Car seat hysteria?

[jodifla]

Wow! I can top everybody --- Dad used to be a long distance trucker. He would let me (then 4) sit on his lap and steer an 18 wheeler!!! Of course I now realize his knees were steadying the wheel but COME ON!!!! This is what we call BRILLIANT !

Ahh the good old days!

I'm a big believer in safety but I do love to stump the carseat nazis. I love to stir the "carseat on the airplane" threads by saying, "I hope you're renting a car when you get to WDW. You can't possibly consider using WDW transportation as it is completely unsafe for a child." The point is the level of risk you are comfortable with. I am comfortable with a toddler on a plan minus the carseat. I am not comfortable driving the highways without one for the most part. I have, however, taken taxis and held my breath because I had to. I wasn't willing to stand somewhere and start life all over again simply because my only option was cab and no carseat.

It's all a matter of comfort. What is acceptable risk and what's not is individual.

Yes, technically my DS doesn't need anything but a seatbelt at 4 where we live, but we have boosters in both cars. It doesn't look safe to me at all when he's a sleep though, and slumping forward. I think he'd be better off just lying down on the back seat.

But when I need to get in a car with a friend, I don't drag DS's booster seat along. Or when I take taxis or a car service. I just belt him in. Or when you go to other countries, and their laws about even having seat belts in the back are different.

I got stuck once without a car seat when DS was under 3. Our DCL cruise came into a different port because of Hurricane Jeanne, so our car wasn't there. A friend we knew in town picked us up. Because it was so early and because of the hurricane, no stores were open and everything was pandemonium. Never heard from any of the car seat nazis how to handle that one! Maybe I should have walked the 30 miles to my house?

 

[RadioNate]

As for car seats on airplanes, think about those for a minute, are they REALLY going to offer ANY protection in an airplane crash? No, sorry, they aren't going to help at all.

They will absolutley help with sever mid air turbulance or runway incursions. As the little girl in the car seat in Detroit who was the only survivor of that crash if being in a car seat helped her. Ask the parents in the Souix City crash what happened to their lap babies. No car seats won't help at all in an airline environment.

And the laws are 8 OR 80 lbs. A 78lb HSer wouldn't be required to be in a car seat. So no one will be driving or getting married and still need a booser.

I know several overweight 6 and 7 year olds who weigh more than 80lbs.

I don't know what the huge objection to a $20 low back booster is. I mean really know anyone who ever sat on a phone book or pillow so the seat belt fit better? We aren't talking a convertable car seat.

With all the giant cars there I don't know how anyone would even know that an older child is using a booster.

http://www.gracobaby.com/catalog/pr...boBooster%AE&modelNumber=8491RGB&CategoryID=1

 

[dennis99ss]

As a lawyer who practices aviation law, car seats/children having their own seats in planes are an absolute necessity. Even minor turbulence can cause a lap child to be thrown. Why airlines don't require this is, I think, solely financial--i.e. it costs less to pay the damages for injuries than it does to lose passengers who would not fly if they had to buy another seat.

 

[dennis99ss]

As for car seats on airplanes, think about those for a minute, are they REALLY going to offer ANY protection in an airplane crash? No, sorry, they aren't going to help at all.

Major catstrophie, no, probably not, but, in an incident that is not a total loss of life, something like plane ditching in the water, or little rock, or iowa, or the runway overruns, or major turbulence, or rough landings, or flights like the attempted take over of the ba flight a couple of years back, etc. Child seats will stop the child from becomming a missile.

 

[DisneyPhD]

Yes, technically my DS doesn't need anything but a seatbelt at 4 where we live, but we have boosters in both cars. It doesn't look safe to me at all when he's a sleep though, and slumping forward. I think he'd be better off just lying down on the back seat.

But when I need to get in a car with a friend, I don't drag DS's booster seat along. Or when I take taxis or a car service. I just belt him in. Or when you go to other countries, and their laws about even having seat belts in the back are different.

I got stuck once without a car seat when DS was under 3. Our DCL cruise came into a different port because of Hurricane Jeanne, so our car wasn't there. A friend we knew in town picked us up. Because it was so early and because of the hurricane, no stores were open and everything was pandemonium. Never heard from any of the car seat nazis how to handle that one! Maybe I should have walked the 30 miles to my house?

I have a friend who was in a role over accident in northern MI. Out in the middle of no where. Everyone was in car seats and seat belts and was unharmed. However it was over an hour until the police came. Then they would not allow them to take their car seats with them to leave the sene of the accident. They were fortante enough to have a ride from a good sameratian who turns out knew my friends father. (the police offered no help in this mater what so ever, they actually were going to leave them there.) However they were forced to drive over an hour with out car seats in a snow storm where they had just been in accident. They were already freaking out as it was. I could not belive it when I heard it.

 

[ChrisnSteph]

The law in my state is 6 AND 60. Technically my very petite dd should still have been in a car seat at the middle of third grade. It wasn't happening. She was already very shy and has always been teased because of her size - there was NO way I was going to humiliate her in front of all the kids at school by making her sit in a car seat. And yes the drop off is where a ton of kids hang out and they would have seen her. Flame if you must.

 

[mickeyminnie]

Everyone makes their own choices and lives with the consequences of those choices. For me I will not risk injury or worse to my child because they and or I didn't want the inconvience of a booster seat. Having to deal with the horrors of an injury or worse after an accident because my child was not properly restrained will no be lessened because I can say to myself well I never used a seat belt or car seat and I turned out fine.

We used to paint our houses with lead paint. We used to give pregnant mothers the okay to do all kinds of things, kids never wore bike helmets, never mind an adult, no one every worried about medication interactions with over the counter meds, we used to do a lot of things that we have since determined we were foolish for doing and are lucky there weren't more problems that there were.

If we could go back and put children in the 60's and 70's into the car seats we have now I wonder how many might have been protected? We will never prove to some people that the car seats save lives and are worth it because how could you ever to a random double blind study, would you like to be in the group asked to crash without the car seat? Maybe those of you who feel this is all such overkill would like to volunteer?

http://www.aatrust.com/index.asp?pageid=75

 

[RadioNate]

The law in my state is 6 AND 60. Technically my very petite dd should still have been in a car seat at the middle of third grade. It wasn't happening. She was already very shy and has always been teased because of her size - there was NO way I was going to humiliate her in front of all the kids at school by making her sit in a car seat. And yes the drop off is where a ton of kids hang out and they would have seen her. Flame if you must.

Sorry but it is 6 OR 60lbs
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=veh&group=27001-28000&file=27360-27368

27360. (a) A parent or legal guardian, when present in a motor
vehicle, as defined in Section 27315, may not permit his or her child
or ward to be transported upon a highway in the motor vehicle
without properly securing the child or ward in a rear seat in a child
passenger restraint system meeting applicable federal motor vehicle
safety standards, unless the child or ward is one of the following:
(1) Six years of age or older.
(2) Sixty pounds or more.

 

[LisaR]

Actually, the speed limit when I was growing up was HIGHER then it is now, 80 or more on most interstates, 65-70 on most highways. Cars were heavier then too but we did not have the SUV's, etc. Cars now have more safety features like crumple zones, etc, but older cars were a LOT heavier and harder to damage in a crash.

Where I grew up there wasn't a single road that was 80 mph. My dad had a 1 hour and 15 minute commute to work on one of the major highways in our state. The speed limit was 55 mph. Today, that very same road is 75 mph and you could get to his work in half the time because nobody drives ONLY 75.

From what I have read in the past, speed limits have come down on smaller roads but they have increased on major roads.

 

[jodifla]

Where I grew up there wasn't a single road that was 80 mph. My dad had a 1 hour and 15 minute commute to work on one of the major highways in our state. The speed limit was 55 mph. Today, that very same road is 75 mph and you could get to his work in half the time because nobody drives ONLY 75.

From what I have read in the past, speed limits have come down on smaller roads but they have increased on major roads.

Speed limits were definitely higher in the 1960s and 1970s, until the gas crisis hit.

 

[golfgal]

Sorry but it is 6 OR 60lbs
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=veh&group=27001-28000&file=27360-27368

27360. (a) A parent or legal guardian, when present in a motor
vehicle, as defined in Section 27315, may not permit his or her child
or ward to be transported upon a highway in the motor vehicle
without properly securing the child or ward in a rear seat in a child
passenger restraint system meeting applicable federal motor vehicle
safety standards, unless the child or ward is one of the following:
(1) Six years of age or older.
(2) Sixty pounds or more.

This is my exact point. At 6 years of age, most kids are NOT big enough to use a regular car seat belt. My youngest was about 45 lbs at 6 years old, so almost light enough to use a regular infant/toddler car seat. Just because he was 6 doesn't mean his size meant he could be out of a car seat (again, when he was 6 the law was 4 and 40 lbs). My kids were in boosters a year past what the law said at that time. The laws should be written to how kids fit in a seat, NOT how much they weigh or how old they are. Again, if car manufactures would make seat belts child friendly, a lot of these issues would disappear.

In Minnesota the law says that kids over 3 and under 11 have to be in a saftey seat OR seat belt that is used properly and fits properly. That makes more sense then a blanket age/weight requirement.

http://www.dps.state.mn.us/ots/Laws_Legislation/seat_belts_law.asp

 

[golfgal]

Where I grew up there wasn't a single road that was 80 mph. My dad had a 1 hour and 15 minute commute to work on one of the major highways in our state. The speed limit was 55 mph. Today, that very same road is 75 mph and you could get to his work in half the time because nobody drives ONLY 75.

From what I have read in the past, speed limits have come down on smaller roads but they have increased on major roads.

You were obviously born after the '70's then because the speed limits went DOWN to 55 in the mid 70's.

 

[jodifla]

Everyone makes their own choices and lives with the consequences of those choices. For me I will not risk injury or worse to my child because they and or I didn't want the inconvience of a booster seat. Having to deal with the horrors of an injury or worse after an accident because my child was not properly restrained will no be lessened because I can say to myself well I never used a seat belt or car seat and I turned out fine.

We used to paint our houses with lead paint. We used to give pregnant mothers the okay to do all kinds of things, kids never wore bike helmets, never mind an adult, no one every worried about medication interactions with over the counter meds, we used to do a lot of things that we have since determined we were foolish for doing and are lucky there weren't more problems that there were.

If we could go back and put children in the 60's and 70's into the car seats we have now I wonder how many might have been protected? We will never prove to some people that the car seats save lives and are worth it because how could you ever to a random double blind study, would you like to be in the group asked to crash without the car seat? Maybe those of you who feel this is all such overkill would like to volunteer?

http://www.aatrust.com/index.asp?pageid=75

Personally, I think we're a generation who refuses to accept any risk. We blow it up out of proportion to what might actually happen. Do the people in the states with the 8/80 love their kids more than the 4/40 states, or did the car seat lobbyists just spend more money there?

For me, booster seats aren't such an issue in my cars, but more when I travel. Or, when you get stuck without one by circumstance, like in my case with the hurricane, or DisneyPHd's with the car accident. Or when you are trying to carpool, or need someone else to pick up your child because you've been detained. All these circumstances happen every day all over the country.

I think once it gets to the point that you're not taking public transportation, school buses or Magical Express, it is hysteria.

Like I said, I still use one with a 4 year old. Once my kid is 80 pounds though, I think it's overkill.

 

[LisaR]

The law in my state is 6 AND 60. Technically my very petite dd should still have been in a car seat at the middle of third grade. It wasn't happening. She was already very shy and has always been teased because of her size - there was NO way I was going to humiliate her in front of all the kids at school by making her sit in a car seat. And yes the drop off is where a ton of kids hang out and they would have seen her. Flame if you must.

Your child, your right. I would never put my child's safety over my child being teased.

My dd used a booster until she was 10 and was never teased once. A few friends did ask why she still used one and she said it was safer. That was the end of it. Nobody made a big deal about it. My son is 8 1/2 and will be in one for a few more years. Doesn't bother him or his friends at all. My kids also won't be allowed to ride in the front seat until they meet the height/weight requirements. Never been teased about that one either.

Just so we are clear, do those of you that are so opposed to boosters understand that most of us are using the little booster seat that literally just makes the child sit up higher? It isn't that noticeable. We don't have 9 year olds in full fledged car seats.

 

[mrsltg]

I have a friend who was in a role over accident in northern MI. Out in the middle of no where. Everyone was in car seats and seat belts and was unharmed. However it was over an hour until the police came. Then they would not allow them to take their car seats with them to leave the sene of the accident. They were fortante enough to have a ride from a good sameratian who turns out knew my friends father. (the police offered no help in this mater what so ever, they actually were going to leave them there.) However they were forced to drive over an hour with out car seats in a snow storm where they had just been in accident. They were already freaking out as it was. I could not belive it when I heard it.

They couldn't take them because they were worthless. Once a carseat has been in one accident - even low speed - it's absorbed impact and is no good. Another reason why I don't understand the holier than thou "use a carseat on the plane and then get on ME and have them put the seat under the bus." Ummmm - no. One suitcase being thrown on top of that seat can be all the impact it needs to render the seat worthless. No one seems to want to deal with the facts, though. Oh well.

 

[ChrisnSteph]

Your child, your right. I would never put my child's safety over my child being teased.

My son is 8 1/2 and will be in one for a few more years. Doesn't bother him or his friends at all.

A few more years? What will he be - 12 years old before you let him out of a booster? Just curious, because I can't even imagine taking my son to middle school in a booster seat. By that point a regular seat belt should protect him just fine.

And apparently I stand corrected - the law in my state is 6 OR 60, not 6 AND 60. I always thought it was the other way around. So apparently I wasn't breaking any laws by not having my child in a booster or car seat. I also don't let my oldest child ride in the front seat, unless for whatever reason there isn't any more room in the back (like when I have an extra child with me).

 

[mrsltg]

And apparently I stand corrected - the law in my state is 6 OR 60. I always thought it was the other way around. So apparently I wasn't breaking any laws by not having my child in a booster or car seat. I also don't let my oldest child ride in the front seat, unless for whatever reason there isn't any more room in the back (like when I have an extra child with me).

Clearly you don't care about your child or their saftey.

 

[ChrisnSteph]

Clearly you don't care about your child or their saftey.

WTH are you talking about? Because I misunderstood it was 6 and 60 instead of 6 or 60? How dare you say I don't care about my children or their safety. You don't know me, you have no grounds to post such a ridiculous accusation.

 

[mrsltg]

WTH are you talking about? Because I misunderstood it was 6 and 60 instead of 6 or 60? How dare you say I don't care about my children or their safety. You don't know me, you have no grounds to post such a ridiculous accusation.

I was being sarcastic!!!!!!!

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I have a friend who was in a role over accident in northern MI. Out in the middle of no where. Everyone was in car seats and seat belts and was unharmed. However it was over an hour until the police came. Then they would not allow them to take their car seats with them to leave the sene of the accident. They were fortante enough to have a ride from a good sameratian who turns out knew my friends father. (the police offered no help in this mater what so ever, they actually were going to leave them there.) However they were forced to drive over an hour with out car seats in a snow storm where they had just been in accident. They were already freaking out as it was. I could not belive it when I heard it.

Well the police should have done something.

However once in a crash--the safety of the seat is compromised.

While it may appear undamaged--it has to be treated as though it is.

If the police let them leave with the seats--what if the friend just decided--we just won't get new ones. The next accident, they may not be so lucky.