DAS for those with Cognitive disabilities only?

[aaarcher86]

But having it online doesn't help the poor souls waiting in line and being denied and not knowing how to move on with the rest of their trip.

No, but a brochure being handed out would go out to someone in line. They'd still have to go through the same process in person.

Having it online it can be seen before a trip. If someone knows they have to go to city hall to get a DAS they've probably done at least a little research.

 

[tinkerpea]

I totally sympathise I've been to disneyland twice, and both times this is the way i was treated,
I was also actually told that the DAS was only for cognitive disabilities and that I would have to find a way to enjoy tye attractions without it.
The first time I went was when it was the gac and I was told the same thing, all they kept saying was that the lines are suitable for wheelchairs,my issue has nothing to do with mobility and no matter how many times I told them that was the answer I got.

 

[KPeveler]

I have had more problems recently as well renewing my DAS at Disneyland. I use a wheelchair, and so they think that should be all i need. I have stopped trying to renew my pass in DL at all, as they also have the "wheelchair return time" option for the 9 top rides, and they keep telling me that should be sufficient. Not only do you have to go to the rides to get the WC return time (as opposed to using the kiosks), but there is a limited return window for the WC return times, unlike the DAS which is "anytime after." Also, if I want to ride things that are NOT one of those top 9, then I am out of luck. Basically nothing I say seems to make a difference in DL, as all they see is the wheelchair.

I have much better experiences in DCA, since all of their queues are wheelchair accessible. They do not have another system they think "should be enough." So it is easier for me to explain why things like the RSR line would affect me so badly.

I understand why they want to limit the number of DAS'es given out to those who have no other way to enjoy the parks. But some CMs I think are being a little overzealous in ferreting out the "fakers."

 

[cmwade77]

I have had more problems recently as well renewing my DAS at Disneyland. I use a wheelchair, and so they think that should be all i need. I have stopped trying to renew my pass in DL at all, as they also have the "wheelchair return time" option for the 9 top rides, and they keep telling me that should be sufficient. Not only do you have to go to the rides to get the WC return time (as opposed to using the kiosks), but there is a limited return window for the WC return times, unlike the DAS which is "anytime after." Also, if I want to ride things that are NOT one of those top 9, then I am out of luck. Basically nothing I say seems to make a difference in DL, as all they see is the wheelchair.

I have much better experiences in DCA, since all of their queues are wheelchair accessible. They do not have another system they think "should be enough." So it is easier for me to explain why things like the RSR line would affect me so badly.

I understand why they want to limit the number of DAS'es given out to those who have no other way to enjoy the parks. But some CMs I think are being a little overzealous in ferreting out the "fakers."

I don't know how mobile you are, but my recommendation is always if you can walk a short distance, leave the wheelchair just outside guest relations and go in. I know it sounds odd, but I have seen it help many people.

Additionally, it's a theme park, so from this point on, I am thinking of seriously just making sure my camera is on and recording whenever interacting with guest relations CMs.

Believe me, I understand wanting to weed out the fakers, but they can't do it to the point of excluding those that need the assistance.

Luckily, I am able to standup for myself, at least to a point, but I know that there are many out there who aren't and I worry about them as well.

 

[cmwade77]

I totally sympathise I've been to disneyland twice, and both times this is the way i was treated,
I was also actually told that the DAS was only for cognitive disabilities and that I would have to find a way to enjoy tye attractions without it.
The first time I went was when it was the gac and I was told the same thing, all they kept saying was that the lines are suitable for wheelchairs,my issue has nothing to do with mobility and no matter how many times I told them that was the answer I got.

Exactly, they asked me if I tried a mobility device and I was blunt with them, I have tried them and they only make matters worse, as it becomes even harder to get out of the queues. And as I tried to point out to them, there are plenty of places in the various queues that it is not physically possible to get out of that you get directed around with a DAS.

 

[KPeveler]

I don't know how mobile you are, but my recommendation is always if you can walk a short distance, leave the wheelchair just outside guest relations and go in. I know it sounds odd, but I have seen it help many people.

Additionally, it's a theme park, so from this point on, I am thinking of seriously just making sure my camera is on and recording whenever interacting with guest relations CMs.

Believe me, I understand wanting to weed out the fakers, but they can't do it to the point of excluding those that need the assistance.

Luckily, I am able to standup for myself, at least to a point, but I know that there are many out there who aren't and I worry about them as well.

At one point I could have done that, but not anymore... and they should understand a WC does not solve everything. I find that giving specific examples of queues I cannot do (RSR, TSM, Soarin, CS, etc) and why helps some. Once they realize it is not just one or two rides and a regular FP is not going to solve my problem, they tend to be more helpful. It also helps when I am very specific about what will happen to me *in the line* during an average wait. The more specific I am, the better. I have found I can say that "if I do X I will end up in the hospital" and they do not respond as well as "When I do X, I will end up puking in your line."

I am going to keep fighting for understanding that people can be in a wheelchair AND have additional needs.

 

[cmwade77]

Oh, definitely keep that fight up, it's necessary. I just figure if possible, make it easier on yourself until they get the message loud and clear.

To me it seems they don't learn from their past mistakes. When they first introduced the GAC, they did things that are practically identical to what they are doing now until the courts ordered them to expand the GAC because they were not complying with the ADA. The only differences were the GAC had stamps to let the cast members know what assistance was needed, such as visually impaired needing help through darker queues and close seating for shows. And the GACs didn't have return times. So I am guessing that the courts would feel saying that the DAS is for cognitive disabilities only would not comply with ADA law. The problem is that this time the official policy states that it is for all nonapparent disabilities and it's the guest relations CMs who are not doing things properly, where as when the GACs were first introduced, official policy said cognitive disabilities only.

 

[OurBigTrip]

Oh, definitely keep that fight up, it's necessary. I just figure if possible, make it easier on yourself until they get the message loud and clear.

To me it seems they don't learn from their past mistakes. When they first introduced the GAC, they did things that are practically identical to what they are doing now until the courts ordered them to expand the GAC because they were not complying with the ADA. The only differences were the GAC had stamps to let the cast members know what assistance was needed, such as visually impaired needing help through darker queues and close seating for shows. And the GACs didn't have return times. So I am guessing that the courts would feel saying that the DAS is for cognitive disabilities only would not comply with ADA law. The problem is that this time the official policy states that it is for all nonapparent disabilities and it's the guest relations CMs who are not doing things properly, where as when the GACs were first introduced, official policy said cognitive disabilities only.

When did any court EVER order Disney to expand the GAC? And when did any official policy for GAC EVER say it was for cognitive disabilities only?

 

[SueM in MN]

When did any court EVER order Disney to expand the GAC? And when did any official policy for GAC EVER say it was for cognitive disabilities only?

Not that I am aware of.

If this is correct, a link would be appreciated.

 

[asc]

What is rather ironic about this articulated view the SM is that the current DAS system is very poor IMO for its ability to accommodate our child with cognitive disabilities. What a joke.

 

[cmwade77]

When did any court EVER order Disney to expand the GAC? And when did any official policy for GAC EVER say it was for cognitive disabilities only?

As for the GAC only being for those with cognitive disa, That is what I was told by Disney when I wrote them when the GAC was first introduced. I know I no longer have that email, as I deleted it once it was outdated information.

I will have to see if I can find the link to the court order (thinking about it, it may have simply been a settlement, but it was still legally binding) to expand the GAC, back in the day I kept a copy with me when going to the parks. But this was many years ago and I am not sure where it went off to, but I should eventually be able to dig it up. Won't be for at least a few days though.
Edit:

I found some of the information:

I honestly can't remember all of the details, but it was related to this case, or rather to the incident that the case is about:
http://www.care2.com/causes/disneyland-sued-for-leaving-disabled-man-on-its-a-small-world-ride.html

There were actually a lot of changes, at least at Disneyland that were related to the original incident, some were due to court orders, many others were Disney trying to show that they took the complaint seriously.

 

[OurBigTrip]

As for the GAC only being for those with cognitive disa, That is what I was told by Disney when I wrote them when the GAC was first introduced. I know I no longer have that email, as I deleted it once it was outdated information.

I will have to see if I can find the link to the court order (thinking about it, it may have simply been a settlement, but it was still legally binding) to expand the GAC, back in the day I kept a copy with me when going to the parks. But this was many years ago and I am not sure where it went off to, but I should eventually be able to dig it up. Won't be for at least a few days though.
Edit:

I found some of the information:

I honestly can't remember all of the details, but it was related to this case, or rather to the incident that the case is about:
http://www.care2.com/causes/disneyland-sued-for-leaving-disabled-man-on-its-a-small-world-ride.html

There were actually a lot of changes, at least at Disneyland that were related to the original incident, some were due to court orders, many others were Disney trying to show that they took the complaint seriously.

This case had nothing whatsoever to do with the GAC.

 

[OurBigTrip]

What is rather ironic about this articulated view the SM is that the current DAS system is very poor IMO for its ability to accommodate our child with cognitive disabilities. What a joke.

The DAS provides equal access, which is required, and the ability to experience more attractions than those without a DAS, which isn't required.

 

[gap2368]

What is rather ironic about this articulated view the SM is that the current DAS system is very poor IMO for its ability to accommodate our child with cognitive disabilities. What a joke.

why do you think it is poor what can disney do better?

 

[KPeveler]

As for the GAC only being for those with cognitive disa, That is what I was told by Disney when I wrote them when the GAC was first introduced. I know I no longer have that email, as I deleted it once it was outdated information.

I will have to see if I can find the link to the court order (thinking about it, it may have simply been a settlement, but it was still legally binding) to expand the GAC, back in the day I kept a copy with me when going to the parks. But this was many years ago and I am not sure where it went off to, but I should eventually be able to dig it up. Won't be for at least a few days though.
Edit:

I found some of the information:

I honestly can't remember all of the details, but it was related to this case, or rather to the incident that the case is about:
http://www.care2.com/causes/disneyland-sued-for-leaving-disabled-man-on-its-a-small-world-ride.html

There were actually a lot of changes, at least at Disneyland that were related to the original incident, some were due to court orders, many others were Disney trying to show that they took the complaint seriously.

That case was about appropriate services in an emergency related to guests with disabilities and offloading during a ride stoppage. It had nothing to do with a GAC.

 

[cmwade77]

That case was about appropriate services in an emergency related to guests with disabilities and offloading during a ride stoppage. It had nothing to do with a GAC.

I could be wrong about which case it was, but I am pretty sure that it was related to this incident, but like I said, it is going to take me at least a few days to dig out all of the details, it's just the one that jumped to my mind for a lot of the more positive changes that had occurred with accessibility.

why do you think it is poor what can disney do better?

At th risk of sounding like a broken record, instead of issuing return times, make the wait occur between attractions. Yes, you would be able to go straight to the first attraction with a minimal wait. But let's say you are going on Jungle Cruise at 11:30 and it has a 60 minute wait. You would go to the alternate entrance, they would scan your ticket when you first get in line and it would say it is valid as you hadn't gone on anything else. You would need to wait 60 minutes plus the length of the ride from the time that you got in line, in this case it would be 12:30 before you could use your DAS again. If you try to go too early, it would simply tell the cast member to have you come back at or after 12:30. If you waited until 12:30, you would be able to get on and the process would start again.

This would eliminate the need to get return times, allow Disney to save money by not needing as much staffing to man the kiosks throughout the park and by strategically combining with FP, those with cognitive disabilities won't know the difference. Yet, it would keep the elements that are helping to eliminate abuse and eliminates the need for the extra traveling throughout the parks that the present system causes.

 

[gap2368]

I could be wrong about which case it was, but I am pretty sure that it was related to this incident, but like I said, it is going to take me at least a few days to dig out all of the details, it's just the one that jumped to my mind for a lot of the more positive changes that had occurred with accessibility.


At th risk of sounding like a broken record, instead of issuing return times, make the wait occur between attractions. Yes, you would be able to go straight to the first attraction with a minimal wait. But let's say you are going on Jungle Cruise at 11:30 and it has a 60 minute wait. You would go to the alternate entrance, they would scan your ticket when you first get in line and it would say it is valid as you hadn't gone on anything else. You would need to wait 60 minutes plus the length of the ride from the time that you got in line, in this case it would be 12:30 before you could use your DAS again. If you try to go too early, it would simply tell the cast member to have you come back at or after 12:30. If you waited until 12:30, you would be able to get on and the process would start again.

This would eliminate the need to get return times, allow Disney to save money by not needing as much staffing to man the kiosks throughout the park and by strategically combining with FP, those with cognitive disabilities won't know the difference. Yet, it would keep the elements that are helping to eliminate abuse and eliminates the need for the extra traveling throughout the parks that the present system causes.

it disney world the kiosks are not for the DAS so they would still have them, and what would you do about a ride that has a 90 minute wait or a 20 minute wait letting someone walk on a ride when they get there in the middle of the day would be cutting in front of a lot of people 7DMT had an almost 2 hour wait last week so you get there walk on ( or better yet that is your last ride of the day) so no wait for you and other had a 2 hour wait

I agree the DAS is not a one size fits all ( witch disney is trying to do) but there is fair and extra

 

[SueM in MN]

That case was about appropriate services in an emergency related to guests with disabilities and offloading during a ride stoppage. It had nothing to do with a GAC.

yes.
And, it was in 2011, at least 12 years after GAC was put into place.
I started on the DISBOARDS in 1998 (although I think my profile says 1999 because of a couple of server changes and issue in the first years). This disABILITIES forum began in 1999 and even then, we were discussing the different stamps on GACs. With server issues, we lost the 1999 -2000 posts from this board. So, the very first post I could find is this post and answer from 2001 about GAC at Disneyland and talk about physical disabilities. (It was called Special Assistance Pass at DL at that point.)

My grandfather is going to need one of these passes (had chemo and surgery in past months), and I am wondering how they work? Do I stand in line and they have him join me when I get to the front? Is there a place where we all wait together, and how would we know when it is our turn to board?

It is still called the Special Assistance Pass at Disneyland, unles they changed it in the last few months. You get it at the Town Hall, right in the Town Square inside the park. Since few lines at DL are mainstreamed, you will be allowed to use the alternate entrance at most attractions, which is marked with a blue wheelchair sign. You may stay together as a party, it is limited to 4 or 5 people, I forget.

I hope you have a good trip. Feel free to ask more questions.

"My brain takes a vacation just to give my heart more room..."
teri@iluvdisney.com

http://www.disboards.com/threads/wh...-disneyland-with-guest-assistance-pass.15369/

Here's a link to another 2001 thread that talks about GAC at WDW regarding an older man who would not be able to get around well.
http://www.disboards.com/threads/what-is-a-guest-assitance-pass.15336/

 

[SueM in MN]

it disney world the kiosks are not for the DAS so they would still have them, and what would you do about a ride that has a 90 minute wait or a 20 minute wait letting someone walk on a ride when they get there in the middle of the day would be cutting in front of a lot of people 7DMT had an almost 2 hour wait last week so you get there walk on ( or better yet that is your last ride of the day) so no wait for you and other had a 2 hour wait

I agree the DAS is not a one size fits all ( witch disney is trying to do) but there is fair and extra

other people have posted the same things whenever this suggestion has come up.
It would be a complicated system and people have posted real wait time examples showing that this way would/could end up cutting the total wait time a lot. That would make it more 'desirable' for people who want to abuse it and also make people without disabilities more upset because they would feel it is 'preferential' treatment.

 

[asc]

The DAS provides equal access, which is required, and the ability to experience more attractions than those without a DAS, which isn't required.

It's pretty sad that you inferred that I expected more for my child. That's very sad. Oh well. And I don't need to bother with explaining why it did not work for us. This forum is less then welcoming.