Anyone here actually been DENIED pre-boarding on Southwest with children under 5?

[goofy4tink]

A few things here...
When we flew SW last August we all boarded as we were supposed to..yes, there were those 'preboarders' who felt it was okay to try and keep that middle seat open by sitting on either side so that no stranger would sit there, but the one thing that really frosted me was the woman who boarded at the very last minute. Now, I saw this woman, walking around the gate area for at least an hour or so before the flight departure time. I watched her walk away from the gate area about 10 minutes before they started boarding. She had a very young child with her, about 3 or so. So, we are all seated, and on hops this woman, all distraught because there are no seats together anymore. You have to realize that I was about 8th in the A line and when my dd and I boarded we ended up 2/3 of the way back in order to get a window/middle seat combination. So, there we sat, while the FA informed the group that there was a mother who needed to sit with her child...anyone want to change seats??? No response. So, FA tells us that the plane is not going to move away from the jetway until that mother and daughter are seated together!!! And of course, someone moved. But, why the heck couldn't this mother get on the plane when she was supposed to???

Same trip, but going home to Boston.....when we were waiting to board, the gate attendent made the announcement that there was a peanut allergic passenger on board...there would be no peanut product consumption of this flight.....could we all please help out and not eat any peanut products. And again the announcement was made when we were all boarded. So, hope this helps allay some of your fears due to the peanut allergy.

If you book SW, you should realize the manner in which you are boarded. People need to be informed. If sitting together is important to you, then checkin on-line. No printer? Don't sweat it....just ask for a dupe when you get to the airport. No computer? Have a buddy do it for you. I would think that most of us here have access to a computer, otherwise, we wouldn't 'be here'!!! Get to the airport early and have someone wait in the line. I wouldn't have one person wait and hold spots for 10 people though...the people behind you are going to be mighty miffed when those 10 people show up in front of them to board. I have heard here that a lot of people have A passes and don't even wait in the line. They just make themselves comfy and when the A line starts moving, they get at the end of the line and have no problems sitting together.

 

[ducklite]

And that is funny because? Well all the times I have flown on an airline other then SW, I have always had an assigned seat and have always been seated with my group, so I am not sure how accurate that statement is.

Not so much funny as ironic. And just because you've never been on a flight that the equipment changed and you lost your seats doesn't mean it won't ever happen. And frankly any child old enough to attend kindergarten without mommy there can spend a few hours on a flight with mommy a couple rows away. I think half the times it's not the child's "fear" but rather their parents nuerosis.

It's so funny how all I did was try and ease the original posters fears and somehow became the target of your moral advice, not that it has changed my opinion one bit .However, I won't take it personally because I have noticed that you seem to think you are ENTITLED to give unwanted advice alot

I am a realist. I don't live in the perfect little dreamworld of a lot of the pixie dusters on the Dis. I think people need to be prepared for the possibilities that things might not go as planned. Anyone who posts looking for advice needs to be able to take it, whether it's what they want to hear or not. And anyone who posts that they break rules on purpose because in their mind they are somehow entitled to do so needs to be able to take the heat or get out of the kitchen.

Go ahead flame away and claim perosnal attack, I could say that your post earlier about my child one day becoming a booze buying teenager was much more personal

I can run with the big dogs, no need to stay on the porch for this sista.

Anne

 

[tjmw2727]

And that is funny because? Well all the times I have flown on an airline other then SW, I have always had an assigned seat and have always been seated with my group, so I am not sure how accurate that statement is.
snip

Its accurate based on my personal experience as well.

Having flown 5-8 times a year for the past 10 years with my dd's sometimes as the solo adult I have had our seats changed more than not. Almost every time with AA, many times with Delta and once with Jet Blue. It almost seems the earlier you book the more likely you are to have your seats changed due to equipment changes and flight changes.

Even when my dd's were under 5 and the age was noted we often ended up scattered around the aircraft. Most times a call or a visit to the website was all it took to change seats but several times we were at the mercy of the gate agent or other passengers and belive me - they don't want to help you! Our best chance was when the gate agents could offer out the exit rows to others leaving their seats close together for us.

AA was the least helpful, delta was next and Jet Blue was always helpful.

For this reason I like the SWA boarding process because it puts the control and responsiblity on me. If I print out the boarding passes, arrive on time and line up I can assure that we seat together or at least close enough for my comfort.

I have flown twice now with my dd's and both times had no problems sitting with them.

TJ

 

[salmoneous]

OK--this is throwing me into a panic!

Don't worry about it. It would be virtually impossible for you to on end up sitting next to your kids for this flight. You should get to preboard, and if not you have your A passes, and if not, you're at the airport early to wait in line, and if not people will move. And on the one-in-a-zillion chance that every single thing that could possibly go wrong goes wrong, you just get on the next plane. +

 

[kaytieeldr]

And that is funny because? Well all the times I have flown on an airline other then SW, I have always had an assigned seat and have always been seated with my group, so I am not sure how accurate that statement is.

Simply because that's been your experience so far does not necessarily mean that will be your experience every time you fly in the future.

However, I won't take it personally because I have noticed that you seem to think you are ENTITLED to give unwanted advice alot

Giving unwanted advice - which could, however, be appreciated by others reading a thread, making it therefore not unwanted - is different from taking advantage of any firm's policy on anything simply because one is small for one's age.

Go ahead flame away and claim perosnal attack, I could say that your post earlier about my child one day becoming a booze buying teenager was much more personal

Fine - forgetting the booze-buying teen issue, ANY child being taught that a rule doesn't apply to them because it's not convenient or the person setting the example doesn't agree with the rule or doesn't think it should apply to them will likely grow up to be a teenager and then an adult who also feels rules they don't like don't apply to them. Children learn by example.

 

[Rai's Mommy]

Well, I must say that I agree that you should leave very early for a flight. However, Noone knows what the circumstances were concerning why the parent was late in the first place and I will say that had I been on the flight single or with another adult, I would have gladly moved to accomodate him. I really don't see what the big deal would have been.

I totally agree. It really bugs me to see the lack of common courtesy when someone doesn't have a legitimate reason for needing to stay in the seat that he/she is in. I understand those who have issues of being in confined spaces, etc., but there are plenty of people who have no serious reason to refuse and do anyway - like the many rude individuals I encounter daily on the MBTA subway who don't move a muscle in their seats when they see an elderly person, pregnant woman, or small child standing and trying desparately to keep his/her footing.

We are not talking about adults wanting to sit with other adults or even with older children here. We are talking about adults wanting to sit with kids who, e.g., likely wouldn't know what to do, where to go or who else to tell if they needed to use the bathroom.

I haven't ever personally had a problem with our seats on Southwest as I always print the A passes and arrive at the airport way early (usually the 1st one in the A line). Nevertheless, I have been on a plane where more than one child under 5 was separated from her parent. My last flight to Orlando there was a 5 year old who ended up sitting in the row with me and my dd while her mom sat 3 rows ahead. I made sure to keep my eye on her and let her mom know when she looked scared or uncomfortable but all I could think of is what would happen if there were an emergency. I've always found the instruction that you are to put your own oxygen mask on first in the event of an emergency and then assist children, while very sound, to be counter intuitive and have wondered how I would actually react under such circumstances - then having this other little one in my row I thought goodness, her poor mother doesn't even have the ability to make that choice - a stranger does. I really felt for the anxiety most of these separated parents must experience throughout the flight and would never have another person feeling that way if I could assist.

 

[Goobergal99]

I totally agree. It really bugs me to see the lack of common courtesy when someone doesn't have a legitimate reason for needing to stay in the seat that he/she is in. I understand those who have issues of being in confined spaces, etc., but there are plenty of people who have no serious reason to refuse and do anyway - like the many rude individuals I encounter daily on the MBTA subway who don't move a muscle in their seats when they see an elderly person, pregnant woman, or small child standing and trying desparately to keep his/her footing.

We are not talking about adults wanting to sit with other adults or even with older children here. We are talking about adults wanting to sit with kids who, e.g., likely wouldn't know what to do, where to go or who else to tell if they needed to use the bathroom.

I haven't ever personally had a problem with our seats on Southwest as I always print the A passes and arrive at the airport way early (usually the 1st one in the A line). Nevertheless, I have been on a plane where more than one child under 5 was separated from her parent. My last flight to Orlando there was a 5 year old who ended up sitting in the row with me and my dd while her mom sat 3 rows ahead. I made sure to keep my eye on her and let her mom know when she looked scared or uncomfortable but all I could think of is what would happen if there were an emergency. I've always found the instruction that you are to put your own oxygen mask on first in the event of an emergency and then assist children, while very sound, to be counter intuitive and have wondered how I would actually react under such circumstances - then having this other little one in my row I thought goodness, her poor mother doesn't even have the ability to make that choice - a stranger does. I really felt for the anxiety most of these separated parents must experience throughout the flight and would never have another person feeling that way if I could assist.

I am glad someone agrees with me.

Which reminds me of something, the FA never actually said all parents with children under 4 can board, she said "All parents with SMALL children may preboard" and my DD is small, so technically I wasn't lying.

 

[Goobergal99]

I haven't ever personally had a problem with our seats on Southwest as I always print the A passes and arrive at the airport way early (usually the 1st one in the A line). Nevertheless, I have been on a plane where more than one child under 5 was separated from her parent. My last flight to Orlando there was a 5 year old who ended up sitting in the row with me and my dd while her mom sat 3 rows ahead. I made sure to keep my eye on her and let her mom know when she looked scared or uncomfortable but all I could think of is what would happen if there were an emergency. I've always found the instruction that you are to put your own oxygen mask on first in the event of an emergency and then assist children, while very sound, to be counter intuitive and have wondered how I would actually react under such circumstances - then having this other little one in my row I thought goodness, her poor mother doesn't even have the ability to make that choice - a stranger does. I really felt for the anxiety most of these separated parents must experience throughout the flight and would never have another person feeling that way if I could assist.

This is exactly my point, and I think it is selfish for ppl not to move to accomodate families. I could care less what the argument is, We are talking about a child who feels comfortable being with a parent.

Sitting in school in a classroom with students and a teacher that a child already knows in a neighborhood the child is familiar with is way different then being on a 757 with strangers flying thousands of feet in the air. It is just plain rude not to move out of plain selfishness of not wanting to, hopefully that person will have Karma bite them right back.

 

[kaytieeldr]

but there are plenty of people who have no serious reason to refuse and do anyway - like the many rude individuals I encounter daily on the MBTA subway who don't move a muscle in their seats when they see an elderly person, pregnant woman, or small child standing and trying desparately to keep his/her footing.

I got on the Green Line once (a struggle in itself, given the relatively steep steps) and another disabled passenger actually "yelled" at other riders to get up and give me a seat! And one of those not-so-rare times when the T was busing between subway stops, a bus driver had to make people in the "please give this seat to an elderly/disabled person" seats get up so I could sit saying that the bus wasn't moving until I was seated. Doesn't matter anymore - I gave up on the T and now drive to work

I've always found the instruction that you are to put your own oxygen mask on first in the event of an emergency and then assist children, while very sound, to be counter intuitive and have wondered how I would actually react under such circumstances

You really HAVE to work in advance on convincing yourself to forget about counter-intuivity. Keeping in mind that you will probably NEVER have to actually work with the oxygen masks, you gotta remember YOU have to be able to breathe - and therefore be conscious and alert - before you can help anybody else.

Which reminds me of something, the FA never actually said all parents with children under 4 can board, she said "All parents with SMALL children may preboard" and my DD is small, so technically I wasn't lying.

If you have to couch such a comment with "technically", yeah, you were lying. By your reasoning, any parent traveling with a dwarf or midget child (two different conditions) can preboard with that child, even when the child is an adult.

It is just plain rude not to move out of plain selfishness of not wanting to, hopefully that person will have Karma bite them right back.

Interesting analysis. My world revolves around ME, not around any parent who feels they should be given special consideration because they have a child. As others have stated, checking in online and/or getting to the airport early, and boarding in a timely manner for the child's AGE makes this a non-issue.

 

[Goobergal99]

Interesting analysis. My world revolves around ME, not around any parent who feels they should be given special consideration because they have a child. As others have stated, checking in online and/or getting to the airport early, and boarding in a timely manner for the child's AGE makes this a non-issue.

Well since your world revolves around YOU then you shouldn't find it to be strange that a parent would want their world to revolve around their FAMILY
perhaps that mentality is exactly why ppl find loopholes in the 1st place.

 

[Marseeya]

Well since your world revolves around YOU then you shouldn't find it to be strange that a parent would want their world to revolve around their FAMILY
perhaps that mentality is exactly why ppl find loopholes in the 1st place.

You're just rationalizing your own stretching of the truth (i.e. lying). My DD is physically larger for her age, but mentally younger. So, how would it be fair that you can lie to get your DD in a seat next to you when mine is a big kid, but still with the mind of a little girl? I want to sit next to my daughter just as badly as anybody else, but I won't lie to make it happen.

My family comes first with me, but I still don't seek out "loopholes." I work within the system and follow the rules to make sure I can be accomodated, and if that wouldn't work, I'd find another method (like driving or taking a train).

What I find interesting is that I was reading about this very subject on a different forum (not sure where), and the people there were saying that the majority of the parents they saw who were raising a fuss about being next to their child wanted to switch from a sub par seat, like the middle, to an aisle seat. Never did they want to go from the good seat to the middle to be next to their kid.

 

[goofy4tink]

So, let me get this right...those of you that feel those of us that don't feel obligated to give up our seats are selfish and self-centered? We get to the airport early, we wait in the line, as we should in order to get seated with our family, but if you rush to the gate, 30 mins before departure time, with your 5 y/o, you should expect me to move away from my family so you can sit next to your young child? Nope, don't think so. Get there early, get in line like everyone else. Sorry if this sounds harsh, I really don't mean it to. But, it really is that simple. I always allotted more time when my dd was younger and wasn't able to move as quickly or as efficiently through the airport. Now, she's 12 and can 'keep up'. So, we don't leave quite as early. But, I have to tell you...if I were traveling with a wee little one, you can bet your bottom dollar that I would be at the gate very early, in that preboard line, so that I didn't take a chance in not sitting with my child.
You get there late, then you may have a problem. But just because you are traveling with a young child does not give you a 'fast pass' to the ability to sit with your family! Get there early and get in line. Print off that A boarding pass. Just don't expect me to not sit with my child after getting there early and waiting.

 

[ducklite]

This is exactly my point, and I think it is selfish for ppl not to move to accomodate families. I could care less what the argument is, We are talking about a child who feels comfortable being with a parent.

Sitting in school in a classroom with students and a teacher that a child already knows in a neighborhood the child is familiar with is way different then being on a 757 with strangers flying thousands of feet in the air. It is just plain rude not to move out of plain selfishness of not wanting to, hopefully that person will have Karma bite them right back.

I think it's selfish for people to think that the world revolves around them because they've got kids. And most kids don't know their teachers and every kid in their class when they start school.

Bottom line, get you and your kids to the airport early, checkin on line, get on the plane when it's time to board instead of waiting until the last minute, and TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOURSELF. That's really what it comes down to, personal responsibility.

If I book a ticket late and don't have a good choice of seats on a legacy, that's my problem. If I check in online with SW, get and A pass, get to the airport and in line two hours early, I take responsibility for myself. It's really selfish for someone to thien think that I should give up the seat that I've spent the time to get because they were lazy, stupid, or whatever and didn't do what was needed to accomodate the needs of them and their family. Their lack of planning is not my emergency.

Anne

 

[jodifla]

So, let me get this right...those of you that feel those of us that don't feel obligated to give up our seats are selfish and self-centered? We get to the airport early, we wait in the line, as we should in order to get seated with our family, but if you rush to the gate, 30 mins before departure time, with your 5 y/o, you should expect me to move away from my family so you can sit next to your young child? Nope, don't think so. Get there early, get in line like everyone else. Sorry if this sounds harsh, I really don't mean it to. But, it really is that simple. I always allotted more time when my dd was younger and wasn't able to move as quickly or as efficiently through the airport. Now, she's 12 and can 'keep up'. So, we don't leave quite as early. But, I have to tell you...if I were traveling with a wee little one, you can bet your bottom dollar that I would be at the gate very early, in that preboard line, so that I didn't take a chance in not sitting with my child.
You get there late, then you may have a problem. But just because you are traveling with a young child does not give you a 'fast pass' to the ability to sit with your family! Get there early and get in line. Print off that A boarding pass. Just don't expect me to not sit with my child after getting there early and waiting.

Anyone who doesn't move to let a small child sit next to a parent is selfish and self-centered, yes, IMO.

As previously stated, you don't know why they boarded late. Most likely, their previous flight was late, giving them NO CONTROL over when they got on the plane.

 

[Marseeya]

Anyone who doesn't move to let a small child sit next to a parent is selfish and self-centered, yes, IMO.

As previously stated, you don't know why they boarded late. Most likely, their previous flight was late, giving them NO CONTROL over when they got on the plane.

If it's so important to a parent that they sit by their small child, then they probably should be a bit more careful in choosing flights with layovers.

As for not knowing why they're boarding late, how do you know why the person doesn't want to give up their seat?

 

[ducklite]

Anyone who doesn't move to let a small child sit next to a parent is selfish and self-centered, yes, IMO.

As previously stated, you don't know why they boarded late. Most likely, their previous flight was late, giving them NO CONTROL over when they got on the plane.

Actually several people have talked about seeing families in teh boarding area who didn't board when preboarding was called, and then couldn't find seats together. Who's fault is that? And why should someone who's given up two hours of their life to wait in time be inconvenienced for them? Like I said, their lacking of planning is not my emergency.

It's called life, folks. Deal with it.

And like someone else pointed out, NW is now charging extra for preferred seats--aisles and seats in the front of the plane. After paying extra for a seat, there's no way someone should feel they ahve to give it up--for any reason.

Anne

 

[grlzmom]

I have to agree that no one should be made to give up their seat for whatever reason. It is their seat.

I am mom to seven (currently ages 16, 14, 11, 9, 4, 3 and 3) and we HAVE seen preboarding denied for people flying with children under five in Orlando several times in the past few years (we have also seen them change it to children 3 and under). I never fly Southwest (or any other airline for that matter) without at least some thought that we may not all get to sit together. I never assume there will be preboarding and ALWAYS get to the airport very early to get A passes or get them online ahead of time. There is no guarantee of sitting together. We have had people offer to switch with us (after all, there are some people who dont want to sit next to my three year olds and four year old), however, that is their option, their choice and not my expectation.

It does seem like the entire plane tries to preboard in Orlando, and perhaps if people werent attempting to sneak on children older than five the preboarding in Orlando wouldnt be such an issue. The preboard line with Southwest (in my opinion) has grown greatly in the past two years.

When we preboard, dh and I take the little three and the older girls all get in the A line. If I am flying without dh, myself and my oldest dd take the little three to preboard. We usually end up close together, but if not, it is no catastrophe.

I dont have any respect for someone abusing the system whether feigning disability or passing their child off as under five when they arent to preboard. Children learn by example and I am sure that a child older than five can hear the announcement when Southwest calls for families with children UNDER five to preboard.

You can put a spin on it or try to justify it any way you want, its still cheating the system, regardless of the circumstances.

 

[jodifla]

If it's so important to a parent that they sit by their small child, then they probably should be a bit more careful in choosing flights with layovers.

As for not knowing why they're boarding late, how do you know why the person doesn't want to give up their seat?

To me, it's a Golden Rule issue. (I would not expect a person with issues to move.)

As I've said in other posts, I left my aisle seat on a trans-Atlantic flight so a mom could sit next to her mom, because she had an infant with her. I switched to a MIDDLE SEAT because it was the right thing to do.

 

[jodifla]

Actually several people have talked about seeing families in teh boarding area who didn't board when preboarding was called, and then couldn't find seats together. Who's fault is that? And why should someone who's given up two hours of their life to wait in time be inconvenienced for them? Like I said, their lacking of planning is not my emergency.

It's called life, folks. Deal with it.

And like someone else pointed out, NW is now charging extra for preferred seats--aisles and seats in the front of the plane. After paying extra for a seat, there's no way someone should feel they ahve to give it up--for any reason.

Anne

I suspect people with small kids didn't board first because they were trying to run off excess energy of their little ones, limiting the time they spent on the confines of the plane. They probably didn't realize it would jeapordize their chance of sitting together. New parents sometimes make judgments in error like that.

 

[ducklite]

To me, it's a Golden Rule issue. (I would not expect a person with issues to move.)

As I've said in other posts, I left my aisle seat on a trans-Atlantic flight so a mom could sit next to her mom, because she had an infant with her. I switched to a MIDDLE SEAT because it was the right thing to do.

Nope. The RIGHT THING for them to do would have been to book a seat for the child to begin with, then it would have been a moot point.

Again, personal responsibility.

Anne