Al Gore uses 20 TIMES as much electricity as you do

:rotfl: :rotfl2:

That is a total JOKE, they weren't even measuring nor knew about gamma rays until fairly recently, they certainly knew NOTHING about them 100 years ago.

Not to mention how to calibrate and measure effects of solar flares, solar radiation and a ton of other things. What exactly were they "observing" over that time period, the rain? :lmao: So by definition that "thing" that you cited is a TOTAL JOKE.

Nice try!

:rotfl2: :lmao: :rotfl:

Gamma rays were discovered by the French chemist and physicist Paul Ulrich Villard in 1900
 
The studies do not and cannot be done over hundreds of years as the scientist do not live that long. The Data on temperature has been collected for some many years together with studies of ice cores tree rings and many other sources the information was collected as study in a subject is refined and improved (standing on the shoulders of giants) more accurate theories can be put forward. Scientist will tell you there are few if any absolutes but there are highly probables and balance of probabilities.

Baseline models are made for a single cause or co dependant cause then the net result is extrapolated. From that the current widely accepted theory is arrived at.

Yes but data on temperatures, ice cores etc., mean absolutely nothing in isolation, when you are not simulataneously factoring in potential CAUSES, with the warming trends. Be that that it was impossible to have accurate data on what the solar activity, gamma ray activity etc., was at the same time, (Which they don't because they could not accurately measure or quantify such things 100 years ago) you have no scientific LINK to the CAUSE, done under the scientific method. Thus no real scientific study linking man to global warming.
 
Yes but data on temperatures, ice cores etc., mean absolutely nothing in isolation, when you are not simulataneously factoring in potential CAUSES, with the warming trends. Be that that it was impossible to have accurate data on what the solar activity, gamma ray activity etc., was at the same time, (Which they don't because they could not accurately measure or quantify such things 100 years ago) you have no scientific LINK to the CAUSE, done under the scientific method. Thus no real scientific study linking man to global warming.

Firstly solar activity has been recorded for centuaries as have volcanic activites and a number of the things you say should be taken into account. Also radiation can be extrapolated from residual radiation in some substances known to have formd at various time over the study period ie rock forming etc.

Secondly it seemed that you were disputing Global Warming at all then it the cause.

Besides just because you say there is no link has no more validity than me saying there is, other than the various reigorous scientific papers supporting my view that is. Never mind fingers in ears, close eyes and sing LA LA LA. With a little luck the rest of the world will make the changes so my genetic line will continue.:laughing:
 
There is a saying that may be applicable here. Here bush was convinced by the IPCC report. In addition, EXXON changed its long held positions and agreed with scientific conclusions that are not in its economic interests. Both of these are strong indications that the IPCC may be right.

Bush had evidence that there were WMD's in Iraq. It was also backed up by evidence from the KGB, Scotland Yard, and other intelligence agencies.

Therefore, you should agree that going into Iraq was the right thing.

Or, do you only accept evidence that agrees with your point of view... regardless of its accuracy or validity.
 

Firstly solar activity has been recorded for centuaries as have volcanic activites and a number of the things you say should be taken into account. Also radiation can be extrapolated from residual radiation in some substances known to have formd at various time over the study period ie rock forming etc.

Secondly it seemed that you were disputing Global Warming at all then it the cause.

Besides just because you say there is no link has no more validity than me saying there is, other than the various reigorous scientific papers supporting my view that is. Never mind fingers in ears, close eyes and sing LA LA LA. With a little luck the rest of the world will make the changes so my genetic line will continue.:laughing:


I despute global "warming." Compared to what?

Compared to 1988, it's cooler. Compared to the 1930's, it's cooler. Compared to 1000, it's cooler.
 
Bush had evidence that there were WMD's in Iraq. It was also backed up by evidence from the KGB, Scotland Yard, and other intelligence agencies.
Acutally most of the other intellligence agencies (at least the ones not involved in the fixiing of the WMD intelligence) all told the US that the intelligence on Iraq was false. I can bury you with links but I know that the German intelligence agencies told the US that the intelligences on mobile weapon labs was false and could not be relied on and the Germans were the original source of such intelligence in the first place. I also remember that Russia told us that there were no links between Saddam and Al Qaeda and we ignored that intelligence. The only foriegn intelligence agency that backed the US up was the UK and they were a party to the fixing of intelligence by bush and blair to sell the war.

Why do you think that the US could not get anyone on the security council to vote in favor of the Iraq invasion? The other countries knew that the intelligence and facts were fixed.

Again, if you want to debate WMDs, I will be glad to bury you with cites. I note that the Senate is going to finish up the Phase II review of the fixed or faked intelligence to used to sell the war this summer and that will be a fun document to read.

Finally as I noted earlier, even a blind hog can come up with an acorn occassionally. bush's change in position on global warming may be the only correct decision that he has made in his tenure but he was due to get at least one thing right.
 
This entire thread goes back to the point I was making on the "What is a Liberal" thread a few days ago, that being that conservatives seem to be completely incapable of recognizing the complexities of any issue. They insist on comparing Gore's house - including the security, office space, and size differences - to an average American household, and think that they are thereby proving something. Despite the obvious logical fallacies, they continue to spout their nonsense about Gore being a hypocrite. They see the issue only as black and white.

So...thanks to those of you proving my point about conservatives. :thumbsup2 It's much appreciated. :lmao: The only sad part is that there seem to be so many people gullible enough to be taken in by the simplistic argument, rather than looking at the whole picture.

I drive for a lot for my job. I drive about 38000 miles in a 2005 Malibu. I probably have a larger "carbon footprint" than someone who drives a Hummer 5000 miles a year (they have a really short commute). So comparing the average home to Al Gores house (and it's use) isn't really "apples and oranges". It's the bottomline. ONE of his houses uses 20 times more energy than the average house. It's just a matter of justification after that.
 
I despute global "warming." Compared to what?

Compared to 1988, it's cooler. Compared to the 1930's, it's cooler. Compared to 1000, it's cooler.
:rotfl: :rotfl2: Do you have facts to back your claim? :rotfl: :rotfl2: Again, your assertions are funny in that it is clear that you do not know what you are talking about. :rotfl: :rotfl2: All of the scientists at the IPCC disagree with you and they have real data that shows that you are wrong.
 
All of the scientists at the IPCC disagree with you and they have real data that shows that you are wrong.

I guess by "all" you mean the ones that remained after some left because they disagreed with the initial report.
 
Yes but data on temperatures, ice cores etc., mean absolutely nothing in isolation, when you are not simulataneously factoring in potential CAUSES, with the warming trends. Be that that it was impossible to have accurate data on what the solar activity, gamma ray activity etc., was at the same time, (Which they don't because they could not accurately measure or quantify such things 100 years ago) you have no scientific LINK to the CAUSE, done under the scientific method. Thus no real scientific study linking man to global warming.

I have stated my doubts but must tell you that one of the strongest links they have in the whole study is the fact that they can very acurately measure the level of CO2 that was present more acurately than any of the other variables in the study. Ice core samples provide some of the best historic samples of CO2 levels present on earth over literally millions of years and the one generally accepted theroies by all sides is there is no doubt more CO2 present today than there ever has been. The variant that causes the CO2 link to not be the absolute cause of Global Warming is that when looked at historically they can not conclusively link increase levels of CO2 to temperature spikes throughout history based on available data. That is one of the major areas where analysis over the dat breaks down from a statistical standpoint.
 
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Rich::
 
:rotfl: :rotfl2: Do you have facts to back your claim? :rotfl: :rotfl2: Again, your assertions are funny in that it is clear that you do not know what you are talking about. :rotfl: :rotfl2: All of the scientists at the IPCC disagree with you and they have real data that shows that you are wrong.


Typical of you. Don't like the message, so attack the messenger.

Of course those "scientists" disagree. They don't want to stop the gravy train. I can use the SAME data amd show COMPLETELY different results. But, that doesn't suit their agenda. So, they manipulate the data to their benefit.

It's a pretty simple concept.
 
Typical of you. Don't like the message, so attack the messenger.
What message? :rotfl: :rotfl2: For me to disagree with your message, you first have to have a message. You made what appears to be a claim without any apparent backing and I asked if you had any FACTS to back up your claim.

To date you have posted quotes taken out of context and here you make assertions that are against all of the peer review studies that are out there. The IPCC Summary for Policymakers that I posted earlier has some great charts and tables that show that your claims are wrong. If you have authority for your position, I missed it.

Again, you post false and misleading quotes without providing a cite and now you make a claim as to global cooling without any apparent authority. If you have authority provide it. :rotfl: :rotfl2: Otherwise, I will consider your claim to be on the same level as the misleading Al Gore quote that you took out of context. :rotfl: :rotfl2:
 
What message? :rotfl: :rotfl2: For me to disagree with your message, you first have to have a message. You made what appears to be a claim without any apparent backing and I asked if you had any FACTS to back up your claim.

To date you have posted quotes taken out of context and here you make assertions that are against all of the peer review studies that are out there. The IPCC Summary for Policymakers that I posted earlier has some great charts and tables that show that your claims are wrong. If you have authority for your position, I missed it.

Again, you post false and misleading quotes without providing a cite and now you make a claim as to global cooling without any apparent authority. If you have authority provide it. :rotfl: :rotfl2: Otherwise, I will consider your claim to be on the same level as the misleading Al Gore quote that you took out of context. :rotfl: :rotfl2:

I have YET to see you post a thought of your own and frankly, this is the longest post that I have seen you actually 'write'. Usually you offer up a cut and paste of opinions from every moonbat website known to man.
 
Of course those "scientists" disagree. They don't want to stop the gravy train. I can use the SAME data amd show COMPLETELY different results. But, that doesn't suit their agenda. So, they manipulate the data to their benefit.


Please use ACTUAL data and and show some kind of results, I wish you luck in shutting up the DOC but doubt that you will be able to back up any of your claims with actual data.
 
Bush had evidence that there were WMD's in Iraq. It was also backed up by evidence from the KGB, Scotland Yard, and other intelligence agencies.

Therefore, you should agree that going into Iraq was the right thing.

Or, do you only accept evidence that agrees with your point of view... regardless of its accuracy or validity.

Scotland Yard has nothing to do with this matter whatsoever. The reasoning presented to the UK parliament was based on limited intelligence mainly from the US there was no evidence as there were no WMDs it was intellegence, limited and unreliable. Our own intellegence services were hghly sceptical.
 
I despute global "warming." Compared to what?

Compared to 1988, it's cooler. Compared to the 1930's, it's cooler. Compared to 1000, it's cooler.

I was debating with rockbottomsound not you on this point so don't jump in as though it was your point I was responding to, it is confusing, but then again you may wish just to promote confusion.
 
Jumping in once more. And begging forgivness, once more.

I am simply eager to clarify part of the discussion.
Below, you'll find the entire text of the "Bush loves ecology---at home" article that appeared in the Chicago Tribune, which I purchased from their web archives. Hard as I try to remain open-minded and neutral, the idea that Bush "walks the walk" is simply not so. Though I do very much applaud his private efforts at his home in Texas, as the preeminent policymaker of this country, his "walking the walk" would entail advocating effective environmental legislation. Which he has not done.

The 4,000-square-foot house is a model of environmental rectitude.

Geothermal heat pumps located in a central closet circulate water through pipes buried 300 feet deep in the ground where the temperature is a constant 67 degrees; the water heats the house in the winter and cools it in the summer. Systems such as the one in this "eco-friendly" dwelling use about 25% of the electricity that traditional heating and cooling systems utilize.

A 25,000-gallon underground cistern collects rainwater gathered from roof runs; wastewater from sinks, toilets and showers goes into underground purifying tanks and is also funneled into the cistern. The water from the cistern is used to irrigate the landscaping surrounding the four-bedroom home. Plants and flowers native to the high prairie area blend the structure into the surrounding ecosystem.

No, this is not the home of some eccentrically wealthy eco-freak trying to shame his fellow citizens into following the pristineness of his self-righteous example. And no, it is not the wilderness retreat of the Sierra Club or the Natural Resources Defense Council, a haven where tree-huggers plot political strategy.

This is President George W. Bush's "Texas White House" outside the small town of Crawford.

Yes, the same George W. who believes arsenic and drinking water might not be such a bad combo, the same man who reneged on his campaign promise to lower carbon dioxide emissions from power plants, the same man who is doing everything in his power to fling open the Alaskan Natural Wildlife Refuge to oil drilling.

How does the President reconcile an eco-friendly abode for his own family with his persistent stand against anything that smacks of an environmentally friendly agenda for the nation as a whole? The answer to that perplexing question is a real mystery.

Perhaps sound ecological practices are only for those who can afford them: as a self-proclaimed strict constructionist of the U.S. Constitution, Bush must be aware that clean air and clean water are not guaranteed in that glorious document. Perhaps in Bush's Brave New Corporate World, clean natural resources are merely commodities in a free-market economy: if you can pay for them, fine; if not, tough. The rest of us will just have to put up with more toxic dumps and more public lands being turned over to logging, mining and oil companies.

According to David Heymann, the house's architect and associate dean of the University of Texas architecture department, Heymann designed the house so that "every room has a relationship with something in the landscape that's different from the room next door. Each of the rooms feels like a slightly different place."

In a USA Today interview, Heymann said, "There's a great grove of oak trees to the west that protects it from the late afternoon sun. Then there is a view out to the north looking at hills, and to the east out over a lake, and the view to the south . . . out to beautiful hills."

I suppose in George W.'s architectural world only the rich and powerful have views; vistas that the public owns as part of its shared heritage are up for lease and sale.

Heymann also termed the house "stunningly small." Really? Would it be stunningly small for a single mother in South Central Los Angeles? How stunningly small would it be for an immigrant Latino family in San Antonio Maybe in the rarified heights where second homes are the norm, 4,000 square feet is small and on a stunning scale as well, but in Main Street America that much elbow room is pretty big for the first and only home.

But then most of us can't reconcile what might at first glance appear to be inherently irreconcilable. Maybe some day, like our noble president, we will be able to make that kind of staggering mental feat. That is, if we ever stop misunderestimating ourselves.
 
I suppose in George W.'s architectural world only the rich and powerful have views; vistas that the public owns as part of its shared heritage are up for lease and sale.

Heymann also termed the house "stunningly small." Really? Would it be stunningly small for a single mother in South Central Los Angeles? How stunningly small would it be for an immigrant Latino family in San Antonio Maybe in the rarified heights where second homes are the norm, 4,000 square feet is small and on a stunning scale as well, but in Main Street America that much elbow room is pretty big for the first and only home.

But then most of us can't reconcile what might at first glance appear to be inherently irreconcilable. Maybe some day, like our noble president, we will be able to make that kind of staggering mental feat. That is, if we ever stop misunderestimating ourselves.

Above quoted from the article about George.

I guess it's all just more whining from the "have nots" :)
 







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