Are the Days of Walking a DVC Reservation Numbered?

[Genie+]

If you put a lottery on everything currently being walked to noticeable degree… that’s gonna be alot of lotteries And people will groan at 5 days.

What is a reasonable amount of flexibility for an 11m check-in day? Seriously, how many times might an owner find they need to move it while still 10+ months out? Maybe make it that you can move check-in day all you want +/-7 days but day 8 will block you and any change further than that requires re-entering the system.

There’s already a large array of resorts with rooms/dates walked. If Commercial Renting is curtailed, that won’t change the minds of walkers. They’re not going to jeopardize their booking if walking is still an option. The problem is walking only begets more walking, and more walking. It snowballs. Whatever else is adjusted, if walking is still an option, the activity will only go in one direction - increasing.

 

[jennypenny]

Yes, they can but they have to account for owners who actually go on trips for more than 7 days.

The 7 day limit would impact those owners if no modifications were allowed.

This type of change would have to have something in it to address that.

Couldn't they book multiple trips and then have MS combine them? As long as MS is willing to do that at 10 months I think it could work.

 

[Genie+]

A big issue is that even if walkers are moving and some of the days reopen, it’s more of a pita trying to deal with that than just becoming a walker yourself.

 

[Sandisw]

Couldn't they book multiple trips and then have MS combine them? As long as MS is willing to do that at 10 months I think it could work.

Yes, but then they risk not getting their entire trip. You get your first 7 and then when the window opens for the next days, you get shut out.

I don’t think DVC will do that. But, they could change the plus 7 to be plus 10, etc. ir whatever would capture the average size of most owners trips.

 

[Genie+]

…you can move check-in day all you want +/-7 days but day 8 will block you and any change further than that requires re-entering the system.

This allows for up to a 14 day trip by holding Day 1 at 11 months, totally secure.

 

[Sandisw]

A big issue is that even if walkers are moving and some of the days reopen, it’s more of a pita trying to deal with that than just becoming a walker yourself.

Very true…but is that better or worse than finding out you need to adjust a trip later on and you are locked out of doing that because of the limitations of modifications?

Hence why DVC stated they are open to changing the rules but carefully evaluating the impact of those changes.

 

[jennypenny]

Maybe change the 11 month rules to limit modifications but allow for 14 days, and then revert back to original rules at 10 months.

A pain, I know, but I'm over trying to walk reservations lol.

 

[Sandisw]

If you put a lottery on everything currently being walked to noticeable degree… that’s gonna be alot of lotteries And people will groan at 5 days.

What is a reasonable amount of flexibility for an 11m check-in day? Seriously, how many times might an owner find they need to move it while still 10+ months out? Maybe make it that you can move check-in day all you want +/-7 days but day 8 will block you and any change further than that requires re-entering the system.

There’s already a large array of resorts with rooms/dates walked. If Commercial Renting is curtailed, that won’t change the minds of walkers. They’re not going to jeopardize their booking if walking is still an option. The problem is walking only begets more walking, and more walking. It snowballs. Whatever else is adjusted, if walking is still an option, the activity will only go in one direction - increasing.

Remember, the board stated this practice is not common…so they are coming from that mindset when it comes to walking…disconnect it from the commerical renting aspect.

So, how much of a change to do they want to make for something they don’t see at this time as happening in a large degree.

 

[Nabas]

A big issue is that even if walkers are moving and some of the days reopen, it’s more of a pita trying to deal with that than just becoming a walker yourself.

I’ve done this a few times. It’s not that difficult. You just book the days you want after the walker walks over them. It’s pretty easy to do most months.

And for the times it’s difficult to do (e.g. early December), there are going to be more DVC members wanting those dates then there are Studios available. Someone is going to be disappointed.

I love paying low points for my early December trips but have to acknowledge that it’s a popular time of year. Even after the most recent point reallocation, it’s still a lot easier to book August than December.

I don’t want Disney to change it, but I acknowledge that making the first 3 weeks in December more expensive and the last 3 weeks in August less expensive might be one way to better balance supply and demand.

And I’ve never liked the point allocation between Studios and One Bedrooms. Cash costs roughly 50% more but using points costs roughly 100% more. I don’t want this changed because I tend to use Studios, but it might make sense to reduce the point spread between Studios and One Bedrooms, at least at the DVC resorts with lots of One Bedrooms. Again, I don’t want this change but it might be fairer. It might do a better job of balancing supply and demand.

 

[Sandisw]

Maybe change the 11 month rules to limit modifications but allow for 14 days, and then revert back to original rules at 10 months.

A pain, I know, but I'm over trying to walk reservations lol.

I had that idea too…but some would say that your large point owners benefit because they can book a 14 day trip and hold it.

Curbs walking…but then you have owners holding dates for a month when they currently drop them quickly.

 

[Genie+]

Very true…but is that better or worse than finding out you need to adjust a trip later on and you are locked out of doing that because of the limitations of modifications?

Hence why DVC stated they are open to changing the rules but carefully evaluating the impact of those changes.

I get that about flexibility being very important. It’s one of the things that makes DVC different.

It looks like walking could be curtailed by a precision change just to check-in day for same room/date on 11 month booking. Nothing else touched. Just this one. How much flexibility is reasonably needed for this date? Some. But needing to push it past 30 days and still keeping priority seems unreasonable to me. I even think 14 days is within reason, because beyond that it is not an adjustment really.

 

[Genie+]

I’ve done this a few times. It’s not that difficult. You just book the days you want after the walker walks over them. It’s pretty easy to do most months.

You still have the risk days missing, then needing to keep coming back to stalk and possibly need to waitlist. Why not just start a walk instead and stay in total control. More simple. That is why walking is contagious.

 

[Nabas]

I had that idea too…but some would say that your large point owners benefit because they can book a 14 day trip and hold it.

Curbs walking…but then you have owners holding dates for a month when they currently drop them quickly.

Yeah, that’s one of my concerns with changing the booking tool.

I have yet to think of a scheme that is equally fair to all DVC owners.

But if Disney does nothing about walkers, then we are eventually going to reach a point where all rooms are walked year-round.

Right now, AKV-Value and AKV-Club are walked year-round. One of my other concerns is that this starts to happen for Jambo House Standard View rooms. (I think it already has started for some times of the year.) Jambo House rooms tend to be a lot more popular than Kidani Village rooms. The problem will only get worse if Disney does nothing.

Disney’s challenge is figuring out a way to eliminate walking without giving unfair advantages to some. Based on what they said at the meeting, I am encouraged that they are going to carefully consider “unintended consequences” before making a change.

 

[Sandisw]

You still have the risk days missing, then needing to keep coming back to stalk and possibly need to waitlist. Why not just start a walk instead and stay in total control. More simple. That is why walking is contagious.

And that is true, but every change is going to come with pitfalls and people will find a way around them.

That is why walking is done. It’s using the rules to their advantage. Prohibit one thing and people figure out how to achieve something else to their advantage.

And while I could live with this level of change, it means some hard to get rooms will be tied up for a full month until that large point owner drops them.

 

[robinb]

That's how the POS deals with high demand times. That's how Christmas week worked the first couple of years
Can we all agree it would be a terrible solution?
This is what I mean with: "beware what you wish for".

Word. it was an absolutely terrible solution.

I was an owner back when it was implemented. To make it even more fun, the lottery was open to everyone. Not just owners at the particular resorts. I was able to book BWV as an OKW owner and I loved it. The elimination of the lottery was the reason I bought into BWV because we got hooked on NYE at WDW.

As someone who plans 11 months in advance and almost exclusively books the villas in question (AKV Club, AKV Value, BWV Standard and BWV Boardwalk) this kind of change would be a complete game changer for me. It would completely handcuff me into a traditional type timeshare which is something I never wanted.

 

[Leight19]

And I’ve never liked the point allocation between Studios and One Bedrooms. Cash costs roughly 50% more but using points costs roughly 100% more. I don’t want this changed because I tend to use Studios, but it might make sense to reduce the point spread between Studios and One Bedrooms, at least at the DVC resorts with lots of One Bedrooms. Again, I don’t want this change but it might be fairer. It might do a better job of balancing supply and demand.

I know this is off topic but the one thing that gets me more worked up then walking is this delta between studios and 1BR. I’ve thought about this a ton and imo the issue comes down to the lock off premium.

My understanding is the lock off premium is designed to disincentive splitting the room and/or to cover the extra costs of cleaning the rooms. Since the walk off premium seems to be applied exclusively on the 1br side it actually leads to more 2BR being split because everyone goes for studios and then 1br has to be booked begrudgingly. What makes it worse is the extra points from this only lines dvc pockets since we always hit that 2% even for resorts without lockoff (poly)

I know it will never happen but I’ve often wondered how much better balanced studios and 1br would be if dvc just dropped the lock off premium to reduce cost of 1br for resorts without dedicated 1br (not sure they could do it with resorts that have dedicated 1br).

 

[Genie+]

And while I could live with this level of change, it means some hard to get rooms will be tied up for a full month until that large point owner drops them.

I’m unsure if that would make an outsized impact.

If we can move check-in day all we want +/-7 days but day 8 will block us and any change further than that requires re-entering the system, the large point owner can still only move their check-in one week forward (or back) and there’s no real advantage to booking extra weeks that one didn’t actually want.

 

[muppets3d]

I feel like no matter what they do some room types like the animal kingdom value rooms will always be difficult to book so a light touch is appreciated because it’s not worth inconveniencing everyone throughout the entire system just to make a few room types a little bit easier

 

[Leight19]

I feel like no matter what they do some room types like the animal kingdom value rooms will always be difficult to book so a light touch is appreciated because it’s not worth inconveniencing everyone throughout the entire system just to make a few room types a little bit easier

Pitching my idea again to solve by only allowing modifications going past 11month window to take place if at least one additional room is available in that category to book the 11 month date.

Since everyone has access to that additional room the modifier has no advantage over others trying exactly at 11 months. It would not impact any other type of modifications so no impact to flexibility outside this specific scenario. You can still book extended stays up to max length (30 days?) in this scenario for any room without inventory constraints. For those rooms with inventory limits it would be harder to get stays longer then 7 days but could argue if you want a 30 day stay in akv value it should be more difficult to book then 7 days there (and you still would have 7 days if you booked).

 

[Sandisw]

I’m unsure if that would make an outsized impact.

If we can move check-in day all we want +/-7 days but day 8 will block us and any change further than that requires re-entering the system, the large point owner can still only move their check-in one week forward (or back) and there’s no real advantage to booking extra weeks that one didn’t actually want.

Except I do not see DVC setting a rule that prevents trips more than 7 days…

There are a lot of owners who regularly stay more…the only reason that the plus 7 works now for those owners is that they can extend.

I think that would be a big roadblock and one I think will be part of any modification limits.

Increase it to 14 days and the net is wide enough to have minimal impact on those owners.

The theme of the statement by the board was impact and IMO, that will be the priority for any actual rule changes.

Keep going back to it but since they have a rule that covers the rooms most impacted by walking, it makes logical sense that is the route that could take…it would probably been seen as the path of least resistance.