Are you a guest or a customer?

[Crl1817]

IMO, in the table holding situation, the onus is on disney to provide adequate seating, not on the paying customer to be more considerate. Obviously disney is in it for the money (just like any corporation--not holding that against disney). So if they can convince us all that it's our burden to be polite to other guests then they don't have to cut into the profits and offer a bigger dining area with more seating.

There's just nothing fundamentally rude about wanting to sit at a table and rest or supervise young children in a more controlled environment. The problem only arises when there isn't adequate seating, and that's on disney.

 

[Steve BWV'99]

All the TS require your whole party be there before you check-in.

We ran into that at Biergarten. Because of the communal dining setup the family we were seated with was missing one person so the entire table (including us) could not be seated. It was pretty annoying.

 

[Crl1817]

A little off topic, but I was at Target the other day. An employee was answering some questions for DH when the radio called for him. He said, "I'm with a guest." It's interesting how other businesses have adopted Disney's terminology.

I noticed that a few years ago, before I had been to disney. And I dislike it. I'm not a guest. I'm a paying customer. The whole etiquette thing is a different dynamic. Both situations require polite behavior, but what is considered polite is very different.

 

[kaytieeldr]

People holding a table is just like what happens with table service. CS some people sit while others order and bring food. TS everyone sits and waits for a waiter to come and take your order and bring your food. In either case, people are sitting and waiting at a table for someone to bring food.

If the restaurant wants to do crowd control and keep people from sitting until they have food, IMO, they should at a minimum guarantee a table when the food is ready. I understand disney policy is different at times from this ideal and I'm not saying I'm going to ignore a cast member or complain to one while I'm there, but I won't like it.

That's what restricting access to the seating area does. Guests who want table service-styke service - sit, then order food, then wait for food, then eat - need to dine at table service restaurants. Counter/quick serce restaurants don't provide this service, and when tables are at a minimum, guests shouldn't be creating their own version of it.

It's not difficult to understand. (And the premise assumes that people are not holding tables for 15 minutes...or at all.) It's simply a matter of where you want the backlog and what is best for the service of food. If the CM holds back a family, not letting them sit down, and along comes another family. And then another. And the CM says: "Hmmm. This is unusual. Tables typically open up faster than this." Which would be better, having people line up with food that is getting cold while they wait for tables, or putting a hold on additional orders until customers can be seated? There is going to be a backup and a wait either way. But one way gets people cold food and the other way gets them hot food.

Where are these mythical families coming along and coming along and bypassing the already waiting family, coming from? That's not at all how the process works - and it works.

IMO, in the table holding situation, the onus is on disney to provide adequate seating, not on the paying customer to be more considerate. Obviously disney is in it for the money (just like any corporation--not holding that against disney). So if they can convince us all that it's our burden to be polite to other guests then they don't have to cut into the profits and offer a bigger dining area with more seating.

There's just nothing fundamentally rude about wanting to sit at a table and rest or supervise young children in a more controlled environment. The problem only arises when there isn't adequate seating, and that's on disney.

There's adequate seating for the paying customers. Until one's food is at least paid for, the person/party isn't a paying customer. Potential, sure. In the meantime, using a table as a resting place or child corral causes the lack of tables for diners with food in hand.

 

[JanaDee]

Moving away from the table saving debate.....

The entire idea that Disney calls "good" people Guests and "bad" people Customers is as absurd as it is insulting. If you are a guest in my home and I serve you dinner, you get what I cook, the way I prepare it and you accept it graciously. If my playscape is broken and your kids can't swing on the swings, you don't complain. If you are a paying customer, you have a right to expect, and up to a point, demand that you are getting full value for what you are buying. If you order your steak medium rare, you can insist on that in a way that you never could if you were an invited guest. If you are paying for rides an entertainment, you have a right to insist that the same be made available to you. If you are a guest in my home, you cannot demand control of the cable box.

We are not "invited guests" to WDW. We are paying customers. We do not have to graciously accept whatever our "host" sets before us. We do not have to shrug off the failure to deliver the entertainment that we are paying for. To apply a pejorative context to the term "customer" when that person is paying $600 per night for a room, $50 per person for average food and $60 per day for park admission is insane. Disney wants us to feel like invited guests who graciously accept whatever we are offered but we would all be fools to fall into that trap. Sorry. I am a "customer" (in my sense of the word, not theirs) and I make no apologies.

 

[andyman8]

In all the times I've been, I've never really had a problem with seating at QS restaurants and I tend to travel during the busier times of the year and eat during "peak hours". I don't know maybe I'm just lucky.

 

[JimmyV]

In all the times I've been, I've never really had a problem with seating at QS restaurants and I tend to travel during the busier times of the year and eat during "peak hours". I don't know maybe I'm just lucky.

I'm with you on this. The whole thing is a non-issue for us. We typically eat our CS meals at Columbia Harbor House, Flame Tree, Sunshine Seasons, La Cantina, and Fairfax Fare and in 41 years of visits, I can't ever remember waiting 15 minutes for my food. We stay together when we order. After the order is placed, two people stay to carry trays and drinks and one person gets condiments and napkins, straws and utensils. That person then goes to find a table. By the time they complete their mission, the food is usually ready or is a minute or two away. I have no issue with a member of our party finding a table one or two minutes before the others arrive with the food. Where do these "hold the table for 15 minutes" stories come from?

 

[Disney Queenie]

I have no problem, with someone getting a table while someone is line for the food. Nothing worse than standing around with a heavy tray with drinks( drink just waiting to spill if I am holding the tray). So give me dirty looks, for me it is common sense.

 

[Crl1817]

That's what restricting access to the seating area does. Guests who want table service-styke service - sit, then order food, then wait for food, then eat - need to dine at table service restaurants. Counter/quick serce restaurants don't provide this service, and when tables are at a minimum, guests shouldn't be creating their own version of it.



Where are these mythical families coming along and coming along and bypassing the already waiting family, coming from? That's not at all how the process works - and it works.



There's adequate seating for the paying customers. Until one's food is at least paid for, the person/party isn't a paying customer. Potential, sure. In the meantime, using a table as a resting place or child corral causes the lack of tables for diners with food in hand.

Obviously I disagree. Sitting down at a fast food place or mall food court while someone else in your party gets the food is extremely common behavior outside of disney. It is so common that it is the accepted norm, in my experience.

The distinction between table and counter service is where the order is taken and who delivers the food, not in when you get to sit down. We often eat at restaurants where one orderes at the counter then waits for a number to be called. Those restaurants have no place for people to stand and wait and if you tried you would be clogging up the ordering line. You need to sit and wait out of the way and come back when your number is called. Those are most definitely "counter" service restaurants, not "table" service.

If there are a hundred tables and only two are full and only two parties are in line, is there any reason at all some of the line standers shouldn't go and sit down? I can't think of one. So the problem isn't people sitting. The problem is an insufficient number of tables.

And as far as I am concerned I should be considered a customer and treated accordingly if I am in an establishment trying to make a purchase, whether the transaction is final or not.

 

[JimmyV]

Where are these mythical families coming along and coming along and bypassing the already waiting family, coming from? That's not at all how the process works - and it works.

I guess the lack of understanding comes from a disconnect. There are no families passing other families. They are backlogging. Think of the entrance to the dining area as a one lane path with no way to pass anyone else. Family A shows up with food and gets stopped by the CM at 12:00. Family B arrives at 12:02 and gets in line behind Family A. Family C arrives at 12:04 and gets in line. The line is not moving because tables are all occupied by families who are eating. No one is saving a table. The tables are all legitimately being used. What do you do with Family D? Allow them to order food and get in line only to wait 8 minutes to be seated after they get their food (because they are in line behind Families A, B and C), or hold them up in the ordering line and have them wait 8 minutes to order? They have to wait 8 minutes either way. But one way they have food and it is getting cold. The other way they wait to order and get waved through by the CM to an open table with hot food. There is no "right" answer. But holding people up at the ordering station is not irrational.

 

[BudgieMama]

Obviously I disagree. Sitting down at a fast food place or mall food court while someone else in your party gets the food is extremely common behavior outside of disney. It is so common that it is the accepted norm, in my experience.

I agree with this... if I am out somewhere for the day, and need to find somewhere to eat, the first thing I do on arrival is find a table for my party. If there is no table, we find another place to eat.

They either need to stop anyone from getting a table until they have food AND not sell food to people who need somewhere to sit when there is no tables available, which obviously requires extra staff to supervise and direct people (and make sure tables are left clear) or they need to accept that some people will hold tables whilst others get their food, regardless of what statistics say, as most people won't know that, or necessarily be prepared to trust that a table will open up for them when they need it.

 

[maxiesmom]

I agree with this... if I am out somewhere for the day, and need to find somewhere to eat, the first thing I do on arrival is find a table for my party. If there is no table, we find another place to eat.

They either need to stop anyone from getting a table until they have food AND not sell food to people who need somewhere to sit when there is no tables available, which obviously requires extra staff to supervise and direct people (and make sure tables are left clear) or they need to accept that some people will hold tables whilst others get their food, regardless of what statistics say, as most people won't know that, or necessarily be prepared to trust that a table will open up for them when they need it.

I think Disney knows what they "need" to do to control flow in their fast food restaurants more than we do. Obviously most of the time there are plenty of tables, so people sitting without food is not that big of a deal. And other times it causes problems so Disney knows that flowing people into the seating areas that already have food is the way to go.

I think it is kind of like stores that set up their register lines in a different manner during Christmas. Most of the time of the year, they have no need to direct their guests. But when it is extra busy they have found a different way that works better for everyone. Disney is doing the same thing. Taking charge when they have to. The tables turn over quick enough that there is no need for them to stop selling food.

When it is that busy that they are holding tables for people with food, the tables turn over faster. I've never seen a long line of people being held back, waiting for a table. And many people (like me) would have no problem with going outside and grabbing a spot on the sidewalk to eat if it was that long of a line.

 

[DebbieB]

Disney is different than a mall because especially when the weather is hot, you have people coming into counter service and sitting down just to take a rest in the air conditioning without buying food. That is what Disney is trying to control, they want to make sure paying customers can find tables. I was there in May and didn't see them doing this at all, it must be just during crowded times.

 

[Tonyz]

There are two types of people who go to Disney World.

A) People who "get" it and are respectful to cast members, other guests, and the property grounds.

B) People who think Disney is just another amusement park and they're entitled to do whatever they want because they're "paying customers."

 

[GotLabradors]

There are two types of people who go to Disney World.

A) People who "get" it and are respectful to cast members, other guests, and the property grounds.

B) People who think Disney is just another amusement park and they're entitled to do whatever they want because they're "paying customers."

This thread in a nutshell!

 

[kaytieeldr]

Obviously I disagree. Sitting down at a fast food place or mall food court while someone else in your party gets the food is extremely common behavior outside of disney. It is so common that it is the accepted norm, in my experience. Neither is a theme park with tens of thousands of visitors each day.

The distinction between table and counter service is where the order is taken and who delivers the food, not in when you get to sit down. We often eat at restaurants where one orders at the counter then waits for a number to be called. Those restaurants have no place for people to stand and wait and if you tried you would be clogging up the ordering line. You need to sit and wait out of the way and come back when your number is called. Those are most definitely "counter" service restaurants, not "table" service.Table service restaurants - real version, not the hybrid described here - don't allow customers to sit at a table until there is a table available. The only counter service venue I know that has a combination of limited waiting area and high volume is Wolfgang Puck Express.

If there are a hundred tables and only two are full and only two parties are in line, is there any reason at all some of the line standers shouldn't go and sit down? I can't think of one. So the problem isn't people sitting. The problem is an insufficient number of tables.When there are a hundred tables with two occupied and two parties in line, it's not an issue. Disney knows it's not an issue. They don't restrict access. They don't take CMs from their normal positions. There's no need.

I guess the lack of understanding comes from a disconnect. There are no families passing other families. They are backlogging. Think of the entrance to the dining area as a one lane path with no way to pass anyone else. Family A shows up with food and gets stopped by the CM at 12:00. Family B arrives at 12:02 and gets in line behind Family A. Family C arrives at 12:04 and gets in line. The line is not moving because tables are all occupied by families who are eating. No one is saving a table. The tables are all legitimately being used. What do you do with Family D? Allow them to order food and get in line only to wait 8 minutes to be seated after they get their food (because they are in line behind Families A, B and C), or hold them up in the ordering line and have them wait 8 minutes to order? They have to wait 8 minutes either way. But one way they have food and it is getting cold. The other way they wait to order and get waved through by the CM to an open table with hot food. There is no "right" answer. But holding people up at the ordering station is not irrational.

What source indicates all the people at tables eating all arrived at one time, all ordered at the same time, all got their food at the same time, all take the same (long?) amount of time to eat? Your scenario can be likenex to, oh, Mickey's PhilharMagic, when counter service dining in generally is more like Splash Mountain.

 

[Planogirl]

I guess the lack of understanding comes from a disconnect. There are no families passing other families. They are backlogging. Think of the entrance to the dining area as a one lane path with no way to pass anyone else. Family A shows up with food and gets stopped by the CM at 12:00. Family B arrives at 12:02 and gets in line behind Family A. Family C arrives at 12:04 and gets in line. The line is not moving because tables are all occupied by families who are eating. No one is saving a table. The tables are all legitimately being used. What do you do with Family D? Allow them to order food and get in line only to wait 8 minutes to be seated after they get their food (because they are in line behind Families A, B and C), or hold them up in the ordering line and have them wait 8 minutes to order? They have to wait 8 minutes either way. But one way they have food and it is getting cold. The other way they wait to order and get waved through by the CM to an open table with hot food. There is no "right" answer. But holding people up at the ordering station is not irrational.

This never seems to happen.

We've been at Pecos Bills when they have the system in place and we are normally directed to a table without waiting. We have also been there when no one is monitoring the seating and that is when we tend to wander for a while and our food gets cold.

Maybe we should avoid Pecos Bills...

 

[MarineVet]

I haven't see this mentioned, but on our last visit, I heard a CM talking to another guest about this while I was at the fixins bar at Pecos Bills. He said they had to control tables because too many families with picnics they brought in with them were taking up the tables, mostly outside, which made more paying guests seek tables inside, and that was causing a problem.

 

[LSUfan4444]

There are two types of people who go to Disney World.

A) People who "get" it and are respectful to cast members, other guests, and the property grounds.

B) People who think Disney is just another amusement park and they're entitled to do whatever they want because they're "paying customers."

You forgot:

C) People who feel like making up any trivial "standard" they want and expect other guests to adopt it.

 

[RealBlast3]

This is one reason why I have almost exclusively eaten at table service restaurants since I've been going to Disney on my own as an adult. The first time we went as a family when I was younger, we ate at alot of these sorts of counter top service places and it was always such a hassle having to worry about seating, and the food is nothing extraordinary.

The last time I ate at a counter service, which was the Backlot Express at Hollywood Studios, I actually had a wandering family ask me to give up my table! I was still eating! So, I swallowed the last bit of my burger (which tasted like a hockey puck but that's for another thread!) and picked up my fries and gave it to them because I DID feel bad for them, even if asking another party to give up their table is something I would never do.

But yeah, no one wants to eat cold food. It is a reasonable expectation from the guest or customer to be able to sit down and eat their food while it is still hot, otherwise you've just wasted your money. I hate cold food!