Can I file a compaint against the USPS with the BBB?

[bicker]

The Post Office could do so much more cost cutting in a way that wouldn't cut into service for our customers but they are a huge monolith of a beast that has 1000 heads.

This is a favorite refrain of curmudgeons, but without proof I wouldn't be inclined to believe such assertions. Let me turn it around a bit... I bet I could go into your place of work, and find a bunch of things that they can do to save money, each of which will make your life, as an employee, that much more miserable, and/or insist on the implementation of less invasive cost-reductions that, in practice, would be practically impossible to consistently apply.

I know; early in my career as a management consultant I would do that sort of thing, and my managers would have to step-in and smooth things over with the companies I audited. With years of experience, I gained a more comprehensive understanding of operations management that included not only the technical mechanics of it, but also the reality of operations as a system that includes human elements. And those human elements change the equations quite a bit.

It's really amazing to see how it is run from the inside. Take Jack Potter the Post Master General. Does anyone in the media ever talk about the fact that 2 years ago just before all the talk of money woes for the Post Office the man was given a 30% raise.

Another common refrain of curmudgeons. What they tend not to get into is that when you pay your leadership dirt, they tend to leave for more lucrative jobs, and you end up getting less and less talented managers and less and less connected executives. The curmudgeon's best weapon is the "this is bad" approach, because generally folks don't call them out on it and demand proof that there is some other approach that clearly would have better results, considering all factors.

Now, I'm not saying that this Jack Potter situation was the way things should be. This could be one anecdote that has merit within itself. The point is that it doesn't have merit as an indicator of anything other than the anecdote. So, even assuming that what you've described has merit, it represents nothing more than $72,240, or $0.00000036 per stamp.

Kind of puts that anecdote in perspective, eh?

This was the same year the PO decimated the Rural carrier salaries with a rigged count that lost money for a very large percentage of carriers.

That's a shame, but what's interesting is how much more a change in letter-carrier salary has on the cost of stamps than the Postmaster General's salary has. So your first example was an anecdote that was numerically insignificant, while your second example was a broad cost-reduction that had a significant impact on lowering costs, and thereby keeping rates from going up as much.

It is all a matter of perspective. The reality is that everything is a balancing act. In my career, I've found that, generally, people who think they could run big organizations more efficiently and effectively than the way they're being run currently either can, and are unwilling to work for so little money, or cannot, and just are expressing frustration. I can probably count on one hand the number of times that someone has had overwhelmingly better ideas for running anything, without them failing to factor in all considerations that are important. Indeed, generally, they're looking at isolated anecdotal indicators, and not appreciating the full complexity of the system they're expressing their outrage against.

 

[LuvN~Travel]

On a budgetary note--I thought part of the financial difficulties of the post office were the creation of things like billpay, e-mail, e-cards--etc where more and more people are doing things electronically that they used to use the post office for.

Doesn't that cut into revenues and contribute to their losses?

So if they have to operate on less, but don't cut enough to meet those losses, we would by default experience a decline in service. They're still offering the service, but perhaps with less staff to accomodate the loss in revenue.

True the Postal Service has lost business over the past several years due to email and such, but they had also gained business through the small time mailers through Ebay and Amazon. The small time mailers really love us since we are set up for the small mailer.

However, due to the overall downturn of the nation as a whole, and through the prefunding of the retirement yes we finally got hit in the 'gut' so to speak.
Of course what a lot of what the federal govt. won't tell you though is that even though we are quasi federal, and that we receive very little federal funding, most of which is for the blind, handicapped and such, the feds are quite willing to 'take' any profits we make though. They have done that several times over the years that I worked for them. And, when they do, they don't give it back!

But, what is happening right now is that since they are so hard up financially is that they are trying to get rid of personnel right and left, but they are not using their layoff clause, where basically anyone with less than 6 years of service is laid off. That would help them a lot! What is really happening is that they are going after the higher paid personnel, the people with many many years of service in and are trying to find both legal and illegal ways to fire them! And, I know this from personal experience. I haven't put this on this board this year, since so many others have lost their jobs due to the financial problems the nation is facing. But, I was given my letter of dismissal back in late August.

And, why? Because my husband's supervisor decided he didn't like the fact that my husband and I BOTH have had to take a lot of Family Medical Leave over the past few years due to our disabled/perpetually sick daughter. And, after my husband had filed an EEO claim on behalf of a woman in his building who was new and afraid to do so, his immediate supervisor decided to 'get back' at him by going to the postal inspectors at MY business, the USPS and telling him that I was sending my daughter to school but taking off family medical leave citing her illnesses. NOT! However, the postal inspector got a record of her school attendances and decided to use that against me. But, most people unless they have kids in Special Education, don't know is that under the law, federal law, school systems have to put the student as 'in attendance' for the day if the kid does their work. And, that means if they do the work at home, at school, at their grandparents, in the hospital, wherever they may be at the time. Just as long as the work is eventually done, they get credit for it. And, yes our daughter had many times that she did work at home, at her grand parents, later that week at school, etc....

However, even though the law was explained to the USPS and the inspector, they willingly chose to ignore the law and laid me off.

Now, I will most likely get my job back by March. My arbitration is in middle February and the union lawyers are about 98% sure I won't have any problem there. I also have a very good Employer Law lawyer who works with one of the top 25 groups in the nation who is also handling my case as an EEO case as well. Discrimination against someone who has an association with a disabled person, namely our daughter, is also a valid case.

But, right now that is one reason windows are not being staffed correctly. Management won't listen to workers and put people on the windows. They are more concerned with closing stations, and even more concerned with letting positions go by abolishing them. And, most windows are staffed with senior personnel, the ones they are trying to get out of the post office!

But, hey now you have heard my story, right! rofl!

The doesn't mean however, that most window personnel don't care. We do! But, we have been hit with being left on the windows by ourselves, with no help now for about two years running. I was pretty much running my station by myself for about two years. Between personnel changes and one of my coworkers 'subbing' out as a supervisor in outlying towns, I was it, the only one working there.

I've said it before and will say it again. Not all of our mail stays in our hands at all times. Airline personnel and many private contractors also handle the mail, including packages, and we can't keep an eye on them as well as a regular employee. And, unfortunately we do have the occasional employee who does steal. Any company can have that sad to say.

But, even though I was fired due to (and boy could I use some really bad names here, rofl!), lets say incompetitent people guess who I have been using to mail my letters off, mainly to my lawyer and union lol. Yup, the post office! I still know that they are the most secure in the long run. And, of course if postal management would let my carrier look over his/her mail before they deliver it, I might get more of my bills too. lol Again, management is the one behind any letters getting misdelivered too. The poor carriers are threatend with discipline if they check over their mail before they leave the office. According to management , the newer mail sorting machines don't ever missort mail. Yeah right...lol

However, everyone do have a great weekend. Hey, at least I finally got a nice quiet Christmas for once! In 29 years......lol!

Kim

 

[Savsmommy]

My DH is a mailman, a VERY GOOD one might I add. I am so thankful for all the tips he has received so far from all his customers for Christmas. This has been his best year yet. Everyday he comes home with cards full of cash. My DH takes his job very seriously and he goes out of his way for his customers throughout the year.

 

[Beezle2]

This is a favorite refrain of curmudgeons, but without proof I wouldn't be inclined to believe such assertions.>>.

I take issue with your use of curmudgeon Sir, it does not apply in this case If you are interested in proof that the Post Office is whacked feel free to visit Ruralinfo.net or the Delphiforums under government and then rural carriers. I spend time there with people do this for a living and while some MAY be curmudgeons we also have the proof you might insist on listed neatly.

Let me turn it around a bit... I bet I could go into your place of work, and find a bunch of things that they can do to save money, each of which will make your life, as an employee, that much more miserable, and/or insist on the implementation of less invasive cost-reductions that, in practice, would be practically impossible to consistently apply. >>>>

I'd be willing to bet you COULD come into my work and your head would be spinning in no time.


Another common refrain of curmudgeons. What they tend not to get into is that when you pay your leadership dirt, they tend to leave for more lucrative jobs, and you end up getting less and less talented managers and less and less connected executives. The curmudgeon's best weapon is the "this is bad" approach, because generally folks don't call them out on it and demand proof that there is some other approach that clearly would have better results, considering all factors.>>>>

You know, considering all the highpaid leadership we have you'd think we'd be doing better. I'm pretty sure half of them could leave and we wouldn't miss them. But I'm a pessimist that way.

Now, I'm not saying that this Jack Potter situation was the way things should be. This could be one anecdote that has merit within itself. The point is that it doesn't have merit as an indicator of anything other than the anecdote. So, even assuming that what you've described has merit, it represents nothing more than $72,240, or $0.00000036 per stamp.

Kind of puts that anecdote in perspective, eh?>>>>>

Your perspective might be different it it were personal. Lets take $5-8,000 dollars or more out of your yearly pay, give you more work after we cheat you and then we'll give the guy who did it a big fat raise. People were pretty angry.

This is really more effort then I was wanting to put into an internet posting but I didn't want to just let it hang. I respect that you have gone to a great number of keystrokes to quote and reply and what do I know really, lol. Check out those websites I listed, lots and lots on verifiable information and good people who are as and as can be.

 

[bicker]

If you are interested in proof that the Post Office is whacked feel free to visit Ruralinfo.net or the Delphiforums under government and then rural carriers.

I assume that those are anti-Post Office blogs. Sorry, but that's not "proof" -- I suspect the sites you're referring to are simply people venting frustration. The reality is that reasonable people disagree.

And remember, no one is saying that there is "no" waste. If you think that's the context that you're arguing against, then you're arguing against a point not being made.

You know, considering all the highpaid leadership we have you'd think we'd be doing better.

Why? One of the highest paid jobs in health care is neuro-surgeon, yet the mortality rate for neuro-surgery patients is far in excess of the mortality rate for nurse practitioners. Salary generally is not slaved to the statistical probability of success, however success happens to be defined for each specific job. Rather, salary generally reflects how rare the skills, expertise, and experience necessary to do work is, and how much the work is in demand.

But I'm a pessimist that way.

And that's your right -- just keep in mind that there is another perspective that balances your perspective.

Your perspective might be different it it were personal.

Abso-friggen-lutely. However, if it were personal to me, then my perspective would be corrupted by my bias. I wouldn't understand things more clearly -- rather I would understand things less clearly.

People were pretty angry.

And so their criticisms were more a reflection of their anger than on a fair and rational view of the situation. That is completely understandable. Their tainted view is a reflection of their humanity -- it is unreasonable to expect people to be rational about things that affect them so significantly and so personally.

 

[rockydek]

I have been provided the best service by my post office and letter carrier for over 51 years. However...I was so mad the one time something happened, I wanted heads to roll. Someone reminded me of the exceptional service that we have had for over 50 years and I realized I was being unreasonable also, it could of been my own error. I mailed jewelry to a foreign country and it was opened by customs after over a month it was returned. Apparently jewelry is not allowed...Who knew?

 

[Beezle2]

I assume that those are anti-Post Office blogs.>>>

Well you know what they say about that What they are is filled with people who are affected by the actual policies of the Post Office and they can be interesting but perhaps only to those of us affected. You know in real life where it isn't some mental exercise to argue about things that you don't have any experience with.


Sorry, but that's not "proof" -- I suspect the sites you're referring to are simply people venting frustration.>>>

No they are not but if you don't want to waste time visiting the places I told you contain the proof you say you need, we have reached an end to this conversation Your pretty funny though as your "assuming" and "suspecting" is somehow more valid than the thoughts of someone who has actually worked with the beast for 4 years. Carry on, lol!

 

[bicker]

Your pretty funny though as your "assuming" and "suspecting" is somehow more valid than the thoughts of someone who has actually worked with the beast for 4 years.

Why? What do you find "funny" about labeling bias for what it is?

 

[kaytieeldr]

No they are not but if you don't want to waste time visiting the places I told you contain the proof you say you need, we have reached an end to this conversation

Well, I tried to access the first one - ruralinfo.net, I think? - and it locked up my computer before it would even load. Not worth my time.

But, on the off-chance that your side of the conversation has not reached its end, would it be possible for you to actually take advantage of this forum's "quote" feature so readers can actually determine what you're quoting/responding to, vs. your own answer? Thanks.

 

[bumbershoot]

I find it intriguing that this thread has gone on, when the original issue wasn't an issue at all, and the item was delivered exactly on time. Ya always gotta take business days, and the time it takes before shipping, into account!

 

[darlak]

I'm sure--but I find it funny that the theft of my items was discounted on the premise that there are many good employees.

I'm sure if my package were simply damaged, I would have at least received an explanation.

I don't doubt the job isn't anything but hard working and stressful--but I still mourn the loss of my package b/c it got in the hands of an employee who was less than honest.

(though i'm over it--but it is still a bummer, that's all I'm saying.)

Hmm, looking back at your post that I first quoted, I think that I was agreeing with you. Sorry if you took it as if I were discounting your experience.

 

[CathrynRose]

So today is Christmas Eve and yesterday, the post office left me a form to pick up a gift, claiming that they tried to leave it at my house but no one answered the door. First, that's ridiculous -- I was in the kitchen making cookies and had the postal employee merely knocked or rang the bell, we'd have answered it. Four adults were home at the time, so I know NO EFFORT was made to have us come to the door and sign for the package.


-Dorothy (LadyZolt)

I've also had this happen before - also when my mailbox was at the street.

I'm sure--but I find it funny that the theft of my items was discounted on the premise that there are many good employees.

I'm sure if my package were simply damaged, I would have at least received an explanation.

I don't doubt the job isn't anything but hard working and stressful--but I still mourn the loss of my package b/c it got in the hands of an employee who was less than honest.

(though i'm over it--but it is still a bummer, that's all I'm saying.)

I totally hear you. If I think too much about my Disney Box, I get upset. It's a total sore spot for me, still.

To those of you defending the U.S.P.S. - I truly hope that what happened to myself, and other posters, never happens to you. It sucks. You feel completely violated. They stole my dirty underwear, for crien' out loud!!! Along with souvenirs and irreplaceable items, like my Mom's Vintage Disney Beach Towels.

They took all my son's Disney pins - yet were kind enough to put the ziploc baggie, they had all been in, back into the box.

They took my refillable mugs. But the plastic cup I had my travel toothbrushes in....that somehow made it back into the box.

I mean - come on. I am not accusing each and every postal worker of being a scum bag. I can tell you the ones at my local office were pretty horrified at the whole scene (I brought the box with to show it to them) and actually asked me what panned out about it when I went in before Christmas to mail something. However - they agreed. My box was gone through. And it was someone at some post office along the way, that did it.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Well, I sucked it up and used the USPS to send my DN her Princess Tiana. I bought the one with the costume changes and unfortunately, that meant I had to use a slightly larger than normal box. I mean--by a few cm's....not much at all. Just barely over.

I had to ship it ground, b/c due to the extra cms--priority shipping was $22 to Kansas City. I just did not get that.

But Tiana was just a tad too big for a more ordinary box.

 

[CathrynRose]

Well, I sucked it up and used the USPS to send my DN her Princess Tiana. I bought the one with the costume changes and unfortunately, that meant I had to use a slightly larger than normal box. I mean--by a few cm's....not much at all. Just barely over.

I had to ship it ground, b/c due to the extra cms--priority shipping was $22 to Kansas City. I just did not get that.

But Tiana was just a tad too big for a more ordinary box.

$22 bucks for me, would have meant it's UPS, time.

I just can't trust them, anymore with anything worthwhile (i.e. packages) KWIM?

 

[kaytieeldr]

I've also had this happen before - also when my mailbox was at the street.

So, okay, now that two DISers have posted the same experience - and, honestly, I was thinking about this last night anyway - is it possible this is your respective post offices' policies regarding "special" mailings? I mean, delivery routes are generally based on X hours per day. Going over these hours - by, for example, turning off the truck, proceeding to the domicile, waiting for a response, etc. - would require overtime payment, wouldn't it? Especially since there's already so much suspicion or aggravation about presumed wasteful spending, doesn't it make more sense to allow the carrier to complete the route in the allowed time and if a shipment requires special treatment like being too big for the box or needing a signature, to instead inform the customer and let the customer pick up at their convenience? Heck, I know my PO holds packages for several weeks; UPS on the other hand, if you don't make alternate arrangements by the third day/delivery attempt, automatically sends the package back to the shipper.