Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

[cmrdgrs]

LOL! They are literally reading through this thread and throwing our suppositions at us . They are scrambling to try to save the business and destroying it with their one-size-fits-all ridiculous voucher scheme.

Why in the world are they not looking at which situations are salvageable (eg owner can return funds with points still usable, or owners who can rebook their renter)??? Dealing with those, then seeing which situations are a write off and making renters whole themselves??? They’re all over the map!!! And they’ve had a month to start to sort this out

This is what I've been thinking too. They clearly seem disorganized and inconsistent

 

[starry_solo]

That was great advice and a good starting place. Thank you.
I was paid by Capital Technologies but it even has David's picture from the web site next to it. I do not seeing anything about family/friends or goods/services. I will be grateful for any further assistance.


Capitol Technologies
Nov 29, 2019Payment Received
Loading transaction details for
Capitol Technologies
Nov 29, 2019Payment Received

Paid byCapitol Technologies800-610-5791http://www.dvcrequest.comdavid@dvcrequest.com

payment received is not good. That usually means goods or services. Open the transaction to see if a fee was taken out.

usually when it’s friends/family, it should say “money received”

 

[izzy]

I’m an owner and have never rented my points before but have considered it. I was planning on using David’s if I did, but you can rest assured that I won’t do that now given how he is treating both the owners and the renters. He is trying to screw both of them. I think one of the previous posters had it right when they said he is having cash flow problems. He is trying to grab cash from whoever he can at this point. I predict bankruptcy in the near future as he won’t be able to keep his Ponzi scheme going for very long.

 

[cvjw]

I just looked back thru my PayPal transactions and all the money from David’s say payment received. Money that my son just sent me says money received.

 

[Madame]

Mine is the Canadian version of PayPal (I rarely use it). Under two transactions with businesses it states « payment » and describes the service / good. The payment from David’s says « payment received. » No other details. And way past six months. Almost 10.

 

[dsnymnkyuncle]

Thank you, I appreciate your help.

I don't understand how Paypal charge back works but I have only used paypal 1 time since moving the money from David and that was a couple of weeks ago to buy books.

I think removing all financing information from paypal and then ending my account is the safe/best thing to do. Today I reached out to the renter who said they had no contact from David other than the 'offer for certificate is coming'.

Not only am I starting to believe I don't want to be associated with the way this Dave mess is devolving and misleading people I am starting to see my self interest differently now.

payment received is not good. That usually means goods or services. Open the transaction to see if a fee was taken out.

usually when it’s friends/family, it should say “money received”

 

[Dracula]

Thank you, I appreciate your help.

I don't understand how Paypal charge back works but I have only used paypal 1 time since moving the money from David and that was a couple of weeks ago to buy books.

I think removing all financing information from paypal and then ending my account is the safe/best thing to do. Today I reached out to the renter who said they had no contact from David other than the 'offer for certificate is coming'.

Not only am I starting to believe I don't want to be associated with the way this Dave mess is devolving and misleading people I am starting to see my self interest differently now.

That would not really work, PayPal knows who you are and will notify you in case you need to reimburse them. It may be best to keep the account open, because it is used on many websites, including eBay, and they are more likely to side with a loyal customer. Save a print-out of the website that says that owners get paid the 30% remainder whether the guest checks in or not. I seriously doubt PayPal is going to help David recover payments from thousands of customers for transactions that are excluded by their seller’s protection policy.

 

[Galun]

No! If David’s initiated a PayPal chargeback against the owner, the owner will need those funds! This is not a handshake deal world we live in.

I don't think this is a concern if the owner is not trying to double dip (by keeping the 70% and the refunded points).

 

[Galun]

I don't see how either but I know almost nothing about pay pal. And a short time ago I got an email from David (that was supposed to clarify the confusion of their prior email) that states the Disney closed the resorts because the parks were closed. And that as an owner who picked Disney to make these decision I was responsible for it. David did not go to the impossibility or frustration of purpose but to me the thread was implicit. Now I am wondering how the pay pal works and if David could just charge back the 70% I have. This would be a fine to do on top of the possibility of losing points. The yellow highlight was in the original.

"if DVC cancels the reservation due to the parks being closed we will not be able to send the final 30% unless the points are rented to a new guest.

To further explain why we must hold back the 30% if DVC cancels the reservation.
In referring to the Agreement that you the DVC Owner has made with David’s Vacation Club Rentals for the rental of your points. I would like to draw your attention to paragraph 5(g)

1. The DVC Owner agrees to be responsible for: (1-6 deleted by me)
   1. 
      
   2. 
      
   3. 
      
   4. 
      
   5. 
      
   6. 
      
   7. Honoring all reservations made for which funds (partial or full) have been remitted to DVC Owner

When you purchased your real estate interest with the Disney Vacation Club you gave them full rights to make decisions for you as an association member. The Disney Vacation Club decided on behalf of all association members to close the Resorts. Thus as an associate member you agreed to close the resort.

Your issue is with the association and the person you elected to represent you, not with David’s Vacation Club Rentals nor the guest who paid you funds to have a room at a Disney Vacation Club Resort."

If he sent this to an owner, he is desperate and no longer care about goodwill. This is a sinking ship.

If I were a renter I'd file a chargeback while I still can.

 

[AaronEuth]

Assuming the Rental Broker's survive this, I fully expect that going forward they will have a policy in plain to rent points in the first 8 months of their current use year; and keep reservations fully refundable. Those points would all be in a state in which they are able to be canceled and bankable. Payment terms would probably have to be 100% at check in, held in escrow.

Maybe they will have a section, for distressed points which will be non refundable. With distressed points being any point that would not be bankable if reservation cancelled.

Ultimately, I expect the rental market to take a huge hit. Owners aren't going to be interested in possibly losing points.

 

[Galun]

In my history it has no description. Other companies do.

He paid owners through payment for goods and services, and avoided transaction fees to the "seller" by paying with a bank account.

As a seller I had dealt with Paypal investigations before. When the buyer (or seller, it goes both ways) files a dispute, they look for the item and shipment tracking. Plenty of sellers had been hit by return fraud when the buyer "returns" a package filled with rocks but with tracking, and PayPal ruled against the seller and gave the refund to the buyer. They care only about tracking number. This clearly does not apply in this situation.

So they might go after services not performed. I had never deal with a PayPal investigation for services, but in my experience they will need a description of the services rendered (just like in goods where they need what was sold and tracking). Well, David's never filled in a description of what the payment was for.

If the owner is not intentionally trying to double dip (keep the points AND the 70%), I don't think they need to worry too much about a chargeback from PayPal.

 

[McCrae]

Assuming the Rental Broker's survive this, I fully expect that going forward they will have a policy in plain to rent points in the first 8 months of their current use year; and keep reservations fully refundable. Those points would all be in a state in which they are able to be canceled and bankable. Payment terms would probably have to be 100% at check in, held in escrow.

Maybe they will have a section, for distressed points which will be non refundable. With distressed points being any point that would not be bankable if reservation cancelled.

Ultimately, I expect the rental market to take a huge hit. Owners aren't going to be interested in possibly losing points.

I don think many owners would sign up for that.

 

[YourEveryDayAdam]

deleted

 

[suemom2kay]

The contract is pretty clear. Unless there is negligence on the part of the member that causes you not to have a room when you arrive, there is no refund. You are encouraged to get insurance for you trip because there are no refunds in case something happens.

The member can choose to help if they can but they are not obligated to.

I would allow the renter to reschedule up to when the points expire. I have points rented out for the last week in April and the 1st week in may. The points expire on May 31st. Unless the renter can reschedule to use all before May 31st, they are out of luck.

I bet a court of law would find your thinking flawed. You can't rent what you don't have. If the resorts are not open in May you are renting a non-existent reservation and that is awful. I am an owner and rented several reservations this year. I have reached out to all of my renters offering rescheduling or refunds. This is not easy for me, but it is the right thing to do.

 

[McCrae]

I bet a court of law would find your thinking flawed. You can't rent what you don't have. If the resorts are not open in May you are renting a non-existent reservation and that is awful. I am an owner and rented several reservations this year. I have reached out to all of my renters offering rescheduling or refunds. This is not easy for me, but it is the right thing to do.

Did you rent privately or did you use a broker?

 

[DisneyBB]

Lots of great information on this thread with lots of opinions.

My gut is telling me to contact my renters and ask them what they want to do. I would love to Reschedule them myself or even refund the 70% directly to them. However my head is saying that I would open myself up to no end of problems. Mine is time sensitive so I need to act or lose my points and potentially my money.

David has said it is ok to contact the renters but should I copy him in to ensure there is no breach?

 

[McCrae]

Lots of great information on this thread with lots of opinions.

My gut is telling me to contact my renters and ask them what they want to do. I would love to Reschedule them myself or even refund the 70% directly to them. However my head is saying that I would open myself up to no end of problems. Mine is time sensitive so I need to act or lose my points and potentially my money.

David has said it is ok to contact the renters but should I copy him in to ensure there is no breach?

I have similar thoughts to you, but also share concerns about potential new problems we could end up facing. By going directly to the renters you could end up taking the liability for fixing this problem away from David's and taking it on yourself. You could end up with demands not only for a refund, but additional costs such as flights.

My thought have moved on a bit...my thinking has changed.

We pay David a commission to make renting as easy as possible and avoid dealing with any problems. Now is his turn to work for the fee he has been paid.

For the renters I think there is a good possibility that they will be able to get a full refund from David's via a credit card charge back. I think they will be fine.

As for David's I don't feel I owe him anything. If anything he owes me money.

I think it makes sense to move on a draw a line under this.

 

[dsnymnkyuncle]

I agree with what is right to do here, in a moral sense. But David told me the exact opposite. David does not want me to contact the renter (trip reservation at the end of May).

Yet David told me precisely that if my reservation is cancelled by Disney and David can not re-rent the points by the end of my use year then I lose the 30%. David has stated repeated the renter will not get any cash refund.

Of the three parties only David has no claim on the 30%. Yet in writing and in public David has proclaimed he is keeping it.

Lots of great information on this thread with lots of opinions.

My gut is telling me to contact my renters and ask them what they want to do. I would love to Reschedule them myself or even refund the 70% directly to them. However my head is saying that I would open myself up to no end of problems. Mine is time sensitive so I need to act or lose my points and potentially my money.

David has said it is ok to contact the renters but should I copy him in to ensure there is no breach?

 

[Sandisw]

Assuming the Rental Broker's survive this, I fully expect that going forward they will have a policy in plain to rent points in the first 8 months of their current use year; and keep reservations fully refundable. Those points would all be in a state in which they are able to be canceled and bankable. Payment terms would probably have to be 100% at check in, held in escrow.

Maybe they will have a section, for distressed points which will be non refundable. With distressed points being any point that would not be bankable if reservation cancelled.

Ultimately, I expect the rental market to take a huge hit. Owners aren't going to be interested in possibly losing points.

If that is the model, I think he will have trouble finding as many owners who will engage with him,

If I decide to rent again, I won’t be using him. And, if I wanted to, I certainly wouldn’t in a refundable situation.

Id rent on my own and take less.

 

[disneypharm]

Lots of great information on this thread with lots of opinions.

My gut is telling me to contact my renters and ask them what they want to do. I would love to Reschedule them myself or even refund the 70% directly to them. However my head is saying that I would open myself up to no end of problems. Mine is time sensitive so I need to act or lose my points and potentially my money.

David has said it is ok to contact the renters but should I copy him in to ensure there is no breach?

@DisneyBB Thank you for being so supportive of the renter. Please be aware that there are several owners on this thread who have clearly mentioned that they might re-rent the returned points and keeping their 70%. Some of these owners might be giving you advise even though they are not legal experts! I believe that most owners are like you willing to help but they are afraid to reach out because of these posts. If you have a time sensitive reservation and David has mentioned that he is ok with you rescheduling the renter, I would urge you to reach out to both Davids and your renter. Many owners have been successful rescheduling their renters recently.

Just to add, if I were an owner, I will not be sending my 70% to Davids for him to keep and give a voucher to the renter. Please just try to reschedule the renter.