Disney to cancel FPs if room is cancelled

[billlaurie]

If people do the split stay purposefully to game the FP+system with full intentions to cancel the first reservation then Disney needs to address this as well. Why should they get to keep a FOP on their "day 5" which is really their "day 1" and so forth. Hopefully this closes that loophole as well but it will be more difficult for Disney to address since they still have FP on the days of their stay even though they may not have been able to book them if they hadn't gamed the system. Disney can cancel the FP for the days of the first reservation but people that are doing this don't care about those anyway. I naively didn't realize people were doing those things. No wonder those of us that come only every few years for a "short" stay and don't engage in these shenanigans can't get these popular FP!

 

[Wubar]

Close ALL the loopholes.

 

[mamaofsix]

Technically physical presence (or at least checking in) is required for a hotel stay. When a hotel closes the register for the day they take all the no shows, collect the penalty, and reopen the room because technically it was cancelled. So technically speaking by not showing up you’ve cancelled the room. Different if you show up and check in and don’t use. Which is not considerate but allowed. Also though when people book the cheapest category and collect the magic bands for 10 guest (as some bragged on this thread) that is a drag on everyone else. Those aren’t free but are built into the room costs assuming a certain duration of stay. So everyone staying more than 1 night is subsidizing those magic bands and parking too. Especially if a magic bands is 15 per band and then that campsite is 60-100 for a tent site.

People staying longer are not subsidizing magic bands for shorter stays. Disney's cost to produce magic bands is waaaaay less than $15.00 each, otherwise they would not offer up to 10 magic bands per $60 campsite. The magic bands are an incentive to get you to use the parks more often and spend more money while you are there - especially if you connect your credit card to them.

Also, you only get free parking for the days you have a reservation, so I don't understand how longer stays are subsidizing the parking of shorter stays?? Someone who rents a campsite for one night still just gets free parking for the days flanking that reservation. They pay the exact same same cost per day for 'free' parking as someone with a longer stay.

I disagree. Look at how much a DAH event costs per person and people pay it. From between $95 to $129 depending on discounts and same day ticket. Times 4 family members really adds up!


I just went on to mock book a campsite for each day of my upcoming May trip, one day at a time to see availability. There are campsites, all levels, available for the whole week from Monday to Thursday. If there are only 200 basic campsites, there is availability at three months. I would think most people wanting to camp would have their plans set at three months before their trip and if they are last minute bookers then why would it be unacceptable for someone to book a campsite as a throwaway room before the last minute planner makes their reservation? Disney is not going to "hold" availability in case someone wants to use a room or campsite down the line. I think the bigger issue is that people just don't like it, but it doesn't break rules and obviously isn't affecting availability, at least for the week I'm looking at, at 12 weeks prior to a trip. Or maybe the addition of the good neighbor hotels has made it easier to book a campsite?

Disney is fixing the real problem...which is the 60 day fastpass and dash.


I honestly didn't know that people did it either. I knew about throwaway rooms, but not all this other stuff where people are getting things they didn't pay for. But I'm also the one who didn't know about the great magic band scandal from two years ago until AFTER they closed that loophole too.

Agreed. The claim that throwaway campsites are taking away availability for regular tent campers is a non-starter for me. Friends of ours recently booked a basic campsite only about a month before their vacation, and there was LOTS of availability. The same was true when we booked. If people are having trouble booking campsites, I highly suspect it is in the fully-serviced sites. In which case, those expensive campsites would not be booked for throwaways or for day use only, but by fellow campers with trailers who book far in advance.

Those booking cheap tent campsites as throwaways are likely booking inventory that has not been sold anyway. Disney is pocketing the cash and obviously has no problem with profiting on a site that was not previously booked and which they will not have to clean up after.

 

[Q-man]

I don't think that is nearly as much an issue as FP's.

Agree, since the $10 per person no show fee was put in place ADRs are way more available and people now actually cancel ADRs if their plans change making availability open up in the 24 hours out time frame.

 

[SL6827]

If people do the split stay purposefully to game the FP+system with full intentions to cancel the first reservation then Disney needs to address this as well. Why should they get to keep a FOP on their "day 5" which is really their "day 1" and so forth. Hopefully this closes that loophole as well but it will be more difficult for Disney to address since they still have FP on the days of their stay even though they may not have been able to book them if they hadn't gamed the system. Disney can cancel the FP for the days of the first reservation but people that are doing this don't care about those anyway. I naively didn't realize people were doing those things. No wonder those of us that come only every few years for a "short" stay and don't engage in these shenanigans can't get these popular FP!

This is being referenced as a "Leading Reservation". I used to think this and a "Throwaway Room" were the same thing, but now I get the difference. Disney will have a much harder time dealing with "Leading Reservations" I think. Not to say they won't look into them, it might just take a minute.

 

[Runnsally]

This is being referenced as a "Leading Reservation". I used to think this and a "Throwaway Room" were the same thing, but now I get the difference. Disney will have a much harder time dealing with "Leading Reservations" I think. Not to say they won't look into them, it might just take a minute.

You’ve got the lingo correct.

 

[boris]

I was at Disney World from June, 17th until July, 1st, 2017, stayed offsite.
I had a 7day ticket and a one night throwaway resort stay (06/17-06/18) linked to MDE.
I booked fastpasses for my first park day (06/17) 60 days in advance.
One week prior to my arrival (06/10/2017), I changed the throwaway room dates through MDE, new dates: overnight stay 07/09-07/10/2017, the reservation/confirmation number stayed the same, the fastpasses were not deleted as I was in the 30 day timeframe.
After I got home on July, 2nd, I cancelled my throwaway room without a fee.
How is Disney gonna prevent people to do that?

 

[Becky Mouse]

I wonder if they'll fix the extra Magic Band loop hole.

They already did. I think that was last year about this time. Passholders could schedule FastPasses, and they would work even if the Passholder never checked into the park. That means a person going with friends could use the rest of the family's MagicBands to get numerous FastPasses booked in advance. Disney changed it (last year, I think) so that the FastPasses will only work if the actual person the band is linked to checks into the park that day.

 

[Becky Mouse]

I was at Disney World from June, 17th until July, 1st, 2017, stayed offsite.
I had a 7day ticket and a one night throwaway resort stay (06/17-06/18) linked to MDE.
I booked fastpasses for my first park day (06/17) 60 days in advance.
One week prior to my arrival (06/10/2017), I changed the throwaway room dates through MDE, new dates: overnight stay 07/09-07/10/2017, the reservation/confirmation number stayed the same, the fastpasses were not deleted as I was in the 30 day timeframe.
After I got home on July, 2nd, I cancelled my throwaway room without a fee.
How is Disney gonna prevent people to do that?

They won't allow you to change your dates anymore. It would count as cancelling the first reservation, which results in the loss of FastPasses, and then the new dates would be a new reservation.

 

[Marionnette]

I was at Disney World from June, 17th until July, 1st, 2017, stayed offsite.
I had a 7day ticket and a one night throwaway resort stay (06/17-06/18) linked to MDE.
I booked fastpasses for my first park day (06/17) 60 days in advance.
One week prior to my arrival (06/10/2017), I changed the throwaway room dates through MDE, new dates: overnight stay 07/09-07/10/2017, the reservation/confirmation number stayed the same, the fastpasses were not deleted as I was in the 30 day timeframe.
After I got home on July, 2nd, I cancelled my throwaway room without a fee.
How is Disney gonna prevent people to do that?

When you change your throwaway reservation to a later date, the new system will not just threaten to cancel the FPs that were made using the first date, it will actually do it. So in your example, when you moved your reservation to 7/9-7/10/18, the FPs for 6/17/18 would have been canceled within 2 days as you no longer had an onsite reservation for that date.

 

[boris]

Okay, got it, thanks for the explanation.
I am glad that I will actually stay onsite at Disney World for my upcoming reservation from 12/21 until 12/28/19.

 

[Becky Mouse]

Disney should also close the rolling FP+ loophole. If you only book one night, you should only be able to get FP+ for your day of check in and check out and then have to wait until the 30 day mark to book the rest. I also agree that ADRs booked more than 180 days in advance should also be cancelled, at least for the hard to get ones.

Maybe, but there's a bit of a problem with that. Many Disney guests like to do split stays. We're doing one next trip where we're staying in the cabins 2 nights and then Swan & Dolphin for 5 nights. We have a 7 day ticket linked to the cabins, so we can book our FastPasses at 60+7 days out. I'm glad we can book our FastPasses all at once because we're staying on Disney property the whole time, and we bought the 7 day ticket. I'm glad I don't have to book them twice like we have to with ADRs.

 

[Lovewinnie]

If this is retroactive it will be interesting to see if a lot of FP’s open up after 2/4. If they do this will show how abused the system is.
So those of you with reservations in the next 60 check to see what opens up.

Not sure how this could be retroactive? Isn’t the act of canceling the reservation what will trigger the FP to cancel? If someone is in the 30 day window, already canceled a leading reservation plus now has a valid an on-site reservation what would be the trigger? Just curious.

 

[Becky Mouse]

People who are saying that it is unfair to reserve a room and pay for it and then not show up are making no sense.

We travel frequently and book hotels in multiple ways. Almost without exception there is a penalty if you do not cancel by a specific date. If I don’t show up, they still get my money.

Not showing up actually HELPS WDW... why would they care if I actually sleep in the room or use the camp site? This is not a loophole.

I think guests who want to camp care because they can't get a campsite. Also, because of the rules of supply and demand, the practice increases the costs of those campsites. So, campers are understandably upset that people do this because it makes it harder and more expensive for them to go camping at Disney.

 

[Becky Mouse]

What if there are multiple consecutive reservations and only one is cancelled but others left intact? Will that cancel all fp+ or just the ones made during the cancelled reservation time frame?DD plays basketball and when we can leave depends on tournament placement/time?

I think it might be the one that the tickets are linked to, if you buy a package. So, for example, we have 7 day tickets linked to our 2 night Ft Wilderness cabins stay, and then we're resort hopping to Swolphin. If we cancelled Swolphin, I think we'd still get to keep our FastPasses. If we cancelled Ft. Wilderness, I think we might lose the FastPasses.

 

[Becky Mouse]

Does have something to do with SWGE prep. Hate to say it, but I also think it may have something to do with eventually paying for fast passes too. Just gonna wait and see what happens.

I honestly don't think Disney will have people pay for them. I think Disney is opening up a lot of new rooms right now, and they want to incentivize staying at a Disney resort. Disney resort stays will come with the FastPass perks like always, and that will be huge with Galaxy Edge.

I believe this is why there are rumors floating around that Disney is ending it's FastPass perks with off-site partners. Soon, Disney will have enough hotel rooms that the perk will only be for people actually staying at WDW property.

However, a problem with this is that people can stay off-site but book a cheap room like a campsite, and then cancel it to still get the FastPass perks. So, Disney is dealing with this ahead of time by eliminating that loophole. In short, with Galaxy Edge and the demand for FastPasses, Disney is making it so anyone who wants to ride Galaxy Edge is going to need to stay on Disney Property, and possibly for 10 nights to get the 60+10 window! The FastPasses will still be free, but it's about to become a necessity to stay on Disney property to ride Galaxy Edge.

 

[Becky Mouse]

I'm still confused. If I book a reservation from July 1-4 and another from July 4-8, I could book all those days 60 days before July 1. If I later cancel the July 1-4 reservation then I was able to cheat the system by making the July 4-8 fast passes early. How did they close the loophole if they don't cancel my July 4-8 FPs? Is this simply aimed at off-site people trying to game the 60 day window? Because I don't see how it stops my first example.

No, those ones will now be cancelled. I think the FastPasses will be linked to the July 1-4 reservation, and when you cancel it, the FastPasses will also be cancelled.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I honestly don't think Disney will have people pay for them. I think Disney is opening up a lot of new rooms right now, and they want to incentivize staying at a Disney resort. Disney resort stays will come with the FastPass perks like always, and that will be huge with Galaxy Edge.

I believe this is why there are rumors floating around that Disney is ending it's FastPass perks with off-site partners. Soon, Disney will have enough hotel rooms that the perk will only be for people actually staying at WDW property.

However, a problem with this is that people can stay off-site but book a cheap room like a campsite, and then cancel it to still get the FastPass perks. So, Disney is dealing with this ahead of time by eliminating that loophole. In short, with Galaxy Edge and the demand for FastPasses, Disney is making it so anyone who wants to ride Galaxy Edge is going to need to stay on Disney Property, and possibly for 10 nights to get the 60+10 window! The FastPasses will still be free, but it's about to become a necessity to stay on Disney property to ride Galaxy Edge.

Standby is still an option. I don't think we've had any indication that Disney will only have a FP line and won't have Standby ever (I mean at least one of the rides is getting a Single Rider line). Will it be a loooonnnnggg wait in Standby? Yup

I'm not talking about right after it opens as that won't be indicative of a normal everyday operation. I think we all know it will be insanity right around the time it opens at WDW.

 

[Becky Mouse]

No. She’ll lose any FPs for her YC stay but not for CB. Those FPs are “held” by the CB reservation.

No, I don't think so. Let's say I am staying at Boardwalk for 3 nights, but I buy a 7 day ticket. I can book all 7 days when I'm 60 days from check in. All of those FastPasses are now linked to my Boardwalk stay. If I cancel Boardwalk, I lose them all.

So, in her scenario where she is staying at YC and then CBR, she would lose all her FastPasses if she cancelled YC. She'd have to rebook them at 60 days out from the CBR stay. If it's less than 60 days out, then she doesn't get her full 60 day perk.

 

[Runnsally]

I was at Disney World from June, 17th until July, 1st, 2017, stayed offsite.
I had a 7day ticket and a one night throwaway resort stay (06/17-06/18) linked to MDE.
I booked fastpasses for my first park day (06/17) 60 days in advance.
One week prior to my arrival (06/10/2017), I changed the throwaway room dates through MDE, new dates: overnight stay 07/09-07/10/2017, the reservation/confirmation number stayed the same, the fastpasses were not deleted as I was in the 30 day timeframe.
After I got home on July, 2nd, I cancelled my throwaway room without a fee.
How is Disney gonna prevent people to do that?

For the sake of clarity, I wouldn’t call this a throwaway room as you ultimately cancelled the reservation (throwaway room = pay for it but dont actually stay there). The speculation is that under the new rules, the FPs you made at 60d would be cancelled 48hrs after you changed the room reservation.