Delta -- discrimination against a black female doctor inflight

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

I'm obviously not as fussy as you.
In an emergency I would even welcome a veterinarian.

ford family

So you would rather a vet than a neurologist? Because that is what I said.

If I had a choice, I would rather a neurologist than an ob. Not I wouldn't welcome an ob.

And this patient had a choice. There were three medical professionals available.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

Was the doctor who helped the patient a neurologist? If not what was his specialty?

My OB/GYN is a very young Indian woman. She's a fantastic doctor and I can't imagine ever referring to her as looking like a teen playing dress-up. That is so condescending.

I have no idea what the other medical processionals were.

Sorry you find it condescending it wasn't meant to be. I was simply making an observation. The doctor from the news article looks young. Very young.

 

[Kellykins1218]

Funny, in ever single news story I've seen about this, they have yet to find a fellow passenger that corroborates her story. Delta issued the proper response, which is the exact same as any company does in this kind of situation... "they don't believe in discrimination and are looking into it"

 

[Callie]

I'm shocked that another passenger come forward to at least back this lady. It's making me start to think she added some stuff to make the story more outrageous.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I just taught a group of seniors how to do CPR and use a defibrillator. They're biggest concern was doing something wrong. My response was "they're dead...you can't do worse than dead".
You've made the "issues" so complicated that the patient will die while credentials are checked. If it's beyond the training of the flight attendant, then any physician/nurse on the plane is better than none. Yes, I've responded to emergencies many times in my life as a nurse, no one ever asked to see my license.

I've made the issues more complicated?? I'm just interpreting what other experts in the subject have said.

I also happen to believe in, and base my practice on, reasonable standards of care. I don't think that anything I've said or quoted here breaches the reasonable care premise. "If I have the capability to help, I help. If I don't, and someone else is available, then I may defer to them. If I am the only one available, then I do what I can to help, but I can not go beyond my own training or area of expertise." I don't see what's so complicated about that. We are trained to think critically, after all.

 

[Hikergirl]

I have no idea what the other medical processionals were.

Sorry you find it condescending it wasn't meant to be. I was simply making an observation. The doctor from the news article looks young. Very young.

Saying a professional woman looks young and saying she looks like a teen playing dress up come across as 2 very different observations IMO. You can just say she looks very young, adding the dress up part is what makes it come across as a condescending tone to me. I don't know, maybe I'm reading too much into it.

 

[nicolita3]

I am an lpn and was once on a flight where someone had a medical situation. The person had passed out and they called overhead for anybody with medical training. I went to where the patient was and they just asked me if I had medical training, they didn't ask for my licence or anything. Some one else finally volunteered and she said that she was a pediatric nurse. The whole time we were helping the patient there was another flight attendant on the phone talking with the pilot asking if we needed an emergency landing. The person ended up being fine. The flight attendant did a report and took our names and gave us a lunch pack thing and that was it.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Curious about the "anything's better than nothing if the patient's going to die" philosophy.

These are some interesting statistics. Apparently not too many of the inflight emergencies end in death - in fact, it's just one third of one percent of the time that that happens. And also that only 7.3 percent of the time is the aircraft diverted, according to this article. Which translates to, a medical professional may be dealing with an emergency outside of their scope of practice for an entire flight if they are the only person who volunteers.

"Of the 2.75 billion passengers who fly on commercial airlines annually worldwide, only one third of 1 percent ended in death, according to the NEJM study.

Researchers analyzed nearly 12,000 calls to the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center, one of two ground communication hubs that provide physician advisors when an emergency happens in flight.

Those calls represented 744 million airline passengers from five domestic and international airlines from five domestic and international airlines from 2009 to 2010.

The majority of cases (37 percent) involved fainting; other medical emergencies included respiratory (12 percent) and nausea or vomiting (9.5 percent). Aircraft diversion happened in 7.3 percent of the flights."

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/flight...ess-medical-kits-inadequate/story?id=21161144

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I am an lpn and was once on a flight where someone had a medical situation. The person had passed out and they called overhead for anybody with medical training. I went to where the patient was and they just asked me if I had medical training, they didn't ask for my licence or anything. Some one else finally volunteered and she said that she was a pediatric nurse. The whole time we were helping the patient there was another flight attendant on the phone talking with the pilot asking if we needed an emergency landing. The person ended up being fine. The flight attendant did a report and took our names and gave us a lunch pack thing and that was it.

That was good of you!

There are services that airlines can use which give medical advice to those in the air. It seems like it's becoming more common for airline personnel to utilize these agencies.

One example:

http://www.medaire.com/solutions/airlines/solutions/medical-advisory-services-medlink

It is still helpful for FAs to have hands on help in the air, if possible.

 

[MillauFr]

Funny, in ever single news story I've seen about this, they have yet to find a fellow passenger that corroborates her story. Delta issued the proper response, which is the exact same as any company does in this kind of situation... "they don't believe in discrimination and are looking into it"

How would the press find a list of other passengers on the plane? Not like Delta would release that private information.

 

[roseaster]

I'm going to say by the flight attendants response she assumed she was too young. Calling her "sweetie"? That's something you say to a kid.

When she said "Wow you're actually a doctor?" I'm sure she wasn't saying "Wow you mean colored girls can be doctors too?" She was like "Wow you look way to young to have completed medical school!"

The flight attendant should have taken her seriously but honestly young people are rarely taken seriously.

Oh that reminds me. I need to go back to low-key's thread and list that as another benefit of getting older. If you tell people you're a doctor they actually believe you.

O. M. G.

 

[BigAlsGal]

O. M. G.

Oh lord.....if you didn't catch what I did there I was trying to sound like a hillbilly racist. I swear people.... get off the internet.

 

[ronandannette]

I just taught a group of seniors how to do CPR and use a defibrillator. They're biggest concern was doing something wrong. My response was "they're dead...you can't do worse than dead".
You've made the "issues" so complicated that the patient will die while credentials are checked. If it's beyond the training of the flight attendant, then any physician/nurse on the plane is better than none. Yes, I've responded to emergencies many times in my life as a nurse, no one ever asked to see my license.

I (and possibly many others here on the DIS) am a certified First-Aider. Certainly not a licensed medical professional, but with the basic skills to perform CPR, use a portable defibrillator, stanch bleeding, address choking, stabilize an injured limb, etc. in an emergency. I'm wondering, would we even be allowed to assist someone in need in the absence of anyone more qualified? I'd imagine in-flight staff must be trained in this way too - do they actually do it or just let the victim go unaided for fear of liability? Although barely adequate, I wonder what more even a very experienced physician could do in the aisle of a plane without any meds or equipment...

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I (and possibly many others here on the DIS) am a certified First-Aider. Certainly not a licensed medical professional, but with the basic skills to perform CPR, use a portable defibrillator, stanch bleeding, address choking, stabilize an injured limb, etc. in an emergency. I'm wondering, would we even be allowed to assist someone in need in the absence of anyone more qualified? I'd imagine in-flight staff must be trained in this way too - do they actually do it or just let the victim go unaided for fear of liability? Although barely adequate, I wonder what more even a very experienced physician could do in the aisle of a plane without any meds or equipment...

They do keep some basic medical supplies on a plane, and I believe what they keep has been updated - based on recommendations from medical professionals who have attended to such emergencies. It isn't much. (See below.)

 

[ronandannette]

They do keep some basic medical supplies on a plane, and I believe what they keep has been updated - based on recommendations from medical professionals who have attended to such emergencies. It isn't much.

Do you know about the other part of my questions? Would a 1st-Aider be allowed to assist, or would the flight crew do it themselves? The idea of just nobody doing anything (and/or the flight crew actively preventing people from assisting) bothers me.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

From 2015

"Minimum Contents for Medical Emergency Kits

• 
  
  
  • Sphygmomanometer
  • Stethoscope
  • Airways, oropharyngeal: 1 pediatric, 1 small adult, and 1 large adult or equivalent
  • Self-inflating manual resuscitation device with 1 pediatric mask, 1 small adult mask, and 1 large adult or equivalent mask
  • Cardiopulmonary resuscitation masks: 1 pediatric, 1 small adult, and 1 large adult or equivalent
  • I.V. administration set: 1 tubing with 2 Y-site connectors, 2 alcohol-soaked sponges, 1 standard roll of 1-inch-wide adhesive tape, 1 pair of tape scissors, and 1 tourniquet
  • Protective nonpermeable gloves or equivalent, 1 pair
  • Needles: 2 18 gauge, 2 20 gauge, and 2 22 gauge; or 6 needles in sizes necessary to administer required medications
  • Syringes: 1 5 cc and 2 10 cc; or 4 syringes in sizes necessary to administer required medications
  • Analgesic, nonnarcotic, 325-mg tablets, 4
  • Antihistamine, 25-mg tablets, 4
  • Antihistamine injection, 50-mg single-dose ampule or equivalent, 2
  • Atropine injection, 0.5-mg single-dose 5-mL ampule or equivalent, 2
  • Aspirin, 325-mg tablets, 4
  • Bronchodilator, metered-dose inhaler or equivalent
  • 50% Dextrose injection, single-dose 50-mL ampule or equivalent
  • Epinephrine injection, 1:1000 (1 mg/mL) single-dose 1-mL ampule or equivalent, 2
  • Epinephrine injection, 1:10,000 (0.1 mg/mL) single-dose 2-mL ampule or equivalent, 2
  • Lidocaine injection, 20-mg/mL single-dose 5-mL ampule or equivalent, 2
  • Nitroglycerin, 0.4-mg tablets, 10
  • 0.9% Sodium chloride injection, 500 mL
  • Basic instructions for use of the drugs in the kit

The quantity of an item is 1 unless stated otherwise. From Appendix A to Part 121, Title 14, Code of Federal Regulations."

http://www.ashp.org/menu/News/PharmacyNews/NewsArticle.aspx?Source=News&Type=Rss&Id=4158

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Do you know about the other part of my questions? Would a 1st-Aider be allowed to assist, or would the flight crew do it themselves? The idea of just nobody doing anything (and/or the flight crew actively preventing people from assisting) bothers me.

Yes, I believe they would, if help was needed and requested. (I've seen it said that people should ask someone if they need help, if they're awake; if they're unconscious, it's ok to help without permission as permission is assumed.)

Most of what will be happening will be directed from emergency physicians on the ground if they use one of the specialized medi-link services I mentioned above. How much one helps is based on their training and competency (and as we've seen, what other help is available, etc).

It does make you think about this a little more, doesn't it?

 

[Magpie]

I have no idea what the other medical processionals were.

Sorry you find it condescending it wasn't meant to be. I was simply making an observation. The doctor from the news article looks young. Very young.

Frankly, if I had a choice, I'd rather have a young doctor than an old one.

I figure young doctors are more likely to be up to date on their medical training and information, and they've had less time to forget what they've learned.

Also, I would only prefer a neurologist over an ob gyn if my medical issue was neurological in nature. Otherwise, I figure the two of them are equally likely (and equally unlikely) to know what to do for me.

And heck, a vet is probably more experienced than both of them in dealing with a random medical crises of unknown origin. After all human doctors only have to know how to treat one species, and both ob gyns and neurologists are specialists who don't even treat the whole person. Vets are generalists who have to know how to treat multiple different species, and their patients are never able to tell them where it hurts.

 

[Kellykins1218]

How would the press find a list of other passengers on the plane? Not like Delta would release that private information.

Are you serious? This story has been everywhere. The airline wouldn't have to release anything. As soon as these stories come out, people usually come out of the woodwork yet not a single person has spoken up.

 

[Magpie]

Are you serious? This story has been everywhere. The airline wouldn't have to release anything. As soon as these stories come out, people usually come out of the woodwork yet not a single person has spoken up.

No one's come forward to contradict her story, either. So, it's a bit of a wash, either way.