Dilemma

[Feralpeg]

My daughter has a friend, R. They went to college together and see each other on a regular basis. R has a brother who is autistic. R's brother is 20 years old and attends a school for high functioning handicapped individuals. Please forgive me if that is not the politically correct terminology. I will admit that I have limited knowledge of autism and related issues.

The school that R's brother attends has decided not to operate a summer camp. They have done this for many years in the past, but do not have the budget to do it this year. R, my daughter and another friend, J, have been looking for work, but none have been able to find anything substantial. They all graduated with teaching credentials in secondary education social sciences.

R has this plan. She thinks that she, my daughter and J should operate the summer camp for her brother and 21 other people from his school. The school has agreed to allow them to use the building for a price, but they will offer no other support.

Okay, here is my delemma. R seems to think this should not be a problem. My daughter and J are both a bit leery. They have had no training in dealing with people with any type of handicap. I have been around R's brother. He is about six foot tall and about 150 pounds. I have seen him get upset and his dad has had to tallk to him to calm him down. My daughter and J are both about 5'2" and about 105 pounds.

I am just very concerned that they will not be able to handle adults who might become upset. R's brother also suffers from seizures. R knows how to deal with this, but the other girls don't. I see liability here that scares me.

Am I being overly concerned? Do you think that three 23 year old girls, with no training in special education, can handle 22 adults with functioning issues?

Again, I really have never had any experience in working with autism or any other type of learning disabilities of this type. I apologize if I am being insensitive. That is not my intention. I am just concerned.

Input from those who have experience along these lines would be appreciated.

 

[The_Alice]

Youngest son is autistic, and no without proper training they cannot handle it. They will not know what to look for regarding specific needs, what therapies need to be provided and when, what community resources they can rely on, and also what protocol to follow with regard to the Americans with Disabilities Act.

With children who have ASD or Spectrum Disorders it's one thing, adults that's another entirely. My son has violent meltdowns if he gets frustrated. How will these girls handle this if an adult has a violent outburst, nevermind a seizure or other emergency. They are right to be leery of this arrangement.

HTH, and sorry I am not more positive. As the parent of someone with autism I am not sure I would want my child participating if the staff was not trained to help my child progress.

ETA: Autism, Aspergers, and Spectrum Disorders are HIGHLY variable. So variable that many don't present the same way or with similar symptoms. My son, while high functioning still has problems with verbal processing, fine motor skills, social integration with his classmates, etc. While his classmate who is also ASD may never speak, have to wear headphones to block/mute sound, may experience gross motor problems, etc. What my point is, that each of these adults is going to have many different capabilities and/or needs that even if they were highly skilled they would have difficulty supplementing given it's just the three of them. My son is 6, there is only one of me and there is so much I STILL don't know on how to better care for him. And there are days I feel outnumbered, KWIM?

 

[woodkins]

I would seek legal advice prior to agreeing to anything. They would need to obtain insurance in order to do so in order to cover themselves from any liability as well as to cover the individuals in their care should they be injured. I am assuming this would be a for profit venture in which case they need to start a corporation, LLC or some type of business entity.

I personally would not try to offer a camp or group for disabled individuals without having any experience working with that population. Conversely I would not send my disabled child to a camp that had no experience working with that population.

 

[Feralpeg]

Thank you! I agree, The_Alice. If I were the parent of one of the individuals, there is no way I'd leave my child with untrained attendants.

I don't think R has even thought about licensing or insurance. I am going to definitely encourage my daughter to pass this by. R will not be happy, but money isn't everything!

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I would be livid as a parent to know that I was sending my person to a camp that had people running it with no training.

And anyway, that does not sound like a proper ratio. I am no expert however let's just say 1 person is out sick or quits....now you have 2 people running the show?

No way!

 

[Liberty Belle]

No way. Unless they can hire experienced people and enough for there to be a decent ratio, there's no way they should do this.

I work with children with special needs, mostly autism. Even the little ones can be hard to handle at times and honestly, because of sensory issues and other things, things can get bad quickly with someone who doesn't know what they're doing.

 

[MariDisney]

I am a behavior analyst who has been working with people with autism for 20 years. There is no way that I would do this with two of my most qualified colleagues. That ratio is insane, if not illegal (not sure about the laws related to adults as I work with school aged children). They wouldn't be able to get insurance without the proper credentials. The liability they'd be assuming is huge. Understanding how to plan enjoyable and effective programming for these folks takes a long time to learn and cannot be done in a few months. Addtionally, none of the funding sources that would usually pay for a summer program would pay for this set up. Families who are prepared to pay privately will be looking for somewhere with a track record. There are probably 100 other reasons not to try this, but I've said enough. If these young people are interested in working with individuals with disabilities there are lots of great places to get experience. With several years under their belts, the right courses and credentials this might be something to take on 5 or so years down the road.

 

[Feralpeg]

Thank you. I just spoke to DD about this. I shared each of your comments and she admits it is a bad idea. She will pass on this.

 

[The_Alice]

If these young people are interested in working with individuals with disabilities there are lots of great places to get experience. With several years under their belts, the right courses and credentials this might be something to take on 5 or so years down the road.

See I am wondering this as well. If they have an education degree, more and more children with ASD are being mainstreamed into the classroom. Any type of experience they can gather for working with students with special needs the better. This could help them later on.

 

[Feralpeg]

See I am wondering this as well. If they have an education degree, more and more children with ASD are being mainstreamed into the classroom. Any type of experience they can gather for working with students with special needs the better. This could help them later on.

I agree, but that is not really their goal. They just see it as summer employment. Crazy! They aren't really thinking long term. I think I've convinced my daughter to say no to the idea.

 

[laurie31]

I agree, but that is not really their goal. They just see it as summer employment. Crazy! They aren't really thinking long term. I think I've convinced my daughter to say no to the idea.

Oh goodnesss no!!

I know you've already talked your DD out of it, but I just have to say this is a Bad Idea of the Highest Order.

I'm sure "R" thinks she knows about autism because she has lived with her brother, but none of them would be prepared to handle a behavior outburst or any medical condition that could occur. I'm sure she would be excellent with her brother, but for a total of 22 adults with various disabilities?

What if one camper attacked one of them? Or another camper? There are methods of "therapeutic holding" to safely restrain an out-of-control patient, but it takes not only the instruction but practice to do it so neither you nor the patient is injured. The potential for something...unfortunate...to happen is astronomical.

I hope your DD can find something more suitable for summer employment.

 

[golfgal]

Thank you! I agree, The_Alice. If I were the parent of one of the individuals, there is no way I'd leave my child with untrained attendants.

I don't think R has even thought about licensing or insurance. I am going to definitely encourage my daughter to pass this by. R will not be happy, but money isn't everything!

I agree, I would not send a child or adult to a "camp" that didn't have staff with years of experience. I think the problem is that R is used to taking care of the brother and it is just a way of life for R and R doesn't realize that it isn't something everyone has done all their lives.

Absolutely get a LOT of insurance if they go through this-even if everyone else doesn't, load up on the liability insurance for Kendall. You just never know what could happen. You might have difficulty FINDING the liability insurance you need however. Most companies are going to want someone with some kind of a formal background in special ed with experience before they underwrite something like this too. That might be a good way to get out of doing the camp for Kendall without really having to say no to her friends too. "I wasn't able to get proper liability insurance" sounds a lot better to her friends then "you guys are nuts".