DDP and free dining ruining WDW restaurants!

[dumbo71]

Now you say this... and in the beginning you said...



So blame the user's and insult them... but tell them to use it instead of debating the points with you?

So I assume by what you are saying, that IF the DDP was absolved right this second and no longer offered, everything would return to what it was? You mean the corporate office wouldn't want to just keep things the way they are and keep the increased profit margin.. and now without having to provide any service in return??

They knew what they were doing. They increased onsite visitors. They put more bodies in rooms at slower times of the year. They hooked families into staying on longer trips by the MYW pricing. They added the DDP so people would stay on-site at all times, which leads to increased spending on souveneirs/gifts/etc. Love or hate the DDP, it is doing what it was meant to do.

Just because DDP is doing what was designed, does not mean those things are for the better.

You ask if things would return to pre -DDP status if the plan was removed? Not immediately, but yes, we would see the creative Chefs at WDW allowed to be, well, creative.

We would also see guests not have to plan 180 days in advance to go to WDW restaurants.

Service workers would have to earn that 18% tip.

TO GO orders could be started again immediately.

Lewisc seems to be the dining expert here. I was wondering if he would be so kind as to provide a list of restaurants at WDW that DO NOT participate with the DDP and free dining? Those restaurants , I'll support.

Yes, things would get better, some immediately.

 

[DisneyKidds]

This plan will be drastically altered or removed IMO, so enjoy while it lasts. Thewy are losing money by the day as it stands.

On what are you basing the "losing money by the day" conclusion? On the last day of our last trip when we ate $150 worth of food (as measured by the bills) when the plan only cost us $100 for the day? Did Disney lose $50?

Disney isn't that stupid, and the reality isn't as simple as that.

For starters you have the room. Let's say for arguments sake that we were staying at the GF, where I used to be able to get a discounted rate of $300 a night, but to get the plan I booked at a rate of $450. Well, right there Disney more than made up the $50 in revenue they "lost" on the DDP they offered me.

Of course, they didn't actually lose anything on the DDP that I saved so much on. At most sit down restaurants, the actual cost of food is about a third of the set menu price. A little more for high quality fine dining places, but a whole lot less on a counter service meal. Fixed overhead and service costs run about a third as well. So the cost to Disney to provide me the food and the labor and overhead to serve it was most likely around $100 or so. On a cost basis Disney is probably close to breaking even on the dining plan.......but don't forget that extra $150 in revenue they got on the room.

Disney isn't losing money, and to be honest the guests aren't necessarily saving all that much. It's a bit of a shell game, with a little marketing perception thrown in.

Free dining is actually a very good deal on which Disney is losing some margin, but they have an awful lot of fixed overhead that isn't helped by empty rooms in the off months.

So I don't think Disney is losing as much as you think they are, if anything at all. However, I still think that, as a long term strategy, using a gimmick to prop up inflated prices is a flawed strategy.

 

[Lewisc]

http://adisneyworld.disney.go.com/m...agespecific/eng/nontheme/tickets/07Dining.pdf

is a link to the 2007 brochure. It lists the participating restaurants.

Non-participating restaurants include V&A, blueZoo, Shula's, Il Mulino, WGP Upstairs Dining, Fulton's, Portobello Yacht Club, House of Blues and Bongos. Bistro de Paris in EPCOT also doesn't participate. Beaches and Cream is a TS restaurant under the dining plan. It's probably the worse bang for the buck, most DDP customers will pay out of pocket. Any changes at that restaurant have nothing to do with the dining plan.

"Free dining" doesn't change the plan, the guest is given free dining instead of the deep room discounts that were otherwise offered during the hurricane season.

The current dining program has shown that guests will fill the restaurants if the price is right. Now if the non-participating restaurants at S/D, experience high bookings, from guests willing to pay for the kind of dining experience you're looking for Disney might drop one or two signature restaurants from the plan. The GF has a buffet, a one credit TS restaurants and 2 signature restaurants. They could easily drop one of the signature restaurants from the plan but I doubt they could increase the price enough to compensate for the reduced volume.


You keep talking about the old days where guests didn't have to plan 180 days in advance. Why do you keep posting wrong information? CRT, Chef Mickey's and Le Cellier were just as hard to get ADRs prior to the current dining plan. You used to be able to book dinner shows 2 years in advance, it's now 6 months.

The present "bean counters" want more uniformity with the restaurants. I don't see "TO GO" coming back with or without the DDP. The DDP is a good excuse for getting rid of "TO GO" but there isn't any reason why the DDP has to include TO GO (the Spoodles window is no longer included) or why we think DDP guests are going to spend a TS credit on a meal they're going to eat in their room.

Just because DDP is doing what was designed, does not mean those things are for the better.

You ask if things would return to pre -DDP status if the plan was removed? Not immediately, but yes, we would see the creative Chefs at WDW allowed to be, well, creative.

We would also see guests not have to plan 180 days in advance to go to WDW restaurants.

Service workers would have to earn that 18% tip.

TO GO orders could be started again immediately.

Lewisc seems to be the dining expert here. I was wondering if he would be so kind as to provide a list of restaurants at WDW that DO NOT participate with the DDP and free dining? Those restaurants , I'll support.

Yes, things would get better, some immediately.

 

[Sammie]

Thank you to all of the DDP and free dining users. You have helped ruin dining at WDW and things will only get worse.

When you blame what you don't like about Disney on others, that to me is name calling. Blame Disney if you want to but it is insulting to blame others.

Maybe if you and others upset over the changes had kept the restaurants full then the things you like to eat would not have been removed from the menu. Obviously Disney needed a way to keep restaurants full and people purchasing what was on the menu. I seriously doubt they would have offered the plan if the menu items that have been removed were being ordered often and restaurants were staying packed. So I guess you contributed to the changes also.

 

[dwdeb]

We don't use DDP for our family of 3 . Pay out of pocket using DDE.
However, we have noticed the decline in the quality of food over the last year. Portions aren't as much an issue as much as preperation, taste, and extras; like bread served before dinner(charging for it). This happened at a few restaurants.
Servers have said alot of these changes were because of DDP.
Interesting...
Deb

 

[DCDisney]

I really think that's why they took the salmon off the menu at Sci-Fi which bugs me because it's something my husband liked. I think that families who can't afford salmon should still go to Disney but order entrees that are less expensive.

I'm sad about the salmon too because it's an easy thing to order plain for people like me with food allergies and I think the tofu they subbed for it has a very limited appeal. BUT in terms of price and easy of cooking personally I think salmon is probably cheaper. I get salmon at our grocery often for less than boneless chicken.

Yvonne

 

[jodifla]

You keep talking about the old days where guests didn't have to plan 180 days in advance. Why do you keep posting wrong information? CRT, Chef Mickey's and Le Cellier were just as hard to get ADRs prior to the current dining plan. You used to be able to book dinner shows 2 years in advance, it's now 6 months.

You are the one with the wrong info. True, Cindy's has always been hard to get. But Le Cellier and Chef Mickey's could easily be made the month before, and often the week before, as late as last year.

And again, we have more people like dwdeb noticing the quality drop and talking to the servers, who blame the DDP. When will you acknowledge the obvious?

 

[Peter Pirate 2]

A certain group will never acknowledge the obvious in this issue jodifla, as it isn't of interest to them. If the food is "just good enough" that will satisfy those looking for cost benefit or to those who are newbies. Some of the others see us locals as the greedy badguys who are jaded because of those awesome deals Disney gives us .

I understand LewisC's position in that there are still a number of great restaurants that can appeal to "foodies", but those are all chains and, for me, I liked the innovativeness of the GREAT Disney chef's in their themed environments. To this we are losing ground fast. FF lost it's chef to CG who lost their chef due to these cutbacks...The point is FF has not replaced him. Why?

The sad thing that we who miss the greatness of past Disney dining is that the slippery slope leads to a very bad place, IMO. What happens when the cost cutting reaches a level that even ddp proponents stop enjoying it? Will they be able to go back? Doubtful. Chances are it will entail more and more franchising. It'll be fine but never reach the level Disney had achieved I doubt. They'll need the Chili's, Outbacks and Olive Gardens to please the masses I'm afraid.

Oh well. I'm sure this will get construed in a negative manner and it's too bad because I have no problem with a ddp, I just wish Disney would use their wisdom and make it palatable for everyone.

 

[housecat]

Susan,

No need for a flame suit at all. Valid point.

I'm not expecting gourmet food at WDW. All I'm expecting is the same quality, choices, TO GO orders, and service that we received before the dining plan. Nothing more, nothing less.

I'm not looking for culture either. We go to Europe for that or some of the finer US cities.

The declining standards at WDW should be a concern to all.

Wow, your screen name really suits you. LOL at this thread...who cares if you plan to dine offsite? I'm sure Disney won't mind...the DDP has made many patrons very happy, and in turn Disney has MADE money off of it. Many consumers are very happy with the quality of the food, and lots of us tip extra over the 18%. By all means, dine off-site if that's what you want to do...I'm sure Disney will get over it.

 

[susan1]

Wow, your screen name really suits you. LOL at this thread...who cares if you plan to dine offsite? I'm sure Disney won't mind...the DDP has made many patrons very happy, and in turn Disney has MADE money off of it. Many consumers are very happy with the quality of the food, and lots of us tip extra over the 18%. By all means, dine off-site if that's what you want to do...I'm sure Disney will get over it.

what a horrible name calling post, just because the poster answered my question in a civilised manner. i thank god that i stay off site and eat in the lmany splendid areas around orlando. the whole "live the disney experience" fills me with forboding, as i said it is a theme park where eateries and patrons have delusions of grandeur. i am sure no one will miss us but i suspect the wheel will turn and people will be sick to death of being cocooned in disney. the ammount of people staying in villas is increasing steadily.

 

[Uncleromulus]

This thread has gotten out of hand what with the name calling, etc.