DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[lanejudy]

Oh yes you did have to have family members with you. The entire party had to be present. I've used disability access for many years.

I'm not sure if everyone is talking about the same thing...

DAS has never required the entire party to be present to obtain a DAS Return Time. In the old days when it was on paper, a runner could go to the attraction for the Return Time so the DAS-holder didn't need to approach the attraction until it was time to ride. If someone traveled with a small party of just 1-2, it may have been necessary for the DAS-holder to also approach the queue for the Return Time though that was due to party dynamics and not a DAS requirement.

I'm not positive about "wheelchair return times" (without a DAS) but since there was the possibility of being let into the alternate entrance immediately, I would guess the whole party needed to be present.

Rider Switch requires the entire party to be present to set-up the switch.

I believe AQR expects the whole party to be present, and reports have been that most of the time the entire party is asked to at least try the queue with an accommodation offered to 1-2 if someone needs to leave.

 

[Hippomom]

In Disneyland, I have gone to Jungle cruise.. heck all the ones that will give local return times and never HAD to have Kiddo. I just had to have the app and show her pass first. We were there in May and it was still that way....

yes thats with Das not wheelchair. My point was if they don’t give you anything to designate your approved for accommodation it may not work as DAS had.

 

[TLSnell1981]

I'm not sure if everyone is talking about the same thing...

DAS has never required the entire party to be present to obtain a DAS Return Time. In the old days when it was on paper, a runner could go to the attraction for the Return Time so the DAS-holder didn't need to approach the attraction until it was time to ride. If someone traveled with a small party of just 1-2, it may have been necessary for the DAS-holder to also approach the queue for the Return Time though that was due to party dynamics and not a DAS requirement.

I'm not positive about "wheelchair return times" (without a DAS) but since there was the possibility of being let into the alternate entrance immediately, I would guess the whole party needed to be present.

Rider Switch requires the entire party to be present to set-up the switch.

I believe AQR expects the whole party to be present, and reports have been that most of the time the entire party is asked to at least try the queue with an accommodation offered to 1-2 if someone needs to leave.

I'm referring to the disability systems over the years... GAC, etc. There was a time you approached a CM and accommodations were made. Other changes made the entire party be present while still others required the disabled to present in person to receive a RT. Some decided it was unfair thus the many changes over the years.

I've lived it. It is difficult to maneuver the parks on wheels with physical limitations. It's hard when you can't see higher than a person's derrièie. No brakes but folks constantly running in front of you. Buses only accommodate one or two scooters...often a wait until space is free. It's no picnic.

Disney should decide whether of not virtual queues are effective in controlling return times. I'm guessing it only works for Lightening Lane Passes.

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

Disney should decide whether of not virtual queues are effective in controlling return times. I'm guessing it only works for Lightening Lane Passes.

The reason why virtual queues are only used sparingly is that there isn’t enough space in the parks to PUT the people who are waiting somewhere else. Imagine if there were no lines at all. The shops, walkways, restaurants, shows, etc would be mobbed. Perhaps not quite as bad as exiting after the fireworks, but given that not everyone stays in the parks that late it’s probably not a bad approximation of what it would be like at certain times of the day/year if no one had to physically wait in line.

Like it or not, Disney needs lines to help with crowd control.

 

[Tatebeck]

The reason why virtual queues are only used sparingly is that there isn’t enough space in the parks to PUT the people who are waiting somewhere else. Imagine if there were no lines at all. The shops, walkways, restaurants, shows, etc would be mobbed. Perhaps not quite as bad as exiting after the fireworks, but given that not everyone stays in the parks that late it’s probably not a bad approximation of what it would be like at certain times of the day/year if no one had to physically wait in line.

Like it or not, Disney needs lines to help with crowd control.

But they don't necessarily need any long lines. Ideally they would add enough attractions (and not increase capacity) to the point that everything could have a virtual queue and there would be a very small line after VQ for each ride and that's it. No long lines for anything. Probably not going to happen since they would most likely raise capacity as they add attractions, though we can wish!

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

But they don't necessarily need any long lines. Ideally they would add enough attractions (and not increase capacity) to the point that everything could have a virtual queue and there would be a very small line after VQ for each ride and that's it. No long lines for anything. Probably not going to happen since they would most likely raise capacity as they add attractions, though we can wish!

What you are talking about would probably require 5x the current number of attractions to absorb all of the excess, or several huge shows (but then people would be in/out in waves). How would Disney pay for that/where would they put said attractions without raising ticket prices and/or increasing park attendance?

It’s lovely in theory but wildly impractical in reality.

 

[lanejudy]

I'm referring to the disability systems over the years... GAC, etc. There was a time you approached a CM and accommodations were made. Other changes made the entire party be present while still others required the disabled to present in person to receive a RT. Some decided it was unfair thus the many changes over the years.

Ok, well you are going back a bit in history then if you are talking about GAC or earlier. I don't think we can really compare today to back then.

DAS has been in place since 2013 and since that time it never required the DAS-holder to be present to obtain a DAS Return Time. Or maybe you are talking about wheelchair return times, which are different, and yes I can see why the person with the disability/mobility device needed to be present since there is no other way to show an accommodation is needed.

Regardless, I don't really hold any credence to the statement that "some decided it was unfair" resulting in changes throughout the years. Varying reasons, but largely too many people using the accommodation, have caused the changes. That might be fraud, it might be overuse, in the case of mobility devices it's simply that the queues were redesigned to accommodate and thus no need to use an alternate entry (at most attractions.

I understand you don't like the new changes, but you are placing blame illogically. Nobody decided accommodations are "unfair" for those who truly need the accommodation. Alternative accommodations are being offered to those who do not qualify for DAS.

 

[Tatebeck]

What you are talking about would probably require 5x the current number of attractions to absorb all of the excess, or several huge shows (but then people would be in/out in waves). How would Disney pay for that/where would they put said attractions without raising ticket prices and/or increasing park attendance?

It’s lovely in theory but wildly impractical in reality.

Like I said, probably not going to happen, but it would be amazing! Looking it up it looks like Disney's yearly profit is around 30 billion right now lol. They could probably build a whole new park or two every year and still make profit... So they could definitely do it, but it wouldn't bring the highest return on their money so they won't.

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

Like I said, probably not going to happen, but it would be amazing! Looking it up it looks like Disney's yearly profit is around 30 billion right now lol. They could probably build a whole new park or two every year and still make profit... So they could definitely do it, but it wouldn't bring the highest return on their money so they won't.

Disney’s net income was $5bn in 2023 and $6.4bn on an LTM basis through Q1 2024, according to Bloomberg.

 

[Tatebeck]

Disney’s net income was $5bn in 2023 and $6.4bn on an LTM basis through Q1 2024, according to Bloomberg.

Hmm I wonder why different sources vary so much! I wonder if its just Disney vs Disney +all of Disney's shell companies? Or if some sites have made some errors lol. Either way that is a lot of profit they could be using.

 

[DiznyDiva]

I understand you don't like the new changes, but you are placing blame illogically. Nobody decided accommodations are "unfair" for those who truly need the accommodation. Alternative accommodations are being offered to those who do not qualify for DAS.

Sometimes it's easier to invent a boogie man than just deal with he reality of the situation. I get that. Sometimes it's even therapeutic.

IMO, the big thing is that many want special accommodations, not something anyone who is at the parks can access. But isn't that a discrimination in itself? They are unwilling to try what is offered because it is not what they are used to and they are deeply offended by being denied, so then it abuse. Disney only has to offer the accusations, it's up to the person to accept it not.

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

Hmm I wonder why different sources vary so much! I wonder if its just Disney vs Disney +all of Disney's shell companies? Or if some sites have made some errors lol. Either way that is a lot of profit they could be using.

Ok, serves me right for looking at FA on Bloomberg instead of going to the actual statements. I’m clearly being lazy/multitasking. They are using “adjusted” numbers.

https://thewaltdisneycompany.com/app/uploads/2024/02/2023-Annual-Report.pdf

Page 81 of the annual report shows $3.4bn of net income, and $2.4bn attributable to the Walt Disney company.

 

[Tatebeck]

Ok, serves me right for looking at FA on Bloomberg instead of going to the actual statements. I’m clearly being lazy/multitasking. They are using “adjusted” numbers.

https://thewaltdisneycompany.com/app/uploads/2024/02/2023-Annual-Report.pdf

Page 81 of the annual report shows $3.4bn of net income, and $2.4bn attributable to the Walt Disney company.

Yeah where I was looking looks like it only had the total revenue minus only the cost of services and cost of products (but not the selling, general, administrative etc or Depreciation and amortization, etc)

 

[HopperFan]

Ok, well you are going back a bit in history then if you are talking about GAC or earlier. I don't think we can really compare today to back then.

DAS has been in place since 2013 and since that time it never required the DAS-holder to be present to obtain a DAS Return Time. Or maybe you are talking about wheelchair return times, which are different, and yes I can see why the person with the disability/mobility device needed to be present since there is no other way to show an accommodation is needed.

Regardless, I don't really hold any credence to the statement that "some decided it was unfair" resulting in changes throughout the years. Varying reasons, but largely too many people using the accommodation, have caused the changes. That might be fraud, it might be overuse, in the case of mobility devices it's simply that the queues were redesigned to accommodate and thus no need to use an alternate entry (at most attractions.

I understand you don't like the new changes, but you are placing blame illogically. Nobody decided accommodations are "unfair" for those who truly need the accommodation. Alternative accommodations are being offered to those who do not qualify for DAS.

DS started to use the GAC starting about 20+ years ago. We could always send one person to get a return time. Once you had the card you were approved for X number of guests and they took no names. All that existed was the card so whoever was holding the card got the time. They would just write down a return time and you came back with no more than the X number of guests. From the time he has been approved he never had to go get a return time, we could always have someone else get it. Many times we were all together and he was there as we tried to keep our travel in the parks down, but he didn't have to be. They have always made getting return times as accessible as they could with the current technology.

 

[DiznyDiva]

Oh yes you did have to have family members with you. The entire party had to be present. I've used disability access for many years.

I was able to enjoy three-four attractions per day for my family . Is that abusive? If so the simple solution would be to limit the daily usage.

Are you talking with the wheelchairs or mobility devices? Then yes, you had to because anytime like with Jungle cruise and Pirates, you are lead to special loading area. If you re talking DAS without mobility issues, then no you don't. NEVER have had to have kiddo with me when I go and get the times.

I think that it is important to have the whole group there. It once again comes down to planning. Many times we will close one land out, so that we are not going back and forth. It comes down to what is important to you for your park experience. Having DAs does not stop you from having to walk all over the parks because rides go down, entrances are blocked(like during parades) and crowds are unpredictable.

They are not going to limit the daily usage of DAS, they are just, as we are seeing, going to limit those who they qualify for it. Since it is not something they HAVE to do, Disney has even right to limit it. There are other accommodations. Mobility was never supposed to be accepted and from now on will not be.People are, stubbornly because they can't accept what is now gone, just choosing not use them.

Abusive is subject term, but here is no doubt the DAS system was abused. Many are mad because now they have to actually explain why they should have it instead of just saying a diagnosis. That is where the true abuse started. No two conditions are the same. So explanations are required. That is not rude or insensitive.

Now, can Disney do better? You bet. It really needs to get on the same page with the DAS and frontline CMs. One set of rules for who gets return times and which attractions can give them, and who get the (whatever they are calling it) have your party wait and join at the merge and RTQ. That will come, Unfortunately that will make people less happy, because that will mean this new version is locked in for a awhile. It may relax, but old DAS is gone, just like all the versions before.

 

[DiznyDiva]

Newest change? Have seen screenshots and reports on multiple pages.

People now have to wait 120 days to reapply? Honestly, this makes sense to me and if confirmed and done by all CMs, good change. It gives those who have been denied a cooling off period to reassess and actually try the other accommodations. It also gives Disney time to really nail down it rules for the new program going forward, so all the inconsistencies stop.

Most of all it stops all those on Facebook and Tik Tok from endlessly calling back and encouraging others to do it as well. That is where much of the"CM was mean and rude to me " comes from. They keep trying and trying and getting angrier and angrier, making their stories more and more outlandish.

 

[Hippomom]

Sometimes it's easier to invent a boogie man than just deal with he reality of the situation. I get that. Sometimes it's even therapeutic.

IMO, the big thing is that many want special accommodations, not something anyone who is at the parks can access. But isn't that a discrimination in itself? They are unwilling to try what is offered because it is not what they are used to and they are deeply offended by being denied, so then it abuse. Disney only has to offer the accusations, it's up to the person to accept it not.

how do you know they are not willing to try? Ive seen a lot try, some worked many didn’t and most rides were very inconsistent snd confusing.
Many of the same people are getting accommodations everywhere they go.
And no other location has a problem accommodating them.

I don’t qualify (although I do get accommodations elsewhere)but I am fortunate to have a Pass so Im ok if i can’t ride I can’t ride. But many people spent thousands of Dollars on vacations that may not work for them any longer. So I do have empathy for those people.

 

[DiznyDiva]

how do you know they are not willing to try? Ive seen a lot try, some worked many didn’t and most rides were very inconsistent snd confusing.
Many of the same people are getting accommodations everywhere they go.
And no other location has a problem accommodating them.

I don’t qualify (although I do get accommodations elsewhere)but I am fortunate to have a Pass so Im ok if i can’t ride I can’t ride. But many people spent thousands of Dollars on vacations that may not work for them any longer. So I do have empathy for those people.

I know because so MANY of them are all over the Internet saying they calling back day after day after, never stepping foot into the parks. They are not hiding that they are literally calling back the same day over and over and telling others to do so.

Being accepted at different parks, by Disability and whatever means nothing to Disney. DAS is not something that is required. There are accommodations. If Disney suddenly got rid of DAS, then what? I suspect because then no body can have it, those people would suddenly find ways to adapt.

I have sympathy and compassion too. I also have a some concerns for those who have such extreme panic attacks, PTSD, and other issues how they handle being stuck on rides, long LL for return DAS, Parades, crowds, dinning and anything lse at a huge, loud, overstimulating, smelly amusement park. I don't believe they are being realistic to what DAs really does. And those who so immune compromised.. but DAS suddenly protects them?

I feel for people and the money they have spent....I do believe Disney should rerun any unused Magic Keys and any other travel. Then if they continue to come that is up to them to plan how to navigate the parks. I don't have compassion for those that instigate with lies and half trues just to sir up trouble and encourage others to confront and record CMs.

 

[jennab]

Newest change? Have seen screenshots and reports on multiple pages.

People now have to wait 120 days to reapply? Honestly, this makes sense to me and if confirmed and done by all CMs, good change. It gives those who have been denied a cooling off period to reassess and actually try the other accommodations. It also gives Disney time to really nail down it rules for the new program going forward, so all the inconsistencies stop.

Most of all it stops all those on Facebook and Tik Tok from endlessly calling back and encouraging others to do it as well. That is where much of the"CM was mean and rude to me " comes from. They keep trying and trying and getting angrier and angrier, making their stories more and more outlandish.

This would be interesting…. I feel like they won’t do it though because what if someone has a trip in 30 days then tries the new accommodations and don’t work while there so wants to call back?

 

[TLSnell1981]

Ok, well you are going back a bit in history then if you are talking about GAC or earlier. I don't think we can really compare today to back then.

DAS has been in place since 2013 and since that time it never required the DAS-holder to be present to obtain a DAS Return Time. Or maybe you are talking about wheelchair return times, which are different, and yes I can see why the person with the disability/mobility device needed to be present since there is no other way to show an accommodation is needed.

Regardless, I don't really hold any credence to the statement that "some decided it was unfair" resulting in changes throughout the years. Varying reasons, but largely too many people using the accommodation, have caused the changes. That might be fraud, it might be overuse, in the case of mobility devices it's simply that the queues were redesigned to accommodate and thus no need to use an alternate entry (at most attractions.

I understand you don't like the new changes, but you are placing blame illogically. Nobody decided accommodations are "unfair" for those who truly need the accommodation. Alternative accommodations are being offered to those who do not qualify for DAS.

There have been many on the board complain about disability services being "unfair". There were newspaper articles on this topic. Maybe coincidently not long before the service changed (over and over).

I have friends who returned today. One spouse has multiple disabilities and they also have small children one with special needs. They have utilized a pass on previous visits but were denied a DAS under the new system. The spouse spent half of their vacation in the room because they weren't psychically able to tour. They tried the various remedies. Walking up asking for a return time was granted twice. One CM at a different attraction was downright nasty. Others were extremely invasive. Some were clueless.

Perhaps the alternative "hit or miss'' accommodations are acceptable for some. I'm not okay with the hodge podge of solutions being offered. I'm not into playing Russian roulette especially after the first hand account I just heard. It's not worth the stress, money or tears.