Belle, Aurora & Snow White switcharoo

[mom2rtk]

Actually, I think it's the guests who are trying to make a round peg fit in a square hole, not Disney. Disney never said "we're building a meet & greet", but guests keep trying to turn this into one and then getting angry when it isn't one.

As for removing Belle from TST -- I imagine it was because she'd be doing shows pretty much in a constant rotation in Fantasyland, and you can't really tell a guest that they can have a FP to meet Belle at 2:40 when she has an ETwB show scheduled at 2:30. I suppose you could just not offer FPs during the times that Belle is "on stage" over in the Beast's castle, but then you're pretty much taking her out of TST for the bulk of the day anyway. TST was going to have to lose a princess anyway when they moved Rapunzel in there, and Belle was the one who "lost" based on her having a featured show location in Fantasyland. I know you don't like that answer or that logic, but I'm also fairly certain that the Character department didn't do it on a whim.

Do you think I'm going to throw a fit if we go to ETWB and don't get a photo or something? If so, then I'm sorry I left that impression. I would never be anything but gracious in the park. I'm sorry if you think otherwise.

We're having a discussion about this, which I think is a good thing, as it helps to manage expectations when people finally do get to experience this attraction.

I do get the character integrity issues this has presented. I hadn't considered the impact that fastpass itself would have. But I think they're sort of splitting hairs when you can see Ariel at CRT then walk right over to see her in her grotto.

I was disappointed in this change, not "angry".

The MVMCP change? Yeah, I'll fess up. That one ticked me off.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

I'm really surprised that so many people seem to have difficulty grasping the concept of why people are bothered? No one has said that ETWB was promoted as a meet and greet. What people ARE angry about is the fact that Belle is impossible to meet for an autograph and a proper meet and greet an MK. There would be NO issue if she was still available at MK.

As for the argument about the FP coinciding with Belle doing her show, you can also get a FP to meet Mickey when the 3PM parade is on. You can also still meet the TST Princesses when the Parade is on as well the the Dream Along with Mickey Show so that argument doesn't really work given Disneys current stance on the same issue. The only thing you won't see in the parks in seeing the same character twice from the same area. Snow White doesn't meet on Main St when Dream Along with Mickey is on, she used to swap out with Mary Poppins.

Actually, I think it's the guests who are trying to make a round peg fit in a square hole, not Disney. Disney never said "we're building a meet & greet", but guests keep trying to turn this into one and then getting angry when it isn't one.

As for removing Belle from TST -- I imagine it was because she'd be doing shows pretty much in a constant rotation in Fantasyland, and you can't really tell a guest that they can have a FP to meet Belle at 2:40 when she has an ETwB show scheduled at 2:30. I suppose you could just not offer FPs during the times that Belle is "on stage" over in the Beast's castle, but then you're pretty much taking her out of TST for the bulk of the day anyway. TST was going to have to lose a princess anyway when they moved Rapunzel in there, and Belle was the one who "lost" based on her having a featured show location in Fantasyland. I know you don't like that answer or that logic, but I'm also fairly certain that the Character department didn't do it on a whim.

 

[mom2rtk]

It seems that I am the only one happy that Belle is not at CRT and TST, and we will get to meet Jasmine/ Rapunzel instead which will be great! We have no issue with only meeting Belle at Epcot.

I think the prob is that when people are comfortable and familiar with something, they don't like to change. Change management is always most difficult for companies, in this case, Disney. This is a case of change management badly executed perhaps

I'm glad you found a silver lining.

And I do hope the Epcot option works out for others. It just doesn't work for us, as we are only spending a short day there, and I promised my husband no character meets that day.

Believe it or not, some people don't make it to Epcot at all. And some people dont go to Akershus. And perhaps some who arrive at the MK already had their Epcot day earlier in the trip.

Believe it or not, we'll come through this just fine. I'm glad I know the ins and the outs of this heading in. But I think there will be an awful lot of folks heading into the MK with an exectation that there is a meet & greet with Belle like there has been ever since we started going. And now there is not.

And I also think there will be an awful lot of folks heading to MVMCP with no idea their favorite holiday meet & greet is gone. I'm glad that at least if they checked in here, they will know ahead of time.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

It seems that I am the only one happy that Belle is not at CRT and TST, and we will get to meet Jasmine/ Rapunzel instead which will be great! We have no issue with only meeting Belle at Epcot.

I think the prob is that when people are comfortable and familiar with something, they don't like to change. Change management is always most difficult for companies, in this case, Disney. This is a case of change management badly executed perhaps

I'm not disappointed because I'm comfortable with the current set up. I'm disappointed because they have more or less removed the ability to meet Belle now at MK. If they had to take her out of CRT, they could have had Belle meet at least a few times a day elsewhere at MK. If Belle is SO popular they made her an entire new attraction, why is she now even MORE difficult to meet? And now Beast has been removed from EPCOT and for the time being, it looks like you will need to have a reservation for dinner to even meet him. I'm surprised that so many people don't seem to understand why people are bothered.

I'm glad the new changes will work for some people. This won't stop us going to CRT (we like Jasmine, can't stand Rapunzel but that's a whole side issue If Rapunzel WAS the official replacement we would probably never do CRT! Jasmine will be the official replacement with Rapunzel the fill in)

 

[longing4disney]

I'm glad you found a silver lining.

And I do hope the Epcot option works out for others. It just doesn't work for us, as we are only spending a short day there, and I promised my husband no character meets that day.

Believe it or not, some people don't make it to Epcot at all. And some people dont go to Akershus. And perhaps some who arrive at the MK already had their Epcot day earlier in the trip.

Believe it or not, we'll come through this just fine. I'm glad I know the ins and the outs of this heading in. But I think there will be an awful lot of folks heading into the MK with an exectation that there is a meet & greet with Belle like there has been ever since we started going. And now there is not.

And I also think there will be an awful lot of folks heading to MVMCP with no idea their favorite holiday meet & greet is gone. I'm glad that at least if they checked in here, they will know ahead of time.

Yes, so difficult for people who are not informed, such disappointments too.....WDW are once in a lifetime trips for many visitors of the US and many just don't get the most out of their trip because they are not well informed about the possibilities.
I'm just so glad I found DIS!! So even someone like me who only visits the US and WDW once in many years can get up to date and plan a fruitful trip!
Because I found this thread, I am keeping my Akershus ADR so that we get to meet Belle.

 

[homer2210]

So now this is the only place to see Belle at MK? Any other park to meet her at? I know the DHS has the Beaty and Beast show where you can see her. My DD will be extremly disappointed if she cannot meet Belle anywhere.


Scroll to 11:40 to see the quick "phot op"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYjOhlOQxKg

 

[Disney_Princess83]

So now this is the only place to see Belle at MK? Any other park to meet her at? I know the DHS has the Beaty and Beast show where you can see her. My DD will be extremly disappointed if she cannot meet Belle anywhere.


Scroll to 11:40 to see the quick "phot op"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYjOhlOQxKg

You can only meet Belle now at EPCOT outside the France pavilion. She is also at Akershus. She is no longer meeting with Beast. Beast will be greeting people with reservations at Be Our Guest once it opens for dinner.

There is the Beauty and the Beast Show at HS but you cannot meet them there.

 

[jtowntoflorida]

I guess I'm in the minority. I like the new interactive experience with Belle. My kids seemed to enjoy it more than just going up, talking to a character for a minute or two, and snapping a quick picture. They got to actually do something with a character that lasted longer than a minute. We're not autograph collectors, so not being able to not get an autograph isn't a big deal to us.

I guess I view ETWB similar to Jedi Training Academy. Each child has a unique opportunity to interact with an iconic character. Sure, we don't get Vader's autograph and we don't have any posed pics with him from JTA, but we do have some really cool action shots, just like we have with ETWB. I must prefer the kids doing something with the characters rather than just posing for a picture.

 

[mom2rtk]

I guess I'm in the minority. I like the new interactive experience with Belle. My kids seemed to enjoy it more than just going up, talking to a character for a minute or two, and snapping a quick picture. They got to actually do something with a character that lasted longer than a minute. We're not autograph collectors, so not being able to not get an autograph isn't a big deal to us.

I guess I view ETWB similar to Jedi Training Academy. Each child has a unique opportunity to interact with an iconic character. Sure, we don't get Vader's autograph and we don't have any posed pics with him from JTA, but we do have some really cool action shots, just like we have with ETWB. I must prefer the kids doing something with the characters rather than just posing for a picture.

I don't think a single person on this thread has said that they don't like the new attraction. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times....... we're really looking forward to it. Heck, I'll probably tear up just seeing Belle walk into the Beast's Library. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE.

And I see your point on JTA. But the only way you could compare it to that would be if they previously had a Darth Vader traditional meet & greet in the park and took it out to be replaced by JTA.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

I don't think a single person on this thread has said that they don't like the new attraction. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times....... we're really looking for it. Heck, I'll probably tear up just seeing Belle walk into the Beast's Library. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE.

And I see your point on JTA. But the only way you could compare it to that would be if they previously had a Darth Vader traditional meet & greet in the park and took it out to be replaced by JTA.

Thank you! I was about to post the same thing

 

[RachaelA]

I don't think a single person on this thread has said that they don't like the new attraction. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times....... we're really looking forward to it. Heck, I'll probably tear up just seeing Belle walk into the Beast's Library. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE.

And I see your point on JTA. But the only way you could compare it to that would be if they previously had a Darth Vader traditional meet & greet in the park and took it out to be replaced by JTA.

ETWB is super cute, but they should have it in addition to a normal M&G with Belle (in TST) not as a replacement because its not the same thing.

 

[homer2210]

ETWB is super cute, but they should have it in addition to a normal M&G with Belle (in TST) not as a replacement because its not the same thing.

agreed x10

 

[Disney_Princess83]

ETWB is super cute, but they should have it in addition to a normal M&G with Belle (in TST) not as a replacement because its not the same thing.

This!

 

[Magpie]

I don't think a single person on this thread has said that they don't like the new attraction. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times....... we're really looking forward to it. Heck, I'll probably tear up just seeing Belle walk into the Beast's Library. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE.

And I see your point on JTA. But the only way you could compare it to that would be if they previously had a Darth Vader traditional meet & greet in the park and took it out to be replaced by JTA.

The majority of guests have no idea what has been previously available, and won't have any idea that Belle ever was in the TST. Most will walk into the park, see the princesses listed, and won't in any way expect to see a princess who simply isn't there. People don't ever say, "Arrgh! I was expecting to see Tarzan's JANE in the Magic Kingdom! Why isn't Jane here? Vacation ruined!"

It's a relatively small subset of people who not only know that Belle used to be there, but who actually care. Disney is in the business of catering to the majority. Belle is well represented in several parks, so taking her out of TST leaves a spot open for a different princess. Which is important!

So yes, it's exactly like the JTA. Because no one remembers whether or not there was ever a traditional Darth meet & greet.

FWIW, there are plenty of characters you can't meet any more, in any park: http://www.intercot.com/infocentral/characters/wheretomeet.asp#RetiredCharacters (though Gaston is back, happily!)

 

[Disney_Princess83]

And if the guest wants to take a photo or get a autograph with Bell and told "no, sorry go to EPCOT tomorrow and get it?" The way ETWB is set up, everyone in the room actually has to WATCH people take the photos with Belle. Can just imagine how a 3-4 year old will take that, watching their beloved Belle take photos with "everyone else" (exactly how a child would see it) except them! The knowledge that they can meet Belle tomorrow means very little to young child.

As for people not expecting it, I'm not sure of the logic. If they can meet every other princess and character at WDW with an identical meet and greet format, then they would be expecting to be able to meet Belle in the same way.

The majority of guests have no idea what has been previously available, and won't have any idea that Belle ever was in the TST. Most will walk into the park, see the princesses listed, and won't in any way expect to see a princess who simply isn't there. People don't ever say, "Arrgh! I was expecting to see Tarzan's JANE in the Magic Kingdom! Why isn't Jane here? Vacation ruined!"

It's a relatively small subset of people who not only know that Belle used to be there, but who actually care.

So yes, it's exactly like the JTA. Because no one remembers whether or not there was ever a traditional Darth meet & greet.

There are plenty of characters you can't meet any more: http://www.intercot.com/infocentral/characters/wheretomeet.asp#RetiredCharacters (though Gaston is back, happily!)

 

[Magpie]

And if the guest wants to take a photo or get a autograph with Bell and told "no, sorry go to EPCOT tomorrow and get it?" The way ETWB is set up, everyone in the room actually has to WATCH people take the photos with Belle. Can just imagine how a 3-4 year old will take that, watching their beloved Belle take photos with "everyone else" (exactly how a child would see it) except them! The knowledge that they can meet Belle tomorrow means very little to young child.

As for people not expecting it, I'm not sure of the logic. If they can meet every other princess and character at WDW with an identical meet and greet format, then they would be expecting to be able to meet Belle in the same way.

Apparently that's not true any more... many people have been told that anyone can line up for a photo. There are also roles for anyone who wants to join in (which I plan to do, as I really want a bookmark!). Read some of the recent reports in this thread from people who've actually been there.

This is what happens when you judge something based on a dress rehearsal.

BTW - I'd love to know, how do these theoretical children ever survive not being picked to participate in Turtle Talk with Crush? How come there's no letter writing campaign insisting Crush pick out every single child in the audience? Why aren't we hearing about traumatized children having to sit through being ignored by their favourite cartoon turtle, even though they're waving their hand in the air?

That a LOT more unfair than anything that has, or will happen, at Storytime with Belle.

 

[WDSearcher]

I totally agree.

I don't need an ETWB meet & greet. I just want a Belle meet & greet somewhere in the MK.

Nobody would be trying to turn this into a meet & greet if they hadn't completely emptied the park of this opportunity.

I just don't like that the people wanting a meet & greet in the MK at the moment Belle's village opens are painted as unreasonable and demanding. I think the real question is...... why would they think that was a good idea?

I'm sure they thought it was a fine idea, but they wanted to do something more with her in her village than just a meet & greet. I don't know that it's "unreasonable and demanding" to want to meet Belle there, but I do think it's a bit stubborn. Disney is trying to develop something new and different -- which, generally, guests are clamoring for. If numbers for the show drop off drastically and complaints come pouring in, they'll go back to a regular old meet & greet like they did for Rapunzel. Or they'll turn it into a weird kind of hybrid that won't really be either a show or a M&G. IMO, that would be a shame, because it's just so nice to have something different to do with a character besides just "hug / smile / photo / autograph / leave".

 

[Disney_Princess83]

You and I have had this discussion on a previous thread and it didn't end well. I appreciate your point of view and would appreciate if you appreciate mine. I have read the threats and this does seem to be changing, although only some CM's are offering that anyone who wants photos can join the line. There have been reports that some people have not been allowed to get a photos unless they were in the show. There have also been several reports that other then two guard positions, adults have been discouraged from participating. There doesn't seem to be a set rule on meeting Belle during ETWB

Crush has NEVER been a character you can meet in the park. It's not like you can meet Nemo and Dory. You can meet all the other princesses and I would imagine many people would expect you can meet Belle in a similar way. She is now the only main princess you can no longer meet at MK.

I don't think it's a case of not "surviving" as you put it, of course this isn't a life or death situation and NO ONE is saying that it is. I think ETWB looks amazing and cannot wait to see it! However at the expense of meeting Belle I've complained to WDW and I know that many other people have too.

Apparently that's not true any more... many people have been told that anyone can line up for a photo. There are also roles for anyone who wants to join in (which I plan to do, as I really want a bookmark!). Read some of the recent reports in this thread from people who've actually been there.

This is what happens when you judge something based on a dress rehearsal.

BTW - I'd love to know, how do these theoretical children ever survive not being picked to participate in Turtle Talk with Crush? How come there's no letter writing campaign insisting Crush pick out every single child in the audience? Why aren't we hearing about traumatized children having to sit through being ignored by their favourite cartoon turtle, even though they're waving their hand in the air?

That a LOT more unfair than anything that has, or will happen, at Storytime with Belle.

 

[Magpie]

You and I have had this discussion on a previous thread and it didn't end well. I appreciate your point of view and would appreciate if you appreciate mine. I have read the threats and this does seem to be changing, although only some CM's are offering that anyone who wants photos can join the line. There have been reports that some people have not been allowed to get a photos unless they were in the show. There have also been several reports that other then two guard positions, adults have been discouraged from participating. There doesn't seem to be a set rule on meeting Belle during ETWB

Crush has NEVER been a character you can meet in the park. It's not like you can meet Nemo and Dory. You can meet all the other princesses and I would imagine many people would expect you can meet Belle in a similar way. She is now the only main princess you can no longer meet at MK.

I don't think it's a case of not "surviving" as you put it, of course this isn't a life or death situation and NO ONE is saying that it is. I think ETWB looks amazing and cannot wait to see it! However at the expense of meeting Belle

Well, we're in agreement that things seem to be changing. I haven't heard anything about adults being actively discouraged from participating - I'd be curious if you have any links. That would seem to be counter to most Disney practice and policy.

As for Crush never being a character you can meet in the park, my point stands. Most people won't know that Belle ever had a traditional meet-and-greet. You can meet Crush, in the same kind of way you can meet Darth Vader and Belle, and they do a great job of making Crush completely real for the kiddies.

The reason I bring it up, is because people keep trotting out the spectre of heartbroken four year olds when they're objecting to ETWB (as opposed to just saying "I want both a traditional meet & greet and this!" which is where I think you stand, no?).

My point with regards to the "think of the children!" crowd is that Disney will break that 4yo's heart in many ways before their vacation is over. That 4yo will not be picked for the bird show in Animal Kingdom, will not be invited up to demonstrate animal sounds at the Lion King, won't be picked for demos in Epcot, nor invited to participate in street shows, is too short to ride the coasters, etc, etc... By contrast, ETWB seems eminently fair.

I do appreciate your point of view, and you're definitely entitled to your feelings of disappointment. But I also understand why Disney might want to maximize the number of different princesses in the Magic Kingdom, in order to appeal to the broadest demographic. And I think your point of view is a minority one, even if you are in the majority on this board.

From a "running the park" perspective, the question is really, "Why should we deny a spot in the TST to another princess, when guests can already play with Belle in New Fantasyland?"

However, I'm right with you with regards to Belle and Beast at the Christmas Party. They shouldn't have been removed, and I'm hoping Disney puts them back in. However, even if they do, I won't be going back to MVMCP. I think it's a colossal waste of time and money. I'll just be happy for everyone else who wanted that Christmas photo.

 

[jtowntoflorida]

I don't think a single person on this thread has said that they don't like the new attraction. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times....... we're really looking forward to it. Heck, I'll probably tear up just seeing Belle walk into the Beast's Library. THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE.

And I see your point on JTA. But the only way you could compare it to that would be if they previously had a Darth Vader traditional meet & greet in the park and took it out to be replaced by JTA.

OK, then let me rephrase: I'm in the minority because I don't mind that they have replaced a traditional M&G with this interactive experience. I think the interactive experience is superior to a traditional M&G. Sorry I didn't state that more clearly.

FWIW...we got some pixie dust from an awesome CM last year and actually did get a private M&G with Vader last year after our JTA session. My daughter expected the same thing this year, but I had to explain to her that it just wasn't going to be possible again. She's six and accepted that because she understands that things change and that things aren't always going to be the same. She didn't really understand how special a private M&G with Vader was last year, because (1) it was her first visit; and (2) she was five at the time. In her mind, you went to JTA, then you met Vader, and then you went on your merry way. So to her, it would have seemed like something was "taken away" from her this year.

Instead of focusing on what has been taken away, why not focus on this new, unique experience that Disney is now offering?

I think ultimately we're probably going to have to agree to disagree on this. I just don't feel wounded or betrayed by this change, and I'm sorry that you do. I hope your future Disney experiences are magical, even without Belle in her former format.