Behavior Challenge Thread

[BeckyScott]

Awww, he doesn't want to buy a baby. The initial cost is bad enough, but the maintenance, whoa . You know, we'd all be freakin' rich if it wasn't for these little beasties in our houses, with their $3/bag Tinky noodles and $80 iCoasters and probably $400 worth of Pixar DVDs. Child tax credit, my butt, that's not even close to what they cost....

Slightly but a couple weeks ago a local chiro spoke at the autism play group, and he sounded very DAN-ish. Another mom & I asked him if he'd gone to the DAN conference (he isn't listed on their website) and that he really needed to go to it 'cause he sounded just like one of the. I took DS to see him yesterday and he's decided to go to the DAN conference this spring. So we'll have a local DAN! No more 2 hour drives! hoo hoo!

Back on topic. I am having trouble (and this isn't a new problem) with the kids just not liking school. Last week youngest DS had a very bad week, not motivated in the least, didn't get work done, needed constant prodding and then only produced the minimum necessary. It's beyond bribing or punishing. I can do that. But they genuinely don't like school. It makes me sad, and I don't know what to do to help. Bribing them isn't effective, as they both dislike school so much that they don't even care about a reward. And even then... I don't necessarily wanting them to be good students just to get an extra buck, I want them to like learning. And there are parts of it they do like, but not much.

I am hoping as they get older and have more input as to what classes they choose, that it will get better. But really even in high school and college you still have to take core classes.

I don't know if this is typical, or if it's part of the umbrella and needs to be handled differently, or if there's really nothing I can do. If it's just that neither child is "another brick in the wall" and as such, they're never going to be really happy in that whole traditional way of education. Or if they've both decided they just don't care, period, and I need to step in and get hard-core with it.

 

[DisDreaminMom]

Becky- hate to tell you but the whole "hate doing something I'm not interested in" thing will not go away. I failed half my classes and had A's in the others. it wasn't until I got to college that I had a decent grade point average. I was constantly hauled into the guidance counselor's office. If I ever hear someone tell me about not living up to my potential, I'll hurt somebody. It's just so hard to rationalize WHY they NEED to focus and try in classes they don't like or have no interest in. I don't know the answer.

I'll tell you what I told my DD when she was having major issues with PE. I said, "You may hate it. You may curse them under your breath. You may think it's the stupidest thing in the world. But you will smile and act like you are having fun, and just maybe one day you will. The more you hate it, the more I want you to pretend you enjoy it".

That was two years ago. She is not totally cured, but she doesn't complain to me anymore and now has a good grade in PE and occasionally tells me she has a good time. Oh, and it worked for math, too. That was a better success.

Tell them that they can't get to study the "good stuff" if they don't have the grades for the schools they want to get into. And honestly, if your kids seem like they will be interested in electricity more than a Liberal Arts degree or PhD then why worry? They'll make more money in the skilled trades professions now anyway. I wish I had become a mechanic. I'd be making a killing.

But no, I bought a couple of babies and now have buyers remorse. They are like a boat. It's not the initial investment, but the upkeep will kill you!

 

[DisDreaminMom]

oh, and I was reading your post super fast, and I for a moment thought you were telling us about a Danish chiropractor.

Glad you found someone to help, right before gas prices go sky high again...

 

[mechurchlady]

I can drive 40 miles for california rolls but cannot get myself to go to the post office or call someone. Resistance is futile. For me yelling and loss of our home cannot get me moving. Maybe bookworm can help you.

 

[bookwormde]

The whole education system is very much the antithesis of how we learn; learning a little about everything is just not out “style”, we want everything about something(s).

Remember motivation is about interest and logic with the distortion of the lack of social immediacy.

bookwormde

 

[C&G'sMama]

We have a friend with a son in his mid-30's. He was diagnosed with Asperger's in his early 20s. We just found out about this over Christmas. They struggled with him all through junior high and high school. He is now an attorney and married with 2 kids. His advice to us "Homeschool". We have thought about it for both of our children. We take it one day at a time. I guess DS was perservating at school today. He does it at home all the time but I guess this was the first time he got this "bad" at school. Apparently they had animal crackers if they were on "green" all day and a couple of kids weren't. So DS is analyzing why the kids, who were already crying, didn't get crackers.

And to BookWormde's comment about the school not being made for them. He's right. The schools try to fit everyone in one category. I found myself in the middle of a discussion on the family board about kids starting kindergarten late and trying to say just because the government says "5" doesn't make it right. Well I feel the same way about the structure of our schools. Not every child learns in the same manner. I myself am a visual learner. I can't handle straight lectures without handouts. It just doesn't sink in for me.

If you are fortunate to live somewhere with lots of choices you may be okay. We don't know what we will do with DS when we get to that point, but we always keep home schooling as an option.

 

[BeckyScott]

Thanks for the input on that.

I was just thinking about oldest DS. On the Aspie screening, there was one question that was something like "doesn't look happy when complimented" or "doesn't show emotion when an adult tells him he's done good", something like that. And his teacher had marked that as an "all the time". Whenever he gets a really good grade on a worksheet or test it goes right on our fridge. But he doesn't show them to me, they're just shoved in the backpack with everything else.

Last spring in art class they had a contest. They made cars out of cardboard and glue, like a make-your-own Boy Scout soapbox derby, they spent quite a while making them in class and then had a big race day. Not surprisingly, DS was one of the few that mastered making an axle out of cardboard, and he won every race, out of all the kids in his grade level. And there was a newspaper reporter there (slow news day?) and he ended up on the front page. Like his own little 15 minutes of fame. You woulda thought he'd won the Nobel Peace Prize, the way I acted. He didn't seem to think winning the races was a big deal, the newspaper however did get him pretty excited.

This year I was asking him about art class, and he was all blase about it, whatever, it was okay I guess but {{shrug}}. I was totally totally confused.

 

[DisDreaminMom]

Becky, dear, why would you be confused? If he won something that went along with his special interest, he'd never let it go! DS is great at spelling and aces tests. But he could care less. Now, if he won the "Best drawing of Paris with a poodle" contest- that's all we would hear about.

He made the car axel because it was a challenge, it was a puzzle, and it was required. (and it's wheels!!!) But he knows he's not going to get to spend the entire year in art class making cardboard car parts. The rest of art class is doing stupid "art" exercises and truth be told, unless you are really into it, drawing the bowl of fruit with pencil dots is one sure way to make me want to hurt myself. So he was having fun and met success making an auto part and using his product. That's no where near the same category as "art".

I have been told that homeschooling is the best for those that have the extreme aversion towards mandatory classes. Depending on how gifted they are, and you as a teacher-and the ability to be running around with them all day and not have any other job-AND keep them challenged enough-(whew!)- then this could be an ideal solution. Get them to test out on the basics of the subjects they don't like and then let them really concentrate on the ones they do.

I would totally pay for this type of school by the way. Montessori in upper and middle school is done on this concept, by the way. More colleges are noticing how well these kids do compared to "regular" school pupils.

Jack of all trades, Master of none. Amen, sister.

 

[DisDreaminMom]

We are on our 4th snow day. Anyone want to trade with me? Anyhow, DD's little friend came over a few minutes ago (her parents have NO backup plan for off days- how do people function?). I am not a huge fan of this girl, but I do like her parents and she gets along well with DD. DS is upstairs with them now "playing". His version of playing involves screaming at the top of his lungs. I hope the girls don't kill him. I told DD that she needed to let him play for a while, and as long as they all play with animal toys, it's OK. But DS never gets that he needs to calm the heck down. It's just exhausting for me to have a day like this. And I stayed up too late watching TV and I just want to take a nap, not play referee. But I'm hiding here in the office, pretending not to care...

Mechurchlady- I would drive 40 miles for california rolls. Don't feel bad. It's OK.

 

[mechurchlady]

They were very good but set on me and I should have bought something to drink besides the half can of soda in the car. Sure will trade you any day. AT least you can still set on the kid. Try having an 83 year old 200+ pound woman demanding to know what is for dinner. She loved the special dinner of turnkey with apricot jelly, mashed taters done my way, and harvest veggie medley that I love if it is cold. I do not do hot veggies except corn, taters, peas and soups. I swallow them if force and can do cabbage but yuk.

I would feed the screamer some peanut butter, the gooey kind, lol. Knowing my luck he would swallow it whole. I need to go to sleep now. Try to be good while I sleep. We need a california roll smiley.


Oh and I can go to Disneyland as the have a Southern California payment plan and take Calvin. He is not Disney or travel smart. Dude plans a cruise and thinks he is getting one meal a day.

I got my E Drive back mysteriously. Next time I will buy a female E Drive.

 

[BeckyScott]

I can tell you, absolutely, positively, there is no way I could homeschool. I would move to another school district, another state, before I'd home school.

And I work in education. But not with kids, and not with special needs kids.

I just don't have it in me. There's not enough anxiety meds in the state to get me to homeschool. More power to those that do, I have a great amount of respect for them, I wish I had it in me. Now way, no how. I can barely make it through a half hour of homework time without wanting to scream. No way I could do it all day every day.

I have a great great respect for paras and SpEd teachers who can do it all day. I don't know how many times I have **almost** put in an app to be a sub or a para and I just could not bring myself to do it. I would be insane.

I suppose if it got bad enough, or there was no choice at all, I do have the skill set, but it would have to be pretty extremely severe circumstances. Plus, it requires a level of organization that would be challenging for me, to put it lightly. If you saw my "filing system" oh my. I also have a feeling that, considering the amount of behavior issues we already have, that the kids would think they were getting off the hook if they were homeschooled, and that is something we'd have to really work at getting past before much could be accomplished.

{{Beckys' rant is over}}

 

[C&G'sMama]

I can tell you, absolutely, positively, there is no way I could homeschool. I would move to another school district, another state, before I'd home school.

And I work in education. But not with kids, and not with special needs kids.

I just don't have it in me. There's not enough anxiety meds in the state to get me to homeschool.

I'm soooorrrry! I didn't mean to cause agida. Okay I have to rephrase. When I say "We" have considered homeschooling. "We" means DP. She is more than willing to do it and I'm more than willing to support her in it. She would be very good at it.

There is a reason DP is a SAHM and not me. Mama (that's me) doesn't have a lot of patience. We have our strengths. I will shovel, I will take the kids sledding in 0 degree weahther and I will pick up the dog poop, but please don't make me stay home with them for days on end. I don't think they make enough prozac for that.

We will take it a year at a time. When our friend advised home schooling it was after DP had said we had considered it. We have also considered it for our NT daughter for a variety of reasons. We also live in an area that has a large home school population both religious and non-religious based. And there are tons of activities from bowling and ice skating to chess clubs and science clubs.

So I'm sorry.... If I give hugs and chocolates (to quote Church Lady) will you forgive me?

 

[C&G'sMama]

Anyone have any experience with something that works with perseverating? DS is getting worse both at home and at school. He is in OT, PT and speech at school. In addition we have him once a week at a speech center at one of the local colleges where they work on pragmatic speech. We don't know what to do about the perseverating. We don't know if it's diet related or stress related (I have been working long hours since before Christmas so he doesn't see me as much). Anyone have any useful strategies or gone to therapist. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[bookwormde]

If you can give a little more specific information as to the type and nature of the preseveration (verbal, movements, interest etc) it would be helpful. In general it can be as stress mechanism (reaction or comfort), time management structure, or focus based. Doing a good analysis of the environment and timing is often helpful.


bookwormde

 

[C&G'sMama]

If you can give a little more specific information as to the type and nature of the preseveration (verbal, movements, interest etc) it would be helpful. In general it can be as stress mechanism (reaction or comfort), time management structure, or focus based. Doing a good analysis of the environment and timing is often helpful.


bookwormde

Thank you so much for any suggestions you might have. We talk to the peditricians but it is alsonice to talk to other parents and those that have been there themselves.

It's verbal. At school yesterday he couldn't get off the topic of why 2 of the children in his class couldn't have animal crackers. It was because they were "off green". He asked everyone to raise their hands if they thought it wasn't fair. (several times). Apparently he did the same thing after Barack Obama won the election. "Raise your hand if you're happy Barack Obama won the election".(several times) At home, the other day we spent 5 hours on "not talking about his bad dream the night before" "mama, I shouldn't talk about my bad dream beacause I already told you" "It's okay to talk about it honey but not over and over". "Well, I shouldn't talk about it anymore should I?". This went on before we left the house, while we were sledding and while we were out for hot chocolate and when we got home".

It's all stuff like that. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I have been working quite a bit lately. When I am home, like I was Saturday, I try to spend time with the kids. The working thing should end within the next couple of weeks, though it will happen again, it's cyclical.

It very well could be stress.

 

[mechurchlady]

You forgot one important thing when dealing with Becky.





She needs lots of coffee to get started in the morning.
Big hugs and chocolates and coffee.

Perservate wow a big word out of my grasp. Lawyer asked me if I ws "technical" and I stared dumbfounded, um, what does that mean. For me it is a lot to do with stress. To cope I can cry, chew, bite, or worst is the nonphysical shut downs where I cannot do something.

 

[bookwormde]

Since it sounds like it is “subject oriented” for the most part, I would not be overly concerned. I know it can be “socially difficult” but it sound like it is just items which he is concerned about or interested in and is trying to figure out. The most practical way to work through this situation is to provide as much “data” or rational insight as practical, so he may work through his evaluation. I view this as Aspie skill building, while as a child he is not fully intellectually developed and lacks much of the overall life perspective; he is working trough the issue and is trying to come up with a solution. The reason he is asking these question and reviewing the information over and over is that he does not have enough “data” to come up with a purely logic based answer. With the overlay of “heightened sense of justice” (cookie issue), trying to figure out the logic of social issues or in the case trying to process some innocent comment about dreams which he took literally in light of a “bad dream”.

I find taking the time to get my son to review all the information he has on the subject and following the “logic” trail and trying to fill in “data” an clearing up any misconceptions often hastens resolution. With the dream you have a bit of a paradox since the “rule” he has adopted from some comment or other source (not talking about the bad dream) must be changed before he can move forward.

The good news is that this does not seem anxiety induced, although it can be anxiety generating when the evaluation process can’t to move forward from lack if input and logical guidance.

Remember that what you are seeing is the immature version of what from a societal contribution perspective is the greatest gift the spectrum individuals have to offer.

bookwormde

 

[BeckyScott]

C&G, of course you are forgiven.

 

[koolaidmoms]

Since it sounds like it is “subject oriented” for the most part, I would not be overly concerned. I know it can be “socially difficult” but it sound like it is just items which he is concerned about or interested in and is trying to figure out. The most practical way to work through this situation is to provide as much “data” or rational insight as practical, so he may work through his evaluation. I view this as Aspie skill building, while as a child he is not fully intellectually developed and lacks much of the overall life perspective; he is working trough the issue and is trying to come up with a solution. The reason he is asking these question and reviewing the information over and over is that he does not have enough “data” to come up with a purely logic based answer. With the overlay of “heightened sense of justice” (cookie issue), trying to figure out the logic of social issues or in the case trying to process some innocent comment about dreams which he took literally in light of a “bad dream”.

I find taking the time to get my son to review all the information he has on the subject and following the “logic” trail and trying to fill in “data” an clearing up any misconceptions often hastens resolution. With the dream you have a bit of a paradox since the “rule” he has adopted from some comment or other source (not talking about the bad dream) must be changed before he can move forward.

The good news is that this does not seem anxiety induced, although it can be anxiety generating when the evaluation process can’t to move forward from lack if input and logical guidance.

Remember that what you are seeing is the immature version of what from a societal contribution perspective is the greatest gift the spectrum individuals have to offer.

bookwormde

Thank you for the understanding.

I guess Mommy needs to learn some more patience. I try very hard to sit and explain everything to him but when he is going on the third hour of why he can no longer use a marker he accidently dropped on the floor I want to sit and cry.

Usually it goes something like:

No it is not broken let's try it. Yes, you can use it. Let Mommy try it. It is not dried out. See. It wrote on your finger! No, I do not have soap in the car to wash your fingers. No, the marker is not broken. Repeat as necessary usually for 2-3 hours.

One of the sentences my parents used on me was, "Because I said so!" I HATED that. I always promised myself I would never do that as because is not a reason. I have only broken this once when he repeatedly asked for hours why asking questions was annoying sometimes to other people.

C&G's Mama and I sometimes play a game in the car to make me feel better when I think I can't take it anymore. As he stops talking I slowly start to count in my head - 1001, 1002, 1003 .... Never have I gotten past 1005. That's usually when I start to cry then I realize again that is just him and pull myself together and start answering his questions all over again.

I guess my question is do they eventually learn to process in their heads and not out loud? How do you teach them to do this?

I know he is only 5 but he never stops talking unless he is asleep or totally engrossed in something that really interests him. We worry about this at school as he is becoming the crazy kids who never stops talking to the other kids. They just ignore him a great deal because he just never stops talking and it is almost like I see him being invisible to them - they have tuned him out.

Thank you for all your help. This is really the one place we go to talk to people who "get it."

 

[mechurchlady]

I put mother on ignore. It is frustrating because she has asked me the umpteenth time for details on my Disneyland trip. I would explain twice then stop as he has the information. Hand him the marker and paper and let him figure out the answer. It takes a lot of patience. How many times has my mom talked about something and I just pretend to listen as I really hate her opinion on the subject and she done beat it to death.

Either they are being an annoying brat or they are miswired like mom and cannot stop asking the questions and retelling the same story over and over again. Have patience and be glad he is a talker instead of one of them stone cold silent kind that cannot tell you things. In time he should be able to get over his need to check on something.