As members aren't we entitled to a fair Wait List system?

[bighoo93]

I think the wait list system should be fair, but after reading this thread, I don't see any indication that it isn't. To me, fair is that everyone has the same opportunity, no special privileges or rules or work-arounds. From the way it has been described here (and I have no first hand experience using it), it sounds archaic, crude and lazy, and gives off an air of incompetence from DVC. But that incompetence seems to be spread evenly to all members, so I'd say that's fair.

 

[nabi]

After all this informative banter, I feel thrilled for my waitlists coming through!!

I agree, my perspective on it all has changed too. I suppose I look at it now as a tool to try, rather than a place in line.

 

[delilah]

I think the wait list system should be fair, but after reading this thread, I don't see any indication that it isn't. To me, fair is that everyone has the same opportunity, no special privileges or rules or work-arounds. From the way it has been described here (and I have no first hand experience using it), it sounds archaic, crude and lazy, and gives off an air of incompetence from DVC. But that incompetence seems to be spread evenly to all members, so I'd say that's fair.

I agree with this. I just returned from a vacation where I stayed at AKL Kidani village, and had waitlisted BLT from the 7 mo time frame. We were staying for 5 nights, and our request never came through. We own points at both AKL villas (both Kidani and Jambo), and at SSR. I am seriously thinking about selling the SSR points and then buying BLT points, since we haven't stayed at SSR since about 2006 or so. It is not compelling, because we really like AKL. I tried to book the tree house villas once, in the morning at the 11 mo mark, and was unable to do so, and that wait list never came through, either (we stayed at AKL that time, too).

What I find more disturbing is the entitlement attitude that somebody is "snatching" a room away from a person because they are making a reservation. I don't think that anybody is intentionally trying to steal a room away from anybody. I am fortunate that at the 7 mo window, I was able to book a 1 BR unit at BWV at Christmas time. Didn't do it to mess someone else up, though. We just wanted to try a different resort this time.

 

[lilpooh108]

I was told the one time points would not go back into my account if I canceled so I didn't want to risk canceling the one night in order to book what was available on the website without doing it through MS.

I am like, 98% sure that this is untrue. 2 years ago, when the one-time use points came out, I bought 2 points for a reservation. I then changed the reservation and it stayed in my account. I just couldn't bank them or anything.

The reason why I'm not completely positive is because this was before the online system came out and so I couldn't see the transaction, etc.

I'll try and go back through my statements and see if I can find this reservation.

But anyway, MS is always wrong. It's so annoying b/c you have to come on DIS to ask the question, get the right answer, and then call back until you get the right MS who knows the right answer.

 

[lilpooh108]

Ok, I looked but I can't find it.

I distinctly remember it showing up as a "manual adjustment to points transferred in", and then the number of points in.

Then when I cancelled and rebooked, I simply had the same amount of points to book with.

I would call MS back and ask them to clarify the rule. I really am fairly positive that the one-time use points can be re-used even if the original reservation is cancelled. I just know that they can't be banked or transferred, etc.

 

[lilpooh108]

Here are the rules. The points, once purchased, expire in the same use year according to the reservation for which the points are used. They don't disappear simply because you cancel the reservation.

It's not explicit in the rules, but it's implied and that's how they worked for me. It is implied because of the expiration clause. If you cancel the reservation for which the points were booked, they can only expire if they remain in your account.

Next time, you should probably buy the amount that you need for a "dummy" reservation, cancel it and have the points ready for the waitlist if you truly need that one night.



"One-time-use vacation points expire according to the use year of the reservation booked and are non-refundable, non-transferable and cannot be banked or borrowed."


Here's the whole thing:
As a Disney Vacation Club Member, occasionally you may find yourself in need of just few extra vacation points in order to book that perfect dream vacation. Previously, this required borrowing vacation points from a future use year, but very recently a new alternative was introduced. They're called "one-time-use" vacation points and are available for a fee of $15 ($13.33 plus $1.67 tax) per vacation point. Availability of one-time-use vacation points may be limited or suspended from time to time, and the fee is subject to change.
Details:
One-time-use vacation points are vacation points available for Disney Vacation Club Members to use as an alternative to borrowing vacation points from the following use year's allotment.
You can obtain a maximum of 24 one-time-use vacation points once per use year per membership.
A maximum of 24 one-time-use vacation points are processed in a single transaction, not multiple transactions.
The fee for one-time-use vacation points is $15 (including tax) per vacation point, and is subject to change.
One-time-use vacation points expire according to the use year of the reservation booked and are non-refundable, non-transferable and cannot be banked or borrowed.
One-time-use vacation points are not available for waitlist reservations.
One-time-use vacation points cannot be applied retroactively to existing reservations.
One-time-use vacation points are only available for Members whose contract is closed and in good standing.
One-time-use vacation points are available only for Disney Vacation Club Resorts, Disney Collection*, Adventurer Collection* and World Passport Collection reservations.

* Available when you purchase directly from Disney.
One-time-use vacation points used for Disney Vacation Club resort reservations can only be used up to 7 months prior to arrival.
One-time-use vacation points for Disney Collection, Adventurer Collection and World Passport reservations can be used according to the booking guidelines for each individual collection.

 

[bumbershoot]

I am like, 98% sure that this is untrue. 2 years ago, when the one-time use points came out, I bought 2 points for a reservation. I then changed the reservation and it stayed in my account. I just couldn't bank them or anything.

The reason why I'm not completely positive is because this was before the online system came out and so I couldn't see the transaction, etc.

I'll try and go back through my statements and see if I can find this reservation.

But anyway, MS is always wrong. It's so annoying b/c you have to come on DIS to ask the question, get the right answer, and then call back until you get the right MS who knows the right answer.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one who thinks the OP was given bad info. They expire with UY if not used, not just if you cancel the reservation without rebooking immediately.

 

[bumbershoot]

Thought about it a minute longer and a new thought popped into my head. When I recently bought the one-time points (all four of them lol) it couldn't be done online, it all had to be done with the CM. So I imagine a change has to be done with a CM as well. I don't doubt that. But I think it was just explained poorly, or understood wrong by the CM who said it.

Same result but different reason. But I don't like wrong reasons being given by CMs.

 

[mjc2003]

Here are the rules. The points, once purchased, expire in the same use year according to the reservation for which the points are used. They don't disappear simply because you cancel the reservation.

It's not explicit in the rules, but it's implied and that's how they worked for me. It is implied because of the expiration clause. If you cancel the reservation for which the points were booked, they can only expire if they remain in your account.

Next time, you should probably buy the amount that you need for a "dummy" reservation, cancel it and have the points ready for the waitlist if you truly need that one night.



"One-time-use vacation points expire according to the use year of the reservation booked and are non-refundable, non-transferable and cannot be banked or borrowed."


Here's the whole thing:
As a Disney Vacation Club Member, occasionally you may find yourself in need of just few extra vacation points in order to book that perfect dream vacation. Previously, this required borrowing vacation points from a future use year, but very recently a new alternative was introduced. They're called "one-time-use" vacation points and are available for a fee of $15 ($13.33 plus $1.67 tax) per vacation point. Availability of one-time-use vacation points may be limited or suspended from time to time, and the fee is subject to change.
Details:
One-time-use vacation points are vacation points available for Disney Vacation Club Members to use as an alternative to borrowing vacation points from the following use year's allotment.
You can obtain a maximum of 24 one-time-use vacation points once per use year per membership.
A maximum of 24 one-time-use vacation points are processed in a single transaction, not multiple transactions.
The fee for one-time-use vacation points is $15 (including tax) per vacation point, and is subject to change.
One-time-use vacation points expire according to the use year of the reservation booked and are non-refundable, non-transferable and cannot be banked or borrowed.
One-time-use vacation points are not available for waitlist reservations.
One-time-use vacation points cannot be applied retroactively to existing reservations.
One-time-use vacation points are only available for Members whose contract is closed and in good standing.
One-time-use vacation points are available only for Disney Vacation Club Resorts, Disney Collection*, Adventurer Collection* and World Passport Collection reservations.

* Available when you purchase directly from Disney.
One-time-use vacation points used for Disney Vacation Club resort reservations can only be used up to 7 months prior to arrival.
One-time-use vacation points for Disney Collection, Adventurer Collection and World Passport reservations can be used according to the booking guidelines for each individual collection.

I went over this multiple times with MS. Basically the way it was explained is that if I created this "dummy" reservation and canceled it, I would not see nor be able to use the one time points online to make a new reservation. Only MS would be able to make this switch.

I don't doubt that this could be inaccurate, but this is how it was explained to me.

 

[mjc2003]

At this point after following and reading this I've come to this conclusion....
Life isn't fair, deal with it. Not to be rude but there are flaws/problems that exist with every scenario listed. OP is upset they aren't getting the room they want. I understand that.

I'm actually not upset at all, and here is why: I have 8 nights in a 2BR at BCV in a lockoff. At the 7 month mark, I wanted to add a night at the beginning, but only a 2BR with 2 queens was available. So I booked that with the one time points, and am waitlisted for the 1st night in a lockoff. So I have a room at BCV, just have to switch after one night; it's an inconvenience at best. My point was not so much about me being upset, though I was highlighting my particular circumstance, but more about whether the system in general works effectively. I can see from the responses that the consensus is that it works ok, people don't seem to bothered by some of the inefficiencies, and that's reasonable. I'm not upset, it's 1-2 times every few years I might rely on it.

I still think a system that holds rooms for nearly sold out nights is not too complicated and could be done, but that's just my opinion.

 

[mjc2003]

I think the wait list system should be fair, but after reading this thread, I don't see any indication that it isn't. To me, fair is that everyone has the same opportunity, no special privileges or rules or work-arounds. From the way it has been described here (and I have no first hand experience using it), it sounds archaic, crude and lazy, and gives off an air of incompetence from DVC. But that incompetence seems to be spread evenly to all members, so I'd say that's fair.

Point taken. But just because they are consistently archaic, crude and lazy doesn't mean it has to be acceptable.

What I find more disturbing is the entitlement attitude that somebody is "snatching" a room away from a person because they are making a reservation. I don't think that anybody is intentionally trying to steal a room away from anybody. I am fortunate that at the 7 mo window, I was able to book a 1 BR unit at BWV at Christmas time. Didn't do it to mess someone else up, though. We just wanted to try a different resort this time.

I was not trying to suggest that anybody is doing anything wrong. I was being critical of the system, not the people using it. Of course you, I or any member can and should book any room available if they want. I was suggesting that the system could better service the wait lists, especially for "sold out" resorts during busy times. If a room becomes available today at one of the Epcot resorts in October, you can be guaranteed there's several people waiting for it. However, for the next few hours it's fair game for somebody who has not been waiting for it. I wish the system could hold these rooms under this scenario and assign it to somebody who has been waiting. However, the system doesn't work that way and most people seem ok with that. I'm not saying it's wrong, just that it could be improved. But I certainly had no intention of casting any aspersions on anybody who grabs one of those rooms!

 

[mjc2003]

Thought about it a minute longer and a new thought popped into my head. When I recently bought the one-time points (all four of them lol) it couldn't be done online, it all had to be done with the CM. So I imagine a change has to be done with a CM as well. I don't doubt that. But I think it was just explained poorly, or understood wrong by the CM who said it.

Same result but different reason. But I don't like wrong reasons being given by CMs.

Basically this is what I was told. All "transactions" involving the 1 time points had to go through a CM.

 

[CarolMN]

Basically this is what I was told. All "transactions" involving the 1 time points had to go through a CM.

This has been the case since the inception of the one-time points. They have never shown up online.

 

[lilpooh108]

I went over this multiple times with MS. Basically the way it was explained is that if I created this "dummy" reservation and canceled it, I would not see nor be able to use the one time points online to make a new reservation. Only MS would be able to make this switch.

I don't doubt that this could be inaccurate, but this is how it was explained to me.

Interesting. I guess when I changed my reservation it was an "non issue" at the time since there was no online reservation system yet. Good to know and sorry about your problem.

 

[bumbershoot]

Basically this is what I was told. All "transactions" involving the 1 time points had to go through a CM.

I had to buy 9 points to book any 2BR for that night b/c we were short on BCV points, hence me having to wait til the 7 month window to book that one night. I was told the one time points would not go back into my account if I canceled so I didn't want to risk canceling the one night in order to book what was available on the website without doing it through MS.

OK, so those two things you said are different from each other. There's a difference between losing the points entirely vs needing to have the CM do the change.

 

[mjc2003]

OK, so those two things you said are different from each other. There's a difference between losing the points entirely vs needing to have the CM do the change.

I'm a little confused as to how my statements differ; if I canceled the one night without the help of MS (meaning online), I would lose the points entirely, they would not go back into my account Therefore all transactions involving the one time points had to go through MS.

The reason given for this is that one time points have to be tied to a reservation once purchased, they can't be co-mingled with unused points in our account. So if I booked a room for that night and then canceled to have the points available to book my desired room online myself, as some had suggested, I would again have been 9 points short because the 9 points I bought would have been essentially forfeited.

Obviously whether this is accurate or not seems open to discussion, but that's what I was told.

Since I have the room currently booked with one time points, I will call MS today and ask again what would happen to the one time points if I canceled the room I'm currently holding with them.

 

[CarolMN]

I'm a little confused as to how my statements differ; if I canceled the one night without the help of MS (meaning online), I would lose the points entirely, they would not go back into my account Therefore all transactions involving the one time points had to go through MS.

This is not true. The points go back into your account. You can't see them online or book with them online, but MS will be able to see them and use them if they are valid for the reservation you want to switch to.

That said, I wouldn't take the chance of cancelling a reservation online and then calling MS hoping that what I wanted would still be available. I would have MS do both the cancel and the re-book.

One time points expire at the end of the use year into which the reservation that first used them fell. They cannot be banked or borrowed.

If the MS CM tells you something different, politely ask for a Supervisor - as you see from what lilpooh108 copied from the website, you originally received incorrect information. Unfortunately, that sometimes happens.

 

[bonrea]

Next time you see it BOOK IT! Then go cancel the waitlist. That's what I did!

Actually I've never gotten what I wanted when added to a wait list. I check the Website every morning (when I'm trying to get the room I want) at 0600hours ET. I have figured out that at 0600hours ET is when the database has completed its updates from the day before and most, if not all, of the new / updated room information is in.

If I find the room I want; I book it. I have always gotten when I wanted doing that. Yes... 0600hours is early for most folks but I'm up and leaving for work at 0610hours anyhow.

For Dining reservations, at times of the year that we KNOW are going to be a high demand time, like December; my wife and I divide and conquer with two computers. I at one computer and her at another.

The early bird gets the warm in most cases.

 

[OneMoreTry]

My wait list just came through.

 

[mjc2003]

OP here, just as an update I called in and was told that I cannot cancel the reservation with the hopes of using the one time points to book online. The points would not be lost, but MS would have to make any reservations, thus defeating any purpose to booking a dummy reservation only to cancel to be able to use the points the moment I see something available online. Doesn't work that way.

More interestingly, in my conversation with MS I was told that the waitlist is run constantly throughout the day, and ALL cancellations are run against the wait list BEFORE becoming available on the website. Since I was told earlier that this is way too complicated and would tax the system, and since it was generally accepted that the wait lists are run only at night, I find this info interesting. I politely asked the representative to confirm this with a supervisor, who also confirmed that wait lists are matched each time there's a cancellation, NOT only at night.

So when I originally started this post I said there was a lot of ambiguity as to how WL's worked, and several people responded to say there is no mystery, they are run at night. Turns out this is not the case. Or is it? Who knows, but MS is saying otherwise.