Are they kidding???

[MaryAnnDVC]

To the issue of 'compassionate release', Generally, these people are so sick that there really is no point in keeping them locked up. They are basically imprisoned no matter where they are.

So, let me see if I understand. If a prisoner is sentenced to life in prison, but gets sick and is going to die, he should therefore receive a compassionate release. Then what prisoners serving life in prison actually SERVE "Life in Prison"? Just the "healthy" ones, who suddenly drop dead?

That's like all those defense arguments in horrific murder cases...the defendant had a tough life, abused as a child, was on drugs, drunk, etc. So I guess only the happy healthy well-adjusted people should be responsible for blowing someone's brains out.

As for saving money for medical expenses, we could have saved a whole lot more and hung him more than 20 years ago.

Individuals can forgive. Governments should operate under the rule of law.

I do believe in forgiveness. I hope the families of the victims have been able to forgive this man, just for their own sakes, but being forgiven doesn't mean he shouldn't still have to face the consequences of his actions, nor should he be free to repeat his crime.

 

[Handbag Lady]

This makes me sick.

I'm quite angry at the poster who said this affected few. How old are you, anyway? I was a teenager and in the air over England when this happened. Do you have any idea what that was like? MANY Americans were distressed and angered over this. It sent a shock wave around the world that this could have happened as it did.

He should rot the rest of his life in jail. I'm embarrassed for any of my Scottish friends who think I'll think less of them. I won't, not of them, but of their government, yes.

People here speak of compassion and forgiveness. He had none of either of those two human elements to do what he did. Try and imagine being ON that plane. Try and imagine being a family member of one of them.

But still, we can show him compassion and forgiveness to him. We're above that need to kill, right? He should have been left in jail to suffer his natural consequences and to pay out his sentence. I would gladly pay taxes to keep him there until he dies to face his maker.

There is NO reason to let him go just because he took ill. Life in prison is just that. I can't understand why to show him compassion and forgiveness should equal his release. Unless, you agree with the terrorists, that is.

Someone here really thinks letting him go and following him will get answers? You are not thinking clearly. He will inspire future terrorists and he'll become a celebrity. Look at who sent his plane for starters! I don't see the U.S. government or ANY one else doing anything about him, what on EARTH makes you think further following is going to amount to anything?

He did not earn the right to be able to spend his dying days with family and to be up for martyrdom, and he will be honored back home.

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

Your posts are all insults and no meat. I will endeavor to no longer read them, but I'm really bad at ignoring such things.

Don'tcha hate it when I'm right?

Really, just put me on ignore if it upsets you that much.

 

[dismom2]

I'm sure the release was politically motivated more than anything.

Why on earth would anyone welcome him home in a 'festive' manner when they guy killed so many people? Sick and twisted people.

More importantly, if he can be realeased because he is dying, can't anybody else who is in the same situation be granted the same luxury? If not, why him? (unless for political reasons). Will all the dying prisoners now waste the publics money, and the court's time, trying to use this same clause to get out of serving their sentences?

 

[BelleWDW]

So, let me see if I understand. If a prisoner is sentenced to life in prison, but gets sick and is going to die, he should therefore receive a compassionate release. Then what prisoners serving life in prison actually SERVE "Life in Prison"? Just the "healthy" ones, who suddenly drop dead?

:That is so true. In America, do dying prisoners get released to their family?

 

[PinkRhombus]

I wasn't aware you had someone on the plane that was blown up in 1988. I'm sorry to hear that.

My sentiment about forgiveness remains, however. It's a lesson Jesus taught that people who say they are followers can't seem to grasp.

It's about showing compassion and forgiveness to those that ask for it and feel bad about their actions.

Nowhere did he say to enable those to set out to destroy human life.

 

[kirbsam]

And you are making your own assumptions by accusing me of trying to stir things up. This should go without saying but I'm going to say it anyway: I'm not in any way, shape or form trying to "stir things up".

I have a differing opinion from the OP on what the Scottish Government did today. I am of the group who heartily applauds the Scottish Government's behavior. I explained my reasons for why I feel the way I do. I even apologized to someone who implied that she had relatives "slaughtered" by the man who was allowed to go home to die.

If you have a problem with my stance on this situation, then all I can say is that the problem is yours; not mine.

invoking jesus in this debate did stir things up. so yes i believe that you were trying to do that. if you just give your opinion then, i agree, that is not stirring things up.

 

[aprilgail2]

:That is so true. In America, do dying prisoners get released to their family?

I don't even think John Gotti was allowed out of prison when he was dying was he??

 

[#1MMFan]

Regarding "life sentences", I don't think in either of our countries - UK or US - does that necessarily equate to full life as opposed to say 20 yrs. I could be wrong but over here life is not "until death". I know how stupid that sounds - I don't understand the logic behind it either. There are lots of unanswered questions about how he managed this all alone, and whilst it may make people feel better to have the man die in prison (which I understand and am in two minds about myself) I think the better person rises above that and accepts that neither keeping the man in prison nor letting him go is going to bring back the poor victims. And it is a specific situation where he has a terminal condition. I can honestly see both sides to the pros and cons of releasing the guy - I don't think there is a right answer overall, but we don't do the death penalty over here and to be honest overall I'd rather be the person who showed compassion and rose above him and his values (or lack thereof) as opposed to the person who wanted simple animalistic revenge. I know of people personally who had bits of bodies come through their roofs of their houses in Lockerbie and believe me it affected Scotland as much as anyone else. A horrific crime but he'll answer to his God soon enough.

 

[Handbag Lady]

Regarding "life sentences", I don't think in either of our countries - UK or US - does that necessarily equate to full life as opposed to say 20 yrs. I could be wrong but over here life is not "until death". I know how stupid that sounds - I don't understand the logic behind it either. There are lots of unanswered questions about how he managed this all alone, and whilst it may make people feel better to have the man die in prison (which I understand and am in two minds about myself) I think the better person rises above that and accepts that neither keeping the man in prison nor letting him go is going to bring back the poor victims. And it is a specific situation where he has a terminal condition. I can honestly see both sides to the pros and cons of releasing the guy - I don't think there is a right answer overall, but we don't do the death penalty over here and to be honest overall I'd rather be the person who showed compassion and rose above him and his values (or lack thereof) as opposed to the person who wanted simple animalistic revenge. I know of people personally who had bits of bodies come through their roofs of their houses in Lockerbie and believe me it affected Scotland as much as anyone else. A horrific crime but he'll answer to his God soon enough.

But is being the "better person" excuse to let this man out and cause hurt and harm to the victims' families, as well as sealing the future of other terrorists who will be inspired by his release?

Again, we normally don't let out people who are in for life just because they have a terminal illness. It isn't revenge as to why I want him kept in prison, it is to protect others by his possible actions or those actions he creates in others.

 

[lillygator]

But is being the "better person" excuse to let this man out and cause hurt and harm to the victims' families, as well as sealing the future of other terrorists who will be inspired by his release?
Again, we normally don't let out people who are in for life just because they have a terminal illness. It isn't revenge as to why I want him kept in prison, it is to protect others by his possible actions or those actions he creates in others.

nope......there is no better person here....just stupidity that let him loose.

 

[Took]

well heck, let's let all the dying prisoners go FREE!!

Actually, I think the "compassionate" stuff was just spin on the Scots' part. I do think prisoners are let out when they're dying fairly frequently so that the justice system doesn't have to pay for their health care. My mom worked as an accountant in a prison, and she said the medical bills on prisoners could often be VERY high. Thus, the system "frees" them when the prisoner is so sick that he or she is a) not a danger to anyone and b) would otherwise cost taxpayers a great deal of money.

I'm not justifying the action, just explaining that I don't think mushy "compassion" (however noble the sentiment) is at the root of the decision.

took

 

[rie'smom]

Mohandas K. Gandhi:
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.

Forgiveness is one thing, outrage another. Ghandi was outraged plenty of times. His outrage that the Indian community had to struggle for civil rights in their own country brought about his protests.
We are outraged that a mass murderer has been set free for compassionate reasons.
If we catch Osama, let's kiss his hand and let him tip toe through the poppies.

Exactly. Someone caused you pain, you forgave them. You found out how good that feels when you do that.

The mad bomber of Scotland, however, commited an act over 20 years ago that didn't impact the vast majority of the posters on this board nor the vast majority of people in America. Yet I'm seeing all sorts of anger, hatred, righteous indignation and desire to commit vehement atrocities on this total stranger who, before today, most people couldn't pick out of a crowd even if they wanted to.

Our friend in Scotland has the ability to do the most: she can write her representatives and let them know how she feels. Her behavior will have an impact; her representative won't get her vote. The rest of us can do nothing that will have any kind of an impact except on ourselves and those around us.

Getting mad won't bring that mad bomber back to prison. It only adds to the upcoming heart disease of the emotive person (and those who choose to stay around him or her).

However since that time we had an incident called 911. This horror has helped us to empathize with those who lose loved ones to terrorists. So his release and his crime has had an impact on anyone who was moved by the tragedy of 911.

Khadaffi sent his personal plane to pick him up; most rational people can extrapolate from there.

key phrase

Regarding "life sentences", I don't think in either of our countries - UK or US - does that necessarily equate to full life as opposed to say 20 yrs.

In some states a life sentence is for life until death. I'm happy to live in one of them.

 

[#1MMFan]

Actually, I think the "compassionate" stuff was just spin on the Scots' part. I do think prisoners are let out when they're dying fairly frequently so that the justice system doesn't have to pay for their health care. My mom worked as an accountant in a prison, and she said the medical bills on prisoners could often be VERY high. Thus, the system "frees" them when the prisoner is so sick that he or she is a) not a danger to anyone and b) would otherwise cost taxpayers a great deal of money.

I'm not justifying the action, just explaining that I don't think mushy "compassion" (however noble the sentiment) is at the root of the decision.

took

Well, no, actually, we are paying for this bloke's healthcare regardless of whether he is in prison or not. Remember that our taxes pay the health service and it doesn't matter whether he's in prison or in the community. And I think they said that only 23 people had been released in our country on compassionate grounds, full-stop, so that sounds a very small proportion of people in prison. At the end of the day, if it's the law here, it's the law here and whilst you might disagree with it (and I'm not brilliantly happy about it either), I wouldn't be too happy if he was allowed to just be electrocuted or gassed in the States but I'd have to accept it as capital punishment is the law in your country. Not every terrorist is terminally ill and suddenly going to be compassionately released but to say it's simply due to cost is frankly illogical given we've been keeping this chap for several years and already paying for his cancer care - his last 3 months of life is hardly likely to dent our budget too much versus the rest of the money spent on keeping him already. There also seems to be serious concerns about the safety of his conviction in the first place which is glossed over on this forum. I don't know the specifics but it's quite clear that the people affected by the tragedy in the UK are in two minds as to his guilt.

 

[Disneyadore]

Maybe we should wait with this discussion until he really dies.

I would not be surprised if he recovered magical and lives happily ever after.

 

[lacrosse_lady72]

I am a very forgiving person but something like this... not so much. He should have died behind bars alone.

 

[honugirl]

He should have been left in prison to die, not flown home to be with his family. No one on that plane had a chance to say goodbye to their families. He'll get pain killers and other palliative care, when who knows what pain the victims of his bomb went through before they died. This is too good for him. Some people should never be forgiven. Especially when they commit completely heinous acts and will go on to be a martyr and possibly fuel other terrorist acts.

 

[Tinker74]

I wasn't aware you had someone on the plane that was blown up in 1988. I'm sorry to hear that.

My sentiment about forgiveness remains, however. It's a lesson Jesus taught that people who say they are followers can't seem to grasp.

OK...lets open up all the prisons and let out all the murdereres and rapists...after all we should "forgive them"

 

[Tinker74]

And you are making your own assumptions by accusing me of trying to stir things up. This should go without saying but I'm going to say it anyway: I'm not in any way, shape or form trying to "stir things up".

I have a differing opinion from the OP on what the Scottish Government did today. I am of the group who heartily applauds the Scottish Government's behavior. I explained my reasons for why I feel the way I do. I even apologized to someone who implied that she had relatives "slaughtered" by the man who was allowed to go home to die.

If you have a problem with my stance on this situation, then all I can say is that the problem is yours; not mine.

She DID NOT imply that a relative died in the bombing...You are just trying to stir...we can ALL SEE IT.

 

[Tinker74]

Thanks for the link.

(All will note that the story was written nearly an hour after KJJ's post.)

Well all can note that it was ALL OVER our news here in the UK about the heroes welcome long before KJJs post.!!!

Not sure what you were trying to imply.