Are they kidding???

[snapppyd]

• The Manson girl was not serving in a Scotish prison.
• Someone posted that Scotland already has oil.

Just making a comparison. We have oil too, but not enough, right?

 

[Tartan Tigger]

that.

I am shocked and appalled at this state of affairs. It's not like he killed 1 person either. This was an airplane full of innocent people going home for the holidays. He served only 8 years of prison time and well he is terminally ill, let him be home with his family. I will never go to Scotland. You will never EVER get a penny of my money for what you have just done.

There were also 11 innocent people sitting in their homes who were killed when part of the plane landed on them! My uncle was invloved in the recovery process, finding body parts in trees etc, absolutely horrific stuff, he has never flown since.
It was Kenny McAskill who made the decision NOT the people of Scotland. One man made the decision not the country so please don't tar us all with the same brush. Personally, I don't know anyone who agrees with his release.

 

[DWGal210]

There were also 11 innocent people sitting in their homes who were killed when part of the plane landed on them! My uncle was invloved in the recovery process, finding body parts in trees etc, absolutely horrific stuff, he has never flown since.
It was Kenny McAskill who made the decision NOT the people of Scotland. One man made the decision not the country so please don't tar us all with the same brush. Personally, I don't know anyone who agrees with his release.

I'm so sorry your uncle had to be part of this tragedy....so terrible.

I once saw an interview with this woman who lived in Lockerbie. She said there were bodies all over their town for days, just lying there until they could be processed for evidence and what not. She said there was a young man lying in front of their house, and she finally asked if she could cover up his body. I thought about her when I heard they were releasing that creep.

In that same story, they also talked about how the doctors felt that some of the passengers could have been awake during the crash. I guess in the part of the plane that didn't get the full impact, they would have gone unconscious due to the opening in the plane and the air rushing out, but as the plane descended, it was their thought that some passengers could have woken up in the midst of that tragedy as they got oxegyn for that brief time. I can't even imagine.

I say these things not to add a sensational element to this thread, but more to illustrate how horrific I think it was that they let this monster go.

 

[KatieG73]

I actually feel quite sick reading some of the posts and the glib comments about Sotland (about child molesters being freed etc). I'm Scottish and am horrified by the way this whole episode has been handled and seeing the 'heroes' welcome just made me sick to my stomach.

Please do not tar all Scottish people with the same brush -I don't know anyone who agrees with this decision. Reading between the lines there has been murmurings that the conviction was 'unsafe' doesn't mean he wasn't guilty - I think there is more to this than meets the eye and it's a poor reflection on how thie whole trial was handled. As a nation we are tough on crime and this is NOT a popular decision - a decision I think will cost the current government dearly.

I understand that feelings are high but one man's decison is not the voice of a whole nation.

 

[rie'smom]

There were also 11 innocent people sitting in their homes who were killed when part of the plane landed on them! My uncle was invloved in the recovery process, finding body parts in trees etc, absolutely horrific stuff, he has never flown since.
It was Kenny McAskill who made the decision NOT the people of Scotland. One man made the decision not the country so please don't tar us all with the same brush. Personally, I don't know anyone who agrees with his release.

I'm sorry your uncle had to deal with that tragic scene.

I actually feel quite sick reading some of the posts and the glib comments about Sotland (about child molesters being freed etc). I'm Scottish and am horrified by the way this whole episode has been handled and seeing the 'heroes' welcome just made me sick to my stomach.

Please do not tar all Scottish people with the same brush -I don't know anyone who agrees with this decision. Reading between the lines there has been murmurings that the conviction was 'unsafe' doesn't mean he wasn't guilty - I think there is more to this than meets the eye and it's a poor reflection on how thie whole trial was handled. As a nation we are tough on crime and this is NOT a popular decision - a decision I think will cost the current government dearly.

I understand that feelings are high but one man's decison is not the voice of a whole nation.

To both of you, first I made the molester comment and if it offended you, I'm sorry. I did not mean at all anything about the Scottish people. It was aimed at Kenny McAskill. My family is from Scotland and I'm very proud of that.

Don't forget we in the US certainly don't want to be tarred with the same brush as some of our politicians, both past and present either. They do stupid things too.

 

[KatieG73]

rie'smom - I'm probably feeling a bit over sensitive! Apologies if I made you feel uncomfortable. I would just hate to think that people overseas thought that the average Scottish person was ok with this decision.

I have enjoyed so many wonderful holidays to the US ( Florida of course!) and would hate to think that anyone would be reluctant to come to Scotland over this.

It's definately a 'hot' topic and one which I am sure will be debated for a long time. Definately not Scotland's proudest moment.

 

[laurie31]

Don't forget we in the US certainly don't want to be tarred with the same brush as some of our politicians, both past and present either. They do stupid things too.

Exactly. I have had the pleasure of visiting the beautiful country of Scotland twice, and found its people gracious and warm. I would love to go back, and I'm sure I will one day, when life permits.

As for the tenuous topic of forgiveness, what I got out of the "let him die in prison" posts (mine included) was the idea that prison is about *protecting society* from dangerous criminals. Forgiveness or no forgiveness, terminally ill or not, I am horrified to think anyone thought it was okay to let him go free. What I feel is not hatred but indignation, and honestly a bit of fear. I *was* affected by this man's actions, although certainly not to the extent of anyone who lost a loved one, or those who had to live with a victim's body in view for days , but it was like 9-11 - a horrible feeling of vulnerability and the senselessness of so much death, for no reason. Totally innocent people slaughtered in a heinous manner. I can still remember my Daddy holding me when we first heard the news, thinking how it could have been MY plane. I almost felt something like survivor's guilt. The kids on that plane were no different than me and my friends. Why was it them and not us?

We're going to Italy next year. I do not intend to cancel, but dang, it makes me nervous to think this guy could be out there right now, inspiring the next generation of mass murderers.

 

[rie'smom]

rie'smom - I'm probably feeling a bit over sensitive! Apologies if I made you feel uncomfortable. I would just hate to think that people overseas thought that the average Scottish person was ok with this decision.

I have enjoyed so many wonderful holidays to the US ( Florida of course!) and would hate to think that anyone would be reluctant to come to Scotland over this.

It's definately a 'hot' topic and one which I am sure will be debated for a long time. Definately not Scotland's proudest moment.

No worries! In fact, my husband and I are planning to go to England and Scotland w/in the next year or two. I can't wait to see Scotland as I've heard stories of the first in our family to emigrate from there my whole life! He lived in Isle of Skye, Inverness, Scotland, and left to come to America from there.

 

[BeachGirlFLA]

It's absolutely wrong for someone like him to be shown "compassion." As one of the relatives that I heard interviewed yesterday said "isn't compassion supposed to come immediately after an apology. This man has never apologized or shown any remorse."
I mentioned this on another thread earlier this week but when I was in middle school, one of my friends had a sister who was supposed to be on this flight but missed it because of being delayed in pre-boarding procedures. She was finishing her semester abroad and flying back for Christmas. That family got extremely lucky/blessed but so many families didn't. He served 11 days in prison per victim, which is absolutely outrageous. The only thing I can think of that is good about this is that he probably won't get the best care in a country like Libya and according to everything I've heard, it's not exactly the best place to go for palliative care.
For the Scottish on the thread, I do not blame the Scottish people at all....the Scottish government, yes but not Scottish individuals.

 

[islandmum]

You go ahead and be embarassed. I'm of Scottish descent and applaud the compassion they showed even in the face of someone who showed no compassion.

Isn't this what Jesus taught, after all?

what a embarrasingly pious post.

You seriously think ANY of this was "out of compassion"?? ..... I suggest you do a little more reading up on the reality of the world and its politics and discover that this was a hugely political move, unobstructed by (e.g. supported) by the British government who are extremely keen and eager to ingratiate themselves with Libya for amongst other things a vast wealth of oil.

They need good old Ghadaffi to play ball with them, this was a fairly easy way to push that further along.

BTW the bible also teaches an eye for an eye - I find people who quote the bible very selective in which bits they want to use as and when.

Forgive all you like, many people do, but we should also see justice served - which was not in this case.

It doesnt make you a better person because you can forgive.

I suggest you get cracking on the PC and read online UK papers like Daily Mail, Guardian, Daily Telegraph where you can read more in depth on this issue (heros welcome, political motivation etc..) rather than the very brief details the US media has released.

BTW I forgive you for making such a ridiculous post.

I was born in Scotland and as yet am yet to hear any views supporting this from ANY scottish person in the press - apart from the dip**** politician!

 

[ajanvrin101]

I've been upset about this all morning. Agreed that he showed no compassion, so why does he deserve even the slightest bit himself? If it were up to me, he'd be in prison until he took his last breath, which would be a far better death than those he caused.

agreed

 

[Mickeyistheman]

I meant no ill will towards the people of Scotland, however if someone in my government would have done the same thing. I would no longer want to be a citizen, that is just my opinion. I had several friends and family members die on September 11th so I have certain feelings in regard to letting a man such as this go because he is terminally ill.

I would hope that the people of Scotland would be just as outraged as those of us on here.

I just pray that this man does not go into remission because then all bets are off and now those of us who will be traveling anywhere will be thinking in the back of our heads.....will it happen again?

It is such a shame.

 

[honugirl]

He caused more emotional grief than physical pain. I was listening to a radio show yesterday that was recapping what was realized--the pilots needed at least 5 seconds to get oxygen masks on if they did it quickly. When they were found--there was no evidence of any attempt to get the masks. The bomb was too quick and too damaging.

No one was there so we have no idea what physical pain those people were in and if they were in pain, even one millisecond is too long. Emotional pain is no less devastating than physical pain, in fact it generally persists for longer and can be more of an issue.

As far as this forgiveness bit--one has to want to be forgiven truly be forgiven.

Forgiveness doesn't mean that you forget.

Forgiveness doesn't mean taking away accountability.

If I forgave my children for every little thing they do but not hold them accountable to their actions--what would they learn, really?

If someone wants to forgive him, more power to them, personally, I can't. I don't think he deserves it. I forgive people when they show remorse and he hasn't.

 

[islandmum]

He caused more emotional grief than physical pain. I was listening to a radio show yesterday that was recapping what was realized--the pilots needed at least 5 seconds to get oxygen masks on if they did it quickly. When they were found--there was no evidence of any attempt to get the masks. The bomb was too quick and too damaging.

.

incorrect I'm afraid - link to keep those happy who demand proof.

http://http://www.economicexpert.com/a/Lockerbie:bombing.htm

There were a number of passengers and crew who survived the bomb and were alive for the fall and indeed one was alive after hitting the ground but died in the arms of a Lockerbie resident.

The pilots could not activate the airmasks as the cockpit seperated immediately from the fuselage and all the controls for such instruments were severed.

 

[DisMN]

incorrect I'm afraid - link to keep those happy who demand proof.

http://http://www.economicexpert.com/a/Lockerbie:bombing.htm

There were a number of passengers and crew who survived the bomb and were alive for the fall and indeed one was alive after hitting the ground but died in the arms of a Lockerbie resident.

The pilots could not activate the airmasks as the cockpit seperated immediately from the fuselage and all the controls for such instruments were severed.

Any clue why I can't get to your link? I'm interested in reading it. Thankyou.

 

[koima]

http://www.economicexpert.com/a/Lockerbie:bombing.htm

islandmum had the http part twice.

 

[crashbb]

Any clue why I can't get to your link? I'm interested in reading it. Thankyou.

There's an extra "http://", just delete one.

 

[DisMN]

Ahhh Thankyou!!

 

[Aisling]

They compassionately sent that man home to a hero's welcome.

Scotland should have kept him in prison and used their compassion to give him a clean bed to die in. That's all. He premeditatedly bombed down an airplane and he killed over 200 innocent people. They didn't have a choice of where they would die.

 

[Aisling]

If someone wants to forgive him, more power to them, personally, I can't. I don't think he deserves it. I forgive people when they show remorse and he hasn't.

I can forgive him, but he still shouldn't be released.