Boy killed by bus at Fort Wilderness

[Shan-man]

While not wanting to flame. This could only come from someone who doesn't have any children.

Letting the ad hominem float past for the moment, could I ask that you address the argument made? Are you asserting that Disney is responsible for the children since their parents are on vacation? Since you didn’t give a hint of what else you disagree with I can only assume you find me disagreeable. But even that is no reason to try to silence someone.

As for my parental history, I have been a father to my stepson since he was 12 (he's now 28) and a grandfather to my granddaughter since she was conceived and she is now 9. So yeah, I know nothing of the ages 10 and 11! I do know that if I had my granddaughter at FW I wouldn’t turn her loose on her bike, insisting that she stay on our loop at the least (if not within visual distance). Nor would I turn a 13yo loose with a golf cart, or allow a small child in the hot tub, or a thousand other things that happen at the Fort all the time because parents don't want to be bothered with parenting.

 

[devores]

Let me start by saying I have no more information regarding this tragedy than you guys do.

I just saw an interview on the news with the childs monther. She said the children had gone to the arcade and the parent were to meet with them 30 min later. The mother also mentioned pushing for criminal charges against the bus driver and a possible law suite against Disney. With a law suite on the horizon, no specifics were discussed, but the reporter did say that the child had hit the bus. But no one will know for sure until the investigation is complete.

How horrible for the bus driver. Not only having to deal with the thought of taking a life unintentionaly, but know a criminal investigation too boot.

 

[BigDaddyRog]

Shan...Im not sure how much reading of ths DIS youve recently done....but DisneyBishops just lost his son in a horrible car accident 2 weeks ago....maybe some understanding is in order.

 

[RocklandRVers]

I certainly agree with everyone that this is a tragedy. And while the last thing I would want to do is to heap guilt upon misery, one has to ask, where were the parents? A 9- and 11-year-old were out riding alone along Big Pine!? I'm sorry, but that is inexcusable. Is it possible they slipped away unnoticed and against parental prohibition. Sure. Is it possible that something unpreventable happened to cause the accident, that might have happened even with the parents there (like a chain breaking, or a branch getting caught in the wheel). Sure. But let's not kid ourselves here. The people most responsible for the safety of this child were not the bus driver, or the sidewalk planners, or the speed limit setter, the 11 year-old 'guardian'. They are the parents, and they were nowhere to be seen.

Please, care for your children... they are YOUR responsibility. (let the flames begin)

You expressed my feelings and thoughts exactly. I cringe when I see kids zipping around on bikes unsupervised and seemingly not thinking about the potential dangers. I know its easy to let our guard down in a magical place like the Fort but it is just like letting kids do the same thing on a busy street back home. God bless the young man, his family and friends as well as the poor bus driver. I am betting he is devastated!

 

[cranbiz]

Let me start by saying I have no more information regarding this tragedy than you guys do.

I just saw an interview on the news with the childs monther. She said the children had gone to the arcade and the parent were to meet with them 30 min later. The mother also mentioned pushing for criminal charges against the bus driver and a possible law suite against Disney. With a law suite on the horizon, no specifics were discussed, but the reporter did say that the child had hit the bus. But no one will know for sure until the investigation is complete.

How horrible for the bus driver. Not only having to deal with the thought of taking a life unintentionaly, but know a criminal investigation too boot.

Let's see,

Child is witnessed (by approx. 28 other guests) to have swerved off the sidewalk and into the side of the bus. Normal forward motion of bus pulls child under the back wheels. Bus is traveling at or below the speed limit. Driver stops as fast as a 40' bus stops. Tragically, the child is killed.

What is criminal on the part of the driver? What is the basis of the lawsuit?

This was a horrible accident. Nothing more.

As a 12 y/o, I swerved off the road and into a telephone pole on my bike, broke teeth, had a concussion, and other facial damage. My parents did not see fit to sue the phone company. There weren't criminal charges filed.

I feel for the driver and the family for their horror and loss, but I have lost some respect for the parents as well.

I was not the driver, I was not working that day and got my info the same way everybody else did. There is no amount of training that can be given to prevent this tragedy as it has been reported.

"Off my soapbox" "Puts on turnout gear"

 

[MandMLUVMMandDVC]

This was a horrible, tragic accident. I feel for the parents who have now lost two dear children. But, I cannot understand the immediate (less than 24 hours!) decision to lay blame on Disney, and the bus driver, and to already start discussing a law suit. The FHP is still investigating. Let them do their job before you decide to sue! Now is the time for the family to deal with their unsurmountable grief. Please don't 'hate on me' about this. I too have been through sudden loss like this so I know people don't think clearly and want immediate answers, but I am disappointed in our 'sue happy' world these days. I will keep this family in my prayers for a long time, just as I will do for DisneyBishops, and I continue to do for the parents of Austin Wuennenberg (killed in last year's monorail accident).

 

[kazlac4]

Let me start by saying I have no more information regarding this tragedy than you guys do.

I just saw an interview on the news with the childs monther. She said the children had gone to the arcade and the parent were to meet with them 30 min later. The mother also mentioned pushing for criminal charges against the bus driver and a possible law suite against Disney. With a law suite on the horizon, no specifics were discussed, but the reporter did say that the child had hit the bus. But no one will know for sure until the investigation is complete.

How horrible for the bus driver. Not only having to deal with the thought of taking a life unintentionaly, but know a criminal investigation too boot.

I know I do not know all the facts in the case, but I do know that if I had just lost one of my children to a tragedy like this, I would certainly not wanting to be taking the time doing a television interview. I find it hard to believe that the parent's might already be "pointing blame" to the driver when apparently there were many witnesses who state the child ran into the side of the bus. It seems this was a horrible accident, not a criminal act, so in the same manner, if one could blame the driver than I guess one could say the parents were neglectful in watching their child..thus it could be deemed their own fault. Unfortunately many accidents do not have witnesses and there is no chance to know what really ever happened but in this case it seems there were many witnesses (who all now must live with this terrible memory). Sadly, it seems that the child made an error thus causing terrible results, thus a terribly sad accident.

 

[mnsprk]

I also feel for and we are praying for the family.

IT WAS A TRAGIC ACCIDENT and nothing they do will bring there son back.

However, in February we had the same thing happen, but fortunately I was able to hit the brakes before I hit the boy(closer to 13/14) who rode right out in front of us. The big difference was he was "riding with his parents".

This also happened on Big Pine, and he veered from the walk for absolutely no reason without even looking.

 

[AuburnJen92]

Shan...Im not sure how much reading of ths DIS youve recently done....but DisneyBishops just lost his son in a horrible car accident 2 weeks ago....maybe some understanding is in order.

Shan, take it from someone who visited Dan and his family after the horrible accident with his son, you need to read the Dis more. Two absolutely terrible accidents of innocent children in a very short time have occurred. I have seen the horror that it is to lose a child on human faces. NO ONE should have to go through this, no one. I am very saddened that this thread has turned into a blame game. I agree with Rog, understanding and compassion should be in order here, not a bitter defending of your point.

 

[gmflanigan]

While not wanting to flame. This could only come from someone who doesn't have any children.

Amen.

 

[bigdisneydaddy]

The fact is that we dont even know what we dont even know and at this point we are all just armchair quarterbacks.

The parents talk of a lawsuit is probably a knee jerk reaction to try to make sense of a tragedy that really cant be made understandable. Because it is so horrible, someone surely must be to blame, when in fact there may be no blame. it was just an unfortunate event that happened for reasons that our mortal minds just cant fathom.

 

[AuburnJen92]

The fact is that we dont even know what we dont even know and at this point we are all just armchair quarterbacks.

The parents talk of a lawsuit is probably a knee jerk reaction to try to make sense of a tragedy that really cant be made understandable. Because it is so horrible, someone surely must be to blame, when in fact there may be no blame. it was just an unfortunate event that happened for reasons that our mortal minds just cant fathom.

Amen

 

[tim5055]

Chase's family disputes FHP's preliminary findings.

Barbara Burkett, the boy's grandmother, said the friend who was with Chase during the accident told her that she and Brubaker were on the sidewalk when the bus struck the boy.

Burkett did not identify the girl, but said she lives near the Brubaker family in Redington Beach.

The sidewalk and roadway are separated by a narrow strip of well-worn grass — a sign that vehicles have crossed over the area in the past.

The girl heard, but didn't see, what happened, she told the boy's relatives, though the girl insists they never left the sidewalk.

Full Article - Family blames Disney for son’s death at Fort Wilderness

 

[bigdisneydaddy]

That grass area is worn because of golf carts pulling over to let other traffic pass by, I have done it many times, never once seen a car, truck or bus run off on it.

 

[LarryJ]

I certainly agree with everyone that this is a tragedy. And while the last thing I would want to do is to heap guilt upon misery, one has to ask, where were the parents? A 9- and 11-year-old were out riding alone along Big Pine!? I'm sorry, but that is inexcusable. Is it possible they slipped away unnoticed and against parental prohibition. Sure. Is it possible that something unpreventable happened to cause the accident, that might have happened even with the parents there (like a chain breaking, or a branch getting caught in the wheel). Sure. But let's not kid ourselves here. The people most responsible for the safety of this child were not the bus driver, or the sidewalk planners, or the speed limit setter, the 11 year-old 'guardian'. They are the parents, and they were nowhere to be seen.

Please, care for your children... they are YOUR responsibility. (let the flames begin)

I also have to agree and that was my wife's thought also when I told her about this tragedy. When our two son's were growing up (now 37 and 33) we often rode our bikes at the Fort and until they were in high school and around 16 or even 17 or so they didn't ride alone anywhere alone and when we road they were always in front of us so we could watch them and stayed to the half of the sidewalk away from the road. I can't count the number of times that we had to remind them to pay attention to what they were doing when they would turn their head to talk or look anywhere except ahead. Now even if the parents were there this might not have been avoidable, but my point as was stated above. "Please care for your children ... they are YOUR responsibility" and even then you can't be 100% careful, but it's your responsibility to do the very, very, best you can. Parenting at least in our opinion is a full time job and it's so sad very time I hear about a drowning in a tub with a small child because the parent was away just for a moment to get clothes out of dryer or take a phone call or not watching a toddler like a mother hawk over her baby that is loose 100% of the time is again in our opinion just not something we think is best. We sure weren't perfect parents ... far from it, but that was always first on on mind and everything else was secondary. I would never have let a 10 YO ride a bike at FW with the type of traffic there is there since notwithstanding the buses the private vehicle speed is often way in excess of what I think is safe anyway.

We can't ensure that our children always make the best decisions, but watching and counseling/helping them as much as possible and sharing our thoughts about always thinking safety is something we can and IMO are critical to do.

We were also very restrictive after our sons got their license's and they weren't allowed to have even one passenger in the car until they were a junior/senior in HS and then only one other passenger was allowed in the car at any time and we still worried about that. Our sons are just over 4 years apart and we didn't even like them to be in the same car at the same time alone together until our oldest was almost 18 and then it was only to go to Boy Scout meetings. They were and still are best friends and we felt there could be the possibility of the driver becoming distracted in conversation, etc. I can't tell you now that they are just now learning what they actually know and the number of times that both have thanked us for some of the things we did warms our heart each and every time.

I can't even imagine the grief and sorry parents go thru when a tragedy like this happens so there are no words I can offer or even begin to say. SO SO SAD.

I hope my post is taken in the spirit that is was made and that is we all must DO THE VERY BEST WE CAN to keep our children safe and try and teach them the values and responsibilities that we think they should have. Taking your eye "off the ball" so to speak even once can have tragic consequences.


Larry

 

[rapriebe]

I certainly agree with everyone that this is a tragedy. And while the last thing I would want to do is to heap guilt upon misery, one has to ask, where were the parents? A 9- and 11-year-old were out riding alone along Big Pine!? I'm sorry, but that is inexcusable. Is it possible they slipped away unnoticed and against parental prohibition. Sure. Is it possible that something unpreventable happened to cause the accident, that might have happened even with the parents there (like a chain breaking, or a branch getting caught in the wheel). Sure. But let's not kid ourselves here. The people most responsible for the safety of this child were not the bus driver, or the sidewalk planners, or the speed limit setter, the 11 year-old 'guardian'. They are the parents, and they were nowhere to be seen.

Please, care for your children... they are YOUR responsibility. (let the flames begin)

I also have to agree and that was my wife's thought also when I told her about this tragedy. When our two son's were growing up (now 37 and 33) we often rode our bikes at the Fort and until they were in high school and around 16 or even 17 or so they didn't ride alone anywhere alone and when we road they were always in front of us so we could watch them and stayed to the half of the sidewalk away from the road. I can't count the number of times that we had to remind them to pay attention to what they were doing when they would turn their head to talk or look anywhere except ahead. Now even if the parents were there this might not have been avoidable, but my point as was stated above. "Please care for your children ... they are YOUR responsibility" and even then you can't be 100% careful, but it's your responsibility to do the very, very, best you can. Parenting at least in our opinion is a full time job and it's so sad very time I hear about a drowning in a tub with a small child because the parent was away just for a moment to get clothes out of dryer or take a phone call or not watching a toddler like a mother hawk over her baby that is loose 100% of the time is again in our opinion just not something we think is best. We sure weren't perfect parents ... far from it, but that was always first on on mind and everything else was secondary. I would never have let a 10 YO ride a bike at FW with the type of traffic there is there since notwithstanding the buses the private vehicle speed is often way in excess of what I think is safe anyway.

We can't ensure that our children always make the best decisions, but watching and counseling/helping them as much as possible and sharing our thoughts about always thinking safety is something we can and IMO are critical to do.

We were also very restrictive after our sons got their license's and they weren't allowed to have even one passenger in the car until they were a junior/senior in HS and then only one other passenger was allowed in the car at any time and we still worried about that. Our sons are just over 4 years apart and we didn't even like them to be in the same car at the same time alone together until our oldest was almost 18 and then it was only to go to Boy Scout meetings. They were and still are best friends and we felt there could be the possibility of the driver becoming distracted in conversation, etc. I can't tell you now that they are just now learning what they actually know and the number of times that both have thanked us for some of the things we did warms our heart each and every time.

I can't even imagine the grief and sorry parents go thru when a tragedy like this happens so there are no words I can offer or even begin to say. SO SO SAD.

I hope my post is taken in the spirit that is was made and that is we all must DO THE VERY BEST WE CAN to keep our children safe and try and teach them the values and responsibilities that we think they should have. Taking your eye "off the ball" so to speak even once can have tragic consequences.


Larry

I totally agree with both of these posts. I would never have let my son go out riding his bike alone at that age (9 or 11) especially in a place he was not accustomed to. When we were on vacation, he never went off on his own, guess I was too protective. Now that I have a granddaughter, I don't let her out of my sight when we are RVing. She was confined to staying right around the camper. I would not be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if something were to happen to her because I was not around watching her.

I'm sure the parents are playing the "what if" mind puzzle now wondering if they did the right thing by letting them go off on their own but I'm surprised they are talking to the news media about suing already

 

[LarryJ]

I totally agree with both of these posts. I would never have let my son go out riding his bike alone at that age (9 or 11) especially in a place he was not accustomed to. When we were on vacation, he never went off on his own, guess I was too protective.

Well I'm another of those over protective parents like you.

Now that I have a granddaughter, I don't let her out of my sight when we are RVing. She was confined to staying right around the camper. I would not be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if something were to happen to her because I was not around watching her.

My exact thoughts also.

I'm sure the parents are playing the "what if" mind puzzle now wondering if they did the right thing by letting them go off on their own but I'm surprised they are talking to the news media about suing already

Me too on the lawyer and lawsuits and that would be the last thing on my mind during this tragic event so soon after it has happended. I hope it doesn't say something about the parents and how they view their children.

Larry

 

[sshudson99]

This is so tragic I hate to see blame put on anyone when it was an accident. I also have a DS11 and DD6 and like I have put in other post on this forum, I am very protective of my kids. I ride bikes with them, they are not allowed to go to bathrooms by themselves, etc. BUT, kids have their way of getting into things, that's why the saying "It takes a village to raise a child" is so true. I have been at campgrounds before and have seen kids that could get hurt doing something and I try to keep my eye on them as well. My first trip to FW is coming up and I understand that the roads are busy. We are not taking bikes but I am renting a golfcart, but there is always dangers. I am truly sorry for their loss (now 2 children) I just don't understand why they are discussing a lawsuit at this point? I am sure Disney will either be found responsible or they will settle out of court because of the bad publicity, but does that make it right? I know this may make some people mad, but, the fact is there is another child in heaven at a very young age. My prayers are for the families of all involved, I hope they can find peace. I look forward to my first trip in June, but this tragedy will be in the back of my mind. God Bless everyone!!

 

[Disney Campers]

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