Credits unpooled?

[bicker]

I also don't think guests really are obligated to keep track of credits to ensure they don't violate this rule. The only thing I believe guests are obligated to do is to not plan to violate this rule. Even more specifically, it means not paying OOP for children, with an eye towards using those credits for adults. It means a family of two adults and two children shouldn't be sitting together at a quick service table with three adult meals obtained with Dining Plan credits. That sort of thing.

 

[p2oh]

I don't care one way or another what someone eats, I do however think it is wrong to knowingly violate a rule, wherever it is. But I am a big scaredy cat about everything! Anyway, my thought is that this brochure is the first step and that further steps will be taken prior to free dining beginning. They had to change the check-in rules for that time period to avoid "phantom children" for heavens sake.

 

[jonimce]

Count me in for that pizza party. I will be there Aug. 13 for 10 glorious nights.

On another thread, some of you made me feel like I was cheating the system when we only used credits I payed for. My problem is the oppsite. DS is 19 and we pay adult price for him. He lives on burgers, fries, and pizza. Why would I waste TS's on him? We have used them on other people (With Disney's permission) and on this upcoming trip we will use his for a few 2TS's meals for DH and I. I do not feel like I am cheating the system.

 

[BCV23]

And don't forget the most obvious option: Don't use the Dining Plan if you don't feel that it fits with your family's needs and preferences.

Or equally obvious, just pay for what your child wants. Didn't mean to leave either option off but both are so self-evident, that you would think they would occur to everyone.

 

[mickeyfan2]

On another thread, some of you made me feel like I was cheating the system when we only used credits I payed for. My problem is the oppsite. DS is 19 and we pay adult price for him. He lives on burgers, fries, and pizza. Why would I waste TS's on him? We have used them on other people (With Disney's permission) and on this upcoming trip we will use his for a few 2TS's meals for DH and I. I do not feel like I am cheating the system.

I don't see you and your DH using your adult son's credits so you can eat at 2TS restaurants as cheating. You used an adult credit for an adult meal for a person in your party. If you ask to use a credit for a non-party member (again an adult credit for an adult) and Disney says yes, that is not cheating. What is cheating is using childs credit (which cost less) for adult meals. I too believe Disney will eventually make the pool into child and adult credits and they would need to be used as such.

 

[kaw1218]

I just dont get the big deal.. I mean I believe ordering a child lets say a Pecos Bills a burger because they have no burgers at Pecos Bills on the kids menu and asking for the DDP to pay for it is not a big deal! Now as far as trying to get a child a adult meal off a TS menu thats different.. I have two adults a junior (age 12) and a 9 yr old and we have used the DDP before and never had a problem except my 9 yr old getting sick of chilled chicken or nuggets and mac and cheese so I would like to be able to order something different for her but if I cant Im willing to share my own with her..No biggie..I dont see where I will need to pool my credits, Im not even sure why ppl need them pooled..I know you can use the credits any way you want to but I for one buy my breakfast (except the one TS at Boma and than I buy our lunch that day) and use a CS for lunch and TS for dinner and there is always more than enough food! To be honest sometimes I worry that ppl will try and cheat the system and ruin it for everyone else out there.. Again I am NOT saying anyone here is cheating the system Im just making a point..

I agree with this.....why is it Pecos bills a burger place, has no burgers for the kids..... same with pizzafari...PIZZA fari....no pizza for kids????? that is crazy... by DD can't have peanut butter.... so do I feed her peanut butter because its one of two items she can choose?

 

[Gillian]

And at Columbia Harbour house, known for its fish & chips - no kids fish. Just that stupid chilled chicken (& cheese cubes) that neither of my kids would eat. If your child didn't eat cheese you'd be out of luck, as the other choice is macaroni & cheese.

 

[bstnsprts]

I am not saying that people should track thier own credits. If people make mistakes in using them and unintentionally use them in ways not intended then my view is that its Disney's job to provide a better solution to the problem and people shouldn't have to build spreadsheets and bring PDA's to track credits.

However I think that for most people the issue isn't that they don't know that they are using credits in a manner not allowed but instead are intentionally using them in a way not allowed solely to save money. There is a difference between a large family that is eating at different places and different times inadvertantly using credits in violation of the rules and the couple with one kid that eats every meal together and intentionally orders adult CS meals for thier kid so they can save the 7-8 dollars it would cost to buy one for thier kid. The have no excuse regarding tracking who is using what credit. When they purchase an adult CS Meal for a kid then they are violating the plan. (Note: The next 10 posts will be about convoluted schemes where they could actually purchase a an adult CS meal for a kid using an adult CS credit.).

As I said before if people want to do this so they can save $30-40 over the course of a trip by engaging in fraud then they should go ahead but don't try to rationalize it. You are not doing it for your kid and for the most part it isn't because they couldn't keep track of the credits. It is simply a risk free way to steal money from Disney. I don't see any difference in this than the whole refillable mug issue or lying about your kids age to save on park tickets. I would have more respect if people would just post this as what it is, a way to save money by engaging in fraud. However I suspect that the people that are going to do this want to save the money, realize that there is no real penalty to doing this but can't stomach the thought that they are engaged in stealing so they need to post here to justify why what they are doing isn't that. I would suggest that they look up the definition of stealing in the dictionary. It says nothing about having an enforcement mechanism.

I'm not trying to justify anything here, really don't know why I would have too. I'm just trying to state facts. You purchase DDP credits from Disney at adult and child rates, but Disney chooses to hand them to you all lumped together, and accepts them at participating restaurants that way. Either at a TS or CS I order meals, CM delivers meals and check, I hand them room card with DDP attached and Disney's system removes credits as payment. Definition of stealing is:
To take (the property of another) without right or permission.
By pooling the credits and accepting them for payment without acknowledging child or adult credits, Disney is granting permission to use the plan this way. The responsibility is with Disney to close the "loop hole" and stop the use of DDP in this manner.

 

[JoiseyMom]

I'm not trying to justify anything here, really don't know why I would have too. I'm just trying to state facts. You purchase DDP credits from Disney at adult and child rates, but Disney chooses to hand them to you all lumped together, and accepts them at participating restaurants that way. Either at a TS or CS I order meals, CM delivers meals and check, I hand them room card with DDP attached and Disney's system removes credits as payment. Definition of stealing is:
To take (the property of another) without right or permission.
By pooling the credits and accepting them for payment without acknowledging child or adult credits, Disney is granting permission to use the plan this way. The responsibility is with Disney to close the "loop hole" and stop the use of DDP in this manner.

Nod, I totally agree. Plus WDW has used this pooling method will the previous silver and gold plans. They called them wishes then, not credits, and you were able to use them as you wish!

 

[PureTcrazy]

One thing that always comes to my mind when I read these type of threads is how odd it is that most of the people who argue that it is "ok" to use the DDP fraudulently, seem to be repeat disney customers. I too am a frequent WDW visitor and I know how much disney trips cost. Many of them have stayed at resorts I only dream of staying at, but they are the ones bragging about their schemes to steal from disney. It just seems hard to believe that one would be willing and able to pay for this kind of trip and then stoop to such a low level to "get over on the man(or mouse)."

If the DDP doesn't work for you, don't purchase it. If you're getting the DDP free, you are already getting a dang good deal - why feel like you have to get even more than they are already giving you FREE! If you feel a need to scam disney, please don't ask me to say that what you are doing is "ok."

 

[JoiseyMom]

One thing that always comes to my mind when I read these type of threads is how odd it is that most of the people who argue that it is "ok" to use the DDP fraudulently, seem to be repeat disney customers. I too am a frequent WDW visitor and I know how much disney trips cost. Many of them have stayed at resorts I only dream of staying at, but they are the ones bragging about their schemes to steal from disney. It just seems hard to believe that one would be willing and able to pay for this kind of trip and then stoop to such a low level to "get over on the man(or mouse)."

If the DDP doesn't work for you, don't purchase it. If you're getting the DDP free, you are already getting a dang good deal - why feel like you have to get even more than they are already giving you FREE! If you feel a need to scam disney, please don't ask me to say that what you are doing is "ok."

Well, since this has been Disney's policy for the current dining plan and previous dining plans, and CM were telling people this was the plan and how to maximize it, then how is it fraud? It isn't. If Disney feels like the are losing money, then they will change it and all the credits will be unpooled. If that is coming down the pike, then so be it. Disney makes the rules and we follow them. And the dining plan isn't really "free". It is just the discount, and it varies by party. If you have 2 adults, your discount is about 80.00, if you have 1 adult and 1 child your discount is 50.00, etc... Each party decides if this is a better deal then other discounts available. Last year we saved about 100.00 per night on our package. That was better than any other discount. This year since my dd is now 10 (even though her eating habits are no different), we are saving 130.00 per night. Yes it is a good deal.

If it was illegal, or fraudulent as you say to pool our credits and use kids for adults, then Disney would be able to arrest us for theft and or fraud. They can't though can they??

 

[jonimce]

Thank You JoiseyMom, you said it all. None of this is new. And none of this has changed in over 5 years that we have been adding dinning. So I guess Disney dosen't have a problem with it. Just some of the people on the boards.


Boy am I going to get flamed for that one.

 

[4mcbjCtr]

It is fraudulent when it is clearly written now. People can justify all they want. It doesn't change what is written and what is right.

 

[PureTcrazy]

Well, since this has been Disney's policy for the current dining plan and previous dining plans, and CM were telling people this was the plan and how to maximize it, then how is it fraud? It isn't. If Disney feels like the are losing money, then they will change it and all the credits will be unpooled. If that is coming down the pike, then so be it. Disney makes the rules and we follow them.

If it was illegal, or fraudulent as you say to pool our credits and use kids for adults, then Disney would be able to arrest us for theft and or fraud. They can't though can they??

Well it seems obvious to me that disney has changed it, even though most people understood and followed the intent of the plan before. The new brochure's language surely cannot be misunderstood. Disney made the rule, and I will be following it!

They probably would not arrest someone for cheating them out of money using the DDP in an unethical./illegal manner. Regardless whether or not the credits remain pooled, it is still breaking the rules as published in their brochure. Just because a store doesn't have a surveillance camera and the clerk doesn't see someone slip an item out of the store doesn't mean they didn't steal.

Maybe I am not sympathetic enough to the financial plight of some of the people in this forum. Maybe the money they save makes the difference in being able to take their kids to WDW. If it were me and I needed to save the money that badly, I would probably stay home.

It is a sad thing that even the change in the brochure was not enough to convince some people of disney's intent.

 

[Lewisc]

I'd hate to be the store owner anytime you use a self service check out lane. I'd hate to be a store owner who decided they could trust you in their small store when they have to take a bathroom break. By your definition you have permission to help yourself.

You no longer have Disney's permission to use child "entitlements" to obtain adult meals. Just read the the last page of the new brochure. The fact that Disney isn't physically stopping you doesn't mean you have permission.

I'm not trying to justify anything here, really don't know why I would have too. I'm just trying to state facts. You purchase DDP credits from Disney at adult and child rates, but Disney chooses to hand them to you all lumped together, and accepts them at participating restaurants that way. Either at a TS or CS I order meals, CM delivers meals and check, I hand them room card with DDP attached and Disney's system removes credits as payment. Definition of stealing is:
To take (the property of another) without right or permission.
By pooling the credits and accepting them for payment without acknowledging child or adult credits, Disney is granting permission to use the plan this way. The responsibility is with Disney to close the "loop hole" and stop the use of DDP in this manner.

 

[huey578]

That's right. According to your definition, I will be cheating and I am not honorable. I choose to see it as ordering meals for my child that she may actually eat. You may flame away now.

Please don't try to scam , if enough folks do it Disney will do away with DP!

 

[punkin]

Please don't try to scam , if enough folks do it Disney will do away with DP!

Maybe then, they'll bring back hotel discounts.

 

[huey578]

Maybe then, they'll bring back hotel discounts.

They gotta make money somehow, there not running a homeless shelter

 

[Sammie]

Thank You JoiseyMom, you said it all. None of this is new. And none of this has changed in over 5 years that we have been adding dinning. So I guess Disney dosen't have a problem with it. Just some of the people on the boards.


Boy am I going to get flamed for that one.

No flaming, I don't feel that accomplishes anything on either side of the issue. I do have a question though, if Disney does not have a problem with it, why the new wording on the online brochure which some are obviously choosing to ignore?

I don't think the wording can be any clearer, but I guess for some strong arm enforcement will have to be next.

 

[PureTcrazy]

Lewisc, huey578 and sammie