Costa Concordia Runs Aground / Deaths Reported

[OrlandoMagic]

To whomever above said to believe the BBC reports most, they are almost as bad as the rest of the media at hamming things up (according to them a few years back everyone under 50 was going to catch swine flu and most of us would die ), though admittedly they are slightly less sensationalist than other media outlets.

All media are pretty much working from the same spokespeople and "exclusive" interviews with passengers and crew who are understandably all in shock.

So take all media reports with a pinch of salt at these early stages. We'll find out what happened sooner or later as there will inevitably be a formal report.

People are referring to quotes made directly by Costa which are verbatim.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

According to Wikipedia, she cost $570M. I know she would have to be gutted now but it's hard to imagine scrapping her. I agree with what you posted earlier about the salt water being so corrosive that all wiring would be have to torn out but it seems like most of the structure, the rooms, the decks and the bridge and part above water would be salvagable.

Well I'm sure the corporate guys will look at the tax write-off and the PR aspects and she may indeed end up but sold for parts and scrap iron.

I am afriad I disagree. The entire interior of the vessel, whether it is under water or not will have to be gutted. The wries cannot just be cut short and new wiring added, it can't be done that way.

Also we are looking at millions in repairs to the port side hull damage. I know it doesn't look all that bad........but that is ALOT of damage.

Add to that , the stbd side is laying on the rocks and it was reported today she is moving now and grinding on the rocks.............


Sorry, JMHO...but she is scrap.


AKK

 

[bound2travel]

Here is a link that has a graphic that says what the course should have been.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...vor-Manrico-Giampedroni-airlifted-safety.html


It also has several other pictures including some of the people waiting to get on lifeboats.

 

[Rogillio]

I am afriad I disagree. The entire interior of the vessel, whether it is under water or not will have to be gutted. The wries cannot just be cut short and new wiring added, it can't be done that way.

Also we are looking at millions in repairs to the port side hull damage. I know it doesn't look all that bad........but that is ALOT of damage.

Add to that , the stbd side is laying on the rocks and it was reported today she is moving now and grinding on the rocks.............


Sorry, JMHO...but she is scrap.


AKK

You are probably right. It just kills me though to see a $570M ship "totaled" over what looks like a fender-bender. She only about 6 or 7 years old....

 

[Prose]

Here are underwater photos of the wreckage, from an Italian news site:

http://www.ilgiornale.it/fotogallery/costa_concordia_foto_sub_/id=3671-foto=1-slideshow=0

 

[Alexander]

Here is a link that has a graphic that says what the course should have been.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...vor-Manrico-Giampedroni-airlifted-safety.html


It also has several other pictures including some of the people waiting to get on lifeboats.

I took two things from this article and photographs....

1. The passengers waiting to board lifeboats do no look panicked to me. They look squished which would make me very claustrophobic, but there is no one crying and they look pretty calm. Of course things could not be what they seem, but they look okay at that point.
2. The captain gave 7 whistle blasts which indicates emergency or abandon ship. This is only useful if the guests had had a drill. They would not have known what those blasts meant if they hadn't practiced.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

People are referring to quotes made directly by Costa which are verbatim.

Why should anyone beleive Costa ?......they have alot of liability here and it seems to me, reading between the lines they are throwing the Master under the bus, which will help them!.EI damage control.

Now that doesn't mean I think the Master is not the cuase of the accident, but there is alot more information needed to determine how, what and why it happened.


AKK

 

[lbgraves]

I.....Her story about the waiter or cook trying to steer the lifeboat & just circling cuz they didn't know what else to do, no orders from above, one crew member having to get on another's shoulders just to steer the lifeboat, this all just sickens me to no end. ....

.... he said that DCL drills with their boats 2X more than what is required by law. I am very confident that DCL is prepared better than most to handle a "situation"..... He said DCL lifeboats have two motors and are much more steerable. He also indicated that they have far more people trained on the lifeboats than they would ever need should someone not be able to make it to their station.

We have witnessed the lifeboats being tested on at least 5 out of 8 cruises tht I can remember. They seem to operate very easily with the pilots doing figure eights, circles, and going a bit of a distance away from the ship. We have talked to Marco at Palo about this and his eyes lit up when he told us is is a pilot of one of the lifeboats. His brother was when he was onboard as well. He said that they really enjoyed the days they are able to take the lifeboats out.

 

[pxlbarrel]

Also we are looking at millions in repairs to the port side hull damage. I know it doesn't look all that bad........but that is ALOT of damage.

Add to that , the stbd side is laying on the rocks and it was reported today she is moving now and grinding on the rocks.............


Sorry, JMHO...but she is scrap.


AKK

I think it looks very bad ... the rock still embedded in the hull is a very dramatic and sad photo. Still can't believe it.

 

[rosermama]

When we were on the DREAM last April we saw them do boat drills not once but twice

Here is the boat in the water in Nassau

Here is the boat in the water next day at Castaway Cay

 

[K8T]

My point was that just becuase Costo is saying so......doesn't make fact. They have alot of liablity here and the lawylers are for sure damage controll. Which may mean throwing the Master under the bus.......a legal point that does make alot of difference is whether Costa knew of the Masters course changes this trip and/or others.

We do not know for fact what routes were permited or not.

On the other side of the coin, the Master as total control of what course he will put the vessel on, of course, if he was reckless and that recklessness cuased the wreck, then he could indeed be crimminally liable.


As for the alarm sounding, that is true, it is meant to advise the bridge watch when the vessel was off course, not if a intendtional course change were done.

AKK

I was in fact saying that what I had said was 'fact', as it had been queried. Who knows what actually happened? not even the CEO of Costa, until there has been a full enquiry.

However, you would hope that taking into other Officers accounts, that they (Costa), would at least have some more concrete idea of what occured that night. There are more people than just the Captain on the Bridge!

As for the BBC, they are probably more reliable than any other source, which isn't saying a lot (says she who used to work for the BBC in London! ).

 

[bettyboop42413]

I have not read the thread in it's entirety, if this has already been posted, I apologize.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162...cked-cruise-ship/?tag=contentMain;contentBody

I read this and it made me so sad, this poor couple apparently did what they were supposed to do and still perished.

GIGLIO, Italy (AP) — Coast guard divers searching the submerged part of the Costa Concordia on Sunday found the bodies of two elderly people still in their life jackets, authorities said, raising to five the death toll after the luxury cruise liner ran aground and tipped over off the Tuscan coast.

Divers scouring the bowels of the ship in the murky, cold sea discovered the bodies at the emergency gathering point near the restaurant where passengers were dining when the ship carrying more than 4,200 people hit a reef or rock near the island of Giglio, Coast Guard Cmdr. Cosimo Nicastro said.

 

[justmestace]

I am very confident that DCL is prepared better than most to handle a "situation.

As we watched the crew struggle to control the lifeboats, the CM explained that those boats only have one motor and they are very difficult to steer. He said DCL lifeboats have two motors and are much more steerable. He also indicated that they have far more people trained on the lifeboats than they would ever need should someone not be able to make it to their station.

No, DCL has never had to go through such a horrific experience, but I just feel that the level of customer service and care for the guests is so much higher and lets be honest, Disney does not want a scandal like what appears to be happening with the Concordia. I have much more confidence in DCL than most of the others....naive....probably, but oh well!

I've been waiting to see how long it would take for this to turn into a "Disney is Superior" conversation.

There is NO WAY that anyone could say that this could not happen on ANY cruise. Please don't turn it into something like that.

This was horrific, and even though reports are that the Captain made a horrible, terrible decision to take the ship too close to shore, I'm reasonably certain that he didn't intend for this to happen. It was an accident. It was an avoidable accident, for sure...but it wasn't malicious, and he will most likely pay for that dearly.

We were on another (non-DCL) cruise one time, anchored just outside of the port. Many of the othr passengers had already tendered into port. My husband and I listened and watched, fascinated, while the crew did an "Abandon Ship" drill.
Every cruise line that we've been on has always done a lifeboat drill before we left port, but as I understand in the case of the Concordia, this was one of those cruises where passengers can join the cruise at various ports. Not like Disney, where everyone gets on at Port Canaveral and gets off at Port Canaveral. So therefore, it would be unreasonable to have a drill at every single port.
I also truly believe that in an event like this one, it wouldn't matter what ship you were on, many people would panic and not know what to do. Granted, I understand that the "alarm" wasn't sounded as soon as people think it should have been...but again....there's no way to say that Disney would have done it differently. We all HOPE that whatever ship we're on, it would be done differently.
But someone had mentioned putting their passport, etc, into a waterproof bag and keeping it in the safe, just in case. Odds are, you won't go back to your stateroom to gather your belongings in the event of an emergency. There is JUST NO WAY to be totally prepared. Think about it....it's 10:00 at night, you're in one of the clubs, having a drink, and BAM...suddenly the lights go out, people are screaming, running every which-way.....do you really think you'd go up to Deck 6, 7, 8, 9....or down to Deck 2...to open the safe and collect your things? Or to get "your" lifejacket?

Anyway....all I'm saying is that it could happen. The best that anyone can do is to be mindful at all times....and again, if you're relaxed and enjoying your vacation, is that really going to happen?

 

[justmestace]

Tonka's Skipper....or anyone who would know....I have a question...

Obviously, the Captain is the master of the ship. But....what are the duties and responsibilities of the other crew members on the Bridge??
If one or more of them realize that the captain is about to make a huge mistake, is there any way that anyone else can override his decision?

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

I was in fact saying that what I had said was 'fact', as it had been queried. Who knows what actually happened? not even the CEO of Costa, until there has been a full enquiry.

However, you would hope that taking into other Officers accounts, that they (Costa), would at least have some more concrete idea of what occured that night. There are more people than just the Captain on the Bridge!

As for the BBC, they are probably more reliable than any other source, which isn't saying a lot (says she who used to work for the BBC in London! ).

\




I guess what I am trying to point out is due to thier liablity issue and that shifting as much blame on the Master as possible improves there liability position , Costo is going to present a picture at helps them best...........even out right lie if needed. So I am not beleiving anything just because Costa says so.


What Costa is saying now and what other officers say when under oath and in court may very well be very different.


Now all that said.I think the Captian has a lot of serious questions to answer:

1. Why he was where he was and when going close to the island, how was the navigation performed?

2. Was this the first time or is this a little joy ride that he has done before?

3. Ha it been Costa line Captians pracitice to do this little joy ride?

4. Do the charts show deep water in that area,?.

5. Was the rocky reef marked?.....in the correct position? The deep of rocky reef correct?

6. Was navigation is this area at all restricted?

7. Was Costa aware of this practice?

8. What are Costas instructions to the Master when at sea regarding diversion from what is routine planned tracks?

9. Drug test results of the Master and Deck watch?

10.Was the vessel in any way having a power issue as we reported to the passingers?(which was likely just to keep the passingers calm)

11. Was there any malfunction of the bridge eqiupment/navigation gear?

12. Why was he ashore at 1130 when most passingers were still on the vessel at 0300.? (if indeed he was ashore at these reported times)


AKK

 

[CWO4DVC]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aw4pVWYeplU&feature=player_embedded

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Tonka's Skipper....or anyone who would know....I have a question...

Obviously, the Captain is the master of the ship. But....what are the duties and responsibilities of the other crew members on the Bridge??
If one or more of them realize that the captain is about to make a huge mistake, is there any way that anyone else can override his decision?

Whoa........now theres a tough one!

First we dont know yet if the Master was making a big navigation error.....please read my post just below.

On the bridge of any merchant ship the number of people varies. The Watch Office is in charge and the jr watch officer assits (if there is a jr watch officer). These Officers are licensed.

There is a lookout, usually on the bow and the quartermaster who is on lookout if not actually steering the vessel. At sea the vessel is often on autopilot.


Now some shipping lines may also have a additional lookout, and navigation Officer(licensed) and other personel.





When the Master enters the bridge, the watch officer is still in command, unless the Master takes the *con*. In all situations , normal and emergencies, the Master has the ultiment authority/power and responsiblity.

If he gives a lawfull order, you obey it.

Now all that said........when I was a Watch Officer, and I have seen a Captain making a error, say navigation, or in a traffic situation, it was my responsiblity to point it out to the Captian, what is wrong and why. I have never had a Master that did not take my comment seriously and change what he was doing( or in one case as a junior watch officer show me where I was wrong).

To forcabilly take command away from a Captian on his ship............................whoaa...........thats rough....if he was drunk, sick, it would not be to hard to defend later, but you had better be right six times over to force say a course change or whatever againist his orders.


I hope that made sense!

AKK



!

 

[justmestace]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aw4pVWYeplU&feature=player_embedded

The comments below the video are interesting. I liked seeing the other boats (ships) coming to aid.

I couldn't help thinking, as I watched the ship veer toward the island "What an idiot".

But I had read that in years past, the ships had done a "fly by" to honor a captain's wife or some such thing. Apparently, this captain thought he could do that with someone he knew on the island. Idiot.

The good news out of all of this, is that it doesn't "just happen" and we can rest a little easier on future cruises.

 

[justmestace]

Whoa........know therte a tough one!

!first we dont know yet if the Master was making a big navigation error.....please read my post just below.

On the bridge of any merchant ship the number od people varies. The Watch Office is in charge and the jr watch office assits if there is a jr watch officer. These Officer was licensed.

There is a lookout, usually on the bow and the quarermaster who is on lookout if not actually steering the vessel. At sea the vessel is often on autopilot.


Now some shipping lines may also have a additional lookout, and navigation Officer(licensed) and other personel.





When the Master enters the bridge, the watch officer is still in command, unless the Master takes the *con*. In all situations , normal and emergencies, the Master has the ultiment authority/power and responsiblity.

If he gives a lawfull order, you obey it.

Now all that said........when I was a Watch Officer, and I have seen a Captain making a error, say navigation, or in a traffic situation, it was my responsiblity to point it out to the Captian, what is wrong and why. I have never had a Master that did not take my comment seriously and change what he was doing( or in one case as a junior watch officer show me where I was wrong).

To forcabilly take command away from a Captian on his ship............................whoaa...........thats rough....if he was drunk, sick, it would not be to hard to defend later, but you had better be right six times over to force as a course change or whatever againist his orders.


I hope that made sense!

AKK



!

I understand completely.

 

[Rogillio]

I've been waiting to see how long it would take for this to turn into a "Disney is Superior" conversation.

There is NO WAY that anyone could say that this could not happen on ANY cruise. Please don't turn it into something like that.

This was horrific, and even though reports are that the Captain made a horrible, terrible decision to take the ship too close to shore, I'm reasonably certain that he didn't intend for this to happen. It was an accident. It was an avoidable accident, for sure...but it wasn't malicious, and he will most likely pay for that dearly.

We were on another (non-DCL) cruise one time, anchored just outside of the port. Many of the othr passengers had already tendered into port. My husband and I listened and watched, fascinated, while the crew did an "Abandon Ship" drill.
Every cruise line that we've been on has always done a lifeboat drill before we left port, but as I understand in the case of the Concordia, this was one of those cruises where passengers can join the cruise at various ports. Not like Disney, where everyone gets on at Port Canaveral and gets off at Port Canaveral. So therefore, it would be unreasonable to have a drill at every single port.
I also truly believe that in an event like this one, it wouldn't matter what ship you were on, many people would panic and not know what to do. Granted, I understand that the "alarm" wasn't sounded as soon as people think it should have been...but again....there's no way to say that Disney would have done it differently. We all HOPE that whatever ship we're on, it would be done differently.
But someone had mentioned putting their passport, etc, into a waterproof bag and keeping it in the safe, just in case. Odds are, you won't go back to your stateroom to gather your belongings in the event of an emergency. There is JUST NO WAY to be totally prepared. Think about it....it's 10:00 at night, you're in one of the clubs, having a drink, and BAM...suddenly the lights go out, people are screaming, running every which-way.....do you really think you'd go up to Deck 6, 7, 8, 9....or down to Deck 2...to open the safe and collect your things? Or to get "your" lifejacket?

Anyway....all I'm saying is that it could happen. The best that anyone can do is to be mindful at all times....and again, if you're relaxed and enjoying your vacation, is that really going to happen?

I read that the crew was mostly Asian and most did NOT speak Italian and this compounded the confusion during the evacuation. So I don't think it's fair to say this could happen on any ship. Yeah, any ship could hit a rock and run aground but the way the evac was handled was a unmitigated disaster! I would think that ships carrying English speaking passengers that has an English speaking crew would have gone a long way in mitigating some of chaos anyway.

Also, and this might be a stretch, if you only have 3 ships you have a lot fewer Captains to manage. While it may be too early to point blame at the CPT, I think barring some sort of major nav equipment error, he was responsible. Just thinking from a corporate HR perspective.....if you have 90 Captains on the payroll, you are more likely to have a bad one than if you only have 4 or 5.

Don't slam me, I'm just thinking out loud.