manage to buy merchandise on almost every occasion (go figure...)!

The price increases that I read about today are absolutely ludicrous. I enjoy Disney, but there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that the quality of the product has declined since the the early-90's pinnacle. The only thing you know for sure about next year at Disney is that you will pay more and get less (despite slick marketing to the contrary). Of course it's only my opinion, and we all have our own unique value equations, but for me it just doesn't add up. An 11.2% price increase this year AND they no longer offer CHILD 3-9 pricing??? Come on?!? DL in CA raising APs around 30%, and Jay (Disney CFO) suggesting a similar increase next year at WDW? The arrogance is astounding.

Could I afford 6 APs - you betcha! According to my IRS tax return, I guess I am blessed with an income that is greater than 99.2% of the US population, but again, from a value perspective, I think that Disney has surpassed the gouging level.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...-disney-california-adventure-park-price-hikes

Universal hear we come!

 

[mill4023]

LOL. I just finished reading an article that said 80% of NBA ballplayers are broke 6 years after leaving the nba.

That's because they too don't worry about the "300" bucks that always add up to 300,000 bucks. remember the old saying how the grand canyon was created by a small river of water?

My salary is good but my wealth comes from me worrying about each and every dollar that comes into my grubby little hands. My parents had a saying "you're rich when you're money works for you, not when you work for your money". Since I work like a mule for my salary, whether my salary is 4 dollars a month, 40 bucks a month or 40K a month, I know where each dollar goes to.

You really think rich people don't track their money? that's also why lottery winners always have such a hard time maintaining their good fortune.

I wasn't implying that rich people don't pay attention to where their money goes. But most people, rich or not, don't usually stress out about an annual expense increase that is equivalent to about 1 hour's pay.

And basketball players don't go broke from not worrying about the $300. They go broke from not worrying about the $5 million homes and $450k Ferraris.

 

[eliza61]

Sure, being mindful of your money is great... but at your income level it probably helps your wealth more that in one month your "grubby little hands" get 80% of what an average family gets in an entire year. "Good" is a bit of an understatement

The income level is moot. The fact is really simply. No matter what you make if you spend more than you earn, you are in fact broke. If I make a million dollars annually and then start pissing away money even if it's only 300 bucks at a time, then my income isn't the problem.

If not, how then would one keep what ever salary they make? KWIM. If you're broke in a mansion how is that possibly any better than being broke in a small house (see: Terrel Owens) except for you have more room? either way the bank is coming after you.

So once again, the way high wealth folks stay high income and keep their wealth is that the scrutinize every dollar for the value. at least the ones I know do, if their purchases don't match up with their sense of value no matter if it's 3 bucks over the line or 300 dollars over the line they don't purchase it.

NO matter what my income, I no longer stay at a deluxe unless it's with my dvc points. Deluxes imo are a rip off and at best are 3 stars, so yeah I'm definitely the type if that even if I made Oprah Winfreys salary you will not see me staying at the Grand floridian on a cash basis. that's a waste of my money and this gal tries very, very hard never to waste money. Especially when there is a Ritz Carlton in spitting distance.

 

[eliza61]

I wasn't implying that rich people don't pay attention to where their money goes. But most people, rich or not, don't usually stress out about an annual expense increase that is equivalent to about 1 hour's pay.And basketball players don't go broke from not worrying about the $300. They go broke from not worrying about the $5 million homes and $450k Ferraris.

They don't stress about the dollar amount but they most assurdly stress about whether or not the dollar amount is "worth" the product. So if the increase does not match the percieved value, you better believe there is some discussion over whether or not to buy that AP.

like I said above I know many wealthy people who will never stay at a Disney deluxe. they recognize that for the cash disney wants for the deluxes, it is a rip off.

But I don't know any uber rich, like I said anyone I know making a good salary works dog hard for it and scrutinize all their purchases. heck, they've been known to complain about the baggage fees because they feel it's a rip off.

 

[WDSearcher]

The income level is moot. The fact is really simply. No matter what you make if you spend more than you earn, you are in fact broke. If I make a million dollars annually and then start pissing away money even if it's only 300 bucks at a time, then my income isn't the problem.

If not, how then would one keep what ever salary they make? KWIM. If you're broke in a mansion how is that possibly any better than being broke in a small house (see: Terrel Owens) except for you have more room? either way the bank is coming after you.

So once again, the way high wealth folks stay high income and keep their wealth is that the scrutinize every dollar for the value. at least the ones I know do, if their purchases don't match up with their sense of value no matter if it's 3 bucks over the line or 300 dollars over the line they don't purchase it.

NO matter what my income, I no longer stay at a deluxe unless it's with my dvc points. Deluxes imo are a rip off and at best are 3 stars, so yeah I'm definitely the type if that even if I made Oprah Winfreys salary you will not see me staying at the Grand floridian on a cash basis. that's a waste of my money and this gal tries very, very hard never to waste money. Especially when there is a Ritz Carlton in spitting distance.

I would agree with this (the bolded, italiced part).

However ... to continue to use the OP as an example ... if the majority of his family preferred Universal over Disney anyway, there wasn't value in Disney even before the price increase.

The OP is using the price increase to justify not buying APs. Price went up -- therefore, no more APs and it's off to Universal. But the OP hasn't yet answered the question, "If Disney had not raised prices, would you have purchased new APs this year?"

If OP would have purchased new APs knowing that the majority of the family doesn't like Disney as much as other options, then they're not exactly purchasing based on value in the first place, are they?

 

[POOHsie]

Then you're quite mistaken. A job is worth what the market will bear. You could be a cashier at Disney and only be paid the going rate for cashiers as long as you hold that job. If you're there for 20 years doing the exact same job as someone fresh off the street, you haven't contributed any value that isn't easily replaced. Therefore, you aren't OWED a pay increase.

It's silly to think that the amount of time you've spent doing a job is worth more money just because you've hung around. If you want more pay, add more value.

Employee turnover and low morale are huge, costly problems, and readily solved by recognizing individual and team efforts of even the lowest level workers, and giving each employee good reasons to stay. It's penny-wise, pound-foolish philosophies like yours that make great workers of all levels look for, and find, better positions elsewhere.

 

[wbeem]

Employee turnover and low morale are huge, costly problems, and readily solved by recognizing individual and team efforts of even the lowest level workers, and giving each employee good reasons to stay. It's penny-wise, pound-foolish philosophies like yours that make great workers of all levels look for, and find, better positions elsewhere.

I didn't say it was my philosophy. I merely pointed out the economic realities. Please don't ascribe motivations to me when you know not what I think.

As I said, employes are not OWED a raise. The earn a raise. How they earn that raise varies from one business to another.