Bean Counters and shortsightedness

[Aluminum Falcon]

Offsite is the majority of Disney and Universal guests.

Yes true. I wonder what the split between people primarily staying at hotels planning a trip to Dis over uni and vice versa

 

[Jrb1979]

Yes true. I wonder what the split between people primarily staying at hotels planning a trip to Dis over uni and vice versa

That would be interesting to find out. I know when we stay off-site we tend to visit more than just Disney and Universal. We will 1 day at MK and 1 and Universal. Then the rest of the time visit SeaWorld and other attractions in the area.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

That would be interesting to find out. I know when we stay off-site we tend to visit more than just Disney and Universal. We will 1 day at MK and 1 and Universal. Then the rest of the time visit SeaWorld and other attractions in the area.

yeah, that makes sense for a "regular", i wonder more about the "first timers" who are unfamiliar with the parks

 

[Moliphino]

I've even noticed more now than before kids not into a lot of the newer Disney movies. IMO it's alot different now then when we were younger. There wasn't as many options and it felt like Disney was everywhere

Even in the Disney renaissance days we still had non-Disney stuff like Land Before Time, Fievel, Thumbelina, Anastasia, etc. And we didn't have the Disney Channel because you had to pay for it, so we watched a lot of PBS kids shows.

 

[Brian Noble]

To me the dueling dumbos was the best decision for a ride, jacked up capacity for a must do for so many without causing a new wave of fresh guests.

I can see the junior executive now: "Let's spend money in a way that doesn't increase our revenue!"

I kid, I kid. WDW has done this elsewhere as well: Soarin's third theater, and TSMM's third track. But unlike Soarin (which was just a simple addition), the Double Dumbos and TSMM expansion were each part of a highly-marketable expansion in the form of New Fantasyland and Toy Story Land, respectively.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I don't know how much it will effect the parks but I do know that most kids aren't into Disney like kids in the past are. My nieces who are 12 and 13, aren't into Disney at all and the goes for their friends too. Kids today have a lot more options for entertainment than kids in the past did. Even my 3 year old would rather watch Blippi, Peppa Pig or Cocomelon over anything Disney puts out.

I wonder if Youtube also plays a part (not really wondering, it probably does). Everywhere I go in public, I see kids with ipads watching stuff on there. Even streaming platforms like Twitch have a big kid audience (not the toddler crowd but the 9+ crowd).

 

[ChipnDale79]

I've even noticed more now than before kids not into a lot of the newer Disney movies. IMO it's alot different now then when we were younger. There wasn't as many options and it felt like Disney was everywhere

disney store closure is gonna hurt that also. for us, when our boys were little, we'd go to the movies at concord mills near charlotte, after the movie, we'd walk the 100 yards in the mall to the Disney Store, and boom, there are all sorts of things from the movie we just saw.

(i cant tell you how many lightning mcqueens we have hiding around our house)

every time we went to the mall, movie or not, we went to the store, and almost every single time, it was crowded with a line to buy things.

to me, closure of the disney store was another "bean counter" move. Sure they get more profit margin off of the target stuff, but why cant they do both? the disney store offered a little bit of magic to its base, that helped push you to booking that vacation.

I dont have the numbers in front of me, so i admit i could be talking out of my butt, but i do not think the disney store was losing money.

You get that generation by taking them to the movies, then taking them to a "mini emporium".

They've cut the little things.

 

[ChipnDale79]

I wonder if Youtube also plays a part (not really wondering, it probably does). Everywhere I go in public, I see kids with ipads watching stuff on there. Even streaming platforms like Twitch have a big kid audience (not the toddler crowd but the 9+ crowd).

Id imagine it plays a big part, my boys are 12 and 10, they watch youtube like we used to watch tv. They dont watch sitcoms or things like we used too.

However, we go to NYC this weekend, my 10 year old has been watching a lot of videos on things to do in NYC, and a few videos on things to do at Disney (ha).

 

[Smugpugmug]

disney store closure is gonna hurt that also. for us, when our boys were little, we'd go to the movies at concord mills near charlotte, after the movie, we'd walk the 100 yards in the mall to the Disney Store, and boom, there are all sorts of things from the movie we just saw.

(i cant tell you how many lightning mcqueen we have hiding around our house)

every time we went to the mall, movie or not, we went to the store, and almost every single time, it was crowded with a line to buy things.

to me, closure of the disney store was another "bean counter" move. Sure they get more profit margin off of the target stuff, but why cant they do both? they disney store offered a little bit of magic to its base, that helped push you to booking that vacation.

I dont have the numbers in front of me, so i admit i could be talking out of my butt, but i do not think the disney store was losing money.

You get that generation by taking them to the movies, then taking them to a "mini emporium".

They've cut the little things.

One of my friends recently went to one of the only remaining Disney Stores in the US and it was a depressing Marvel and Star Wars hellscape. Absolutely nothing else in the store other than those two IPs.

I miss the Disney Store. The one closest to me closed a few years ago but even in the last few years of its life it only had merchandise of the two mentioned IPs and stuff for babies so I always walked out of there without buying anything.

 

[HokieRaven5]

I dont have the numbers in front of me, so i admit i could be talking out of my butt, but i do not think the disney store was losing money.

You get that generation by taking them to the movies, then taking them to a "mini emporium".

They've cut the little things.

They don’t publish enough of a breakdown to really know. At least in the 2019 Annual they attributed the increase in revenue at the retail side to an increase in online sales.

My neighbor worked at one of the better performing stores that was swiftly closed, and now works at one of the few remaining outlet stores in the region.

They actually just closed another one of the outlet stores a month or so ago.

I think Times Square is the only remaining non-outlet Disney store.

 

[Smugpugmug]

Id imagine it plays a big part, my boys are 12 and 10, they watch youtube like we used to watch tv. They dont watch sitcoms or things like we used too.

However, we go to NYC this weekend, my 10 year old has been watching a lot of videos on things to do in NYC, and a few videos on things to do at Disney (ha).

Yeah that's what I mean. Lots of kids have gravitated towards Youtube/Twitch. So many more options for things to watch. There's also video games which kids are obsessed with.

 

[ChipnDale79]

One of my friends recently went to one of the only remaining Disney Stores in the US and it was a depressing Marvel and Star Wars hellscape. Absolutely nothing else in the store other than those two IPs.

I miss the Disney Store. The one closest to me closed a few years ago but even in the last few years of its life it only had merchandise of the two mentioned IPs and stuff for babies so I always walked out of there without buying anything.

that was a beef i had. i wanted more adult things to buy also, but at the time, we had young kids, and we did spend money there.

but id love decent mugs and things for the house, or decent adult tshirts.

 

[Brian Noble]

why cant they do both?

Because money is not infinite, and they have to decide how to spend the capital they have.

Disney closing brick-and-mortar stores is not some outlier exception. That is happening nearly everywhere. See: Dying malls, bankrupt chains, and more targeted closures. How often do any of us drive to a store these days vs. just ordering something online?

 

[ChipnDale79]

Because money is not infinite, and they have to decide how to spend the capital they have.

Disney closing brick-and-mortar stores is not some outlier exception. That is happening nearly everywhere. See: Dying malls, bankrupt chains, and more targeted closures. How often do any of us drive to a store these days vs. just ordering something online?

a lot of malls are still doing great in larger cities. they shifted to a larger profit margin of moving to smaller space inside of target stores.

 

[Brian Noble]

Big city malls are doing great? Sure they are. (I'm cherry-picking this one a little, because SF's office vacancy rate is the highest in the US. But similar things are happening everywhere else to some degree or another.)

"moving to a smaller space inside of target stores" does not sound like vibrant growth to me. It's not even "steady as she goes."

 

[Smugpugmug]

Because money is not infinite, and they have to decide how to spend the capital they have.

Disney closing brick-and-mortar stores is not some outlier exception. That is happening nearly everywhere. See: Dying malls, bankrupt chains, and more targeted closures. How often do any of us drive to a store these days vs. just ordering something online?

I've gone to a store to try something on but a lot of the time the store doesn't even have my size. I like that the store can ship it to me for free but it does defeat the purpose of physically going there.

I think another aspect of the Disney Store closing is that there are so many other places to get official Disney merch. As mentioned above, the stores never had anything for adults but there are other storefronts for that now.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

I can see the junior executive now: "Let's spend money in a way that doesn't increase our revenue!"

I kid, I kid. WDW has done this elsewhere as well: Soarin's third theater, and TSMM's third track. But unlike Soarin (which was just a simple addition), the Double Dumbos and TSMM expansion were each part of a highly-marketable expansion in the form of New Fantasyland and Toy Story Land, respectively.

you are 100% correct, it would cost them a fortune to overhaul. Personally i think that's the best way to push back crowds but i can see how that's an impossible sell to shareholders, and the best way to handle would be to tie it into another project and sell it as a whole

 

[Brian Noble]

No one can possibly say with a straight face that in-person shopping has held its own. A 2018 Marist poll found more than half of us prefer to shop in person. But that means that almost half of us didn't.

And that was 2018. It's only gotten worse for brick-and-mortar, and that's even before the pandemic re-wired us.

 

[Brian Noble]

i think that's the best way to push back crowds

The other way to push back crowds is to raise prices. The pleasant side-effect of that is you can make as much (or more) revenue on lower costs.

Demand falls? Discounts for everyone! But that puts you right back to where you were before financially while customers think they are getting a better deal, so that works out well. Look at the people who fall all over themselves to book free dining even when it is not a particularly good deal vs. regular room discounts.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

As far as kids in the parks during traditional school times, there are also many school systems that have year round schedules, virtual settings, or other options that either give flexibility or have nontraditional breaks.

Just like there is no longer a 'slow' time at Disney, there is not a more kidless time either.

The closest thing to a kidless park used to be Epcot. My kids do not care for that park, and it is my favorite.