Anybody else have this grouping of dx?

ireland_nicole

<font color=green>No brainer- the fairy wins it<br
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
4,152
O.K., so I feel weird asking this, but I haven't been able to find anyone yet in TX, so I'm widening my search. My DD (8) was born at 28 wks, and currently has the DXs of RAD, ASD, Bipolar, ADHD, and dyspraxia. She also has IgA insufficiency, but that's not important right now. I'm mostly just curious to see if anyone else even has the majority of those. I know it's foolish, but it would be nice to know we're not completely alone. (I won't mention DS's dx's, that's a post for another time.) Thanks for putting up w/ me.:) Nicole
 
We've heard ASD, ADHD, CAPD, SID, anxiety, language delay. I thought I had most of the initials down, but I'm not sure what RAD is. My DS is 8 also.
 
Hey, not bad. RAD is Reactive Attachment Disorder (good times) she also has ODD (oppositional defiant). What is CISD?
Nicole
 

O.K., so I feel weird asking this, but I haven't been able to find anyone yet in TX, so I'm widening my search. My DD (8) was born at 28 wks, and currently has the DXs of RAD, ASD, Bipolar, ADHD, and dyspraxia. She also has IgA insufficiency, but that's not important right now. I'm mostly just curious to see if anyone else even has the majority of those. I know it's foolish, but it would be nice to know we're not completely alone. (I won't mention DS's dx's, that's a post for another time.) Thanks for putting up w/ me.:) Nicole

You're definitely not alone!

My ds9 has ASD (Aspergers), ADHD, RAD, ODD, Sensory Integration Dysfuction, Depressive Disorder NOS and possible FAE. I'm also guessing he's got CAPD going on too, but we haven't gone there yet. When we adopted him at age 6 we were his 5th, and final, family (and the 3rd for him in 3 months).

I, too, have other sons with multiple dx's. My ds14's (adopted at birth) are similar...ASD (Aspergers), ADHD, possible FAE and Sensory Integration Dysfunction. My ds10 (adopted at 7) is ADHD, possible FAE, PTSD and possible CAPD.

I love the vegetable soup we've got going on!
 
I can't tell you how much it means to me to hear from ya'll. It's always so confusing, b/c tx for one dx is often contraindicated by another, and talking to parents of kiddoes w/ only one of these dx, while still encouraging for everyone, still doesn't parallel my experience. I'd love to hear more from you, if you'd like, please feel free to PM me, and we can discuss more. I'm just so excited to know that there's another mom with similar daily challenges, and I'd love to find out what has/hasn't worked for you. LOL
Nicole
 
I can't tell you how much it means to me to hear from ya'll. It's always so confusing, b/c tx for one dx is often contraindicated by another, and talking to parents of kiddoes w/ only one of these dx, while still encouraging for everyone, still doesn't parallel my experience. I'd love to hear more from you, if you'd like, please feel free to PM me, and we can discuss more. I'm just so excited to know that there's another mom with similar daily challenges, and I'd love to find out what has/hasn't worked for you. LOL
Nicole

I'm sending a PM right away.

And to answer your question in an earlier post:

Oops, meant CAPD? Thanks

Central Auditory Processing Disorder
 
Oops, meant CAPD? Thanks

Cental auditory processing disorder = difficulty in processing sounds/words (not a hearing problem, but a processing problem)

We have to make sure to talk clearly and in short sentences for him to process what we say.

Basically after many evals and many of these different dx, one Dr. finally told us "He's on the autism spectrum. When you add up all these different dx, you end up with a child on the spectrum". Our son was overlooked for autism because he makes eye contact and didn't stare into space or flap, etc. So we just kept getting all these diff. dx trying to figure out what was really going on - why would he obsess over certain things, why was his tolerance to sound so low, why was it hard for him to socialize, etc. Of course the older he's gotten the more noticeable it is compared to a young child that is just immature and not really talking much yet.

Hang in there. We know what you're going through.
 
I tell people my dd has so many initials behind her name, she should be a Doctor:rotfl2: . She's been DX with RAD/ODD/ADD/ASD. She is now 11 and her DXs will continue to evolve and change as time goes on. Also depending on what profession the diagnosing Dr is, the Dx outcome may be different,
depending on whether it is a neurologist/pyschiatrist/or pyschologist.
And although the DX is needed to get services(in school and elsewhere) the most important thing in my opinion, is to get therapists or counselors that can help your particular child and circumstances.
Good Luck and you are not alone.

Mary ellen
 
I tell people my dd has so many initials behind her name, she should be a Doctor:rotfl2: . She's been DX with RAD/ODD/ADD/ASD. She is now 11 and her DXs will continue to evolve and change as time goes on. Also depending on what profession the diagnosing Dr is, the Dx outcome may be different,
depending on whether it is a neurologist/pyschiatrist/or pyschologist.
And although the DX is needed to get services(in school and elsewhere) the most important thing in my opinion, is to get therapists or counselors that can help your particular child and circumstances.
Good Luck and you are not alone.

Mary ellen

I totally agree. The dx's do help with getting the help, but it's what the help does that matters, if that makes sense!
 
I love that Mary Ellen, if you don't mind, I think I might borrow it. more letters than a Dr. :rotfl2: We're still learning to navigate the whole tx thing. There were a few therapies we tried that definitely made things worse, although we now have the best play therapist in the whole world and a Neuro and Psych. that we can live with for the moment. Our current challenge is school. In TX you have to meet strict criteria for an education based AU dx, and they're trying to say DD doesn't have enough of a speech component to qualify. Should continue to be fun. In the meantime, we'll keep on our crash course of trying to figure out IDEA, Wrights law, etc. I feel like to more we learn, the more we get some clue of how much we don't know. At least now I know there are more of moms out there with alphabet soup kids...its kind of nice to be able to learn a little from each other.:grouphug: Nicole
 
I'm with mary Ellen and Figment, it seems like each trip to the neurologist isn't complete with out adding a few more letters. DS(8)'s current laundry list includes ASD (PDD-NOS), SID, ADHD, GAD (generalized anxiety), disregulated mood disoder, and low tone. Oh, and OHI on his IEP. I'm affraid to even ask what's next but my guess is the disregulated mood will change to generalized depression. It's so sad to think that in some office such amazing kids have been reduced to a series of letters on paper. Yes, I know it's a necessity, it's just annoying as a parent. I'm sure you all know what I mean.
 
I agree completely; I've tried to psych myself into looking at these letters as tickets to the services that she requires, no more, no less. At the end of the day, DD knows (I hope) that these dx's don't define or limit who she is. Besides that, the medical field is constantly adding or changing criteria for dx. A generation ago, my kiddoes would have had an all encompassing, politically incorrect label and all of their symptoms would have been covered by it. I'm sure 5 years from now, at least one of their dx's will have changed to some new, en vogue label. However, school services are very dx based, so if my child needs an intervention or therapy, and the dx required for it is appropriate to her, I appreciate getting it. It's just the ticket to get in the gate.
Probably the most frustrating thing is that you get treatments and therapies based on current dxs, and then get a new one added only to find out that intensive early intervention was required, which you didn't get because you were too busy treating the dxs you had before. I struggle w/ mommy guilt already, because at least one dx is considered genetically based and some are probably influenced by the fact that she was so early(logically I know that wasn't my fault, but...) Anyway, the new dx means that I have now missed some critical window etc.etc. Oh well, at least its not boring. :confused: Nicole
 
:scared1: yes ds has adhd bipolar aspbergers dyspraxia and a few dr's thought attachment disorder and anxiety. I can feel where you are comming from. SOme days I feel so so alone
 
DS was thought to have ADHD, RAD, Bipolar and PTSD but a 20 minute in-office EEG and a 24 hour ambulatory EEG proved it to be Frontal Lobe Epilepsy. He has never had an obvious or typical seizure. I thought I'd throw this out there just in case anyone is running into dead end after dead end...you might want to consult with a neurologist. It's extremely common for Epilepsy to be misdiagnosed.

Hugs!
 
Thanks! We have a neurologist for both kids, but this possibility has never been mentioned. I think I even asked about it b/c we noticed a huge change in the RAD symptoms w/in 2 wks of starting anticonvulsant meds...hmmmm.
Appreciate the input. I think I'll bring it up again.
Nicole
 
If you are looking for some quick emotional support probably do not read this. If you are looking to deal with the alphabet soup read below.

While some children on the autism spectrum do have a long list of additional distinct appropriate diagnosis, this is the exception. In most cases these "laundry" lists of diagnosis come from clinician who are well meaning but poorly educated, trained and experienced in the area of autism trying to use neurotypical criteria, perception and experience to diagnose autistic children.

The result is that they apply neurotypical therapies, which are not effective towards a long term positive outcome. Yes, sometimes when the co morbidity is manifesting itself in a way that is acutely damaging to individual, medication and other neurotypical therapies are necessary in the short term to allow for more appropriate therapies to take hold.

I will go through some of the list. And yes some children may have a distinct diagnosis but first the clinician must remove from the observations he(she) is using the ones which are manifestations of autism.

My first and “favorite” is ADHD. The inexperienced clinician sees a child who does not focus on the clinician's "task at hand" which is typically supplied though written of verbal form. First the task is not being supplied and the output is not being analyzed in the child’s "native" visual format (how attentive would you be if the task was give say in Russian). Second there is the assumption that the child would have interest in the request of the "adult". Why would he (unless he has received intellectual instruction in, practiced and generalized this social skills area) what the clinician wants is not within the child’s areas of interest. So then you have a child (who is bored) up and walking around exploring or "playing" in his visual "world".
For those of you who are not significantly Aspie, this needs a little explanation. We live our live through a visual medium. We think, play and learn though "pictures and movies". What you are seeing, when your child is "running around", talking or singing, shouting or humming and making apparently nonsensical movements, is your child taking on a part in a theatrical play, which he is enjoying in his mind. The best neurotypical analogy I can give is to "daydreaming" except the child is completely conscious and interactive with the play (neurotypical children do this to an extent but it is much less intense and is limited by there social "understanding" that this behavior will be viewed in “public” as odd) (unless they are practicing for a play). If you want to know if your child is ADHD ask yourself the following question. Can my child "sit" for extended periods (typically much longer than a neurotypical child) of time working (playing) on his area(s) of special interest? Does he focus on visual medium (of interest) for more appropriate lengths of time? Remember that visual processing is much more efficient so time spent on any one item will by nature be less unless it is exceptionally visually complex. If these 2 items are capabilities of your child you can be reasonably sure that your child is not ADHD (or ADD). There is also the issue of "executive function" which is quite different in autistic children. They do not "discriminate" the way neurotypicals do (in all ways). Facts are simply accumulated but not categorized or organized and are then processed by the use of non linear dynamics (much as neurotypicals process social skills). This leads to the appearance of lack of organization and "focus" (but are able to come up with solutions which neurotypicals can not). The next issue is medication. Some autistic children who are not ADHD or ADD respond medications by presenting a more neurotypical profile, and depending on the level of risk the medication has (most have high risk and if were up for current approval would be black label drugs)(some of the newest ones are better) this may be needed until more appropriate long term therapies can take hold (in some cases it may even help with the therapies initially) (but can be an impediment in the intermediate to long term).

Anxiety disorders, bipolar, RAD, ODD, OCD and so on are all primarily co morbid manifestations of you child trying to adapt and cope with a neurotypical social world with out the innate social skills of a neurotypical, and without the intellectual social skills training, practice and generalization. Additionally these may be from a world where much of what is expected of them is delivered in a "non visual format". For your children there behaviors which have warranted them such a large collection of letters are just their best logical way to adapt to the social neurotypical world, which they have not been trained for, so as to reduce or expel accumulated levels of anxiety which is unhealthy for them (unfortunately this is only partially effective so the manifestations tend to build on themselves). Again medication may "help" but have serious risks and do not get to the root cause of the anxiety and its maladaptive behaviors. Additionally if “environmental sensitivities” are not addressed and accommodated for, the level of stress from this can be annoying at best and excruciating at worst thereby raising anxiety level precipitously.

So what to do, I break it into 4 parts

As a parent educate your self to the greatest extend practical. For those at or near the Aspergers end of the scale who are just starting this process I would recommend Tony Atwood "complete guide to Aspergers syndrome" C/2007 available on Amazon. It has many references to other works in the back for when you need more. It is also helpful for parents of children elsewhere on the spectrum but does not deal with the verbal communication issues. Attwood work is also available on video for those who are more visual oriented.

Second, find a clinician who I highly experienced with Autism/Aspergers. This should be there primary practice and they should be taking 100+ hours of continuing education in the area each year (or preferably teaching it) Unless you are lucky this will involve significant research to find the person and a long drive or a flight to get to them along with significant expense for the evaluation. What you will get is an unscrambling of the alphabet soup that your child’s diagnosis has become so that you can focus on his core needs from a fresh starting point and perspective.

Recognize and accommodate for your child’s environmental sensitivities and make sure his school does the same. And if you must expose your child to some “mall torture” or similar stressful situation or stimuli, expect the heighten anxiety and the perfectly logical manifestation that come with it (you would think that WDW would be the worst of this, but the “magic “ seems to for a great extent to negate the effects, could that be because for the large number of probable aspies involved in Disney’s creative end?).

Now for the most important part, obtaining and implementation of a curriculum to aid you child in developing the “missing” skills to allow him to function in a neurotypical social world with the minimum of effort and anxiety (to the extent that he wants to).
I have three major components, social skills, theory of mind and executive function.
While these need to be generalized, the primary place for this is in the educational/therapeutic setting. These are broadly accepted “needs” of Austistic/Aspergers children to enable them to get an appropriate education, and as such are cover by IDEA. World class clinicians in this area state that 2-4 hours per week of direct instruction and practice in this area is the minimum necessary for the “fastest” learners with more (up to the majority of there education time) for other areas of the spectrum (I am still working in my sons school to get to and adequate level). This can include both the standard educational setting and therapeutic setting (if you can afford them). Obtaining and generalizing these skills will allow you child to function in the “social world” with much less effort and anxiety, thereby allowing them to suffer from a minimum of co morbid issues typically well below the clinical level.

Yes in most cases it is difficult to get the “schools” to do what is needed and is a challenge and a process. Do not take it out on your local IEP team and school personnel they are doing the best they can with what they have, just try to get them educated. Drag the district and state into it, as it is ultimately there responsibility. Bring with you your references from major clinicians (books), your child’s diagnosis, and a copy of appendix A of part 300 of IDEA (you can find it on wrightslaw.com) for when they try to use state regulations to avoid the federal standard. Focus on what your child needs to be able to obtain an appropriate education commensurate with their abilities. If your child is on the autistic spectrum the items above are paramount. In addition to this the school should be adapting the academic curriculum to a more visual format (I am still working on this also).

Do not expect the schools and therapists to do it all, your support and generalization will be needed. And yes this is a lot of effort and stress but consider this, the effort and stress to accomplish this is only a small percentage of the stress and anxiety that your child is going to go through without these supports.

If you do not know how to approach your current clinicians feel free to print this out for them to read. Some will take it in a try to help you move forward. Others will point to the diploma on their wall or some other similar defensive actions. If they do ask them this, are autistic children am major part of their clinical practice, how much specific training in autism did they get during the acquisition of that diploma (typically less than 40 hours if that much), was that training from the dark ages (before 2000) (yes I know you would not phrase it that way), how much continuing education training have they a since 2000 specific to Autism/Aspergers (should be at least 50hrs /year), was it from nationally or international recognized and published educators in the area of Autism/Aspergers. If you have an alphabet soup diagnosis and are using neurotypical therapies the answer to virtually all of the above question would be none to minimal. If your clinician is still “in denial” then it time for a new one.

I hope this is helpful, I know I can be a little “direct” but after all its about our children’s needs

bookwormde



So you know where I am "comming from" I am a 50yo subclinical aspie dd from a long line of aspies. As I state to new poeple which I meet at support groups, I would have been very dissapointed if at least one of my children had not been and aspie. I was fortunate to have a 8yo ds who is clinical. I also have a 4yo ds who is more to the neurotypical side of the world and a neurotypical dw.
 
O.K., so I feel weird asking this, but I haven't been able to find anyone yet in TX, so I'm widening my search. My DD (8) was born at 28 wks, and currently has the DXs of RAD, ASD, Bipolar, ADHD, and dyspraxia.

Have you ever looked at Preemie-Child? It's an email group for the parents of Preemies. It's for parents of kids older than 4. Many former preemies have mental health diagnoses.

Our DD is ten (sniff, sniff, where did the time go?) and has several diagnoses including: CAPD, NLD, SID, CP (very mild), hearing loss, metabolic disorder nos, fatigue, migraine, latex allergy, hypoventilation, uses oxygen, etc. She's a great kid who learns a bit differently than others.

Our-Kids is another email group for parents of kids with various disabilities.

PREEMIE-CHILD@LISTSERV.ICORS.ORG
OUR-KIDS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU
 
Laura;
Thanks, I will check that out. Both of my kids are preemies (my oven really undercooks) and it would be interesting to see how other "older" preemies are doing.
Nicole
 
(I don't mean to hijack the thread)

Bookwormde, I found your post really informative.

Youngest DS is autistic- high-functioning and verbal. A year after his autism diagnosis, they added in ADHD. I really thought that was silly to do. Don't all kids with autism have an "attention deficit" when you look at it from a neuro-typical perspective? Not that they necessarily do have it, but the truth is they're just busy doing other stuff, thank you very much, and not in the mood to put up with the nonsense of the outside world.

He is also a very visual learner. Very very. I remember when he was younger, preschool age, they were running some test on him, can't remember which one 'cause there's been so many. They showed him cards with drawings and he was supposed to identify the thing. Well, they were black and white line drawings. He got like *none* of them correct, even though I knew he knew what some of those things were. We pieced it together-- he preferred photographs. Line drawings didn't make sense, they didn't really look like the object. This is why the standard PECs didn't work either. This is why the children's dictionary with photos has been dragged around our house so much that the cover fell off.

Our oldest has an ADHD diagnosis, but I think there is a little Aspie going on there. He's 10. He is also very visual. And he does have trouble concentrating, unless it's something he's interested in. Namely, the computer or the Wii. We have a "reputation" at the local used gamer store for being the most prolific game-traders in town. He brings a game home, immediately goes online to find the cheats for it,:rolleyes: marathons it until he finishes then is ready to trade in. Both kids, their favorite tv show is "America's Funniest Home Videos"- very visual humor. Either that, or they get on YouTube and watch cartoons and replay parts over and over.

One thing that really bugs me, and I'm curious as to your input on this, both of them often have things that don't "hit their radar", which is frustrating. For example, it's time to leave the house, put on your shoes. Neither one of them can ever find their shoes, even though they are laying in plain sight, they'll walk right past them. Or they'll go to look for them, briefly, then get distracted by something else. Oldest DS has 3 or 4 things that go with him to school every day, and they are put in the same place in our house. But I will have to go down the list over and over each morning, or he will walk out without everything. I try to make it as routine as I can, but it doesn't seem to help.
 












Save Up to 30% on Rooms at Walt Disney World!

Save up to 30% on rooms at select Disney Resorts Collection hotels when you stay 5 consecutive nights or longer in late summer and early fall. Plus, enjoy other savings for shorter stays.This offer is valid for stays most nights from August 1 to October 11, 2025.
CLICK HERE













DIS Facebook DIS youtube DIS Instagram DIS Pinterest

Back
Top