Cinderella and others arrested

[cseca]

I feel bad for those protesters but I don't agree with their tactics.
Yes, having no insurance is bad but your right does not trump other people's right's to enjoy their vacation.
Who says that because you are miserable that everybody else have to?

Protest in good taste, bring your signs but don't wear your costumes. Don't wake customer's up at 6am because you can.

All it does is make more people upset at you for being inconsiderate.
Yes, Disney is quite possible being inconsiderate of your needs but not the guests who are being affected by your protests.

So yeah, I feel bad. But I would feel so much worse for them if they had done it properly. That's my opinion of course.

 

[AmericanItGirl]

They don't have the option to join. If they are hired into their position, they are instantly members of the union.

I hate that about unions, because of what happened to my neighbor. He just graduated from high school and while in high school he worked part time as a bagger for a local grocery store that happened to be unionized. Well, the monthly dues were more than his monthly wages. Not wanting to spend all of his earnings on dues in addition to asking his parents for money to cover what his pay check didn't, he simply didn't pay the dues. As a result, he ended up in hot water with the union. His dad had to sit down with the local union rep to sort everything out and get them off the poor kid's back. I get that unless most everyone is with the union, then it's not as effective, but people should always be given the choice to say yes or no.

 

[Quest4fun]

How do you measure good performance? I bet hotel workers are doing things that are much more physically demanding and work just as hard as someone making 100k a year. That "communist" boost, as you call it, only exists because no one cares about minimum wage employees, as this thread clearly shows. But then how can we all make money, if we don't exploit those at the bottom of the barrel? (Yes, they are being exploited)

I know people who work three jobs and still struggle to make ends meet for their family. It's not a simple question of not working hard enough, or just quitting one's job and finding another. Finding a job and even getting an education are not easy things to do.

Compensation is not measured by any standards of performance. If that were the case, I'm sure the janitors at my workplace work harder than anyone here and would make more. It measured by how our society values what you are doing, and if we deem a worker as unskilled labor, we don't care how hard they work. One could be the best housekeeper in all of Anaheim, and he/she wouldn't be making that much more than minimum wage.

Nobody is holding a gun to their head saying "Work an entry level job at Disneyland."

I understand that everybody has to start somewhere and some have put themselves in the position to where they cannot afford any type of schooling.

Disneyland jobs fall in line retail jobs and burger flipping I'm sorry to say. You can't measure performance because there is a ceiling at which they work which they cannot go outside of. It's the nature of the position.

Just because you can't get into USC doesn't mean you can't go to school. You can get your degree in community college in the evening if you have to work during the day. Don't expect to get a high paying job out of school either. Everybody needs to pay their dues and work their way up.

I'm sympathetic to the plight of those who work multiple jobs. My own brother works two and barely makes ends meet. He prefers that to a 9 to 5'er that would pay him the same amount because the work is more stressfull. It's his decision.

I welcome the added stress of my office job. It sucks while I'm there but at the end of the day I can shut off my computer, turn off my phone and not have to worry about bills. My wife and I have a budget that we stick too. I took some work to get here but that's what it's all about. One of my old coaches once said, "There's no free lunch." I remind myself that every time I find myself looking for somebody to blame when it get's tough I remind myself that I am a product of my decisions. If I want anything I'm going to have to work for it.

 

[Disney Dreams]

The problem with their tactics is they are trying to disrupt the vacation of the guests at the DLR. Acting like idiots, parading down the streets with a mariachi band, getting arrested in Disney costumes, and waking up the guests at 6:00 am in the morning is not the right way to negotiate. They need to realize that their union representatives are a bunch of idiots who don't want to meet with Disney management.

Or...
They have successfully gotten the attention of media, current tourists, and people who have reservations in the future at the affected hotels.

We know nothing about their union reps, but how on earth can you say, "their union representatives are a bunch of idiots who don't want to meet with Disney management" when we know that they have met with Disney management many times? You just called them idiots, but are either ignoring facts or not comprehending what you have read.

Unless you have personal knowledge of the situation, I have read nothing that say they are not willing to meet with management as you have stated.

I have no problem with disagreeing with their approach, but how about we stick with the facts?

 

[JaneJetson]

This would be a good lesson for your child I think. Here's how I would explain it.

"Cinderella didn't go to college so the best she could do with a High School education (or GED) is sign autographs at Disneyland since she only needs to know how to sign her name. There is no room for advancement and there is little opportunity for performance based compensation. Her union ensures that she is paid for doing the least amount of work required for her pay scale. When she and her co-workers decided that wasn't enough, they decided to disrupt the operations of their employer to get what they want. In essence they threw a tantrum in the hopes of being given money to be quiet. Your mother and father don't get hauled away by police because they finished school and have good jobs that reward hard work with a competitive benefits package and yearly raises and bonuses."

Bring on the hate.

 

[JaneJetson]

As for the costumes, I've already expressed my distaste before they started getting arrested, but I'm even more disgusted now. How the *beep* do parents explain that to little kids? Princesses and Tinkerbell aren't supposed to break the law and should never be portrayed as doing such.

Luckily they were just in the cheapy costumes you can buy anywhere. So they don't really look like the actual face characters in the park. They just like 'adults" dressed up on halloween or something.

 

[disneyobsessed808]

The problem with their tactics is they are trying to disrupt the vacation of the guests at the DLR. Acting like idiots, parading down the streets with a mariachi band, getting arrested in Disney costumes, and waking up the guests at 6:00 am in the morning is not the right way to negotiate. They need to realize that their union representatives are a bunch of idiots who don't want to meet with Disney management.

That's the point.

If enough people are put off enough to stop/delay/rethink their plans at Disney property, it will start having an effect. A number of people on this thread are already saying they will stay offsite to avoid these "idiots." Mission accomplished.

Also, there's no point in scheduling negotiations if the company (Disney, in this case) hasn't made any movement in terms of offers. If Disney is going to continue to making the same offers, something else needs to be done to enact change.

 

[JaneJetson]

Really? Of all the evils on this earth, crossing a picket line is one of the worst ones? Wow.

Hahaha! Yeah. Forget murder! Forget abuse! Crossing a picket line is the most evil thing of all!!!

 

[JaneJetson]

That's the point.

If enough people are put off enough to stop/delay/rethink their plans at Disney property, it will start having an effect. A number of people on this thread are already saying they will stay offsite to avoid these "idiots." Mission accomplished.

Also, there's no point in scheduling negotiations if the company (Disney, in this case) hasn't made any movement in terms of offers. If Disney is going to continue to making the same offers, something else needs to be done to enact change.

Actually, didn't only one person say that?

Personally, I always stay offsite. It has nothing to do with the protestors. I just don't feel like paying that much for a hotel I'm barely in anyway.

 

[Quest4fun]

WOW! Do you honestly believe what you have just written?

How about...
"Cinderella is working 3 jobs because she was laid off from her job that she got after working hard for 4 years in college. She and her co-workers work very hard to make others vacations wonderful. She can't afford to give up 1/4 of her pay for benefits that she was getting when she accepted this job.

Your mother and father aren't in the same position because they got lucky and their job did not get cut from their company when the budget cuts came down.

It's important, kids, that we don't make pre-judgments about people based on their work. We don't know their story, all we know is that they are human, just like us."

Luck has nothing to do with it. Hard work is rewarded. My parents went through hardships. My dad worked for the state so I know all about pay cuts and the like. My mom was laid off frequently. I've been laid off twice myself. I always landed on my feet. I've never filed for unemployment. Do you consider me lucky because I have a marketable skill that I've spent more than a decade developing? They wouldn't call it work if it didn't involve it.

I never consider myself special. If I lost my job today I'd be able to find another one. I can take a pay cut to get in the door and work my way up. It's how I've always done it.

If Cinderella is giving up 1/4 of her check for healthcare she needs to find a better job. It's typically 10 to 15% tops. Cinderella needs to learn how to type. Personally, I would love to get paid to carry bags to a room, take reservations, or *gasp* waive and sign autographs. I'll never do it because it doesn't pay enough to support a family let alone myself. That's a good job to pay the bills while you work your way towards a real job that adults have. It's time to grow up and contribute.

I believe everything I say. I'm not lucky. I just work hard. Much harder than the anybody at the Disneyland Hotel works I'm certain.

 

[CrazyDuck]

Or...
They have successfully gotten the attention of media, current tourists, and people who have reservations in the future at the affected hotels.

We know nothing about their union reps, but how on earth can you say, "their union representatives are a bunch of idiots who don't want to meet with Disney management" when we know that they have met with Disney management many times? You just called them idiots, but are either ignoring facts or not comprehending what you have read.

Unless you have personal knowledge of the situation, I have read nothing that say they are not willing to meet with management as you have stated.

I have no problem with disagreeing with their approach, but how about we stick with the facts?

You think this is the first time they have been in the news? This dispute has been on going 6 months now!!! If the union reps can't accomplish anything in that time they need to step aside and let their members pick new reps!!!

"The union is demanding to meet on Disney property, as they always have. But Disney negotiators want to talk at a "neutral" location, Disney spokesman John Nicoletti said. Disney negotiators have offered to meet at off-site places, including the union's headquarters and the Hilton Anaheim across the street from Disney."

From this article: http://www.ocregister.com/news/disney-union-want-1981893-hotels-members

You can't blame Disney for not wanting these fools on property, Look at the way they act!!

 

[JadeDarkstar]

i havent read all the posts yet but i heard about there protesting a month ago im glad finely some one arested them im so sorry for them but come on runing others vacations by ruining the imagination the kids have by dressing up is carzy.

and ill not boycot disney becosue this..so sad every ones suffering and to the person raiseing three grandkids and her mom they can get on state covered health care. even with 14 an hour (she has 5ppl in her house hold in less her mom works then she could get on the access.)

im so sorry for the ppl working hard and stuff but its hard every where i have known 7 ppl in the last year get laid off from work becosue the econimey
be lucky there not loseing there jobs like some are.

ok im over my rant but come on dont say the mouse is turning in to a rat or boycot them.
you and ppl like you boycotting them will only make them raise prices and cut pay to workers more.

 

[Quest4fun]

i havent read all the posts yet but i heard about there protesting a month ago im glad finely some one arested them im so sorry for them but come on runing others vacations by ruining the imagination the kids have by dressing up is carzy.

and ill not boycot disney becosue this..so sad every ones suffering and to the person raiseing three grandkids and her mom they can get on state covered health care. even with 14 an hour (she has 5ppl in her house hold in less her mom works then she could get on the access.)

im so sorry for the ppl working hard and stuff but its hard every where i have known 7 ppl in the last year get laid off from work becosue the econimey
be lucky there not loseing there jobs like some are.

ok im over my rant but come on dont say the mouse is turning in to a rat or boycot them.
you and ppl like you boycotting them will only make them raise prices and cut pay to workers more.

Well said.

Here's a suggestion for everybody who wants to make a difference. Instead of supporting unions, support scholarship programs.

 

[disneyobsessed808]

Nobody is holding a gun to their head saying "Work an entry level job at Disneyland."

That's true in some sense, but for many people they have no other option. Finding any job, especially as "unskilled" labor, is difficult. I have a feeling that many of them are working more than one job because they must in order to make ends meet

Disneyland jobs fall in line retail jobs and burger flipping I'm sorry to say. You can't measure performance because there is a ceiling at which they work which they cannot go outside of. It's the nature of the position.

It's really just because our society has decided that their work is not as valuable as others. Also, if you can't measure their performance, how can you say compensation should be based on performance. The concept is completely arbitrary

Just because you can't get into USC doesn't mean you can't go to school. You can get your degree in community college in the evening if you have to work during the day. Don't expect to get a high paying job out of school either. Everybody needs to pay their dues and work their way up.

School is not for everyone. Many people won't be able to thrive in school, for a number of reasons: their language, bad test-taking, bad studying skills. And for people who are referenced in the article, they simply don't have the time. If they're caring for children or grandchildren, it makes it much harder to go to any sort of college. Also, if they're past middle age like the workers referenced in the story, the costs of going to school might be significantly greater than the long term benefits. It's one thing to graduate from college when you're in your 20's, it's quite another when you're 50.

I'm sympathetic to the plight of those who work multiple jobs. My own brother works two and barely makes ends meet. He prefers that to a 9 to 5'er that would pay him the same amount because the work is more stressfull. It's his decision.

I welcome the added stress of my office job. It sucks while I'm there but at the end of the day I can shut off my computer, turn off my phone and not have to worry about bills. My wife and I have a budget that we stick too. I took some work to get here but that's what it's all about. One of my old coaches once said, "There's no free lunch." I remind myself that every time I find myself looking for somebody to blame when it get's tough I remind myself that I am a product of my decisions. If I want anything I'm going to have to work for it.

I think its wrong to assume that your job is any more stressful than having to work an entry-level job. I'm not saying that your job isn't stressful, since I don't know you. However, my brother also works two entry-level jobs (one at a hotel). He is always worried about work and at work, he's always tense, especially having to deal with grumpy tourists. It may be a different kind of stress, but stressful none the less

I agree that "There's no free lunch" and the same concept should be applied to Disney. They shouldn't exploit their workers and be able to get away with it. Also, considering that workers voted to take lower wages in exchange for healthcare benefits, it wasn't free for them either. Disney is reneging on their part. The workers are still working for what they want while they work and while they protest.

 

[Disney Dreams]

Luck has nothing to do with it. Hard work is rewarded. My parents went through hardships. My dad worked for the state so I know all about pay cuts and the like. My mom was laid off frequently. I've been laid off twice myself. I always landed on my feet. I've never filed for unemployment. Do you consider me lucky because I have a marketable skill that I've spent more than a decade developing? They wouldn't call it work if it didn't involve it.

I don't understand what your above comment has to do with the discussion at hand. No one has disagreed with anything you have said. Every person that was arrested had a job; therefore landing on their feet with whatever lead to this point. We have nothing that tell us that any of those asking to keep their current health benefits has filed for unemployment. They have marketable skills. They work hard every day. So, I guess they are all just like you. Hard working people.

If I lost my job today I'd be able to find another one. I can take a pay cut to get in the door and work my way up. It's how I've always done it.

Of course you could. And if your current employer wanted to take away some of your benefits, I would hope you would speak up and fight for yourself before they were lost. I know I would.

...Personally, I would love to get paid to carry bags to a room, take reservations, or *gasp* waive and sign autographs.

Really? You would love to go home every night with back pain, sore arms, carpal tunnel, and *gasp* spend hours in a hot costume in 98 degree weather with crying kids, demanding parents, sore feet, and have to force a smile? I'm not so sure I would like to do so. It'd be much easier to sit in an air conditioned office typing and answering phones.

I'm not lucky. I just work hard. Much harder than the anybody at the Disneyland Hotel works I'm certain.

Again, lucky was referring to those unfortunate enough to have a job cut due to budgets. Let's keep it in context.

I just work hard. Much harder than the anybody at the Disneyland Hotel works I'm certain.

Really? You're sure? I think to say that people at a hotel don't work hard is REALLY amazing. I won't argue with you because I don't know what you do (and am not asking), but we know what hotel employees do and I for one would not want to have to do it all day long. It looks like really hard work to me.

 

[JaneJetson]

I don't understand what your above comment has to do with the discussion at hand. No one has disagreed with anything you have said. Every person that was arrested had a job; therefore landing on their feet with whatever lead to this point. We have nothing that tell us that any of those asking to keep their current health benefits has filed for unemployment. They have marketable skills. They work hard every day. So, I guess they are all just like you. Hard working people.


Of course you could. And if your current employer wanted to take away some of your benefits, I would hope you would speak up and fight for yourself before they were lost. I know I would.


Really? You would love to go home every night with back pain, sore arms, carpal tunnel, and *gasp* spend hours in a hot costume in 98 degree weather with crying kids, demanding parents, sore feet, and have to force a smile? I'm not so sure I would like to do so. It'd be much easier to sit in an air conditioned office typing and answering phones.


Again, lucky was referring to those unfortunate enough to have a job cut due to budgets. Let's keep it in context.


Really? You're sure? I think to say that people at a hotel don't work hard is REALLY amazing. I won't argue with you because I don't know what you do (and am not asking), but we know what hotel employees do and I for one would not want to have to do it all day long. It looks like really hard work to me.

There's a difference between a crappy job and a difficult job. Just because a job stinks and a lot of people wouldn't want to do it does not make it a hard job to do.

I wouldn't want to walk around in a hot costume. Or clean someone's nasty hotel room. Not because it's a difficult thing to do...but because it wouldn't be fun and it's gross.

I've never been a character at Disneyland so I can't say for certain if it's hard or not, but I can't imagine it being all that difficult. And cleaning a hotel room....again, a gross job...sure. But cleaning isn't hard to do. I clean all the time and don't even get paid for it.

 

[HydroGuy]

It was bound to happen.

luckly they weren't wearing the real costumes.
I won't buy anything disney until they work out a contract with these people.

that mouse is slowly becoming a RAT

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/08/15/disney.protesters.ap/index.html?iref=mpstoryview


Rudy

Do you work at Disney?

When someone with very few posts starts a thread like this, my first thought is that a rat may indeed be at work.

 

[JaneJetson]

Do you work at Disney?

When someone with very few posts starts a thread like this, my first thought is that a rat may indeed be at work.

Are we thinking perhaps....

????

 

[disneyobsessed808]

Luck has nothing to do with it. Hard work is rewarded. My parents went through hardships. My dad worked for the state so I know all about pay cuts and the like. My mom was laid off frequently. I've been laid off twice myself. I always landed on my feet. I've never filed for unemployment. Do you consider me lucky because I have a marketable skill that I've spent more than a decade developing? They wouldn't call it work if it didn't involve it.

I never consider myself special. If I lost my job today I'd be able to find another one. I can take a pay cut to get in the door and work my way up. It's how I've always done it.

If Cinderella is giving up 1/4 of her check for healthcare she needs to find a better job. It's typically 10 to 15% tops. Cinderella needs to learn how to type. Personally, I would love to get paid to carry bags to a room, take reservations, or *gasp* waive and sign autographs. I'll never do it because it doesn't pay enough to support a family let alone myself. That's a good job to pay the bills while you work your way towards a real job that adults have. It's time to grow up and contribute.

I believe everything I say. I'm not lucky. I just work hard. Much harder than the anybody at the Disneyland Hotel works I'm certain.

Its not that easy to find a job or just to quit one's job and get educated. My brother had a desk/office/salaried job for 8 years. After he was laid off, he looked for work in the same field for two years, until he gave up and started working for the hotel full-time.

A lot of the hiring decision is based on luck. If you're good looking, taller, have a nice smile - those things have a lot of influence unfortunately. Taller people get paid more and its not because they are any better, it's because height equals power.

I don't know many people who would rather work at a hotel or restaurant, and its not because of the pay. The jobs aren't that easy, and the working conditions aren't great. And they are just as "real" as my office job or yours.

 

[pixiewings71]

All I know....Amen to Quest!! I agree with just about everything he has said. This whole thing is just disgusting and pathetic. These protestors and Union Reps need to get on with the negotiations and get something settled. From what I've heard Disney is trying but the employees are not. I pay for my healthcare and for my kids' healthcare. Why can't they pay? If it's so hard working there then they need to go elsewhere to find good jobs. Stop wasting time picketing and get a better position, that's MY advice. And you know what, I don't have a college degree but I have an amazing job with a great company that truly cares about me and my family. I wouldn't change it for the world, healthcare paid or not! And no, I don't make minimum wage, I work M-F and can take time off with little notice. Yes, I'm extremly lucky and yes, I know it.

I do hope that a balance can be reached but I think that anyone should be able to chose to join the Union or not. And yes, I do have experience, my ex was in a Union before we split up. I do not think that Unions are great for our country, I think people who work hard and have good ethics are. Not saying Unioners don't have ethics or work hard, just stating my thoughts.

Oh and for the record, I do have an office job. I go home every night with sore arms, sore wrists, sore fingers, neck pain, back pain and all I do is "answer phones and type" LOL What a dumb statement..... I sit in an old bunker that has been renovated (we have SKYLIGHTS! lol) and freeze my butt off because my co-workers think it has to be 68 in here. I wear sweaters in summer because I'm cold....my benes have changes thru the years and you know what. I do NOT protest or picket. I listen to what my employers say and how the economy is affecting our company and I chose to have a small co-pay instead of losing out on a raise or some other benefit. We have an amazing profit sharing plan, I would much rather pay for my healthcare than cut that! Just because I don't work in the sun (couldn't anyway, I get heat stroke, migraines, etc etc) doesn't mean I work any less hard than anyone at DL. AND the protestors aren't the CM's INSIDE the park, they are the people who bring you clean towels from housekeeping.....we need to remember that. These are hotel employees, not park employees who DO pay for their healthcare.