Bush will veto attempts to stop Dubai based company run our ports

[Sylvester McBean]

You're right. I don't have to. And I don't.

The St. Pete Times article linked to doesn't corroberate your story at all. You do realize that, don't you?

From the 9/11 Commission (which fits with the facts obtained from TIA):

fantastic. good for you, I never thought it would. and I really don't care.

pledge your allegiance.

 

[bsnyder]

fantastic. good for you, I never thought it would. and I really don't care.

pledge your allegiance.

That's it? I'm disappointed. I thought you would tell me who was on that Delta jet you saw with your own eyes? Or at least that you'd tell me how that fits in with your conspiracy theories and irrational hatred of President Bush?

 

[Sylvester McBean]

That's it? I'm disappointed. I thought you would tell me who was on that Delta jet you saw with your own eyes? Or at least that you'd tell me how that fits in with your conspiracy theories and irrational hatred of President Bush?

I believe I told you I had no idea who was on ANY of the planes we saw on the east runways those days. (once again, multiple aircraft, most military, some not) and I'm not a huge conspiracy kind of guy. we're just located next to International Plaza in Tampa. run a google earth map and survey the location if you think I'm a conspiracy theorist. as for irrational hatred of the president, you're losing all credibility with me. you may think my views are irrational, but I'm entitled to my beliefs. calling my beliefs irrational is just you trying to force your beliefs onto me. like I said earlier, I voted for George the first time. I believe the war in Iraq should have been held off until Bin Laden was captured. this crap about the Saudis controlling US ports is soooo ridiculous. W. is a soft-headed **** who is endangering our country in the name of preserving his family's ties with the Saud family.

now go slap another 'I support the Troops' sticker on the minivan and sleep better at night.

in the meantime, once again:


http://www.houseofbush.com/news.php

 

[bsnyder]

I believe I told you I had no idea who was on ANY of the planes we saw on the east runways those days. (once again, multiple aircraft, most military, some not) and I'm not a huge conspiracy kind of guy. we're just located next to International Plaza in Tampa. run a google earth map and survey the location if you think I'm a conspiracy theorist. as for irrational hatred of the president, you're losing all credibility with me. you may think my views are irrational, but I'm entitled to my beliefs. calling my beliefs irrational is just you trying to force your beliefs onto me. like I said earlier, I voted for George the first time. I believe the war in Iraq should have been held off until Bin Laden was captured. this crap about the Saudis controlling US ports is soooo ridiculous. W. is a soft-headed **** who is endangering our country in the name of preserving his family's ties with the Saud family.

now go slap another 'I support the Troops' sticker on the minivan and sleep better at night.

in the meantime, once again:


http://www.houseofbush.com/news.php

Hey Sylvester, lighten up. Reasonable people can disagree on just about everything in politics. And I'm sure you're a reasonable guy. But your conspiracy theory doesn't add up.

And I'm in no need of Google maps. I worked at TIA for 5 years, for the Hillsborough County Aviation Authority. I'm quite familiar with the area.

The bottom line is, you have no idea if anyone was even on a Delta jet. And your conflating that with a conspiracy theory that's based on what has now been shown to be a misunderstanding (the FBI originally saying they had no knowledge of the non-commercial flight out of Tampa).

 

[bsnyder]

this crap about the Saudis controlling US ports is soooo ridiculous. W. is a soft-headed **** who is endangering our country in the name of preserving his family's ties with the Saud family.

now go slap another 'I support the Troops' sticker on the minivan and sleep better at night.

and just an FYI, the Saudis are not part of this port deal.

 

[Sylvester McBean]

the UAE share the same border with Saudi Arabia. of course the FBI is going to report no knowledge...blah, blah, blah.

if you lived here in 2001 you remember the St. Pete Times breaking the story which got picked up worldwide. of course it was eventually discredited.

your 'facts' are yours. mine are mine personally. george w. bush is in bed with Saudi oil. I voted for a puppet. a guy who once said 'dead or alive' in respect to Bin Laden never mentions him anymore. son of a... how can anyone in their right mind think it's a good thing to PAY the UAE to manage our most important and sensitive ports?!!!?? how many of the (blanking) September 11th hijackers were Saudi's?!!??

finally, buy the book:

http://www.houseofbush.com/news.php

I don't get paid a commission.

 

[Caradana]

If you look at the U.S. State Department website, it will corroborate the facts presented in the Heritage Foundation UAE website, and it also mentions that foreign companies are forbidden from bidding on UAE government contracts. The UAE has also apparently had problems with worker's rights abuses. Change your mind yet, Dana? You would never admit it.

The irony of your post is that I, an avowed anti-Bushie, am actually reasonably in favor of his stance on this issue.

And the facts displayed on the Heritage Foundation's site aren't really at issue: it's the character of the Foundation's members, much the same as the character of Matt Drudge. Actually, I learned something interesting last week: reportedly, one of Matt Drudge's best buddies is Howard Stern.

 

[bsnyder]

And the facts displayed on the Heritage Foundation's site aren't really at issue: it's the character of the Foundation's members, much the same as the character of Matt Drudge.

I would love for you to elaborate, Dana.

 

[DawnCt1]

Um Dawn I really hate to break it to you but Rocky Benihawna is from the US!!! An american born and bred. Japan did give us really enjoyable monster movies.... GO GODZILLA!

It was a tongue in cheek comment. I thought that you were smart enough to figure it out with out a little laughing stick figure. I guess I was wrong.

 

[Charade]

how can anyone in their right mind think it's a good thing to PAY the UAE to manage our most important and sensitive ports?!!!?? how many of the (blanking) September 11th hijackers were Saudi's?!!??

We don't pay the UAE, they pay us. We LEASE the ports to THEM.

The number of Saudi hijackers was 15.

Are you sure you don't buy any gas that's from Saudi Arabia?

Do you by anything "made in Japan"? You know they attacked us back in '41.

 

[TCPluto]

set your wayback machine to September 12th, 2001. my office is scarcely a mile from TIA. the FAA had supposedly grounded all commercial flights. Central Command (CentCom) is based a few miles south on lower Tampa Bay. if you don't think we weren't pinned to the windows watching the activity at TIA runways you would be wrong. military craft don't have flight markings emblazoned on the tails. who were on those planes? who knows. but there were outbound passenger planes from Tampa, Florida on September 12th and 13th. one was a large Delta jet. my physical evidence? none. we saw what we saw. you don't have to believe me. in the meantime, purchase:

http://www.houseofbush.com/news.php

I saw what I saw?? Come on you don't live in Fla...... you live in area 51. You were abducted weren't you? Had a love child with the aliens too...

 

[crazyme5kids]

bsnyder I knew that already lol! Sorry but you just made my day . I'm just sitting here cracking up. I guess I do come across as a rather niave person sometimes, but I'm really a little sharper than that, I really am !

Still stand by my opinion that Bush should have known and been part of the decision making process on this one.

My neck is killing me this morning and I can barely move, laughing isn't helping it, but man I can't help it lol! Believe me, I don't underestimate anything out government does anymore.

 

[Puffy2]

It gets worse...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060223/ap_on_go_pr_wh/ports_security

apparently the Bush Administration had a "secret deal" with the Dubai company inwhich their business records would not have to be kept on American soil and thus able to be requested by (demanded) American courts.

Ok , explain this one to me - our own govenrment allows a foreign company to have access to and function in the daily operations of some of our major ports (areas that have already been indentified as potential terrorists targets) and not only that, they want to make it so that the company isn't subject to scrutiny by the American judicial system. WHAT???

 

[Charade]

It gets worse...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060223/ap_on_go_pr_wh/ports_security

apparently the Bush Administration had a "secret deal" with the Dubai company inwhich their business records would not have to be kept on American soil and thus able to be requested by (demanded) American courts.

Ok , explain this one to me - our own govenrment allows a foreign company to have access to and function in the daily operations of some of our major ports (areas that have already been indentified as potential terrorists targets) and not only that, they want to make it so that the company isn't subject to scrutiny by the American judicial system. WHAT???

Just playing devil's advocate...

I wonder if the other foreign port operators are required to keep records on US soil? The article did say that manifest record are not as sensitive as other types (they cited telco operations).

 

[siouxi31]

I'm still riding the fence about this decision to allow DPI to manage our east/southern coast ports.
As I mentioned in another post, I work for an ocean shipping company. I feel a bit relieved to hear the opions of port experts where they are not concerned. I quote the below from the Chicago Tribune:

"But the deal by Dubai Ports World to operate in 28 American ports is being viewed very differently by many shipping industry participants and some security experts. They said Wednesday that a change of ownership in the company that runs docks and warehouses won't compromise national security.

It won't change who works on the docks or what they do, they point out, nor will it change security procedures, which are overseen by the U.S. Coast Guard, the U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency and armed port authority police. The ports themselves are government-owned, usually by states or cities.

If anything, those in the business say, the acquisition of P&O Ports by Dubai Ports World is just the latest chapter in a long history of consolidation in the maritime industry. P&O itself is rooted in a 169-year-old British-owned company that got into the American port management business only within the last 10 years.

"There has been a lot of hyperventilated rhetoric," said Bill McLaughlin, a spokesman for the Philadelphia Regional Port Authority, one of six U.S. ports to host a P&O terminal. The others are New York, New Orleans, Baltimore, Miami and Newark, N.J.

"It seemed like there is too much of a big deal being made" of the Dubai deal, agreed Sean Duffy, general manager of the New Orleans-based Steamship Association of Louisiana, a trade group for maritime companies. "I don't see it as potential security breach."

This is part of why I sit on the fence. Back after 9/11, we went through a big change in the way we report what's coming into the country. Factories of goods being shipped from "origin countries" must report 24 hours prior to a vessel docking at the origin point of goods exactly what it is they're shipping. It's called the 24 hour rule. This information must make sense as far as the harmonized tariff code (a number that describes in detail exactly what is being shipped), the weight, size, measurements of the cargo. Can a company determine what's inside of a container when they unload it from a ship? Well, most often they can. As they're pulling the container off of the ship, they can determine the weight of the container. Seal #'s are checked and if a seal has been broken/replaced, the container cannot come in. The information is provided to the ocean shipping companies who then transmit the EDI manifest to US Customs. It's US customs who are viewing what comes in and if there is anything shady about it.
The other reason I sit on the fence is that I wonder just how involved the UAE would be in the port management. Are they able to sneak anything by? I don't really think so. Homeland Security and US Customs are quite separate from port management and they have the word as to whether something can come into our country or not.
Anyway, just wanted to provide you all with this information to help you be better informed about your stance on this issue.

 

[Geoff_M]

apparently the Bush Administration had a "secret deal" with

With respect to the "secret" nature of the "deal", Paul at Wizbang makes this rather obvious comment about the assertion:

Arab Company, Administration had "Super Secret" Agreement

And this year's award for the most misleading headline goes to... the Associated Press.

Check out this headline: "Arab Co., White House Had Secret Agreement"

That damned secretive White House at it again. First Cheney, now this... Tonight we learn the administration had a "Secret Agreement" with the Arab company they sold the ports to. Or then again, maybe not....

Arab Co., White House Had Secret Agreement

The Bush administration secretly required a company in the United Arab Emirates to cooperate with future U.S. investigations before approving its takeover of operations at six American ports, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press. It chose not to impose other, routine restrictions.

As part of the $6.8 billion purchase, state-owned Dubai Ports World agreed to reveal records on demand about "foreign operational direction" of its business at U.S. ports, the documents said. Those records broadly include details about the design, maintenance or operation of ports and equipment.

The administration did not require Dubai Ports to keep copies of business records on U.S. soil, where they would be subject to court orders. It also did not require the company to designate an American citizen to accommodate U.S. government requests. Outside legal experts said such obligations are routinely attached to U.S. approvals of foreign sales in other industries.

"They're not lax but they're not draconian," said James Lewis, a former U.S. official who worked on such agreements. If officials had predicted the firestorm of criticism over the deal, Lewis said, "they might have made them sound harder."

The conditions involving the sale of London-based Peninsular and Oriental Steam Navigation Co. were detailed in U.S. documents marked "confidential." Such records are regularly guarded as trade secrets, and it is highly unusual for them to be made public.

They didn't have a "secret agreement" they had an agreement to keep trade secrets. The difference between the two is about as large as the difference between Billy Ocean and the Atlantic Ocean.

The agreement (by the idiot reporter's own admission) was "routine." The exact terms of the deal were not made public. Imagine that. Terms of deals like this are never made public. Heck, terms of your average lawsuit in civil court are not made public.

The headline and the writer conspire to make you think the White House had a nefarious deal that the AP exposed when nothing could be further from the truth.

I tell ya, I didn't support this deal in the beginning but when I see the same people pulling the same stunts, it really makes me want to back Bush on this one.

Link

Further more, the negotiations that routinely take place between the Government and companies concerning the approvals of such transactions are "secret" because they envolved sensitive internal non-public information and trade secrets. This is just like when the FTC does a Robinson-Pattman (sp?) monopoly determination when two US companies want to merger. The results and certain details may be made public, but most the information discussed remains private.

 

[Geoff_M]

The other reason I sit on the fence is that I wonder just how involved the UAE would be in the port management.

On NPR this AM they did a background story on DWP and it was very impressive. It also mentioned that none of the senior management of the company is from the UAE or is Arab. They interviewed the CEO and he said the UAE is totally "hands off". They view the company as one of the means to insure the financial future of the country as oil revenues are projected to drop as time goes by.

Go here to listen to the story.

 

[bsnyder]

Believe me, I don't underestimate anything out government does anymore.

And you've cracked me up by adding the qualifier "anymore" to this statement. As if government bueauracracies were ever any different than they are now.

 

[Puffy2]

And you've cracked me up by adding the qualifier "anymore" to this statement. As if government bueauracracies were ever any different than they are now.

This one - the Bush Administration - is especially horriable and inept.

 

[Puffy2]

Just playing devil's advocate...

I wonder if the other foreign port operators are required to keep records on US soil? The article did say that manifest record are not as sensitive as other types (they cited telco operations).
__________________

Here's the thing - I don't think that the United States should have ANY other country (Saudies , Iranians or British for that matter) with ANY role in our ports, our rail lines, our pipelines, our side of the borders, our Airports, or our waterways. None.

Why can't these jobs go to Americans and American held and based companies? Lord knows we need some jobs to stay here in the US, and maybe it's just me, but I think one place to start would be with industries that are vital to our national security.