Amazon selling book for pedophiles

[FlightlessDuck]

I don't want Amazon censoring materials.

From wikipedia:

Censorship is suppression of speech or other communication which may be considered objectionable, harmful, sensitive, or inconvenient to the general body of people as determined by a government, media outlet, or other controlling body.

Since Amazon is a for-profit company, they are able to decide what they do and do not sell. They are not the government, therefore they are not "censoring".

 

[It'sWDW4me]

just found this through google

http://www.aolnews.com/nation/artic...dophilia-e-book-amid-boycott-threats/19712148

Meanwhile, the book's author, 47-year-old Philip R. Greaves, is speaking out in defense of his self-published work.

Greaves, a former nurse's aide from Pueblo, Colo., told the local Channel 9 TV station there that he wrote the book to change people's perception of pedophiles. "Every time you see them on television, they're either murderers, rapists or kidnappers, and, you know, that's just not an accurate presentation of that particular sexuality," he said.

"True pedophiles love children and would never hurt them," Greaves told CNN.


OMG that man is sick, sick, SICK!!

Yes, methinks there will be a full investigation made into his life.

A PP had written that this was probably written to tell the world that there is nothing wrong with pedophilia. That it's "normal" and simply the way they're oriented. Yep, that's what this superscum is trying to promote.

I'm going to go throw up now.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

OMG that man is sick, sick, SICK!!

Yes, methinks there will be a full investigation made into his life.

A PP had written that this was probably written to tell the world that there is nothing wrong with pedophilia. That it's "normal" and simply the way they're oriented. Yep, that's what this superscum is trying to promote.

I'm going to go throw up now.

Where have you been? NAMBLA had public officials and priests for YEARS. Go look it up. It is some sick stuff.

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

My thoughts exactly!

It's so sick to me that so many people don't GET how awful and serious this is!

I get it- but I don't get why you picked THIS book to get outraged about - and not the how to KILL book. And yes, I DO happen to think murder is worse than child rape.

 

[horseshowmom]

After seeing this thread I sent a note to Amazon telling them that I was a loyal and satisfied Amazon customer for many years but I would no longer be. I have never boycotted anything in my life, but this just makes me too sick. They are free to make whatever business decisions they choose, and I can make my choices too.

No need for legal or censorship discussion in my mind. Every retailer makes a choice about what kind of seller they want to be for heaven's sake. Would the censorship soapboxers come out and protest that an X-rated store is not carrying Sound of Music? Might the store lose business if they carried too many wholesome family movies and books and customers complained? Yep. And the free-speechers would not indignantly be there!

I got a reply this morning though about how it is no longer available. I am relieved and think that this is a good business decision that happens to be morally responsible. I think it still might take a while for the sick feeling to go away enough for me to shop there.

I got that email last night.

Now, after reading this thread, I'm a little more aware of some of the stuff Amazon makes available for sale.

How can anybody in good conscience (with ANY conscience) market a game where you track down and rape a mother and her daughters??? Why did they have to be MADE to pull the game - why was it there to start with? I wonder if those two guys who were recently tried for breaking into a doctor's house, knocking him out, and then proceeding to rape, torture, and murder his wife and two daughters had the chance to play the video game too?

People can scream against censorship all they want to, but somewhere a little common sense ought to kick in. As someone who has dealt with the consequences of being molested, I can tell you that there should be laws against this stuff - not questions about violating some *******'s censorship rights.

 

[It'sWDW4me]

Where have you been? NAMBLA had public officials and priests for YEARS. Go look it up. It is some sick stuff.

Unfortunately, I've been around. Yes, I know this sh!t has been going on for centuries. I've read about the sick scums being arrested or moved to another area (read "church"). I am also one of the many unfortunates to have had immediate family members directly affected by these ..... words fail..... scum, sicko, dirtbag, degenerate.... are just so inadequate.

Every story I read still makes me nauseous.

 

[horseshowmom]

I get it- but I don't get why you picked THIS book to get outraged about - and not the how to KILL book. And yes, I DO happen to think murder is worse than child rape.

Why can't posters be upset about BOTH books? The fact is that this is the book that happened to come to our attention, and there's NOT ONE THING WRONG with being outraged about it. Thank goodness for the posters who do see it as an outrage.

And while I will concede that if I HAVE to make a choice, murder is worse, I can tell you that living with the results of molestation for almost 4 decades is something that NEVER goes away and changes your life forever. And you felt Amazon should get a BRAVO for it.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Unfortunately, I've been around. Yes, I know this sh!t has been going on for centuries. I've read about the sick scums being arrested or moved to another area (read "church"). I am also one of the many unfortunates to have had immediate family members directly affected by these ..... words fail..... scum, sicko, dirtbag, degenerate.... are just so inadequate.

Every story I read still makes me nauseous.

 

[merryweather20]

I am curious---has ANY one of you read, or even skimmed this book before making the decision that you will boycott a BOOK retailer which carries it?

How about those of you saying you are posting REVIEWS of this book? How can you review something you have not read?

I haven't, becuase it looks like an awful book about somehtign I truly disagree with. I don't want to read it. If it is what I think it is I really don't want other people reading it (actually, I don't care if they read it so long as they don't try to do the things I think it advocates).

I think the fabric/wal-mart comparison is not the same at all. Wal mart was never primarily a fabric store. Amazon's primary business is as a book seller. Their policy is that they do not judge the worthiness of a book, they simple make (legal) books available. Customers can judge whether the book is good/morally sound/etc and should be bought or not.

Personally, I will vote with my wallet by not buying THAT book or even anything else by that author (if there is anything else). I will also vote with my pocket book by continuing to be a customer of amazon.com as I like that they support me as a customer being able to make those moral (and taste) decisions myself.

I don't need to read the book to realize I'm not interested, and that its offensive and dangerous. The authors has provided us with his chosen title and a variety of news agencies have provided us with the unfortunate contents.

Wal-Mart is the primary fabric store for a lot of people, but Amazon is not primarily a seller of books promoting pedophilia. More to the point, both businesses make business decisions of what they will carry and what they won't.

I completely agree. I think it is very disingenuous for Amazon to say they won't censor this book. I know for a fact that certain books aren't available on Amazon...so Amazon does believe in "censorship" for reasons such as profitability, etc. I'm sure Amazon doesn't sell hard core pornograpy books or dvds, do they? Censorship!!!
Big difference between government violating first amendment rights and a business refusing to sell a particular book.

You have mentioned "rape kits" a few times. I have no idea what such a thing would even be. It also sounds like it would be a random add in to a store that sold nail polish.

I would shop at a specialty store which sold hundred and thousands of items within that one specialty (in this case books, could be music, movies, fabrics, whatever)--making as many items in that specialty available to the consumer as possible even if I found a select few of those items to be morally reprehensible. I would see it as the retailer allowing the customer to make his/her own moral choices about the items. So, I guess the closest answer I can give to your totally unrealistic scenario is to say that if there were a DVD store which carried literally tens of thousands (or more) DVD titles and one of those titles was "How to Rape Someone", yes I would still buy my DVDs there. I still use the internet too--and there is a vast array of terrible stuff available on it.

Of course I have not subscribed to a kiddie porn site. First of it is illegal and secondly it hurts kids (actually the bigger issue to me) and thirdly I would not like it at all anyway (I don't even like regular old porn--I find it a turn off). There are many things i do not do--many things i disagree with but I would never try to tell others something is so terrible it should be banned if i have not even bothered to really look into and at what I think should be banned.

ETA--just found on their FAQ that amazon.com offers "over 14 million titles" SO, yes, if someone has over 14 million items in a category (books, music, DVD, necklaces, whatever) I think they are offering as much as they possibly can to consumers and not trying to force any sort of moral judgment about the individual items within the category and I will buy from them even if some of those individual items are reprehensible. I admire the retailer for taking the stand that it is not their place to judge the quality or moral value of the individual items (so long as they are legal).

The internet is not a single business entity. There is no comparison at all. What people are saying is they aren't patronizing the store on the corner. They're still going to walk down Main Street and visit the bakery.

And again, 14 million titles is not every book. They've already passed judgement on what they will or will not offer. They don't have to judge the "quality or moral value" of the items, but they do have to decide what interests their customers.

 

[Dictator]

The great thing about Free Speech is it protects the speech you don't agree with.

 

[bookgirl]

The hard truth is pedophilia exsists. If this book is a guide to anything illegal then the cops will yank it. If it is a book on alternatives to performing illegal acts it could be considered therapy and honestly better than someone acting out on the urges associated with the deviation.

Personally I might not like the content of a book, but legally and more importantly constitutionally if it is within the bounds of law then it is considered free speech and part of intellectual freedom. You don't have to like the content or the subject but it is the right of the writer and readers to have.

If a book were eligible for censorship for others dislike of subject matter than there would not be one fundmentalist christian book on the shelf, no bibles, no korans, no torahs, no books on creation or darwinism, no books on women's reproductive rights or abstienence, no books on alternative medical care or end of life debates.

the old quotes are the best

I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend until death your right to say it.

I very rarely shop at Amazon. I would not let a book that I do not condone stop me from using them. I have everyright to buy any book I want, as does every other customer. As every customer has the right to choose NOT to buy from them. That is the best way to let them know your opinion, but having an opinion does not make you right, it makes you human and entitled to your opinion.

If they are selling a book that breaks the law then they are to be held accountable, until then they are a store doing buisness.

 

[MosMom]

In that article, the author states that he finds fondling and kissing not that big of a deal. I'm surprised encouraging that isn't illegal because that is pretty much molestation.

 

[RitaE]

You have to realize there is a distinction between the act itself and writing a book about it.

It is not illegal (in the United States) to write a book about illegal activities or to state an opinion that you think an illegal activity should be accepted.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

You have to realize there is a distinction between the act itself and writing a book about it.

It is not illegal (in the United States) to write a book about illegal activities or to state an opinion that you think an illegal activity should be accepted.

Good point. Many authors and movie makers would be in jail. Can you say McCarthyism?

That is why public outcry, boycotts, protests, and voting are freedoms in America that are exercised daily.

And look, it is a system that works. Amazon pulled the book from it's "shelves".

 

[MosMom]

I do understand that. I was replying to the person that suggested cops will take care of the book if there is illegal activity in it. There is illegal activity in it and nothing is being done because there is nothing to be done.

However, I still believe a private for-profit business can absolutely choose not to sell whatever they choose not to sell. Is this book available in public libraries?

 

[skater]

In that article, the author states that he finds fondling and kissing not that big of a deal. I'm surprised encouraging that isn't illegal because that is pretty much molestation.

It is molestation.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

It is molestation.

No it is not. I would say kiddie porn maybe.

Molestation has to involve live people.

 

[skater]

No it is not. I would say kiddie porn maybe.

Molestation has to involve live people.

Sorry. thought it was obvious that I meant fondling and kissing a live child is molestation.

 

[LisaR]

Sorry. thought it was obvious that I meant fondling and kissing a live child is molestation.

But it isn't illegal to write about it. Disgusting beyond words but not illegal. It has to involve a live human before it becomes illegal.

 

[luvmy3]

But what about the books - how to kill, how to build bomb! Why are those any less offensive?

to me it is just faux outrage - since it seems more serious books don't bother you?

Thats fine for you, but some of us have our own personal reasons to be outraged about a book like this, its real and justified.

I completely agree. I think it is very disingenuous for Amazon to say they won't censor this book. I know for a fact that certain books aren't available on Amazon...so Amazon does believe in "censorship" for reasons such as profitability, etc. I'm sure Amazon doesn't sell hard core pornograpy books or dvds, do they? Censorship!!!
Big difference between government violating first amendment rights and a business refusing to sell a particular book.

Exactly, too many people throwing around teh censorship word. Amazon isn't telling this author he can't write this book, they are just making a decision not to sell it. There are millionsx of books Amazon sells, and I'm sure there are many that they don't for various reasons. This isn't censorship, this is a decision not to sell something. All retail businesses make these types of decisions everyday, and nobody cries "censorship".
[
QUOTE=Pigeon;38910192]I don't want Amazon censoring materials.[/QUOTE]

Amazon doesn't have the power to censor, they only have the power to choose not to sell a product. When Amazon starts telling people what they can and can't write about, then you can let them know you don't want them censoring materials.

The great thing about Free Speech is it protects the speech you don't agree with.

Very true and Amazon pulling this book does not violate any free speech amendment.