Back To The $6 Delivery Fee

[BWV Dreamin]

When they obfuscate on something as minor and inconsequential as a delivery fee, it only makes me wonder what else they feel entitled/justified to do without oversite...

Love that word “obfuscate”! Now off to look it up....

 

[k_hase]

I have received a reply:

In response to your request from our recent conversation, attached are the audited financial statements for Disney’s Saratoga Springs Resort Condominium Association. In addition, as we discussed, the groceries delivery fee is an optional service for which Members are only charged if they ask for the service. Therefore, in our view the statutes you referenced on the call are not applicable.

If anyone is interested in getting a copy of the financial statement PM me. Or I might attach it here, not sure if I can or should, though. However I think it's a public document.

Under this logic, everything I use that others choose not to use could be assessed with a fee--the pool is an optional service, the elevators are an optional service, the coffee maker is an optional service; all things I could be charged for only if I ask. That's ridiculous.

 

[zavandor]

Under this logic, everything I use that others choose not to use could be assessed with a fee--the pool is an optional service, the elevators are an optional service, the coffee maker is an optional service; all things I could be charged for only if I ask. That's ridiculous.

What they told me is that the grocery delivery is not included in the list of things that members pay with their dues. Luggage delivery is included. Common parts like elevators, pools or services like transportation to the parks or to the airport are included. However they've not shared the list and not told where this list is. So we don't really know if they can start asking for a fee for services we think are included but are not in their magical list.

 

[drusba]

Doubtful there is any list. I cannot imagine that they determine annual dues applicable for bell services employees based on whether, and number of times, those employees deliver luggage or groceries. From what I have seen this is a fee added by the main WDW Parks and Resorts entity and on the website it notes, so that guests understand tips may still be needed, that the money specifically does not go to paying any employee who does the delivery. In other words, this is just a fee the Park and Resorts entity is charging the resorts for the service though it does not cover any actual expense incurred in addition to what is already, and supposed to be, included in dues, i.e., this is just a charge to add profits to that company. That company seems to understand sometimes that it cannot add fees payable by DVC members for use of services at the resorts that are already included in dues, e.g., it did not include DVC in the new parking fees, but then decides to understand otherwise when it feels like it.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

What they told me is that the grocery delivery is not included in the list of things that members pay with their dues. Luggage delivery is included. Common parts like elevators, pools or services like transportation to the parks or to the airport are included. However they've not shared the list and not told where this list is. So we don't really know if they can start asking for a fee for services we think are included but are not in their magical list.

As Bell Services would be paid an hourly wage and scheduled to have a certain level of coverage the response does not make sense on the groceries. Other than making sense as a new income for Disney.

 

[SuzannesDCL]

Wow you were charged for your owners locker? So far we have never been charged for that. You said that wasn't supposed to happen, did you get your money back?

No. I was also locked out of my room for an hour when our magic bands stopped working & they gave me a credit of $50 for that, so I just let things wash out.

 

[k_hase]

As Bell Services would be paid an hourly wage and scheduled to have a certain level of coverage the response does not make sense on the groceries. Other than making sense as a new income for Disney.

Then I thought, what if I show up with groceries and my room isn't ready and then they are stored in the BS area in their refrigerators, and then I ask for it to be delivered---is that grocery delivery? It's just like Garden Grocer showed up, isnt it?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Then I thought, what if I show up with groceries and my room isn't ready and then they are stored in the BS area in their refrigerators, and then I ask for it to be delivered---is that grocery delivery? It's just like Garden Grocer showed up, isnt it?

Or if when you change resorts and you have groceries that you move?

 

[k_hase]

As Bell Services would be paid an hourly wage and scheduled to have a certain level of coverage the response does not make sense on the groceries. Other than making sense as a new income for Disney.

I thought about this and can see the argument that grocery deliver on top of luggage delivery requires more staff at Bell Services, particularly since many grocery orders are for longer stays and larger groups (anecdotally--couples staying in studios for short trips probably don't order very many things). More staff requires more than initially budgeted for Bell Services, so we pay $6 to make up for he extra man hours? Of course, it was not presented that way, but HAD they presented the argument that way I'd probably not think so much about this stupid $6 that is really not that big a deal other than what it means they will upcharge for in the future.

 

[Ms.Minnie]

No. I was also locked out of my room for an hour when our magic bands stopped working & they gave me a credit of $50 for that, so I just let things wash out.

Interesting, we weren't charge a fee to have our owners locker delivered in Jan. I will definitely be keep check of this when we go again this coming Jan. Has anyone else been charged a fee to have their owners locker delivered?

 

[drusba]

I thought about this and can see the argument that grocery deliver on top of luggage delivery requires more staff at Bell Services, particularly since many grocery orders are for longer stays and larger groups (anecdotally--couples staying in studios for short trips probably don't order very many things). More staff requires more than initially budgeted for Bell Services, so we pay $6 to make up for he extra man hours? Of course, it was not presented that way, but HAD they presented the argument that way I'd probably not think so much about this stupid $6 that is really not that big a deal other than what it means they will upcharge for in the future.

Your annual dues include the estimated costs of Bell Services for the year. That is the allowed charge. DVD guarantees there will be no special assessments during the year, which allows it escape paying dues on the points it owns, at least until the actual costs during the year exceed dues collected from members. The basis for the supposed new fee, adopted in April, is the delivery of groceries. That issue has been around for several years and if they hired more people last year as a result and anticipated hiring more this year partly because of the additional work, they were legally allowed to include the additional estimated costs for the year in your dues (which they probably did). At the end of this year, they will estimate costs for next year that will include an evaluation of any additional costs that might be incurred for services rendered, and that will include any increases in costs potentially related to grocery deliveries.

In essence, what the $6 fee adopted in April amounts to is an improper special assessment that DVD guaranteed would not occur during the year, and based on how they calculate dues, it essentially amounts to a double charge for any such delivery services provided because the costs are already included in dues.. And to make matters worse, the Disney Resort company that gets the $6 fee is not a DVC company and nothing goes to offset dues or employee costs. That company has even stated that the money does not go to pay the employees. In essence, we have a company that appears to have no right to charge DVC members anything for the operations of Bell Services, charging a $6 fee to DVC members, which members are far more likely to use grocery delivery than those staying in the hotel, and that entity pockets that fee for its own profit. I cannot see any possible fairness in that situation. This essentially says to the members, Disney can add fees on top of dues for anything at the resorts just so it can make more profit-- use of the pool, use of the front desk, use of the busses, use of parking -- to the point that additional fees could eventually become more than your annual dues.

Interesting, we weren't charge a fee to have our owners locker delivered in Jan. I will definitely be keep check of this when we go again this coming Jan. Has anyone else been charged a fee to have their owners locker delivered?

Owners Locker, fortunately, is excluded from any such fees.

 

[k_hase]

GRRR.

 

[crvetter]

DVD guarantees there will be no special assessments during the year, which allows it escape paying dues on the points it owns, at least until the actual costs during the year exceed dues collected from members.

This isn’t true. DVC very much pays dues on its points with the guarantee in place. It doesn’t pay dues on unsold inventory (those earmarked to be sold) but those they use and are required to own they pay dues on. See my post today that emphasizes this, let alone the annual budgets state exactly how much they pay and on how many points. It also is made clear in the financial statements what DVC pays in dues.

https://www.disboards.com/threads/totw-closed-july-4th-for-paid-event.3754204/post-60724013
Though I agree with the questionable nature of the grocery delivery charge.

 

[kkbutterfly]

Wow you were charged for your owners locker? So far we have never been charged for that. You said that wasn't supposed to happen, did you get your money back?

I was charged once for an Owners Locker and I didn't realize until after I left. I emailed John from OL and he told me to call the hotel (The Grand - I agree with Pete's rant) as they have an agreement with Disney. I sent the manager an email (from the note provided on the bed) and he called me back and refunded the amount plus 4 dollars (so $10) and provided me a one day ticket. I just wanted the 6 dollars back so the rest was a nice extra.

 

[Ms.Minnie]

Owners Locker, fortunately, is excluded from any such fees.

I was charged once for an Owners Locker and I didn't realize until after I left. I emailed John from OL and he told me to call the hotel (The Grand - I agree with Pete's rant) as they have an agreement with Disney. I sent the manager an email (from the note provided on the bed) and he called me back and refunded the amount plus 4 dollars (so $10) and provided me a one day ticket. I just wanted the 6 dollars back so the rest was a nice extra.

Thanks to both of you, I'm very glad to hear that the Owners Locker are exempt from the charges...that wouldn't be good for business for OL.