Disney has lost another family - do they care?

[Angel Ariel]

If the wait times today are any indication, WDW isn't exactly suffering BUT there are very manageable wait times considering it is a holiday - for all those saying that FP+ is adversely affecting SB wait times.

MK
It's a small world - 20 mins
Astro Orbiter - 20 mins
Big Thunder - 50 mins
Buzz Lightyear - 45 mins
Dumbo - 50 mins
ETWB - 80 mins
Haunted Mansion - 35 mins
Jungle Cruise - 45 mins
Mad Tea Party - 20 mins
Philharmagic - 5 mins
Monster's Inc - 10 mins
Peter Pan's Flight - 60 mins
Pirates - 35 mins
Space Mountain - 60 mins
Stitch - 10 mins
Barnstormer - 35 mins
Magic Carpets - 35 mins
Winnie the Pooh - 25 mins
Tomorrowland Speedway - 40 mins
Under the Sea - 25 mins
Carousel of Progress - 5 mins

Epcot
Captain EO - 10 mins
Ellen's Energy Adventure - 10 mins
Journey into Imagination - 20 mins
Living with the Land - 20 mins
Maelstrom - 20 mins
Mission Space - 15 mins
Soarin - 90 mins
Spaceship Earth - 45 mins
Test Track - 80 mins
Seas with Nemo - 25 mins
Turtle Talk - 20 mins

Hollywood Studios
Muppet Vision 3D - 20 mins
Rock n Roller Coaster - 60 mins
Star Tours - 70 mins
Great Movie Ride - 25 mins
Tower of Terror - 40 mins
Toy Story - 50 mins

Animal Kingdom
Dinosaur - 20 mins
Expedition Everest - 50 mins
It's Tough to Be a Bug - 5 mins
Kali River Rapids - 30 mins
Kilimanjaro Safaris - 50 mins
Primeval Whirl - 40 mins
TriceraTops Spin - 20 mins

So the only waits over an hour are Enchanted Tales with Belle, Space Mountain, Soarin, Test Track, Rock n Roller Coaster and Star Tours. That isn't even all the headliners

Apparently dhs is the place to.be today. Right now waits at dhs are

TOT- 60 mins
RnRC - 80 mins
TSMM - 95 mins
Star Tours - 100 mins

It.just goes to show that sb times can vary considerably as the day goes on.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Okay. Spend your vacation money somewhere else. Many of the FP+ decriers are making similar threats online. That's not going to cause anything to change.

It's not just FP+. ..AND it's not a threat, just fact. We've already changed our habits and will adjust them further, if needed. I love Disney, but there are many other places, that we enjoy. I'm a bit disappointed, but c'est la vie.

 

[rteetz]

I stand by my statement that if Disney did not care at all, which is what I was responding to, then they wouldn't be bothering with the phone calls. The phone call I personally received was absolutely a CM attempting to mollify my concerns and get me to return. Did she offer me any incentives on the phone, no, but I received quite a bit of mail from them, both email and snail, with special offera/pin codes not too long after that call. (Which we have not gotten much of in the past)

thats interesting I haven't heard a lot of disney response I've heard about some but not a lot. This is also the first I've heard of someone getting emails, and regular mail plus a pin code.

 

[Lorrained]

So glad the new system isn't a concern for you but since you go to the parks 3 or 4 times a year and rarely use FP for your touring, it is understandable that you would not be upset with the new system. FPs never played into your touring anyway. For some us it does. For some of us, we only get 1 day in each park once a year or maybe even longer. For some of us, we can only travel during busy seasons with heavy crowds where wait times are crazy by lunchtime. For some of us, we were able to use the paper FPs to allow us to ride favorite rides more than once without a long wait. For some of us, we used 6+ paper FPs at day. And for some of us, 3<6. (Or so I've read)

100000% agree with this post. We have been every year for the last 7 or 8 years and have got 3 weeks booked in August and I too am now dreading it and worried that this will be the end of our favourite destination as we know it.
We also go in busy times because we have to go in school holidays because of the kids and my job, and we stay offsite. we did use the old FP system to ride our favourite rides more than once, for example we have never been a big fan of TM so we will ride RnR or ToT a few times and then use the FP system to ride them again once the crowds get busy, same with the mountains at MK, and we will use the FPs as and when we need them, whereas from what I am gathering with this new system, we are going to have to PRE-DECIDE which rides we use the FP+ for - which is a little like what happened once at universal when we bought the express pass and it turned out the park was quiet and we didn't need it, but obviously we didn't know that when we got there.
The thing is, I've always hated the universal pass, and I've refused point blank when we have visited the parks, thing is, I don't ride many of the rides at say IOA as I don't do big rides, and so it's a case of buy a pass for me to literally be able to go on Poseidons fury and Jurassic park! OR don't get me a pass and I can't ride with my family once it's busy, and generally I take the latter and so miss out in the rides, and also the price of it disgusts me especially when the price can go up so much on different days.

BUT seeing this new system is making me favour universals pass more, which is so sad because I thought that Disneys FP system was fab, and I just don't understand why they changed it.

I'm gutted because it's planned so far ahead and a lot of effort, planni not to mention money to into it, but I feel that I'm going to be dreading the visits to Disney this year and that makes me sad. And the thing is, my kids are now 17 and 15, this is my sons last visit with us, and I just feel it's gonna be like the final chapter of our Disney visit, as I can see my daughter opting for universal next year, especially now it's got the new Harry Potter bit too.

 

[EMode]

If the wait times today are any indication, WDW isn't exactly suffering BUT there are very manageable wait times considering it is a holiday - for all those saying that FP+ is adversely affecting SB wait times.

FP+ adversely effects my wait time for certain rides because I now can't get more than 3 FP's. You may be okay with spending hours through the course of the day waiting in line, but I'm not.

 

[Angel Ariel]

thats interesting I haven't heard a lot of disney response I've heard about some but not a lot. This is also the first I've heard of someone getting emails, and regular mail plus a pin code.

I just want to clarify...I don't *know* that what I received is a result of my emailed.concerns/follow up phone call from disney. I've just gotten a lot more mail from them in the last month than I ever have in the same time period before.

The cm that called me, though, was absolutely concerned about keeping our business.

 

[rteetz]

100000% agree with this post. We have been every year for the last 7 or 8 years and have got 3 weeks booked in August and I too am now dreading it and worried that this will be the end of our favourite destination as we know it. We also go in busy times because we have to go in school holidays because of the kids and my job, and we stay offsite. we did use the old FP system to ride our favourite rides more than once, for example we have never been a big fan of TM so we will ride RnR or ToT a few times and then use the FP system to ride them again once the crowds get busy, same with the mountains at MK, and we will use the FPs as and when we need them, whereas from what I am gathering with this new system, we are going to have to PRE-DECIDE which rides we use the FP+ for - which is a little like what happened once at universal when we bought the express pass and it turned out the park was quiet and we didn't need it, but obviously we didn't know that when we got there. The thing is, I've always hated the universal pass, and I've refused point blank when we have visited the parks, thing is, I don't ride many of the rides at say IOA as I don't do big rides, and so it's a case of buy a pass for me to literally be able to go on Poseidons fury and Jurassic park! OR don't get me a pass and I can't ride with my family once it's busy, and generally I take the latter and so miss out in the rides, and also the price of it disgusts me especially when the price can go up so much on different days. BUT seeing this new system is making me favour universals pass more, which is so sad *** I thought that Disneys FP system was fab, and I just don't understand why they changed it. I'm gutted because it's planned so far ahead and a lot of effort, planni not to mention money to into it, but I feel that I'm going to be dreading the visits to Disney this year and that makes me sad. And the thing is, my kids are now 17 and 15, this is my sons last visit with us, and I just feel it's gonna be like the final chapter of our Disney visit, as I can see my daughter opting for universal next year, especially now it's got the new Harry Potter bit too.

they changed it because they wanted to put everything together as one with mymagic+. Everything can be done on a smart phone now with your magic band. FP has been around for 15 years this is the biggest change to come to it. I'm also sure disney has looked into how many FPs the average guest uses and thats how they came up with three they did test four at one point.

 

[rteetz]

I just want to clarify...I don't *know* that what I received is a result of my emailed.concerns/follow up phone call from disney. I've just gotten a lot more mail from them in the last month than I ever have in the same time period before. The cm that called me, though, was absolutely concerned about keeping our business.

Well at least disney is replying to concerns.

 

[trainingupmy4princes]

Per Bob Iger in the 2014 1st quarter (which includes 2013 Christmas season):
Guest spending was up 8 percent and "per room spending" was up 5%.
They we were able to accommodate 3000 more guests per day during peak holiday season at MK due to MM+.

If they really can accommodate more people then they will make more money. And once they stop spending money on MM+, it will be even more profitable.

Seriously how are they able to add that many more people just because of MM? That many more people would crowd the walkways, etc. as the square footage didn't increase. I don't think adding more people to a gridlocked park is a plus. Especially now they are taking away entertainment (Push, AK parade, Myuki, etc) that would have sponged off some off the crowds from lines and also added some magic when you're one of those unable to get a FP and the SB lines are too long.

 

[practicallyperfect77]

Seriously how are they able to add that many more people just because of MM? That many more people would crowd the walkways, etc. as the square footage didn't increase. I don't think adding more people to a gridlocked park is a plus. Especially now they are taking away entertainment (Push, AK parade, Myuki, etc) that would have sponged off some off the crowds from lines and also added some magic when you're one of those unable to get a FP and the SB lines are too long.

I want to know how MM+ caused this increase as well. I'm not saying it didn't just not seeing the correlation.

 

[rteetz]

Seriously how are they able to add that many more people just because of MM? That many more people would crowd the walkways, etc. as the square footage didn't increase. I don't think adding more people to a gridlocked park is a plus. Especially now they are taking away entertainment (Push, AK parade, Myuki, etc) that would have sponged off some off the crowds from lines and also added some magic when you're one of those unable to get a FP and the SB lines are too long.

well I think they increased the amount of FPs so that may have to do with it. And for MK they have been getting rid of a lot of bottle neck areas for a while like getting rid of planters and expanding concrete areas so it can handle more people. I don't know just a thought.

 

[mom2rtk]

Seriously how are they able to add that many more people just because of MM?

That's easy. Have you seen the photos of how long the FP return lines are today? With everyone in line, there should be lots of room out on the sidewalks.

 

[estherhead]

Seriously how are they able to add that many more people just because of MM? That many more people would crowd the walkways, etc. as the square footage didn't increase. I don't think adding more people to a gridlocked park is a plus. Especially now they are taking away entertainment (Push, AK parade, Myuki, etc) that would have sponged off some off the crowds from lines and also added some magic when you're one of those unable to get a FP and the SB lines are too long.

First, contrary to what is being said on here, Disney isn't trying to take away entertainment. The creator of Push wanted a ton of money and Disney didn't feel it was worth it. So Disney decided to let the contract go and put the money into creating their own creation. Myuki is retiring and they can't find someone to replace her, it's an art that isn't well known. Etc, etc. There are reasons for things.

As for adding people, I'm not a theme park expert. However, my understanding of why MM+ adds people is this:

Each ride and show is a holder of people, as are the lines and holding tanks of the rides. Let's take Mickey's Philharmagic. It seats 500. And 500 can be in the waiting area. And 500 in the line. So that is 1500 people being taken off the walkways if it is full. But it isn't normally full. But what if they could make it full?

If you point people towards these things then they will ride them.

You might say YOU wouldn't, but we on here have done everything. We are not normal. The majority of Disney-goers WANT to be pointed toward something. Try to imagine this is your very first time to Orlando ever. Would you be disappointed with Mickey's Philharmagic? I'm guessing no. You would love it.

So from Disney's point of view it is win, win.

• They are filling buildings with extra people
• They are entertaining people
• They are reducing lines overall by spreading out the crowds
• They are reducing the crowds on the streets

This will make people happier and allow them to fit more people in a park. And will make them more money.

Maybe I'm wrong, but that is how my mind has it worked out. And it is working because you are seeing longer lines on the less important headliners. But still manageable, 20 minutes isn't that unreasonable for Pirates of the Caribbean. It's an enjoyable queue, and a lovely, long ride. And air conditioned. And if there are double the people tied up inside it, then there are less people in line at Space Mt. and less people wandering around Adventureland.

 

[Laketravis]

I want to know how MM+ caused this increase as well. I'm not saying it didn't just not seeing the correlation.

Increased daily guest turnover.

 

[Shaden]

That's easy. Have you seen the photos of how long the FP return lines are today? With everyone in line, there should be lots of room out on the sidewalks.

Hahahahaha ... perfect.

Increased daily guest turnover.

This is probably the closest to the truth.

Many people have been reporting that they are going in to the parks, doing what they want to do, or what they -could- do, then leaving in a shorter period of time.

For some people this has worked well, they aren't ride centric, they did what they wanted and then they basically say the reason they ended up enjoying FP+ is because they did what they wanted and spent more time at the resort, etc.

For other people, they have left out in frustration, they did what they could with the FPs, and then when the lines were too long, or the trade off between wait/ride calculation was beyond what they were willing to do, they left.

Either way, that's increased turnover. For some people, this is a win win, They enjoy it, Disney can sell more tickets. For other people, this is a loss loss. They didn't enjoy it as much as they wanted, and it might alter the cost calculus of returning to Disney, which means Disney might not get their future business.

 

[practicallyperfect77]

Increased daily guest turnover.

Thanks! Was trying to figure out how MM+ increased the #of resort rooms or capacity levels. Duh...turnover.

 

[JBS2]

Whoever mentioned "FastPass abusers" hit the nail right on the head. FP+ is just another example of how Disney is cracking down on the locals who have figured out how to actually get their money's worth by abusing the pass systems (both GAC and FP-) that Disney put in place to make touring the parks easier. I think the next step will be where Disney raises AP rates through the roof.

 

[mesaboy2]

 

[robinb]

Increased daily guest turnover.

Thanks! Was trying to figure out how MM+ increased the #of resort rooms or capacity levels. Duh...turnover.

I would agree, but the MK had FP- over Christmas/NYE so the impact of FP+ really didn't make a big difference. I was there at that time.

 

[practicallyperfect77]

I would agree, but the MK had FP- over Christmas/NYE so the impact of FP+ really didn't make a big difference. I was there at that time.

My original question was in response to Iger's quote. Not quoting now but something along the lines of his they were able to accommodate an additional 3,000 guests a day. I didn't understand how MM+ would cause this to happen. But let's say you had FP+ reserved for 10-11, 11-12, and 12-1. You could leave the park then, go back and swim and allow another family to enter. That would be a result of MM+ well really the FP+ part of the package.