Amazon selling book for pedophiles

[luvmyfam444]

The other book mentioned here - Understanding Loved boys & Boy Lovers is sold on Amazon & according to this... http://www.shfri.net/shfp/ulbabl/ulbabl.html the publisher of this book is Create Space is a division of Amazon.

Interesting...

 

[FlightlessDuck]

Create Space is a division of Amazon.

Yes, Create Space is Amazon's self publishing company. Apparently they aren't are stringent with the books they publish as Apple is with the iPhone Apps they allow.

 

[hambirg]

Everybody sure this isn't actually just a joke book? I mean it's in really bad taste but still, I can't imagine this being real.

A joke? Are you serious? Because I don't think I know anybody that would think that is funny. It's not even juvenile gutter humor. No way, no how! This is somebody that honestly thinks that somehow they are justified. . .maybe, just maybe there are other sick pukes that think like he does. . .so it's all justified. That is exactly the danger of things like this. The whole, "See, I'm not the only mentally ill freak. So you all need to except me. I'm not weird. . .just different. So never mind that we victimize children. This is how God made us." BS. :vomit:

 

[NHdisneylover]

If you've loved Amazon before, then you've loved them while they have sold things like this. I worked there '99 to '02 and we sold stuff like that then AND dealt with backlash from people like most on this thread.

They are a seller of items. This is an item. If you wrote a book about something would you want them to say "nope, not going to sell it, I don't agree with the content"? No.

You loved them while they were selling things like this, and you can still love them now.



It doesn't sound like it *advocates* anything. It sounds like a very poorly written probably self-published thing that (from the description) tells people to not be obvious. Which I would think people doing this would know already (and by writing a book any secrets are given out to everyone, including officers of the law).


I think it's nasty that people like that exist, and I think they are showing their obvious lack of intelligence by writing books like this, but it's waaaaay too slippery of a slope. Amazon has always taken a very strong stance against censorship, and as difficult as it was to take calls from rabid people about it (while NO ONE was buying the books people were in a lather about), and as simple it would have made my life if they'd caved, I do support their not wanting to cave in on the stance.


Amazon also has protected peoples' order information recently, along with their salestax stuff with NC, but I don't see anyone yelling THAT from the rooftops. NC wanted to know what their residents were ordering so they could charge salestax on it, and Amazon said "no you cannot have that information".

To me, it's two sides of the same coin. They will protect this dingbat's right to sell his nonsense, and they will protect the ordering history of their customers.



I wonder just WHO went rooting around in the depths of amazon, to find this, and WHY they did it? Right as the holiday buying seasons is swinging into high gear? As amazon is doing SO well, is starting to truly dominate in their fields? I wonder who and why...why did someone go looking around for such content?


One of the reasons I do NOT shop at walmart is BECAUSE they censor what they sell. So while the power of social networking and some other phrase that I just heard about the power of the people on the internet is actually MUCH scarier, er, stronger, than it was in '02, and while I have a feeling that their stance will end up changing, I would rather support someone that does NOT censor (and that protects customer info) than support someone that does censor.

And everyone's just shooting themselves in the foot by boycotting the best "seller of things" out there!

Molly, this is an excellent post and I agree with everything you say (right down to not chopping at Wal-Mart and why).

 

[Grand Duke]

A joke? Are you serious? Because I don't think I know anybody that would think that is funny. It's not even juvenile gutter humor. No way, no how! This is somebody that honestly thinks that somehow they are justified. . .maybe, just maybe there are other sick pukes that think like he does. . .so it's all justified. That is exactly the danger of things like this. The whole, "See, I'm not the only mentally ill freak. So you all need to except me. I'm not weird. . .just different. So never mind that we victimize children. This is how God made us." BS. :vomit:

Haha I hate to say it but this is exactly juvenile gutter humor. Unfortunately, far worse things than books like this exist.

My assumption is that this book is just a sick satire of pedophiles in line with the very basest of Internet humor. I can't imagine it's genuine.

 

[hambirg]

Haha I hate to say it but this is exactly juvenile gutter humor. Unfortunately, far worse things than books like this exist.

My assumption is that this book is just a sick satire of pedophiles in line with the very basest of Internet humor. I can't imagine it's genuine.

I think you haven't had enough up close and personal experience with people like this. Sorry, but you are severely undereducated on the subject. Lucky for you. If you think it's just a sick joke than you obviously don't have a clue.

Trust me, there are many people that would love for nothing more to push their sick agenda. They think that because the whole gay issue has come out of the closet that they are next. I don't have anything against gays. I don't think it is any of my business what goes on between consenting adults. I have gay friends that I love dearly. . and I am soooo NOT laying this crap at their feet. BUT there are sick people out there that think now their sexual preference must be accepted. . .it doesn't matter what it is. . sex with kids.. .sex with animals. . .sex with McDonald's Egg McMuffins. . .it ALL has to be accepted now. It's just how I was born. . .yeah. .go bite wind!

Did you all see the Oprah episode where she had the sex offender that preferred small boys on? I have to say . . .I actually respected the guy for what he was willing to say. . .BUT it was immensely disturbing regardless. He was open about his sexual urges. . but he went through treatment that taught him that his partners were victims. He actually thought that those young boys wanted it. That's how those sick minds justify it. There was a video clip where he was watching young boy s get off a school bus. I wish I could erase it from my memory, but I can't.

 

[superme80]

I am now a former Amazon shopper. I don't see pulling this book as censorship. I see it as a good business practice. And the fact that they won't just makes me sad. Oh well there are other places that will get my business this Christmas season.

 

[Grand Duke]

I think you haven't had enough up close and personal experience with people like this. Sorry, but you are severely undereducated on the subject. Lucky for you. If you think it's just a sick joke than you obviously don't have a clue.

Trust me, there are many people that would love for nothing more to push their sick agenda. They think that because the whole gay issue has come out of the closet that they are next. I don't have anything against gays. I don't think it is any of my business what goes on between consenting adults. I have gay friends that I love dearly. . and I am soooo NOT laying this crap at their feet. BUT there are sick people out there that think now their sexual preference must be accepted. . .it doesn't matter what it is. . sex with kids.. .sex with animals. . .sex with McDonald's Egg McMuffins. . .it ALL has to be accepted now. It's just how I was born. . .yeah. .go bite wind!

Did you all see the Oprah episode where she had the sex offender that preferred small boys on? I have to say . . .I actually respected the guy for what he was willing to say. . .BUT it was immensely disturbing regardless. He was open about his sexual urges. . but he went through treatment that taught him that his partners were victims. He actually thought that those young boys wanted it. That's how those sick minds justify it. There was a video clip where he was watching young boy s get off a school bus. I wish I could erase it from my memory, but I can't.

Gross.

You're right, looks like I am severely undereducated on the subject and boy am I glad about that. I had no idea pedophiles were trying to pass themselves off as, essentially, the "next gays," or about anything else you mentioned.

So now that you've brought all this up, the existence of this book makes a whole lot of sense and is just horrible. Still though personally, I wouldn't let it stop me from shopping at Amazon. There are tons of awful books for sale at places like Borders and I think we all still shop there.

 

[merryweather20]

If you've loved Amazon before, then you've loved them while they have sold things like this. I worked there '99 to '02 and we sold stuff like that then AND dealt with backlash from people like most on this thread.

They are a seller of items. This is an item. If you wrote a book about something would you want them to say "nope, not going to sell it, I don't agree with the content"? No.

You loved them while they were selling things like this, and you can still love them now.

It doesn't sound like it *advocates* anything. It sounds like a very poorly written probably self-published thing that (from the description) tells people to not be obvious. Which I would think people doing this would know already (and by writing a book any secrets are given out to everyone, including officers of the law).


I think it's nasty that people like that exist, and I think they are showing their obvious lack of intelligence by writing books like this, but it's waaaaay too slippery of a slope. Amazon has always taken a very strong stance against censorship, and as difficult as it was to take calls from rabid people about it (while NO ONE was buying the books people were in a lather about), and as simple it would have made my life if they'd caved, I do support their not wanting to cave in on the stance.


Amazon also has protected peoples' order information recently, along with their salestax stuff with NC, but I don't see anyone yelling THAT from the rooftops. NC wanted to know what their residents were ordering so they could charge salestax on it, and Amazon said "no you cannot have that information".

To me, it's two sides of the same coin. They will protect this dingbat's right to sell his nonsense, and they will protect the ordering history of their customers.



I wonder just WHO went rooting around in the depths of amazon, to find this, and WHY they did it? Right as the holiday buying seasons is swinging into high gear? As amazon is doing SO well, is starting to truly dominate in their fields? I wonder who and why...why did someone go looking around for such content?


One of the reasons I do NOT shop at walmart is BECAUSE they censor what they sell. So while the power of social networking and some other phrase that I just heard about the power of the people on the internet is actually MUCH scarier, er, stronger, than it was in '02, and while I have a feeling that their stance will end up changing, I would rather support someone that does NOT censor (and that protects customer info) than support someone that does censor.

And everyone's just shooting themselves in the foot by boycotting the best "seller of things" out there!

Of course I would expect to hear NO. Such is life. No bookstore, even Amazon carries every book. One in business expects to hear no, from time to time.

This has nothing to do with censorship. This is about a business making smart decisions about the products they carry. You even said yourself that such items weren't selling.

I shop at Wal-Mart less now, because they axed their fabric department. They aren't censoring fabric, it just didn't work anymore from a business perspective. I also don't shop at the music store in my mall. Its plastered with pictures of naked women. They are looking at a different customer base. In fact all the stores I shop in have products that interest me, and don't promote anything I find offensive, and have either an appealing decor or an easy to navigate web-site.... Funny how that works.

There isn't anything at Amazon that I want, that I can't get somewhere else. Somewhere else that isn't interested in promoting rape and pedophilia.

How is not shopping at Amazon shooting "someone in the foot". No one needs Amazon. They don't have a monopoly on ffod, water or shelter.

 

[NHdisneylover]

I am curious---has ANY one of you read, or even skimmed this book before making the decision that you will boycott a BOOK retailer which carries it?

How about those of you saying you are posting REVIEWS of this book? How can you review something you have not read?

I haven't, becuase it looks like an awful book about somehtign I truly disagree with. I don't want to read it. If it is what I think it is I really don't want other people reading it (actually, I don't care if they read it so long as they don't try to do the things I think it advocates).

I think the fabric/wal-mart comparison is not the same at all. Wal mart was never primarily a fabric store. Amazon's primary business is as a book seller. Their policy is that they do not judge the worthiness of a book, they simple make (legal) books available. Customers can judge whether the book is good/morally sound/etc and should be bought or not.

Personally, I will vote with my wallet by not buying THAT book or even anything else by that author (if there is anything else). I will also vote with my pocket book by continuing to be a customer of amazon.com as I like that they support me as a customer being able to make those moral (and taste) decisions myself.

 

[hambirg]

Gross.

You're right, looks like I am severely undereducated on the subject and boy am I glad about that. I had no idea pedophiles were trying to pass themselves off as, essentially, the "next gays," or about anything else you mentioned.

So now that you've brought all this up, the existence of this book makes a whole lot of sense and is just horrible. Still though personally, I wouldn't let it stop me from shopping at Amazon. There are tons of awful books for sale at places like Borders and I think we all still shop there.

Yeah. . sorry I wasn't meaning to call you out. . but I do think that is the idea behind things like this. . "Hey gay people can claim that that is their orientation. . .so why can't I? You (meaning society) has to accept it. I can't help the way I am." BUT they are missing the tiny fact that gays are having consensual sex. . .but like I said. . in their sick minds they think it's consensual. That's how they can justify their crimes to themselves. Sick, I know.

 

[hambirg]

I am curious---has ANY one of you read, or even skimmed this book before making the decision that you will boycott a BOOK retailer which carries it?

How about those of you saying you are posting REVIEWS of this book? How can you review something you have not read?

I haven't, becuase it looks like an awful book about somehtign I truly disagree with. I don't want to read it. If it is what I think it is I really don't want other people reading it (actually, I don't care if they read it so long as they don't try to do the things I think it advocates).

I think the fabric/wal-mart comparison is not the same at all. Wal mart was never primarily a fabric store. Amazon's primary business is as a book seller. Their policy is that they do not judge the worthiness of a book, they simple make (legal) books available. Customers can judge whether the book is good/morally sound/etc and should be bought or not.

Personally, I will vote with my wallet by not buying THAT book or even anything else by that author (if there is anything else). I will also vote with my pocket book by continuing to be a customer of amazon.com as I like that they support me as a customer being able to make those moral (and taste) decisions myself.

I don't think anybody has read the book because nobody is willing to take the risk of being a buyer. Have you subscribed to a kiddie porn site? Something with a title like "Sexy, Hawt, Kindergartners" I doubt it. So we still have the right to logically assume what something like that might entail? Sure. Do we have the right not to do business with a provider that allows something like that? Sure. Would you still shop at a retailer that openly sells rape kits? Is your argument that yes you would because they also sell nail polish and you respect the fact that they allow you to buy nail polish sound ridiculous. . .yep.

 

[bgirldeb]

They're pulling the book.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/11/amazon-pulls-pedophile-guide-amid-outrage/

 

[NHdisneylover]

You have mentioned "rape kits" a few times. I have no idea what such a thing would even be. It also sounds like it would be a random add in to a store that sold nail polish.

I would shop at a specialty store which sold hundred and thousands of items within that one specialty (in this case books, could be music, movies, fabrics, whatever)--making as many items in that specialty available to the consumer as possible even if I found a select few of those items to be morally reprehensible. I would see it as the retailer allowing the customer to make his/her own moral choices about the items. So, I guess the closest answer I can give to your totally unrealistic scenario is to say that if there were a DVD store which carried literally tens of thousands (or more) DVD titles and one of those titles was "How to Rape Someone", yes I would still buy my DVDs there. I still use the internet too--and there is a vast array of terrible stuff available on it.

Of course I have not subscribed to a kiddie porn site. First of it is illegal and secondly it hurts kids (actually the bigger issue to me) and thirdly I would not like it at all anyway (I don't even like regular old porn--I find it a turn off). There are many things i do not do--many things i disagree with but I would never try to tell others something is so terrible it should be banned if i have not even bothered to really look into and at what I think should be banned.

ETA--just found on their FAQ that amazon.com offers "over 14 million titles" SO, yes, if someone has over 14 million items in a category (books, music, DVD, necklaces, whatever) I think they are offering as much as they possibly can to consumers and not trying to force any sort of moral judgment about the individual items within the category and I will buy from them even if some of those individual items are reprehensible. I admire the retailer for taking the stand that it is not their place to judge the quality or moral value of the individual items (so long as they are legal).

 

[Aristomommy]

ETA--just found on their FAQ that amazon.com offers "over 14 million titles" SO, yes, if someone has over 14 million items in a category (books, music, DVD, necklaces, whatever) I think they are offering as much as they possibly can to consumers and not trying to force any sort of moral judgment about the individual items within the category and I will buy from them even if some of those individual items are reprehensible. I admire the retailer for taking the stand that it is not their place to judge the quality or moral value of the individual items (so long as they are legal).

That's what's great about this situation. You can choose to patron Amazon, I can choose to say this crossed the line for me. Like I said before, as a former victim, I know the first hand how these people operate. Every time they find something to normalize their behavior, there is a greater chance another child will be victimized. They have triggers that will come out of nowhere. I do NOT admire the retailer's anything goes attitude and taking a neutral stand on an issue like this.

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

Amazon is a business and can sell whatever they want, but consumers also have the power to boycott. Sounds like the book was pulled for this exact reason. This was a HOW TO book on child molestation. We are not talking about a slippery slope to banning prize winning books or not mentioning sex at all. I am amazed what people defend in the name of free speech. Sounds great in theory, but where do we draw the line? For me, there is no justification for this.

But what about the books - how to kill, how to build bomb! Why are those any less offensive?

to me it is just faux outrage - since it seems more serious books don't bother you?

 

[Mermaid02]

They're pulling the book.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/11/amazon-pulls-pedophile-guide-amid-outrage/

Good.

 

[cdotla]

I am curious---has ANY one of you read, or even skimmed this book before making the decision that you will boycott a BOOK retailer which carries it?

How about those of you saying you are posting REVIEWS of this book? How can you review something you have not read?

If the title of the book and description of it on Amazon's website isn't enough, there are many news articles about it on the internet containing excerpts from it (which I hope they downloaded from Amazon's free preview as opposed to buying this garbage).

Here is one such article showing excerpts from the book which describes tips on how to rape children and not get caught, how to fashion make-shift condoms for children too small to fit regular ones. http://techcrunch.com/2010/11/10/amazon-defends-pedophile-how-to-guide/

Does it really have to be more obvious than this? How much evidence do you need that this is completely objectionable on any and every level???

I am absolutely amazed at the defences being offered for this.

 

[cdotla]

But what about the books - how to kill, how to build bomb! Why are those any less offensive?

to me it is just faux outrage - since it seems more serious books don't bother you?

Faux outrage??? More serious than CHILD RAPE??? Are you kidding?

 

[PollyannaMom]

I'm glad Amazon pulled the book, and I don't see it as censorship.

It would be censorship if the government told Amazon they could not sell a book because it offended people.

It's a sound business decision if Amazon chooses to risk losing the business of a tiny percentage of consumers who want this book instead of losing the business of a much larger percentage who don't.

I'm glad I live in a place where a book shop has the right to carry anything they want. I've bought from Amazon before, knowing that they also carry things I wouldn't buy, and supporting their decision to cater to customers besides me. But, comparing the internet site to a physical store, this particular book "in the window of their shop" would stop me from "walking in" simply because I wouldn't be comfortable there.