Bush was told levies could break ....

[Alicnwondrln]

i am watching msnbc and they showing footage of bush just yesterday saying no anticapted the levies being breeched and that they didnt have any situational awareness
the local and state people messed up they all did but as the presidnet seeing what was happening on the news they should have done more
plain and simple

 

[MrsKreamer]

And why do we care if he knew the levees could break? Was it his responsibility to take care of the state of Louisiana? I'm under the assumption that the wonderful governor and mayor should have been in charge of this state and New Orleans. Unfortunately we as Louisianians don't make the best choices at the polls and we get what we deserve. As long as it's politics as usual in Louisiana we will always be at the bottom in everything. Why do I continue to live here? Beats me most of the time. We can't elect Bobby Jindal for governor. Instead we give Kathleen BLABineaux BLANKo the job. This woman can't put together a complete sentence to save her life and we let her run our state. If you ever hear a speech by her, count the "uh"s and "you knows" in each sentence. All she needs to add is a "like" here and there and we'd have ourselves a real intelligent speech.

I voted for Mr Jindal, and I am so wishing he would have been in office!

Why do we still live here? Well I can't get crwfish anywhere else...(sorry making light of the situation).

You make very good points,and ITA.

 

[MrsKreamer]

Besides turning the clock back 5-10 years, and having the Federal Government give us the funds to actually build Cat 5 levees, and actually taking and using the money for that...I really don't see what more the Federal Govt could have done.

 

[MrsPete]

Um, I've never set foot in Louisianna, but I've known since I was a child that New Orleans was built in a dangerous place: below sea level, man-made levies, all that stuff. Coffins floating after storms, etc. It's common knowledge. How could anyone NOT know that this type of emergency was a possibility?

Now, on the other hand, I can believe that people might have believed we -- as in "we" the government -- were better prepared to deal with such an emergency.

 

[Brer_Papa]

Besides turning the clock back 5-10 years, and having the Federal Government give us the funds to actually build Cat 5 levees, and actually taking and using the money for that...I really don't see what more the Federal Govt could have done.

Getting a bit off track Mrs Kreamer.......

That topic has been rehashed and rehashed....and will continue well into the future.....

the new news is....President Bush was warned the levees COULD break....

then he said nobody COULD anticipate the levees breaking....

that he was less than truthful is the kindest remark I can think of at the moment...

 

[samijam]

I don't know anything about New Orleans or Politics and I KNEW THE LEVIES WOULD BREAK!!!!!

 

[MrsKreamer]

I posted in my original post that I believe that there is a difference in "being told the levees cannot hold Katrina" and the "levees actually failing". I have known since I was a small child that I live in a city 6+ feet below sea level and our levees were only built to withstand a CAT 3 hurricane. Yet "I", a resident of said city, never "antcipated" them actually breaking.

I am sorry that topic of better levees being built has been hashed and re-hashed on this board...I wouldn't know I was evaciated until last month with no internet service.

 

[Bayshore Bandit]

One quote in the video stands out above the rest......when the National
Weather Service expert said this "is of grave concern".

I do not understand how the President can hear that, and then after the
storm say no one anticipated the levies being breached.

 

[LisaR]

the huge difference is President Bush facing the cameras saying no one could anticipate the levees breaking when he was told that they may....given the magnitude and power of Katrina....

Exactly! I agree 100%
This could have happened on anyone's watch........Clinton, Papa Bush, etc, etc. It isn't GWB fault the levees broke. Nobody is blaming him for that.

However, he chose to lie about a crisis, yet somehow there are Bush supporters defending him on this one. So, it was wrong when Clinton lied because that was a moral issue but Bush can lie in a crisis situation and it is okay??? How this man has a 34% approval rating is beyond me. Wake up, people.

 

[eclectics]

the new news is....President Bush was warned the levees COULD break....

then he said nobody COULD anticipate the levees breaking....

that he was less than truthful is the kindest remark I can think of at the moment...

Exactly. We have a President who backs away from taking responsibility time and time again. Rack another one up. I wonder how many more it will take before the loyalists will finally take their blinders off and see exactly where this administration's priorities are, not to the American people, but to themselves and their image.

 

[bsnyder]

There is indeed a difference between a levee overtopping and breeching. And if you look back at the news coverage, and headlines from various newspapers, everyone thought that New Orleans had been spared the worst of the disaster (the levees overtopping) when the storm actually hit. They didn't anticipate the levees being breeched after the storm passed by, which is in fact what actually happened. The levees should have held up for a storm of Katrina's strength (they didn't have Cat 5 winds in New Orleans.) They failed because of structural flaws in the design/construction - human error.

None of that excuses the poor planning and slow response on the part of all levels of government - local, state and federal.

I know the facts won't make a bit of difference to those who just like to think the President is a liar, but they are still the facts.

 

[MrsKreamer]

that's right, I am just speaking as a Bush supporter and not as a resident of the city in question. I only had to be up rooted from my life for half a year, spend all of my savings, and go into debt, and lose countless priceless possesions, watch as my elderly grandparents, and mother became homeless, and yet I say everything to defend the president. It must be nice sitting in the north, freezing your butt off in judgement. Try being from here and actually knowing a few things about the city inferstructure before jumping to the idiotic conclusion that everything I said was just because I am a Bush supporter.

 

[tarmand]

that's right, I am just speaking as a Bush supporter and not as a resident of the city in question. I only had to be up rooted from my life for half a year, spend all of my savings, and go into debt, and lose countless priceless possesions, watch as my elderly grandparents, and mother became homeless, and yet I say everything to defend the president. It must be nice sitting in the north, freezing your butt off in judgement. Try being from here and actually knowing a few things about the city inferstructure before jumping to the idiotic conclusion that everything I said was just because I am a Bush supporter.

Yes, I am a Bush supporter, but I'm not here taking up for Bush. I'm here trashing Louisiana's pathetic government. But, the same thing could be said about you guys that are only here to bash our President. I'm actually ready for the next election so that you guys have something new to complain about.

 

[Laura]

(Bolding mine)

There is indeed a difference between a levee overtopping and breeching. And if you look back at the news coverage, and headlines from various newspapers, everyone thought that New Orleans had been spared the worst of the disaster (the levees overtopping) when the storm actually hit. They didn't anticipate the levees being breeched after the storm passed by, which is in fact what actually happened. The levees should have held up for a storm of Katrina's strength (they didn't have Cat 5 winds in New Orleans.) They failed because of structural flaws in the design/construction - human error.

None of that excuses the poor planning and slow response on the part of all levels of government - local, state and federal.

I know the facts won't make a bit of difference to those who just like to think the President is a liar, but they are still the facts.

You say that they didn't anticipate the breach after the storm passed. So why were Bush and Brown discussing possible breaches on the day of the storm?

White House deputy chief of staff Joe Hagin, Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco and Brown discussed fears of a levee breach the day the storm hit.

"I talked to the president twice today, once in Crawford and then again on Air Force One," Brown said. "He's obviously watching the television a lot, and he had some questions about the Dome, he's asking questions about reports of breaches."

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002114558

(P.S. Just a pet peeve, everybody. It's levees and breaches, not levies--that's for taxes--or breeches--those are pants.)

 

[bsnyder]

(Bolding mine)

You say that they didn't anticipate the breach after the storm passed. So why were Bush and Brown discussing possible breaches on the day of the storm?


http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002114558

(P.S. Just a pet peeve, everybody. It's levees and breaches, not levies--that's for taxes--or breeches--those are pants.)

What I'm saying is that everyone anticipated that flooding could occur when the storm hit - either from breaching or overtopping - after all, Katrina was at one point a CAT 5 hurricane. But it wasn't that when it actually made landfall, it was a CAT 3, and the city of New Orleans didn't even receive CAT 3 winds, they were far lower than that. So there's a lull, when all the news reports are saying that New Orleans "dodged a bullet".

Sorry about the mispelling!

 

[bsnyder]

And just a few more facts, to go with the hype and spin:

The response to Hurricane Katrina was by far the largest--and fastest-rescue effort in U.S. history, with nearly 100,000 emergency personnel arriving on the scene within three days of the storm's landfall.

Dozens of National Guard and Coast Guard helicopters flew rescue operations that first day--some just 2 hours after Katrina hit the coast. Hoistless Army helicopters improvised rescues, carefully hovering on rooftops to pick up survivors. On the ground, "guardsmen had to chop their way through, moving trees and recreating roadways," says Jack Harrison of the National Guard. By the end of the week, 50,000 National Guard troops in the Gulf Coast region had saved 17,000 people; 4000 Coast Guard personnel saved more than 33,000.

These units had help from local, state and national responders, including five helicopters from the Navy ship Bataan and choppers from the Air Force and police. The Louisiana Department of Wildlife and Fisheries dispatched 250 agents in boats. The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), state police and sheriffs' departments launched rescue flotillas. By Wednesday morning, volunteers and national teams joined the effort, including eight units from California's Swift Water Rescue. By Sept. 8, the waterborne operation had rescued 20,000.

While the press focused on FEMA's shortcomings, this broad array of local, state and national responders pulled off an extraordinary success--especially given the huge area devastated by the storm. Computer simulations of a Katrina-strength hurricane had estimated a worst-case-scenario death toll of more than 60,000 people in Louisiana. The actual number was 1077 in that state.

 

[TCPluto]

Originally Posted by MrsKreamer
Besides turning the clock back 5-10 years, and having the Federal Government give us the funds to actually build Cat 5 levees, and actually taking and using the money for that...I really don't see what more the Federal Govt could have done.

Getting a bit off track Mrs Kreamer.......

That topic has been rehashed and rehashed....and will continue well into the future.....

the new news is....President Bush was warned the levees COULD break....

then he said nobody COULD anticipate the levees breaking....

that he was less than truthful is the kindest remark I can think of at the moment...

Not so much Papa bear, MrsKream is actually right on.

A travesty of the magnitude takes years to make. I think that's supported by the Army Corp of Engineers asking for money from Congress for a long time, and being denied.

As well, money set aside for levy maintenance was diverted to pet projects by politicians tasked with levy maintenance. She makes both points. Given that she's from NOLA, she is probably well suited to weigh in.

Listen to the video. "Topped" is mentioned, breached is not. He was not told they could be breached, that is a lie Papa. Unless you have it somewhere else, the video does not support your position.

Make your point, but don't lie in doing so.

 

[Planogirl]

The levees could certainly be built strong enough to withstand these waters. That, as I understand it, this is a federal function. Maybe they need to consult with the Dutch if they can't figure it out.

In the transcipt, I see both Mayor Nagin and the governor asking for help. Isn't that what they were supposed to do?

I guess that all of this fingerpointing is getting old. I personally blame all levels of government including Bush.

 

[TCPluto]

Exactly! I agree 100%
So, it was wrong when Clinton lied because that was a moral issue but Bush can lie in a crisis situation and it is okay???

Clinton lied under oath, felony perjury, regardless of the subject matter.

If President Bush lied, and the video doesn't support that, that would be awful, but not criminal.

 

[jfulcer]