Covid And The Rest of Us

[BadPinkTink]

ahemmm.. trying to keep this thread on topic for non USA based Covid discussion

There have been no further deaths and 79 new coronavirus cases in Ireland.

There have now been a total of 1,776 Covid-19 related deaths in Ireland and a total of 27,755 confirmed cases of coronavirus.

Of the 79 new cases, 39 are men and 40 are women. 73pc are under 45 years of age, 30 are confirmed to be associated with outbreaks or are close contacts of a confirmed case and 21 cases have been identified as community transmission.

43 of the cases are in Dublin, 9 in Kildare, 6 in Cork, 6 in Tipperary and the remaining 15 cases are in Clare, Donegal, Laois, Limerick, Louth, Mayo, Roscommon, Wexford and Wicklow.

The county lockdown for Kildare has been extended for 2 weeks, but Laois and Offally lockdown has been lifted.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The county lockdown for Kildare has been extended for 2 weeks

Are they doing the lock downs roughly 2 weeks at a time or a month at a time? Or something else?

 

[TLSnell1981]

I was speaking to your comment of pool testing

What about those who are asymptomatic?

They aren't sick and may not know they were exposed. They are less likely to test anyways. Using precautions helps stop the spread.

 

[BadPinkTink]

Are they doing the lock downs roughly 2 weeks at a time or a month at a time? Or something else?

this was the first time they did localized county lockdowns, it was 2 weeks.

 

[MommyinHonduras]

We just got word, we have permission to circulate every day of the week, still based on the last number of your ID. This means every 10 days instead of every 14, gotta celebrate the little things!!!

 

[bavaria]

Dubai based Ecolog has now taken over some of the testing at German airports, train stations, and Autobahn rest stops because they have experience in broad testing, and did not have to create a whole new process. They also do the testing in Luxembourg, and in Belgium, but are normally a military service provider testing on behalf of NATO, for the US military, in combat zones, humanitarian aid areas, etc.

What is interesting is that they have the ability to increase this rapid testing that they are now doing in many countries, and I return to my question above as to why Europe and Asia cannot coordinate somehow to have the German 'test on landing from high risk/voluntarily testing from low risk' system in place. Of course the cases are rising, because the testing is getting so broad now and open to anyone if they want peace of mind.

https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/plus...cht-jetzt-ein-aggressiver-Wettbewerb-aus.html

 

[MommyinHonduras]

Honduras numbers for anyone interested. Our testing rate the past week has been under 50% positive! To get marked as recovered you have to have a negative PCR, most are not being retested so our recovered number is much higher.

Good evening. Tonight's numbers are as follows:

Tests
Processed – 1,453
Negative – 891
Positive – 562

Locations
Cortes – 229
Yoro – 200
Francisco Morazán – 83
La Paz – 19
Lempira – 10
El Paraíso – 4
Olancho – 4
Valle – 4
Comayagua – 3
Choluteca – 3
Gracias a Dios – 3



Hospitalized – 906
Stable – 668
Critical – 190
ICU – 48



Deceased – 13
Cortes – 10
Copan – 2
Comayagua – 1


Recoveries – 189
Cortes – 117
Yoro – 54
Lempira – 11
La Paz – 4
Francisco Morazán – 3

Totals to Date
Cases – 53,381
Active – 43,478
Recoveries – 8,271
Deceased – 1,632
Mortality Rate – 3.05%

 

[bavaria]

I really think that this is taking the path of eliminating the virus to an extreme. Yes, of course, breaking quarantine rules are wrong. But we seem to have forgotten or overlooked the mental stress that separating people places on them, and that we are social animals. Sure, he 'only' hugged a friend, and 'was not motivated by severe stress through the likes of a family crisis', but I do believe that this reinforces the message of abolishing COVID at all costs. I also know that most people in Australia and New Zealand support harsh measures.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/cr...solation-hotel-for-a-hug-jailed-for-six-weeks
I know full well what this separation due to COVID does to people. It is only one of the many things that have been impacted in my own life, and I struggle with it every day. Yesterday a friend told me that she could finally see her father for 15 minutes, for the first time in almost 6 months. But his condition had deteriorated so much in those five months that he had no idea who she was, or why she was there. She essentially lost her father in those five months, not due to COVID, but because his mental faculties deteriorated to the point that he no longer was the same person.

 

[bavaria]

Honduras numbers for anyone interested. Our testing rate the past week has been under 50% positive! To get marked as recovered you have to have a negative PCR, most are not being retested so our recovered number is much higher.

I wonder if some humanitarian organization could use the Ecolog method I mentioned above for countries like Honduras. It sounds like they have applied their broad, rapid testing methods in areas of conflict or extreme poverty in past. Until we start testing on a very broad scale, we are sort of stuck in this situation. I do think that so many people are just waiting for a vaccine, but there has to be steps between where we are now, and that happening.

Or something like this. There are advances every week that we need to start implementing globally.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/just-...vid-breath-test-spots-every-carrier-in-trial/

 

[bavaria]

https://e.vnexpress.net/news/news/s...or-visitors-from-vietnam-by-half-4150942.html
Singapore showing some sense and permits travelling from low risk countries. They also cut quarantine down to 7 days for some but I still think testing should replace quarantine.

It is a start, though...

 

[ronandannette]

https://e.vnexpress.net/news/news/s...or-visitors-from-vietnam-by-half-4150942.html
Singapore showing some sense and permits travelling from low risk countries. They also cut quarantine down to 7 days for some but I still think testing should replace quarantine.

It is a start, though...

I'm unclear why testing couldn't replace 14 day quarantine for everyone. Here in Canada for example, where tests are easy to come by and fairly quickly processed, why not a test upon entry and and isolation under approved conditions until the results come back? Anyone who tests positive and is not a Canadian citizen would be removed from Canada where practical. Citizens would be required to go into full lock-down until they either tested clear or were asymptomatic for 5 days.

 

[elphaba91]

I really think that this is taking the path of eliminating the virus to an extreme. Yes, of course, breaking quarantine rules are wrong. But we seem to have forgotten or overlooked the mental stress that separating people places on them, and that we are social animals. Sure, he 'only' hugged a friend, and 'was not motivated by severe stress through the likes of a family crisis', but I do believe that this reinforces the message of abolishing COVID at all costs. I also know that most people in Australia and New Zealand support harsh measures.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/cr...solation-hotel-for-a-hug-jailed-for-six-weeks

As an Aussie, yeah, I do think that punishment is fitting. This is Australia's coronavirus situation as of yesterday:

Most of that second wave is from Victoria (which represents about a quarter of the population) and most of the handful of cases in other states can be linked back to Victoria. Genomic testing has shown that 99% of those cases can be linked to hotel quarantine with 90% from one family of four in quarantine. One family not behaving and not being managed correctly was all it took for thousands of cases and over 400 deaths and counting, millions of people being placed back into lockdown (for most, a harsher lockdown than we've ever seen), likely billions of dollars of debt, businesses being shut down, people being unable to see loved ones, etc. So no, I don't think it's 'only' a hug.

In Australia at least, the government is also throwing a lot of money behind extra support for mental health services, including additional beds and an extra 10 psychology sessions funded through Medicare for Victorians (we normally can only get 10).

Unfortunately there is no 'perfect' response as long as this virus is out there. Yes, people will struggle with their mental health while under restrictions. But if we let this thing get away from us, then people's mental health will also struggle: people who are immune compromised or care about people who are immune compromised being afraid for their health, people losing loved ones, medical professionals and other front line workers being terrified of doing their jobs, people being unable to get treatment for other medical conditions because of the hospital system being too overwhelmed, etc.

Fortunately, things do seem to be improving here numbers-wise; today we had 116 cases, the lowest number since 5 July!

 

[bavaria]

I'm unclear why testing couldn't replace 14 day quarantine for everyone. Here in Canada for example, where tests are easy to come by and fairly quickly processed, why not a test upon entry and and isolation under approved conditions until the results come back? Anyone who tests positive and is not a Canadian citizen would be removed from Canada where practical. Citizens would be required to go into full lock-down until they either tested clear or were asymptomatic for 5 days.

Agreed... That's pretty much what Germany is doing, if one enters from an 'at risk' country (which is more than 150 of them and the list changes daily) Test results are in a few hours. I've also read that some places only had 10 days (vs 14) at the start.

There was concern from Drosten, the great German virologist, that Berlin may run out of tests due to people returning from 'low risk' areas taking a test just for peace of mind. (He created the first COVID test at his lab in Berlin) He's generally very conservative, however, and frankly if Germany doesn't have the capability to produce tests with all the pharma companies, and manufacturing capability, shame on us. The cost of tests I think too is lower than the cost of the quarantine, and follow up, especially in countries which pay for quarantine for at least some people.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/canadians-millions-hotel-quarantine-covid-1.5691370

 

[bavaria]

As an Aussie, yeah, I do think that punishment is fitting.

We'll have to disagree.

I do know that many/most people in Australia and NZ share your viewpoint. Do you think that it is because you are physically isolated anyways that there is more support for your countries' actions? If most people are used to being far, far away and don't feel the need to leave the country, I can understand a bit more why this forced isolation isn't that much different from the usual isolation due to geography.

 

[ronandannette]

Agreed... That's pretty much what Germany is doing, if one enters from an 'at risk' country (which is more than 150 of them and the list changes daily) Test results are in a few hours. I've also read that some places only had 10 days (vs 14) at the start.

There was concern from Drosten, the great German virologist, that Berlin may run out of tests due to people returning from 'low risk' areas taking a test just for peace of mind. (He created the first COVID test at his lab in Berlin) He's generally very conservative, however, and frankly if Germany doesn't have the capability to produce tests with all the pharma companies, and manufacturing capability, shame on us. The cost of tests I think too is lower than the cost of the quarantine, and follow up, especially in countries which pay for quarantine for at least some people.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/canadians-millions-hotel-quarantine-covid-1.5691370

To be clear, I'd advocate for testing everyone - regardless of where they're coming in from. Although it certainly wouldn't address the issue of community transmission from those of us here at home, it would deal with travel-related cases and resolve the issue of border control.

 

[bavaria]

To be clear, I'd advocate for testing everyone - regardless of where they're coming in from. Although it certainly wouldn't address the issue of community transmission from those of us here at home, it would deal with travel-related cases and resolve the issue of border control.

So, apparently the US CDC no longer requires 14 day quarantine on return from outside the country... various news sources report this but I cannot find an English source I care to link. It's interesting that they just removed the requirement from their website without the usual fanfare we see in America regarding us 'dirty furriners' (Sorry, in the old DIS days we were considered such by a few posters... )

Question for any non-US poster: has anyone read about outbreaks linked to flights? I see reports of possible exposure on flights listed all the time, but no reports of linked outbreaks or cases, just that one traveller later tested positive. I've talked to airline employees and airport employees in my circle over the past few months, and outside the US none of them have heard of any fellow staff being impacted by positive travellers.

It's especially interesting to me as crew are often not required to quarantine in places with a quarantine requirement. In the time of SARS, there was an outbreak from one positive passenger which is the seat map we often see published, but we have not heard the same news from COVID-19 as far as I can tell. I know that people think that planes are bad, but the HEPA filters are supposedly very good and while the fear mongering was in the media, the lack of outbreaks on planes doesn't seem to be.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

So, apparently the US CDC no longer requires 14 day quarantine on return from outside the country... various news sources report this but I cannot find an English source I care to link. It's interesting that they just removed the requirement from their website without the usual fanfare we see in America regarding us 'dirty furriners' (Sorry, in the old DIS days we were considered such by a few posters... )

Yes they did remove this. It was for out of state travel as well not just returning from outside the country. At least for us in the States the emphasis in my experience hasn't really been traveling out of the country for months now probably because fewer people are doing that. Instead the emphasis has been traveling from state to state which is more what people are doing.

In the beginning (Jan/Feb/March) when people were coming from outside the country and returning from cruising yes that was the emphasis because at least at that time that's where we thought the cases were originating from. But that quickly went away as community spread took over and with borders closed, stay at home orders, etc the focus shifted to traveling to hotspots within the States. With states reopening, summer travels were less overseas and more state to state travel.

This is all talking about CDC stuff; individual states likely still have international AND state to state travel in their quarantine requirements or recommendations.

 

[lanejudy]

Yes they did remove this. It was for out of state travel as well not just returning from outside the country.

It's important to note, though, that several states still have their own travel/quarantine requirements. So this really doesn't change much, as you said most travel hasn't been international anyway. Folks should still check the quarantine rules of the destination state if coming to the U.S.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It's important to note, though, that several states still have their own travel/quarantine requirements. So this really doesn't change much, as you said most travel hasn't been international anyway. Folks should still check the quarantine rules of the destination state if coming to the U.S.

Yup of course

My last part of my comment was "This is all talking about CDC stuff; individual states likely still have international AND state to state travel in their quarantine requirements or recommendations."

CDC and individual states are different and the PP was talking about CDC's requirement/recommendation

 

[bavaria]

Thanks for clarifying. It did seem a bit counter-intuitive that if one was coming from a lower risk area like Korea, Germany, etc to the US that one had to quarantine. I know that there are still many people coming into the US, especially now that countries are allowing US residents to travel. Also Germany still has a large number of medical arrivals from the US as that is a big business to have treatments not available there and German clinics have travel coordinators who arrange that. And I believe that you are still allowing your international students to return? (Although I read recently that Canada is expected in the long run to be getting more international students who are planning to avoid the US, and go to Canada instead)

I know that TAP and Lufthansa plan to increase their US schedules in the coming weeks, but TAP still requires anyone coming from the US to have a negative test 72 hours prior to boarding (numbers are low in Portugal) and Germany/Lufthansa requires a negative test on landing in Germany if coming from the US (even if via YYZ/YUL/YVR).