Born in the USA, but not a citizen?

[Tigger_Magic]

I'm not sure what I think about this.

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20051103-115741-1048r.htm

House GOP'ers are proposing a law that would appear to violate the 14th Amendment, effectively saying that if you are the child of an illegal immigrant and you were born in the USA, you are NOT automatically a U.S. citizen. Therefore, later in life, after you are grown, you won't be able to sponsor the rest of your family for citizenship.

While it would appear to close a big loophole in immigration law, it would also seem to open the door for misuse. The 14th Amendment does say any person born in the U.S. is a citizen. Period -- end of discussion.

The other idea of building a huge fence along the Mexican border seems silly. There are fences now and it does little to stem the tide. How high and how wide will this fence be and how much are we going to pay for it? Why couldn't that same money be used to hire more people to patrol the borders and pay for more judges to adjudicate immigration cases?

Sometimes the Republican Party can be such an embarrassment.

 

[Chuck S]

On our news stations, they said the fence would cost upwards of $8 billion. They also showed how the electronic camera system installed after 9/11 and costing several hundred thousand dollars, was a piece of junk...never completed, and the few operational cameras are already in need of repair. Imagine what the actual cost of the fence would be, if the estimate is $8 billion. Unless our government suddenly has a way of bringing federal projects in under budget (yeah, right!)

 

[ElizK]

You think it's a bad idea? I think it's a GREAT idea!

Come here legally and have all the kids you can support. Come here illegally, and the US has the right to deport you and any children you've had since coming here illegally.

That's the biggest problem... the current law creates a horrible catch-22 if they try to deport.

 

[Crankyshank]

I honestly think either way we're going to have people taking advantage of the situation. Currently pregnant women are crossing illegally knowing that if their child is born on US they are golden

 

[Toby'sFriend]

The 14th Amendment was ratified in 1868, 137 years ago. The Constitution was never meant to be a static document. I feel that in today's societal and economic climate, it is time to revisit the policy of granting Citizenship to any person born on American soil.



The fence idea -- silly and useless.

 

[Chicago526]

Fence idea is dumb. I like the proposed change that you're can't be a citizen if you are born to illegal immagrants, but wouldn't that need a Constitutional Amendment? They can't just pass a bill, it would get challenged and (rightfully) overturned by an appeals court the way the 14th amendment reads now.

 

[MELISAZACK]

Hummm not 100% sold on the born here idea- What if you are not a citizen of the us - but do come here legally on a visa have a business here - married
wife has a child while here....right now that child is considered a us citizen...
to me that isn't all that bad- especially if the parents are solid business owners and working on becoming citizens too. just a thought...but I do agree alot just cross intime to have the chiild just to make it us citizen now that I agree with.....the fence is just a waste of money

 

[Tigger_Magic]

I agree that something has to be done to close the born on U.S. soil = U.S. citizen loophole. But I doubt that a law would do it, because it would probably be found unconstitutional. I agree with TF that we probably need a Constitutional amendment.

The fence = stupid idea, most likely floated in response to the bashing both Congress and the administration are getting from talking heads over illegal immigration. Also probably floated both in anticipation of 2006 elections (so they look like they are doing something).

 

[True North]

As a Canadian, I'll won't get into if this law is good or bad for your country. I just see a larger international problem. Right now it is a generally accepted international convention that someone born in a country is a citizean of that country. There is nothing saying that a diffrent country (such as the country the parents were original citizeans of) would have to automatically give citizeanship to someone not born in their country. You could end up with children without any citizeanship.

 

[Aurora63]

I honestly think either way we're going to have people taking advantage of the situation. Currently pregnant women are crossing illegally knowing that if their child is born on US they are golden

This is true. Many of my husbands relatives have done this, and they are not Mexican. But they also have plenty of money to support the kids. And they wern't coming in illegally. But they come when the baby is about due, have the baby here, and then return home.

 

[jbdreamer]

My husband was born in London, but his parents were American, so he was given a a duo-citizenship.

But they don't do that anymore! Why should it be different here?

 

[Viking]

The problem with the illegal immigrants from Mexico is partly homemade:
I.e. subsidies for American corn farmers made them produce far to much corn. The America overproduction corn is sold in Mexico at extremely low prices with which small farmers couldn't compete and thus those people were driven into bankruptcy. It's not exactly a surprise they see their only chance in going north. Those 8 billion for that should better be used to make living in Mexico more attractive. This way the Mexicans would prefer to stay in their country.
We had our continent -and especially my country- divided by a wall for a very long time. Believe me: That sucked!!!
We're having exactly the same problem with African immigrants at the European Union's southern borders. The only chance for us also is to help the African countries to become more for their own people.

 

[Shugardrawers]

It makes more sense to me that a child should be a citizen of the country in which his parents hold citizenship until that child is 18 and then can apply for citizenship elsewhere if desired. So, if the parents become citizens, their minor children do too. But if a parent is a citizen of Mexico, Canada, Nepal or anywhere else, that child is also a citizen no matter where they are born.

 

[mickeyfan2]

I believe that only babies born to a paren that is here legally should be given citizenship. A fence will not help.

 

[LisaNJ25]

I agree with it.. Maybe it will make these parents think twice and try to do things the legal way.

 

[Feralpeg]

Maybe we should just annex Mexico. Then, the people there would get all of the same benefits, etc. as the rest of the country. We could develop Mexico like any other state. Then there would be no reason to move out.

 

[DawnCt1]

Build the fence. I think we would recoop any $$$ we spend on it by the money we save with all of the issues of illegal immigration. If your legally here, your offspring are citizens, if not, they are tresspassers, just like their parents.

 

[Chuck S]

If your legally here, your offspring are citizens, if not, they are tresspassers, just like their parents.

Except that Mexican citizens cross into the the US legally, everyday, for day trips and visits to relatives, even just to go shopping in San Antonio...just as Americans walk across freely over to Mexico to shop.

So, technically, a pregnant woman crossing over here going shopping or visiting relatives IS here legally, and the child would be citizen. So now, define "legally" vs. illegally, since it wouldn't stop expectant mothers from crossing the border.

 

[AllyandJack]

I say, the babies are citizens, but the parents aren't. The parents should be deported from the hospital and take the babies with them (or leave them here to be adopted by an American family - their choice). When the kids are old enough to come here and be productive, they can come here and live like any citizen. I don't think citizenship should be taken away from the baby, but they shouldn't allow the Anchor Babies anymore. Parents get a comfortable ride home with or without baby. Baby either stays here and gets adopted or goes back with parents and can come back at any time to live as a citizen.

I think they should build the fence. It'll pay for itself in a few years' time with less Medicaid and welfare benefits like Section 8 and food stamps and all our insurance rates (health and auto) will probably go down because there will be less uninsured people to subsidize. Not to mention less resources spent trying to round them up once they get into the country.

 

[Honu]

These threads just fascinate me. I live in a border state. I have no problem with anyone coming into this state to work or give birth to a baby. I don't know anyone who lives here that has the disdain for Hispanic immigrants that I see on this board on a regular basis either.

They come here to work. They do it because it's that or starve. They provide a workforce that our state needs. I wish they were paid more, but even if these jobs paid more there would not be US citizens lining up to do them. I've known many undocumented workers, and this may surprise you, but many don't want to be US citizens. They come here to work and feed their families. In their place, I can't say I wouldn't do the same.