Are the Days of Walking a DVC Reservation Numbered?

[dvcsince93]

Perhaps it was just instilled at me at a very young age growing up in Texas in the 80s and 90s that life is just not fair and is never going to be fair.

Some kids have more money, some are smarter, some are more athletic, some are better looking, some can sing better…. We have to be OK taking whatever we are were given and maximize our opportunity the best we can….

So if I buy a very strategic Use Year based on my projected travel patterns and own enough points to book out a long period of time and am willing to log into the system regularly to keep that room then I am rewarded for my planning and efforts

This is a poster who is complaining that they can’t book a standard view room when there are other view types of the same room category available. I’m sorry, I just don’t have any sympathy there.

I would be more understanding if they wanted an Ocean or Boardwalk View or Theme Park view and the only thing available is Standard…. but it’s not…. they just think they should have the lease expensive option….

Really, you think someone who doesn't walk is entitled. Not sure if that is more sad or stupid.

Funny, but I have found in life that people who are so concerned about having the power to screw other people and feel superior over little things like disney vacations don't have any other way to feel superior.

 

[Tatebeck]

Yes but the underlying cause of why walking is an issue is that their are not enough rooms.

Do you think that you would see walking of rooms if they eliminated CL rooms and instead made CL services available fee based service?

I agree that there can be a lot of layers to it all and why I mentioned impact.

A one size fit all approach to stop a practice that has no impact on owners may not be the answer either.

Agree that one of the main reasons walking is an issue because there is more demand for certain rooms than there is supply. In normal supply and demand they would either raise the price for those rooms OR increase supply. But they are kind of stuck in that neither of those things are easily doable in the DVC system.

I'm not sure if the second line is very relevant as though. Of course demand for a room would go down if you removed popular parts of it. I don't think people would walk Standard BWV Studios if you removed the bathroom and beds from the room, made them use the public bathrooms, and made them sleep out on the lawn. But owners that wanted to walk would just switch to the next cheapest room that they liked.

 

[DanCali]

Why shouldn't we expect that all owners have the same chance at a room on a given week?

But they do have the same chance...

Some choose to walk and some choose not to. For those who don't, it's a choice - not a handicap imposed on them by anyone.

If you eliminate walking completely, and eliminate modifying reservations completely, some will then have a problem with younger people always clicking faster at 8am than older people and will also demand a change. Where do you draw the line? It's the same rules for everyone....

 

[tx911]

This is a poster who is complaining that they can’t book a standard view room when there are other view types of the same room category available. I’m sorry, I just don’t have any sympathy there.

I would be more understanding if they wanted an Ocean or Boardwalk View or Theme Park view and the only thing available is Standard…. but it’s not…. they just think they should have the least expensive option….

I don't think anyone expects to be guaranteed a specific room type at 11 months every time they want it.

What I do expect is to have the same chance of scoring the room I want as every other owner. A portion of the ownership pool walking destroys that equal footing. And "everyone walk" is obviously not an answer.

There are only 2 ways every owner is on equal footing at 11 months. Everyone walking, or no one walking.

 

[tx911]

But they do have the same chance...

Some choose to walk and some choose not to. For those who don't, it's a choice - not a handicap imposed on them by anyone.

No they don't. Only if EVERYONE walks or NO ONE walks are we all on the same footing.

Anything in between confers an advantage on some owners at the expense of others. If you walk, you can't look me in the eye and say you honestly want everyone else to walk too. You don't.

If the owners don't do what is necessary for everyone to be on equal footing, then DVC has the option of taking steps themselves, which I don't want to see happen.

 

[lowlight]

This is a poster who is complaining that they can’t book a standard view room when there are other view types of the same room category available. I’m sorry, I just don’t have any sympathy there.

I would be more understanding if they wanted an Ocean or Boardwalk View or Theme Park view and the only thing available is Standard…. but it’s not…. they just think they should have the least expensive option….

Ok, now I get it- you are not arguing in good faith.

1) Never said I should be guaranteed the least expensive option.

2) My desired check in date is still 2 weeks away. The room categories have been walked since early November and will not open again until after week 48. It’s not that I won’t have a chance in two weeks when the 11 month date comes up, it’s also that nobody who hasn’t walked it for the last few weeks will either. An 11 month date was filled at 12.25 months.


You keep misrepresenting the facts, like it’s your job.

 

[Leight19]

Really, you think someone who doesn't walk is entitled. Not sure if that is more sad or stupid.

Funny, but I have found in life that people who are so concerned about having the power to screw other people and feel superior over little things like disney vacations don't have any other way to feel superior.

I really think you need to do some self reflection. In this thread alone I’ve seen you call people selfish, rude, immoral, cheaters, and now sad/stupid and losers over their strategy booking a vacation. What’s worse is you do this the whole time acting like you are the moral high ground as you belittle and demean others who you feel are beneath you for walking. The tone alone on your side of of the debate attacking walkers is enough for me to decide who I support in this debate.

 

[lowlight]

I must say however, that this string has shown me that unless DVC stops walking, then there is a subgroup of members that will do it no matter what. They know that walking gets around the 11 month window and they not only don't care, they like it.

I am curious what DVC will say about the problem when they see the attitude of these members.

If you are here long enough, you will see it’s the same group of people every time.

 

[AstroBlasters]

Ok, now I get it- you are not arguing in good faith.

1) Never said I should be guaranteed the least expensive option.

2) My desired check in date is still 2 weeks away. The room categories have been walked since early November and will not open again until after week 48. It’s not that I won’t have a chance in two weeks when the 11 month date comes up, it’s also that nobody who hasn’t walked it for the last few weeks will either. An 11 month date was filled at 12.25 months.


You keep misrepresenting the facts, like it’s your job.

1) Please show me where I ever typed that you were looking to be “guaranteed” anything. That word has a very specific regulatory meaning.

2) What was misrepresented? Are there not other view types of the same category of room available right now that you could book and then modify out? Could you then put in a waitlist for your more desired view type?

 

[AstroBlasters]

I really think you need to do some self reflection. In this thread alone I’ve seen you call people selfish, rude, immoral, cheaters, and now sad/stupid and losers over their strategy booking a vacation. What’s worse is you do this the whole time acting like you are the moral high ground as you belittle and demean others who you feel are beneath you for walking. The tone alone on your side of of the debate attacking walkers is enough for me to decide who I support in this debate.

Welcome to team freedom and flexibility, we are happy to have you.

 

[DanCali]

No they don't. Only if EVERYONE walks or NO ONE walks are we all on the same footing.

Anything in between confers an advantage on some owners at the expense of others. If you walk, you can't look me in the eye and say you honestly want everyone else to walk too. You don't.

If the owners don't do what is necessary for everyone to be on equal footing, then DVC has the option of taking steps themselves, which I don't want to see happen.

Owners will never all be on equal footing.... It's easy to find reasons to complain - for example:

** Some can't plan 11 months out, some can - should we open up 50% of the inventory at 9 months out to accommodate the former?
** Waking up at 8am on the east coast is easier than 5am on the West Coast - should we allocate inventory by place of residence? Leave some for west coasters to book at 8am PT?

Suppose you eliminate walking completely by allowing up to 28-night reservations at 11 months out, but you can't change the checkout date without canceling. Now an owner with 1500 points looking to book 7 nights will book 28 nights and then modify to 7 nights when the time comes. He's not on equal footing with someone who has just 200 points. So do we eliminate the ability to modify a reservation altogether because of that?

 

[Orsino]

How many points do you own?

I don't feel this is relevent, however I'm guessing the implication you are making is that I have a lot of points so that makes me biased.
I have enough points to stay in a 1 bedroom, one week a year; I don't feel that constitues a lot of points, certainly not enough to lord over other memberships. Also, these points are split into two memberships, so leveraging points into a bulk mini-walk is even less likely for me.

"Pay more, get more" isn't a biased position in my view. It is the expected modus operandi.

 

[Cyberc1978]

What’s the difference between me walking a room and someone booking ie 7 nights during the 11 month window but ultimately ends up changing reservation to 3 nights ie 90 days before checkin?

When walking I occupy a room but I return it a few days later when moving on. The same can be said for the person booking 7 nights but changing to 3 nights, but those nights aren’t returned until 90 days before checkin.

 

[Brian Noble]

No they don't. Only if EVERYONE walks or NO ONE walks are we all on the same footing.

I see it a little differently. Everyone can walk, so there is equal opportunity. Not everyone knows they can (or should) walk, and that's "less equal." But, deciding not to is just deciding not to.

I think things are a little different with the bots. Even if you know they exist, and would like to use one, you probably can't build it unless you happen to know someone who (a) has taken EECS 485 and (b) is looking for a side gig.

 

[Brian Noble]

(No, I am not looking for a side gig. At least, not that one.)

 

[tx911]

Owners will never all be on equal footing.... It's easy to find reasons to complain - for example:

** Some can't plan 11 months out, some can - should we open up 50% of the inventory at 9 months out to accommodate the former?
** Waking up at 8am on the east coast is easier than 5am on the West Coast - should we allocate inventory by place of residence? Leave some for west coasters to book at 8am PT?

Suppose you eliminate walking completely by allowing up to 28-night reservations at 11 months out, but you can't change the checkout date without canceling. Now an owner with 1500 points looking to book 7 nights will book 28 nights and them modify to 7 nights when the time comes. He's not on equal footing with someone who has just 200 points. So do we eliminate the ability to modify a reservation altogether because of that?

You are equating involuntary limitations with the conscious choice to pervert the intended use of the membership for personal gain.

 

[tx911]

I see it a little differently. Everyone can walk, so there is equal opportunity. Not everyone knows they can (or should) walk, and that's "less equal." But, deciding not to is just deciding not to.

I think things are a little different with the bots. Even if you know they exist, and would like to use one, you probably can't build it unless you happen to know someone who (a) has taken EECS 485 and (b) is looking for a side gig.

I agree on the equal opportunity part.

It is still true that only if all walk or none walk does the system actually provide equal footing when booking.

 

[Tatebeck]

What’s the difference between me walking a room and someone booking ie 7 nights during the 11 month window but ultimately ends up changing reservation to 3 nights ie 90 days before checkin?

When walking I occupy a room but I return it a few days later when moving on. The same can be said for the person booking 7 nights but changing to 3 nights, but those nights aren’t returned until 90 days before checkin.

In "walking" the way most members are talking about it they are aiming for a date much further out than the 11 month window and using the system in a way that is not intended, that allows them to get that reservation guaranteed before the 11 month booking window has opened for those dates.

In a normal change for a reservation, nothing has been attempted to get a check in date for a room outside of the 11 month window at any time.

One is an attempt to skirt the 11 month booking window, one is not.

 

[Tatebeck]

I see it a little differently. Everyone can walk, so there is equal opportunity. Not everyone knows they can (or should) walk, and that's "less equal." But, deciding not to is just deciding not to.

I think things are a little different with the bots. Even if you know they exist, and would like to use one, you probably can't build it unless you happen to know someone who (a) has taken EECS 485 and (b) is looking for a side gig.

Another argument can be made that even if all members are ABLE to walk, and even if you still see that as a 100% equal playing field, the act of walking itself has moved the point of competition for those rooms at a point other than the 11 month window, which could be considered as going against the "FCFC at 11 months" that the rules describe.

 

[Wedgeout]

The current booking is in my opinion “fair”. But then All’s Fair in Love and War too. We are on equal booking opportunities. Just a frustrating way to have to do it. Do I like “walking”? No. Have I or will I? Yes. Would I have still got it if I didn’t? Most likely yes. For me it was supply and demand with nervousness not getting the family vacation as desired. Last time I walked was VDH two bedroom for October dates. Home resort, not all declared yet. Only 20 of them total in the tower. Availability was fluctuating a week out from trip dates that 11 month prior. I had opportunity to book it early and walked three times for my 5 night reservation. Don’t think anyone does it to hurt any other member. I’d rather keep the equal opportunities we have now to book if whatever they decide to do alters that.