Are we crazy?????

[Nicola2n]

The other thing we were considering was purchasing resale at BWV because we really do like the esthetic of that resort. Love the refurbished rooms, proximity to Epcot and HS. Plus the points required to stay look really low. But...the 22 year term is a bummer.

 

[Spark65]

. We’ve been intrigued by DVC since our first Disney trip four years ago. Since that time we’ve done five Disney trips and three Disney cruises. So we’ve been researching and reading and watching video after video. The thing is we keep coming back to the riviera. But I feel like we’re nuts. Resale restrictions, higher points per stay, higher maintenance fees...high price per point direct. I don’t know. I’m feeling like we are crazy for even considering this. Help!

Why? Seems like the Riviera is the place you want to stay everyone here will tell you to buy where you want to stay. Don't let the cost stop you from buying what you want regrets can be a whole lot costlier and harder to swallow for years.

There are no restrictions for you to resell those restrictions are for the future buyer and that's if you decide to sell. Riviera has also shown it can sell in the resale market so that in itself should
be considered in the equation unless pure profit is all your looking at and not the enjoyment you will get for many years.

 

[mustinjourney]

Not that this is the point of the thread, but it doesnt take 20 minutes to get to MK from vgf on the monorail. There will soon be a walkway from vgf, so what is your excuse then?

If I had a rocket ship that went from Toronto to epcot in 20 minutes I guess by your definition that resort with the rocket ship would be an epcot resort? Don't be ridiculous...if they tie every resort via gondolas they will all be epcot resorts then. Got it...

I said 15 mins from MK to VGF. Not VGF to MK.

 

[vnovabri]

I said 15 mins from MK to VGF. Not VGF to MK.

I'm with you, I don't get the unbias monorail love. You're going to be spending some time either coming out going from one of those resorts. And if there is a line or other issue you wish you could walk. That's why I prefer BLT of the MK resorts. They can be convenient but I loved the simplicity of the gondolas to two parks.

 

[DVC BLT]

Without a doubt, go for it. RIV negativity is based on the restrictions but this is the new normal with DVC. It wont change and your "wait" for the epcot "gate" resort will have the same restrictions. The next epcot resort is a long way away... Riveria is a true deluxe resort from what we saw, jump : )

As for some of the comments in this thread: The amenities are too small for the resort? Really? We have resort design engineer / architects commenting on this board? Come'on guys, Disney is not going to save a few bucks on making a coffee shop a little bit smaller...This is getting funny now... LOL

 

[vnovabri]

As for some of the comments in this thread: The amenities are too small for the resort? Really? We have resort design engineer / architects commenting on this board? Come'on guys, Disney is not going to save a few bucks on making a coffee shop a little bit smaller...This is getting funny now... LOL

To give people and idea, Bay Lake has the same number as DVC units (300) as Riviera and shares it's amenities with Contemporary (another 633 rooms). Similarly DVC only SSR has 888 units (1320 rooms) but only the one main lobby housing a restaurant and quick serve, although more pools spread throughout.

These numbers may not be exact but it gives an idea.

 

[DVC BLT]

They wouldn't if people voted with their wallets though.

But just on this board there's so much FOMO with DVC (aka "addonitis") and existing owners posting about their justifications for buying Riviera. If educated owners are deciding to overlook the restrictions, and people coming in off the street aren't going to know any better, then I guess it is true that DVC policies will continue to become less and less owner friendly over time.

Lets be clear, we live in a "free market." Its what allowed Disney World itself to exist? Please do not turn this world into a place where you want everything & under the conditions you set. Free markets find their own level, if that level isnt for you, move on. I recommend not trying to control people's minds via virtual bullying with comments such as the "educated owners..." deciding to overlook restrictions. You wont change the free market your trying to control, and the idea of controlling it in the first place is itself undermining what is great about freedom to begin with.

 

[RoseGold]

Why? Seems like the Riviera is the place you want to stay everyone here will tell you to buy where you want to stay. Don't let the cost stop you from buying what you want regrets can be a whole lot costlier and harder to swallow for years.

The choices aren't direct or nothing.

Rent points. Buy RIV resale in a few years. RIV is not going anywhere. You don't have to plunk down five figures right this second because you think a hotel is nice.

 

[Spark65]

The choices aren't direct or nothing.

No one said choices were maybe you should start by reading the OP's question first !

 

[SleeplessInTO]

Thank you so much. We really are struggling as there truly seems to be no answer that works for us. We either buy at RIV and have the luxury to stay at all resorts if we wanted to, BUT we don't feel super comfortable with the resale restrictions should something happen and we need to sell (we in no way think that this is something we will make money on, but don't love the idea of losing the bank if things don't work out. We don't particularly want to do resale because it limits us to not being able to stay at the new resorts going forward and we know that we will resent that. We are also Canadian so I just feel that adds another element. Our exchange rate isn't the best at the moment so the $23,000 investment comes in closer to $30,000 of our money.

We are Canadian too and feel your fx pain!! Can’t make the decision for you but we decided to buy Boardwalk resale last year. It was easier decision then because Riviera wasn’t open. Perhaps we could trade reservations some time if you decide to go with Riviera

 

[lovin'fl]

The choices aren't direct or nothing.

Rent points. Buy RIV resale in a few years. RIV is not going anywhere. You don't have to plunk down five figures right this second because you think a hotel is nice.

Though many of us DVC'ers say our #1 regret was not buying sooner. Do a search on this site and the DVC forums here for something like 'what regrets do you have' and most say not buying sooner. Not my regret because we first took the kids to WDW in 2003 (off site) and then again to stay on site (POR) in 2005. Saw the DVC booths on that trip and bought in 2006. Having never stayed at any DVC resort. Bought OKW without having stepped foot on that property. Researched enough to know about resale so that's what we bought. Used the heck out of those points, at all the east coast DVCs (except VGF). Added on many more contracts. And just sold the OKW for $94pp (bought for $76).

 

[Nicola2n]

The choices aren't direct or nothing.

Rent points. Buy RIV resale in a few years. RIV is not going anywhere. You don't have to plunk down five figures right this second because you think a hotel is nice.

Believe me. I’m considering alllll of those options that you’ve listed. Someone referred to it as “paralysis by analysis “. Love that. I don’t think at this point I’d consider RIV resale. I’d hate to be limited to just that resort for the next 50 years. I do also worry about prices per point jumping. We travel a lot. At least two vacations a year. Disney is always our favourite and seems to work best for our family over beach vacations etc. Still thinking it all through.

 

[TexasChick123]

Believe me. I’m considering alllll of those options that you’ve listed. Someone referred to it as “paralysis by analysis “. Love that. I don’t think at this point I’d consider RIV resale. I’d hate to be limited to just that resort for the next 50 years. I do also worry about prices per point jumping. We travel a lot. At least two vacations a year. Disney is always our favourite and seems to work best for our family over beach vacations etc. Still thinking it all through.

The best advice is “Buy where you want to stay.” For example, I bought some resale BLT points pretty cheaply a few years ago. I booked 5 nights in a standard 1BR at BLT at 11 months for this summer. I just decided to split it up into an EP resort/BLT stay. If there had been no EP resorts available, we would’ve been perfectly happy staying at BLT the whole trip which was the original plan.

My VGF points at $130pp were considered on the high side and overpriced 4 years ago. I bought VGC for $165pp just last year. I bought BLT for $100pp (that was a great deal!). My point is that what looks expensive today may look like a deal tomorrow. Granted, these were resale points before the major restrictions. You never know how everything will shake out, but I would say stop analyzing and just buy where you want to stay after you’ve had some time to think about it. That’s what we did, and we’re very happy with it.

If you ask 100 different people their opinions, you’ll possibly get 100 different answers. I have the resorts I like and those I don’t. Two of my least favorite resorts which I can’t see ever staying in again are beloved by their owners. It’s truly a matter of opinion.

 

[Soap_1984]

My only comment would be there isn't "paralysis by analysis"; it isn't as though if you don't buy riviera dvc you can never stay there. It isn't like this is an "opportunity" the numbers are pretty clear it isn't a great deal that shouldn't be missed. If you go 20 years straight and stay there every time, it will be cheaper to not buy dvc there. So ask yourself why you are struggling, what is it that you're really getting out of owning? If you aren't getting a fixed week I'm not sure the answer is anything.

I am Canadian as well. The 200 saratoga points we bought cost about $17,000 when the dollar was close to par; it objectively made sense financially to buy dvc. This isn't a discussion about whether or not riviera is even nice, it's a discussion on what you are getting by owning at riviera vs just staying there and the answer is:

Having no obligation to go in a year you don't want to;
Not having to pay dues and can decide each year if there's value in the vacation;
Having about $50,000 Canadian in your pocket (I'm assuming based on rivieras point chart you'd want 200 points but that's a guess).

List the positives of owning riviera; by that I mean not the resort itself, but actually owning it. You can book at 11 months which you can also do if you book cash or rent points.

 

[vnovabri]

Having no obligation to go in a year you don't want to;
Not having to pay dues and can decide each year if there's value in the vacation;

These factors can also be mitigated a number of ways, you aren't locked into going every year if you own DVC. We are renting surplus points this year that cover our dues and then some and rolled over the rest to be used or rented the following year. Some people also use RCI effectively as another alternative.

It really comes down to how you plan to vacation. There are plenty of calculations out there as well to weigh the cost of buying vs renting or rack rate. For us 'break even" was about 8yrs with the trips we planned out, but we also bought AK resale prior to the latest restrictions. We also could have straight up rented our contract and broke even in like 9 yrs ( including dues) having the next 30yrs worth of points to be ahead of the game.

This math is all different for different situations and always subject to change , but thinking of it this way made it easier for us.

 

[Lorana]

You can find someone who will call any of us DVCers crazy. My family thinks I’m crazy for buying into DVC, and I think they’re crazy for shelling out the money for season tickets to the Patriots. It’s all a matter of perspective. At the end of the day, do what makes sense for you and that will make you happy.

I’m super bummed we didn’t pull the trigger before the resale restrictions went in last year. But part of the reason we bought in is that we love Disney, we’ve been so often that financially it would have made sense to buy in sooner, but also as we look ahead, we want to go more often. If I had to pay “out of pocket” every time, there’s no way I’d go as frequently as we are now going to go over the next many years. I’d want to explore somewhere new, or I’d ball at paying the prices for onsite stays. I feel like that is one thing that you should consider, beyond all the finances and benefits: if visiting Disney more often is what you want to do, buying DVC enables that.

If Riviera speaks to you as home, buy there. Yes, it has restrictions if you resell it, but chances are good that by the time you sell, you’ll have gotten your money’s worth. We all crunch the numbers to do what makes sense for us - I own Direct and Resale, at BRV and AKL - but at the end of the day, it’s also an emotional purchase, and you should do what makes you happy. We bought BRV despite the shorter expiration year because we love the Wilderness Lodge. It is like home to us. And the 5th person was important to us.

But most importantly, the memories of these trips are the real currency in our life.

 

[Soap_1984]

The OP is in Canada I'm not sure how renting your points works; I know I have heard brokers won't assist so your on your own I believe being international; a lot of people don't want to get involved in that situation (including me).

The memories can be had with or without dvc. You're already having awesome vacations without it; I'm not saying don't buy I'm saying weigh your options and determine why you want dvc. The only reason for me was to save money. If that's your motivation then buy resale and trade points to stay at Riv.

This isn't like buying season tickets to football...this is like prepaying for football tickets you know will be available during the year and paying more just to say you're a season ticket holder.

 

[vnovabri]

The OP is in Canada I'm not sure how renting your points works; I know I have heard brokers won't assist so your on your own I believe being international; a lot of people don't want to get involved in that situation (including me).

The memories can be had with or without dvc. You're already having awesome vacations without it; I'm not saying don't buy I'm saying weigh your options and determine why you want dvc. The only reason for me was to save money. If that's your motivation then buy resale and trade points to stay at Riv.

This isn't like buying season tickets to football...this is like prepaying for football tickets you know will be available during the year and paying more just to say you're a season ticket holder.

David's DVC is based in Canada. I'd be surprised if they didn't let you rent through them. I have heard of people using them for Canadian points so I believe that's a non issue.

 

[Lorana]

This isn't like buying season tickets to football...this is like prepaying for football tickets you know will be available during the year and paying more just to say you're a season ticket holder.

I think my point was missed a little. They had asked “am I crazy?”; my point is buying into DVC and buying the resort that speaks “home” to you is no more crazy than people who want to be season ticket holders because they love football and their home team is “home” to them, and they’re willing to pay a little more and pay every year for that guarantee.

I’m not paying more to be a DVC owner over time; I am paying upfront, of course, but in the long run, I’ll come out ahead AND I’ll visit more often AND I’ll get that many more memories in a place I love with family and friends.

If they love Riviera and that’s where they want to stay all the time, go for it. It doesn’t make you crazy. Or as suggested, but split points - some direct at RIV, some resale at another resort. Figure out what works for you financially AND will make you happy, and go for it.

 

[Nicola2n]

Or as suggested, but split points - some direct at RIV, some resale at another resort. Figure out what works for you financially AND will make you happy, and go for it.

I'm not sure I'm completely understanding the split points. RIV and resale. Isn't having little piles of points everywhere counter active? Especially since we can't use the resale points at RIV? and I'm assuming then we could only book 11 months out at those two places separately. We definitely are not financially in the market to be purchasing 200 points. We were thinking 120 was our max direct or closer to 150-170 resale....