Abbott's New COVID-19 Test: 97%-98% Accuracy, 15-Minute Turnaround, $5 Cost

[PrincessShmoo]

While you are talking about this, here’s the ad displayed many times on my page:

View attachment 523226

Is it just for me, or are y’all getting the same?

I use an adblocker, so I don't see those things.

 

[auntlynne]

Happy DISboards anniversary! 12 yrs ago today you joined the best forum on the wikiweb.

Thank you. I hadn’t noticed. I joined in preparation for our first 7-night Cruise, Halloween 2008. I miss the group interaction we used to have here - and the format. I could find conversations or info here, but FB pretty much limits me to only the most recent posts. I have not taken the time to become app-savvy.

Currently, I am delving into the WDW side of DISboards in preparation for some upcoming trips. Thanks to COVID-induced changes and new rides introduced in the last nearly six years, I feel like I need a re-introduction to an old friend.

 

[auntlynne]

.... swan is only in the nose for a few seconds.

That one letter slip let us have a little fun, which most of us could use any day, not just in COVID times.

Hope it didn’t offend. Have a great day - and hope you manage to stay virus free.

 

[T & R]

That one letter slip let us have a little fun, which most of us could use any day, not just in COVID times.

Hope it didn’t offend. Have a great day - and hope you manage to stay virus free.

From now on we're just going to start referring to it as a swan test.

 

[Intr3pid]

From now on we're just going to start referring to it as a swan test.

...and a black swan test if you only find out about it at the terminal.

 

[monkeydawn]

What a difference one space on the keyboard makes - I think a swan up the nose would be worse than a Pap smear.

Sorry for inserting humor in this serious conversation.

Some swans are pretty aggressive. I mean, I could probable deal with a duck but I think a swan is just asking for trouble.

I can see cruise lines constantly testing their staff and crew. And perhaps at embarkation. Continuously testing throughout the cruise or at different ports I don’t know. I think it also depends on the length of the cruise. It’s just a logistical nightmare even if you’re only sailing at half capacity.

Daily testing makes no sense for shorter cruises. I mean you test people who get on the boat so they’re “safe”. But on a three or four night Bahama or Baja cruise if by the slim chance someone catches Covid while in Port or had a negative test at embarkation but turns positive you would most likely be home anyways by time you would get a positive reading or show symptoms. Since from what understand you need at least a day or two or three in order to have that viral load show up on a test. So I can see for the shorter cruises they would just test at embarkation.

And I believe if you test at ports you’re not gonna show a person with a positive reading that just got infected within that day.

This statement assumes you could have only possibly been exposed just before boarding. If someone was exposed 3 days before boarding that test might be negative but a test the next day could be positive. I really dont see a responsible way to cruise without (1) mostly reliable daily testing, (2) vaccines that are trusted and administered to enough of the population or (3) treatment options that are cheap and stable enough to be stocked in sufficient quantities. I think before we get one of those options we wont see cruising *really* returning and ideally we'd have at least two of those options available to have higher consumer confidence. Too many false starts will kill cruising as we knew it (still might be an ultra luxury, high ticket thing).

 

[mm824]

Have you actually had one? I know everyone has different discomfort thresholds but Ive seen it likened to a pap smear as far as discomfort level. Maybe a little freakier since you can see what's going on, unlike a pap. I wouldnt be signing up for daily pap smears for fun but its certainly something I'd consider if it needed to happen as one part of the plan for reopening some activities more safely.

We've had them. They're uncomfortable, but mainly feels like a giant booger : ) (FWIW, I find a pap smear to be far worse).

I suspect we'll hit herd immunity before the vaccine comes out. Many studies have concluded that through contact heterogeneity, only ~ 20% is needed. NYC hit that number back in April, at which point, rates began falling and have flatlined.

 

[squirk]

They made a good point on the podcast a few months back - even if we can thoroughly test everyone before they set foot on that ship and have high confidence that everyone is "clean," what do we do at the ports? If you go off on a port adventure, or even just do your own thing, and come into contact with someone who's infected, I don't think even the best test in the world has the capacity to detect that quickly after exposure, and you could bring it back onto the ship with you.

I wonder if they'd start with "test" cruises that stop only at CC, a totally controlled environment on Disney's part. Or maybe give the industry some temporary relief from maritime laws and allow cruises to nowhere for time being.

 

[disneygeek401]

They made a good point on the podcast a few months back - even if we can thoroughly test everyone before they set foot on that ship and have high confidence that everyone is "clean," what do we do at the ports? If you go off on a port adventure, or even just do your own thing, and come into contact with someone who's infected, I don't think even the best test in the world has the capacity to detect that quickly after exposure, and you could bring it back onto the ship with you.

I wonder if they'd start with "test" cruises that stop only at CC, a totally controlled environment on Disney's part. Or maybe give the industry some temporary relief from maritime laws and allow cruises to nowhere for time being.

I honestly would be shocked if they DIDN'T strictly do the shorter cruises to just CC to start, but then again I do not have a crystal ball. Lot of it will depend other lines are doing, what the CDC guidelines are, what is the stage of the pandemic, will they requrie vaccination, etc.

 

[Intr3pid]

They made a good point on the podcast a few months back - even if we can thoroughly test everyone before they set foot on that ship and have high confidence that everyone is "clean," what do we do at the ports? If you go off on a port adventure, or even just do your own thing, and come into contact with someone who's infected, I don't think even the best test in the world has the capacity to detect that quickly after exposure, and you could bring it back onto the ship with you.

I wonder if they'd start with "test" cruises that stop only at CC, a totally controlled environment on Disney's part. Or maybe give the industry some temporary relief from maritime laws and allow cruises to nowhere for time being.

The cruise lines that have resumed sailing are doing excursions in a bubble - meaning no third-party excursions and no extraneous contact. You go out and come back in only on ship-arranged, carefully managed excursions where the bubble is strictly maintained from start to finish.

Yes, it means less choice for now - but that's OK. The go-go days of freestyle cruising can wait a year.

 

[squirk]

The cruise lines that have resumed sailing are doing excursions in a bubble - meaning no third-party excursions and no extraneous contact. You go out and come back in only on ship-arranged, carefully managed excursions where the bubble is strictly maintained from start to finish.

Yes, it means less choice for now - but that's OK. The go-go days of freestyle cruising can wait a year.

Not that I don't enjoy the ports, but honestly, it would be an interesting change of pace to do cruises to nowhere and not have ports to plan around. Obviously, you never have to get off at a port if you don't want to, but just to have the option taken off the table entirely? I wouldn't mind trying that, especially right now.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

Not that I don't enjoy the ports, but honestly, it would be an interesting change of pace to do cruises to nowhere and not have ports to plan around. Obviously, you never have to get off at a port if you don't want to, but just to have the option taken off the table entirely? I wouldn't mind trying that, especially right now.

Unfortunately, cruises to nowhere are not legal from US ports.

 

[squirk]

Unfortunately, cruises to nowhere are not legal from US ports.

I'm aware of that. In my prior post, I wondered if the U.S. would cut the cruise industry a break and temporarily suspend the PVSA prohibition on cruises to nowhere for foreign-flagged ships.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

I'm aware of that. In my prior post, I wondered if the U.S. would cut the cruise industry a break and temporarily suspend the PVSA prohibition on cruises to nowhere for foreign-flagged ships.

Cruises to nowhere are not illegal by the PVSA. It has to do with work visas for the crew. A cruise to nowhere was determined to be "employment within the US" and the work visas required currently for foreign crew working on cruises from the US, that stop in foreign ports, is different than the visa required for foreign workers working solely in the US. More paperwork involved, and more cost for those visas, and most cruise lines won't do it.

 

[T & R]

I'm aware of that. In my prior post, I wondered if the U.S. would cut the cruise industry a break and temporarily suspend the PVSA prohibition on cruises to nowhere for foreign-flagged ships.

Not counting the Visa thing like Shmoo described, it would not be hard at all to get around the PVSA. It is written into the PVSA that you can simply pay a $762 fine per passenger for not abiding by the Act. I would be willing to let DCL tack on an extra $762 pp to my cruise price if they would let us start cruising again. If others think that amount is to high, then they can simply wait until foreign ports come back into service and prices go back to normal. Also, the Act says ships can request waivers during times of National Defense. It would not be hard to articulate that Covid has caused a state of emergency and that not visiting foreign ports would be in the best interest of national defense due to the potential risk of bringing back Covid contracted at those foreign ports. Wouldn't hurt to request such a waiver, the worst that could happen is they say no and you are just right back where you started, no harm.

The easiest way to me would just be to pay the fine or pay the extra cost of the Visas like Schmoo described and then pass those extra Visa costs onto the price of the cruise. I would be understanding that things cost more to get done when your dealing with these draconian regulations from the 1880's.

 

[squirk]

Not counting the Visa thing like Shmoo described, it would not be hard at all to get around the PVSA. It is written into the PVSA that you can simply pay a $762 fine per passenger for not abiding by the Act. I would be willing to let DCL tack on an extra $762 pp to my cruise price if they would let us start cruising again. If others think that amount is to high, then they can simply wait until foreign ports come back into service and prices go back to normal. Also, the Act says ships can request waivers during times of National Defense. It would not be hard to articulate that Covid has caused a state of emergency and that not visiting foreign ports would be in the best interest of national defense due to the potential risk of bringing back Covid contracted at those foreign ports. Wouldn't hurt to request such a waiver, the worst that could happen is they say no and you are just right back where you started, no harm.

The easiest way to me would just be to pay the fine or pay the extra cost of the Visas like Schmoo described and then pass those extra Visa costs onto the price of the cruise. I would be understanding that things cost more to get done when your dealing with these draconian regulations from the 1880's.

Yes. that was the point of my post, particulars aside: can and would the federal gov't temporarily suspend the roadblocks - legal, financial or otherwise - to allow the cruise industry to sail to nowhere and give itself a shot in the arm?

Is there a practical way to grant temporary visa relief? Could they automatically waive the $762 fine for the next six months? I have no idea. Just spitballing.

 

[BruinEd03]

Yes. that was the point of my post, particulars aside: can and would the federal gov't temporarily suspend the roadblocks - legal, financial or otherwise - to allow the cruise industry to sail to nowhere and give itself a shot in the arm?

Is there a practical way to grant temporary visa relief? Could they automatically waive the $762 fine for the next six months? I have no idea. Just spitballing.

The federal government can do anything they want, but the question is why would they help? The cruise ships are specifically flagged in foreign countries to avoid US taxes and regulations. I also doubt the cruise employees pay US taxes. So from an optics perspective, it may not look good (even if going on cruises may spur ancillary US businesses such as hotel stays, airplane flights, etc.).

 

[squirk]

Yes. that was the point of my post, particulars aside: can and would the federal gov't temporarily suspend the roadblocks - legal, financial or otherwise - to allow the cruise industry to sail to nowhere and give itself a shot in the arm? Could they, for example, automatically waive the $762 fine for the next six months?

The federal government can do anything they want, but the question is why would they help? The cruise ships are specifically flagged in foreign countries to avoid US taxes and regulations. I also doubt the cruise employees pay US taxes. So from an optics perspective, it may not look good (even if going on cruises may spur ancillary US businesses such as hotel stays, airplane flights, etc.).

The ancillary side of things, as you mentioned - the component of the cruise industry that hits the U.S. as taxable revenue - was what was on my mind. As was the optics of “starting to return to normalcy”. But your point is well-taken.

 

[Intr3pid]

The federal government can do anything they want, but the question is why would they help? The cruise ships are specifically flagged in foreign countries to avoid US taxes and regulations. I also doubt the cruise employees pay US taxes. So from an optics perspective, it may not look good (even if going on cruises may spur ancillary US businesses such as hotel stays, airplane flights, etc.).

The foreign flag isn't what determines the tax status; it's the jurisdiction of incorporation -- which admittedly is still the tax-free centers such as Liberia.

The foreign flag exempts ships from the US regulations and labor laws as long as they spend most of their time outside of the US waters. This is the same situation for other US ships - such as freight carriers and fuel tankers - operating in other countries; they are not subject to the laws of other countries either. There are less than 400 cruise ships in the world compared to almost 50,000 other marine vessels all enjoying the same maritime reciprocity exemptions.

The cruise lines come to the US ports to pick up passengers but they spend 90% of their time in international waters or in other countries' ports. Just like Atlantis in Bahamas doesn't pay taxes in the US, a cruise ship shouldn't have to pay taxes in the US either if the main business isn't being conducted in the US.

To the extent they make use of the US facilities, the ports - such as Miami, PC, Fort Lauderdale - extract hefty fees - nevertheless passed on the US customers. There are also billions of dollars being spent indirectly on secondary services - admin, accounting, infrastructure, transportation, etc. - not to mention the local hospitality. About 15% of Florida's tourism revenues are estimated to be derived from the operations of cruise ships.

Your point is very valid. The arrangement I have described is fair in both directions, so the US doesn't owe the cruise industry anything. And that's how it should be.

But, the PVSA needs to go. Its an antiquated law that makes very little sense today.

 

[mousefan73]

I think people just need to accept there will never be a 100% guarantee of zero exposure. Tests reduce risk- not eliminate. Same with a vaccine. I got whooping cough and had the childhood vaccine. I have a feeling many are saying they will not travel or sail again until there is 100% guarantee they will not get sick- well that is never gonna happen.
Have people forgotten there are have been many other communal diseases out there the whole time in the past that put people at risk?? Hepatitus A for example.. Bet most of us dont have that vaccine, but have traveled to Mexico/Carribean and never thought how well the person who cut the pinapple for our beach cocktails washed their hands. Heck my DH even got Tyhoid as a kid and never left town.