DCA: Keep, Update or Demolish

GatorChris

Not of This World
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A link to the story here on the DIS: http://www.wdwinfo.com/disneylandcalifornia/keep-update-or-demolish-disney-california-adventure/

These stories I can't help but read. I want to hear other opinions and I want to make sure they're not calling for the destruction of one of my favorites. I'd imagine if this were written a year ago, there's NO WAY that Tower of Terror would make the "Update" list, but apparently Disney thought so. Sigh.

I definitely agree that the Golden Zephyr needs to go....10 years ago. Jumpin' Jellyfish - my kids like it, though it's not a must. Definitely glad the writer likes the SS Swings - those are always fun.

Not sure I agree with getting rid of the bumper cars. That attraction seems to have the longest lines in Bug's Land. But, yes, bumper cars are very Boardwalk-ish. So maybe they'd fit better at Paradise Pier.

What are your thoughts? What do you keep, demolish or maybe update?
 
Gotta disagree with the Golden Zephyr. It's the only ride in that area without a HR and my 2-yr-old LOVES it. It's like the SSS, but for toddlers. They could probably update the theme, but the ride itself is a good addition to the area.

My kids always hated the Jumpin' Jellyfish. The HR is the problem with this ride - kids tall enough to ride this are tall enough to ride TOT. If it had a 36" HR, it could justify its existence. By the time most kids are tall enough to ride it, they have no interest in it anymore.

My older girls still love the SSS - so I'm also glad it made the keep list.

We're rather indifferent to the bumper cars. That's the one ride in Bug's Land that we often skip. I like that it is a different type of ride, though.

We like Monsters (ride it every trip), though I'm sure it will be leaving with Marvelland (or whatever it is called).
 
A link to the story here on the DIS: http://www.wdwinfo.com/disneylandcalifornia/keep-update-or-demolish-disney-california-adventure/

These stories I can't help but read. I want to hear other opinions and I want to make sure they're not calling for the destruction of one of my favorites. I'd imagine if this were written a year ago, there's NO WAY that Tower of Terror would make the "Update" list, but apparently Disney thought so. Sigh.

I definitely agree that the Golden Zephyr needs to go....10 years ago. Jumpin' Jellyfish - my kids like it, though it's not a must. Definitely glad the writer likes the SS Swings - those are always fun.

Not sure I agree with getting rid of the bumper cars. That attraction seems to have the longest lines in Bug's Land. But, yes, bumper cars are very Boardwalk-ish. So maybe they'd fit better at Paradise Pier.

What are your thoughts? What do you keep, demolish or maybe update?

Bugs land, while lame for older kids and adults, has some of the best attractions for younger kids. Some kids get scared by the dark rides which are the majority of the tamer rides at DL. But bugs land is not scary at all. And the theming is fantastic. Though, I would update the chew coaster with something more like gadget's go coaster, but designed better so you don't wait an hour for a 20 second ride. I can see the point on the bumper cars, but they are fun for kids. Maybe they could update with a kiddie version of autopia, where the cars are more on a track but really little kids can "drive" them without an adult.
 
I'd be ok if Zephyr went away. It's closed frequently due to winds and there are other rides that provide a park panorama experience. I'm keeping the Swings, Fun Wheel and all of Bug's Land except Tuck and Roll which needs an update to it's terrible theming and lackluster experience factor (even for 5 yo's.)

Monsters is GONE. Cheapo ride. We like the queue and Roz, but the ride itself is subpar (imo.)

Which leaves us with Jellyfish which I'll give an update. Oh how I want to like this ride. I want to love it actually, it's so pretty and appealing looking - it lures me in everytime. So you buckle in, go up and that's about it. The whole thing is a minute and a half and for a slow, relaxing ride such as it is, it needs more time to be a fulfilling experience. Double the ride length and change the seats or restraint system to allow shorter riders.
 

It would be sad to see anything in Bugs Land go. It's a really great option for families with little ones.

My 12 yo son and I do love Silly Symphony Swings! That's the one I'd be sad to see go. I also think the Monster's Inc is a fun dark ride for families.

If they take family rides out of the park what are people with kids going to do? Stay at Disneyland!
 
I don't love Goofy's Sky School, but I really enjoy all of the other rides in Paradise Pier- especially at night.

I wouldn't change a thing in Bug's Land. My 5 year old still loves all the rides over there, and it's nice to have an area perfect for small children.

I hope the rumors about Monsters Inc changing to something Marvel related aren't true. We love that ride (and it's short wait).
 
Golden Zephyr-I would not be sad to see this go. The only redeeming quality is that it allows anyone old enough to sit to ride. However shorter kids can’t see over the side, and older kids would probably be happier riding something else.

Jumpin’ Jellyfish-I disagree that it should be demolished. I like this ride for what it is and think it looks nice too, the bright colors are very nice. The downside to this ride is that many parks have similar rides (like Frog Bounces) that have lower height requirements. I wish they had built this in a way that it had a 36” requirement instead of a 40” requirement so that little ones could enjoy it too. But I do think this ride is great for the 3-7 year olds who are tall enough to ride this but maybe not tall or brave enough to ride something else.

Fun Wheel-I dislike this ride, but would not want to see it demolished, so I agree it’s a keeper. I just like the way it looks on the pier and think it would feel wrong if it was gone.

Monster’s Inc-This is a favorite of our families. I think people sometimes expect too much from dark rides. They do not need to be thrilling or even high technology. This ride has great scenes. I believe it will end up on the chopping block when they expand DCA in the future, but I actually think this is a good ride. It would be busier if there was more in that corner of the park, evidenced by the crowd bumps it saw when all the Frozen stuff was over there. It went from never having a line to having 30 minute lines. People just forget about it because there is NOTHING else over there.

Silly Symphony Swings-My husband loves these, I’m not a fan. They are definitely a keeper, and I’m glad they have the tandem swings so adults can ride with kids.

Buggies-We haven’t taken the kids on these yet. They have a height requirement so there is that deterrent in a land made for the littlest tykes, and really bumper cars are just not that much fun unless you’re with a good group and everyone is crashing into each other. Most of the time you end up just driving in circles. I’d be happy to see these demolished and the space used for something better. Actually, we like the rest of Bugsland, but I would be okay with most of it being demolished if they built another good family friendly ride such as a low height requirement coaster or a dark ride.
 
Get rid of the redwood creek trail area. I never see people going in there and to me, it is just a playground like what you can get at your neighborhood park. Waste of space in my opinion
 
I'm looking forward to the thrill rides at DCA, but it's important for it to keep enough attractions for people of all ages and abilities. I will be traveling with someone who can't do rides with lots of movement. As a family, we love dark rides, rides that take you slowly up and down, rides where you control the vehicle. We're looking forward to rides that other people might consider lame, like chew chew train. My son loved Living with the Land at Epcot when he was five, so YMMV, but we're not the only Disney fans like that.

If Monster's Inc is replaced by a Marvelland, let there be a tame ride within that genre in the land. I do agree that bumper car experiences depend on the group -- my DD watched a video and thought it was strange that no one was actually bumping into each other. At LEGOLAND, the kids' driving experience is a huge hit and is not on any track.

As for the Redwood Creek area, some kids get sensory overload and appreciate an area where they can take a break to run and play. I don't know if the area could be improved upon -- my kids love the Jurassic Park area in Universal Orlando because there's lots to explore, including scary dark caves.
 
Golden Zephyr - Keep. It's simplistic but it's a fast loader and (just about) anyone can ride it.

Jumpin' Jellyfish - Demolish. I can't figure out what the point of this ride is. Similar rides exist at other parks, but somehow this one is not as good as those. This is the worst ride in all of DLR for me.

Silly Symphony Swings - Keep. This is an average ride at best, but I like the nod to Walt Disney's early works.

Bumper Cars - Demolish. Not that they are terrible...but I think the bar is pretty low to put in something better.

The others I don't have an opinion on either way.
 
Keep 'em all! What else are we gonna go on when we walk all the way down to Goofy's SS and are like "what?!?! A 30 minute wait?! Well, what else can we go on?" and there are the perennial favorites Zephyr, JJ, SSS, all with 5 minute waits. We need "meh" rides so we can ride...something. Tear them down and build 3 Frozen rides and we might just queue for eternity.
 
Get rid of the redwood creek trail area. I never see people going in there and to me, it is just a playground like what you can get at your neighborhood park. Waste of space in my opinion
But kids will play in it for hours. Mine went on the goofy slide like 50 times in toon town! Annoying! I'd rather be on rides. But everyone has different decompression needs.
 
Get rid of the redwood creek trail area. I never see people going in there and to me, it is just a playground like what you can get at your neighborhood park. Waste of space in my opinion

I do agree that it is like a neighborhood park, although much much better than any parks in our neighborhood. We love it because it is a break from the lines and overload of the amusement park without actually going anywhere.
 
OK, where to start, I guess I am known as an Historian of DCA, and of course Disneyland and Southern Californian Theme/Amusement parks and similar attractions.

That is a scary thing to say, especially when I have lunch with folks who know more than I do, and it is surprising to hear the "Legends" say you got it right.

So if we go back to the 1990's and when Disney started to plan to expand their footprint in Southern California, and basically pitted Anaheim against Long Beach as where to build a new park and expansion. (WestCot/Disney Sea LB).

Of course, we all know that Anaheim won (and it was expected, Long Beach was being used as a "Pawn").

But due to a LOT of political influence in Anaheim, and then seeing how Disneyland Paris failed, we ended up with DCA instead of WestCot.

So what we got in 2001 (and I am going to just address DCA, and not the full Resort Expansion) was a mess, due to so many reasons, mainly due to the current attitude of the Disney Execs in charge at the time. I truly want to write a book about the time, and alas, there are some legal issues about NDA's that prevent me for saying everything I want to admit to, but let me just say, I have met and have discussions with at least 5 MAJOR execs that worked in the 90's,early 2000's but now no longer with Disney, and yes, we are talking even the guy that appeared on the Wonderful World of Disney when NBC was broadcasting the TV series. (My first time with him was at the Anaheim Convention Center as part of the Annual Stockholder meeting that year, I got 5 minutes to talk to him shortly after he became CEO). My last meeting was bizarre, but requested by his staff, as they are working on some historical stuff. But about 45 minutes in a group of his staff, and of course the boss, and little old me. Private dining room, and I wasn't allowed any recording devices, though they had one. As far as I know, it hasn't been used. I wish I could tell you some of his answers, but NDA's say NO!, let's just say, in retrospect, we all had some good laughs and the boss admitted that some mistakes were made.

So with that "History" said, what would "I" do, and just me, has no bearing on anyone else.

OK, we all know that Soarin' was the only real WestCot attraction that was saved in the conversion to DCA.

We also know that Grizzly Peak was picked as the large "Weenie" (Main visual image, like the castles at Disneyland parks).

So where to go from there. I don't think anyone wants to touch the Grand Californian location. (I know many that want a major internal upgrade, which won't be happening for at least a decade).

We can't go West due to Disneyland Drive.

South, maybe a bit, but less than most people can think, you need to have some access roads and internal parking. One option is to remove the DCA backstage offices off Harbor, but that would cost quite a bit.

So we are landlocked (except maybe a bit of room where the current Toy Story Bus drop off area is north of Monsters. Inc.)

So what to do with what we can work with.

Grizzly Peak won't go anywhere due to costs, ToT will be redressed, but also won't go anywhere (weird to see one of my stories being brought back and mentioned today, when Gallagher was the host of the Media Event opening the Tower). Also Screamin' is just too big and does have a good capacity an hour to remove. And then the "lake", aka World of Color, won't get removed. (Of course, can always be upgraded in the future). But IMHO, anything else is fair game as to what to keep, update or remove.

Let's start with the West side (aka Paradise Pier). Little Mermaid is a Upgrade option in a few years, as new movies come out. Easy to redress.

As a Coaster/Amusement Park fan in general, I don't like saying this, but everything else (besides Screamin') is fair game to demolish, except Midway Mania, which is another Update option.

So how do you remake an area with a large roller coaster, two dark rides and a large water feature? That is why folks are paid to design things.... But those are the things that need to stay, everything else can be sold off to other parks and just torn down.

Then let move to the Grizzly Peak area... Now we have Grizzly River Run, and since it is tied into the Mountain, keep, or maybe a minor upgrade, but due to the ride mechanics (rafts), nothing much you can do.

So we have the Redwood Creek area, that is easily demolish, use it for the GCH as expansion for the Hotel, or for something new. It was built as a "filler" area for DCA 1.0.

As for the Soarin' area, we know that was a success, so keep and maybe improve/upgrade the pre-show area and expanded queue.

So next is the Pacific Wharf area (And one of my pet peeves, those who watch too much Star Trek and call the area "Warf", there are no Klingons there!) Another "filler" area, and can be easily demolished for something better.

Now, as for the "a bug's land", well the movie is old, and easily the entire area, including its weak water play areas, etc. can be removed. The rides are slow loading and while nice for kids, showing its age. The "tough to be a bug" movie theater would more than likely be an "Update" due to expense, but heck, almost anything can replace it with some rethemeing.

As for Cars Land, well that is a keeper for the next decade or two. Yes, tweaks and improvements, but not much to do there.

The new main "Carthay Circle" area can use a couple of plusses, but there is more important areas (Paradise Pier ;)

So now we are down to the main area that people are talking about, Hollywood Land.

So we know the TOT building will remain though getting updated to a new theme.

The Hyperion Theater truly needs what was originally planned for, a working Theater, so adding support, such as restrooms and food service to host major events like Movie Premieres, TV filming, music concerts, etc. Still host a main Theme Park Show (say 30 minutes) most of the time, but update it to be much more flexible. Also add more elevators and escalators.

We can look at some of the land around the area, but as mentioned earlier, you can't remove all the backstage support. But for the right project. you could lose some of the backstage parking to the south, and even the support buildings off Harbor. Plus the possibility of expanding north to the current Transportation Hub.

We are looking at the old Muppets Movie Building, the former Who Wants to be a Millionaire building (was always designed as a quick fix), Monsters Inc. (redone once from SSL), and then the Hollywood Backstage Stage (former Dining facility, and now just support), and then the Animation Building/Playhouse Disney building, which is either update or demolish.

Note that this area is the focus for "Marvel Land" or what it will be called at the end.

But looking at the park, there isn't too much that has to stay off the table due to costs. Disney has promised to spend a lot of money to improve the park in a deal with the City of Anaheim, so the money is there. The big question, will Disney be willing to go a bit crazy and try to raise the bar.

Universal has already said they will with expansion plans on both Upper and Lower lots.

Knott's has also said they are willing. (Matt Ouimet has something up his sleeve, wish I could say what).

Six Flags Magic Mountain just broke ground on a new interactive Dark Ride.

So those are my thoughts, longer than originally planned when I started, but hopefully a good blueprint for the future.
 
My 6 y/o LOVES all things bugs land. He's on the cusp of moving beyond the kiddie rides: SM is his favorite but he refuses to even try Splash. My 8 y/o is well beyond these rides, but get a little nostalgic twinge. By far, both of them would call the Tuck and Roll's their favorite in the land. As an adult, I would say something is wrong with it, though. For example, I get more enjoyment out of Heimlich's Chew Chew train and it doesn't load as slowly. The bumper cars a don't work very well; they are entirely too slow to get a good bump into anyone else, which, of course, wouldn't be good for the little kids. Keeping in mind that Disney touts itself as the place where the entire family can enjoy themselves, the bumper cars just don't seem to fit.

As far as the Fun Wheel goes, you couldn't pay me enough money to ever go on that thing, but as a visual, I want it to stay.
 
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DS and I rode the bumper cars one evening while killing time for our Soarin' FP. Those things had to be the slowest bumper cars in the history of bumper cars! Honestly, Bugs Land as a whole seemed to be kinda dead. There were very few guests in that area of CA.

I'd add Goofy's SS for an update in the comfort area. That thing was a jerky mess!
 
None of it needs to go. There should be a good balance of attractions for all ages and thrill levels. DCA is finally at a point where that is the case.

Every attraction right now has some appeal to a group of people. Everything doesn't need to be exciting, thrilling, or cutting edge.
 
None of it needs to go. There should be a good balance of attractions for all ages and thrill levels. DCA is finally at a point where that is the case.

Every attraction right now has some appeal to a group of people. Everything doesn't need to be exciting, thrilling, or cutting edge.

So are you OK with a Knott's like park, or do you expect more from Disney, since they charge a LOT more to visit?

Sorry, but a playground, spinners and lots of filler is not what I expect for the price.

Heck, Knott's has better food, better AP perks including a Soda Cup that allows free sodas all year, and even the voyage of the Iron Reef is better (based on insiders and techs) than Midway Mania.

Knott's also has a lot more attractions than DCA. Good Shows and character interaction.

People in charge who care, and are constantly improving the park with just simple things like a new casual sitting area near the Train Station.

A Knott's basic Season Pass (expires the end of the year) is $90, and if you buy the 2017 pass, you can visit once in 2016 at no extra charge. 9 monthly payments of $10 with no interest. For just another $16, you can get the Combo pass including the Water Park (which is getting a couple of new slides in 2017).

$189 gets you the Platinum Pass including parking, and any Cedar Fair Park in the US and Canada will accept the pass, including two Northern California Pass.

Plus NO blockout dates (Knott's is closed on Christmas so the employees can get the day off).

So if Disney wants to be the PREMIUM park, they need to do better at DCA.

This Summer Ghost Town Live was great, especially for locals. And many of the actors also work at Disneyland/DCA. And to a tee, everyone of them that I know have said they preferred working at Knott's, where they got better interaction with guests and more "relaxed, fun" feel over the corporate stress at Disney.

If you look at who has moved from Disney to Knott's, you find Billy Hill and the Hillbillies, the Glass Blower, and even Steve Martin (yes, that is decades ago, but he started at Disneyland, and got a better job at Knott's performing at the Bird Cage Theater with many other famous folks).

And then we can talk about Universal and the new Wizardly World of Harry Potter, and upcoming additions to both the Upper and Lower Lots.

So for most folks, they want to see change and improvements to get their "money's worth" in buying tickets/passes.
 
So are you OK with a Knott's like park, or do you expect more from Disney, since they charge a LOT more to visit?

Sorry, but a playground, spinners and lots of filler is not what I expect for the price.

Heck, Knott's has better food, better AP perks including a Soda Cup that allows free sodas all year, and even the voyage of the Iron Reef is better (based on insiders and techs) than Midway Mania.

Knott's also has a lot more attractions than DCA. Good Shows and character interaction.

People in charge who care, and are constantly improving the park with just simple things like a new casual sitting area near the Train Station.

A Knott's basic Season Pass (expires the end of the year) is $90, and if you buy the 2017 pass, you can visit once in 2016 at no extra charge. 9 monthly payments of $10 with no interest. For just another $16, you can get the Combo pass including the Water Park (which is getting a couple of new slides in 2017).

$189 gets you the Platinum Pass including parking, and any Cedar Fair Park in the US and Canada will accept the pass, including two Northern California Pass.

Plus NO blockout dates (Knott's is closed on Christmas so the employees can get the day off).

So if Disney wants to be the PREMIUM park, they need to do better at DCA.

This Summer Ghost Town Live was great, especially for locals. And many of the actors also work at Disneyland/DCA. And to a tee, everyone of them that I know have said they preferred working at Knott's, where they got better interaction with guests and more "relaxed, fun" feel over the corporate stress at Disney.

If you look at who has moved from Disney to Knott's, you find Billy Hill and the Hillbillies, the Glass Blower, and even Steve Martin (yes, that is decades ago, but he started at Disneyland, and got a better job at Knott's performing at the Bird Cage Theater with many other famous folks).

And then we can talk about Universal and the new Wizardly World of Harry Potter, and upcoming additions to both the Upper and Lower Lots.

So for most folks, they want to see change and improvements to get their "money's worth" in buying tickets/passes.

What he heck does Knott's have to do with this? That park is super lame, sorry. We can get in there free once a year, and we never go because the one time we did, we were seriously turned off by how low budget it was and the crowds and employees are not friendly either. On the contrary we go to DCA a few times a month and we all have a fabulous time. You might love Knott's. We don't. Different strokes.

Disney still does well by incorporating theme into their off the shelf rides and there is a place for those even in a Disney park. Heck, most "dark rides" at Disney are just a version of the classic carnival ride through experience.

DCA just went through a massive overhaul and added a bunch of new things and rethemed others. The park is popular. At this time, we know they will be adding more thrills in Marvel land. Keep the smaller rides because kids enjoy them. My own kids are 10&12 and prefer DCA. They like almost every ride there (not Screamin', ToT or GRR though).
 





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