A terrorism question for you.

[Amlee]

Ok, with all of the comments on Obama's associations with Bill Ayers and those defending it. Or saying what Ayers did happened years ago and is a changed man now. Not just on the board, but in the media also.


I have to ask would you say the same about the people who were behind the 9/11 bombing or the OK bomber, or the London bombers, or the people behind the Holocaust, how about the guy who did all the shootings a few years back in Washington?

I'm not saying Obama is in any way connected to what this man has done in his past. BUT, I don't think Ayers actions can be justified by saying oh it was done way back when, and now he's not that way.

 

[singingpixie]

For me it's not about how long ago Ayers' crimes were, it's that the nature of Barak Obama's associations with him were completely separate from any sort of anti-government or terrorist activities. Like it or not, this guy is big enough in Chicago to serve on the boards of some pretty big charity projects. That to me is the bigger issue- there could be a good argument that these organizations shouldn't want to be associated with him. But the fact that Obama also served on the board of one of these organizations doesn't change my opinion of him- it's not like they were in some dark basement plotting a revolution.

 

[akhenaten]

i believe in our system of justice and ayers was dealt with, yes, years ago. he has been a productive member of society and worked at prestigious schools.

his past should not be held against him endlessly......

the other terrorists you mentioned were either delt with or will be and will serve their time....

none of this... has anything to do with obama...
i have worked with folks and i am in no way responsible for their past or present life choices....

mccain on the other hand vacationed many times with keating....a much closer association...if you believe in guilt by association .....

 

[Angelhalo]

For me it has nothing to do with what Ayers did. I don't condone it any way. My problem is the OS trying to concoct some sort of relationship between Ayers and Obama that simply isn't there. Its the same old lies as usual. They live in the same neighborhood, and help the same groups. I hardly see this as them being pals or anything other than mere aquaintances. It would be like saying that I am pals with McCain because my mom is a republican. Not bloody likely.

 

[a1tinkfans]

An interesting LINK, and MUST SEE! YOU DECIDE!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiXwZI_YqHY

 

[Mickeyistheman]

Ok, with all of the comments on Obama's associations with Bill Ayers and those defending it. Or saying what Ayers did happened years ago and is a changed man now. Not just on the board, but in the media also.


I have to ask would you say the same about the people who were behind the 9/11 bombing or the OK bomber, or the London bombers, or the people behind the Holocaust, how about the guy who did all the shootings a few years back in Washington?

I'm not saying Obama is in any way connected to what this man has done in his past. BUT, I don't think Ayers actions can be justified by saying oh it was done way back when, and now he's not that way.

Whew, this is going to be a tough one here. I am trying very hard to be as polite and factual as I can. 9/11 is a touchy subject with me but I wanted to respond to your last question.

Ayers was protesting against the Vietnam war, as many were doing back then. I also don't condone what was done BUT he has realized his actions and now is doing good. He did not WANT TO HURT OR KILL OR RUIN A SOCIETY like a few you had mentioned in your above post.

Hitler was behind the Holocaust, he wanted to create his own society so if you believed in something else and I don't agree you should die. He wanted to be God. THAT is very scarey, however some feel that the Holocaust didn't happen. I find that to be intriguing since we have photos and movie reels which are real there is no CGI.

Osama hates us and wanted to kill innocent people going about their daily routine and if we didn't catch on as quickly as we did more people would have died if more planes got up in the air.

To even link Obama to those people upsets me greatly, why would you think this man dislikes this country so? He is running to be President to make it better for the regular man and woman with equal rights and stop the war, give Health care to EVERYONE and get our economy back on track.

I at many timese these past 6 years was not happy with my country but that was because I wasn't happy with my government (President etc).

I think that is what many people miss about Ayers.

The OK bombing was terrible I was a Junior in Highschool and remember when that happened. The guy in Washington I think he was a sniper I don't actually remember why he was doing it, but that doesnt make him a terrorist. He might have just been crazy.

 

[djm99]

I got this from John K. Wilson: Thirty Lies Refuted About Ayers And Obama

LIE: "Bill Ayers is an unrepentant terrorist."

TRUTH: Bill Ayers is not, and apparently never was, a terrorist. The conventional definition of a terrorist is someone who tries to kill innocent people for political purposes. As Factcheck.org noted, In fact, nobody died as a result of bombings in which Ayers said he participated as part of the Weather Underground. (Factcheck.org)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-k-wilson/30-lies-refuted-about-aye_b_132109.html

 

[luvmy3]

I got this from John K. Wilson: Thirty Lies Refuted About Ayers And Obama

LIE: "Bill Ayers is an unrepentant terrorist."

TRUTH: Bill Ayers is not, and apparently never was, a terrorist. The conventional definition of a terrorist is someone who tries to kill innocent people for political purposes. As Factcheck.org noted, In fact, nobody died as a result of bombings in which Ayers said he participated as part of the Weather Underground. (Factcheck.org)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-k-wilson/30-lies-refuted-about-aye_b_132109.html

You don't need to kill anyone to be a terrorist.

Main Entry: ter·ror·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈter-ər-ˌi-zəm\
Function: noun
Date: 1795
: the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion

 

[eliza61]

Ok, with all of the comments on Obama's associations with Bill Ayers and those defending it. Or saying what Ayers did happened years ago and is a changed man now. Not just on the board, but in the media also.


I have to ask would you say the same about the people who were behind the 9/11 bombing or the OK bomber, or the London bombers, or the people behind the Holocaust, how about the guy who did all the shootings a few years back in Washington?

I'm not saying Obama is in any way connected to what this man has done in his past. BUT, I don't think Ayers actions can be justified by saying oh it was done way back when, and now he's not that way.

I think the problem is with the blanket way we begin to characterize people from 1 point in there lives. If you are going to judge Ayers past then you must judge his entire past not just 9 months out of his youth.
Thats what happen during the "Red" scare of the 1950's. People who had so much as talked to some one who was "thought" to be a communist where villified. So it's always a very risky business to start condeming people by "association"

In the same vein, my family lived & participated in the civil rights marches. I mean attacked by dogs, fire hoses, the whole 9 yards. Do we know start condeming all the Caucasians in Mobile & Montgomery who knew one of the cops or fire men?
I would caution simple common sense. Find out all the information, not just 1 article or 1 sound bite.

 

[DawnCt1]

i believe in our system of justice and ayers was dealt with, yes, years ago. he has been a productive member of society and worked at prestigious schools.

his past should not be held against him endlessly......

the other terrorists you mentioned were either delt with or will be and will serve their time....

none of this... has anything to do with obama...
i have worked with folks and i am in no way responsible for their past or present life choices....

mccain on the other hand vacationed many times with keating....a much closer association...if you believe in guilt by association .....

He was dealt with??? How???? He got off because of he illegal wiretapping by the FBI at the time, after being involved in over 30 bombings. His wife served time in jail. As late as Sept 10th, 2001, he said that he "didn't do enough" as he stood on the American flag.
He and Obama sat on the Chicago Annenberg Challenge and used funds in an attempt to radicalized the Chicago school system because they sure as heck weren't interested in improving test grades. Anyone that applied for funding for math or academic skills were turned down. Schools did not improve. He and Obama were students of Saul Alinsky, "Rules for Radicals". The premise is to use the system to beat the system. Did Ayers change? I dont' think so, he just found another way to promote his leftist ideas and make a living at it.

 

[DawnCt1]

I got this from John K. Wilson: Thirty Lies Refuted About Ayers And Obama

LIE: "Bill Ayers is an unrepentant terrorist."

TRUTH: Bill Ayers is not, and apparently never was, a terrorist. The conventional definition of a terrorist is someone who tries to kill innocent people for political purposes. As Factcheck.org noted, In fact, nobody died as a result of bombings in which Ayers said he participated as part of the Weather Underground. (Factcheck.org)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-k-wilson/30-lies-refuted-about-aye_b_132109.html

He founded the Weather Underground. Two men died in the Brinks bombing. Now the way I see it, OBL organized Al Qaeda and Khalid Sheikh Mohammed planned the operation of 9/11. They are both terrorists and murderers. Ayers got off on a technicality but he isn't "innocent".

 

[tink_n_pooh]

My parents told me a long time ago to choose my friends wisely, they will impact who I am - if not actually who I become, at least who others see me as. My parents are smart people.

Ayers may have done his damage a long time ago but it doesn't change the fact that he did it and openly admits that he does not regret the things he did.

 

[SteveInBrooklyn]

The only terrorists that matter in this race are the ones trying to hurt America, the ones that we FAILED to capture, the ones LAUGHING as our economy collapses, and celebrating as they continue to kill Americans. The Republican administration's war on terror is an UTTER FAILURE. Time to give the other party a chance.

 

[DawnCt1]

My parents told me a long time ago to choose my friends wisely, they will impact who I am - if not actually who I become, at least who others see me as. My parents are smart people.

Ayers may have done his damage a long time ago but it doesn't change the fact that he did it and openly admits that he does not regret the things he did.

Exactly. Your parents were wise people. For some reason, Obama is very comfortable sitting on the left side of the room. His choice in friends have been questionable at best.

 

[DawnCt1]

The only terrorists that matter in this race are the ones trying to hurt America, the ones that we FAILED to capture, the ones LAUGHING as our economy collapses, and celebrating as they continue to kill Americans. The Republican administration's war on terror is an UTTER FAILURE. Time to give the other party a chance.

Bill Ayers did hurt America and he would have hurt America more, if he had the opportunity. He regrets that he didn't do more. Al Qaeda has been severely downgraded and we have captured and killed large numbers of them. It is completely erroneous to say that the war on terror is a FAILURE. No one thought that in 2001 we would not have another attack. We haven't. All terrorists matter, the 'accurate bombers" and the inept ones as well.

 

[phragmipedium]

No, what Bill Ayers did was not right. But it also has zero to do with Barack Obama and his ability to be president. And shame on McCain for letting and/or encouraging Palin to go there, because it forces Obama to dig skeletons out of their closet too, that also don't matter. Obama cannot allow himself to be swiftboated the way they did to John Kerry, so if McCain's campaign is going to drag up stuff that has no real bearing on this election to try to discredit his character, Obama has to defend himself.

And I'm SICK that McCain started it and that they're both playing this game, because none of this matters. Not Keating, not Ayers, none of it. If they've both been able to get to this point in the game, none of these issues present a problem in their ability to be high-level politicians including president, and one of them *is* going to be president, so we need to get over who their friends may or may not have been in the past. And this nonsense is taking away from real issues that whoever becomes president is actually going to have to deal with - the economy and what needs to be done, primarily. I'm extremely tired of these distractions (started this go-round by McCain/Palin to take the focus off the economy, in my opinion) because they are not relevant to this election or their potential presidencies. It's garbage, all of it, and it's already been out there discussed, and I don't think the average voter is interested in hearing about it anymore.

 

[Mickeyistheman]

Bush didn't hurt the American People?

He outrighted lied to us and because of that we have lost too many soliders for a war we should NOT be involved in any longer.

So does he have blood on his hands? You do realize that if enough Americans got together Bush could be prosecuted for War Crimes oh and Cheney too. Just an FYI

 

[SteveInBrooklyn]

Bill Ayers did hurt America and he would have hurt America more, if he had the opportunity. He regrets that he didn't do more. Al Qaeda has been severely downgraded and we have captured and killed large numbers of them. It is completely erroneous to say that the war on terror is a FAILURE. No one thought that in 2001 we would not have another attack. We haven't. All terrorists matter, the 'accurate bombers" and the inept ones as well.

Ayers is irrelevant. He is not now nor was he ever a friend of Barack Obama. Also, he never hurt a single human being, nor did he ever try to hurt a human being. But that is irrelevant, because Ayers and Obama are not friends. Factcheck.org say so.

As to al Qaeda's strength: they are still intact, they are still operational, they killed a US civilian in Yemen a month or two ago, they continue to kill our soldiers in Afghanistan. 7 YEARS AFTER 9/11!!!!!!!!! Furthermore, Osama bin Laden, celebrates as our economy collapses and calls it a victory for Islam. OUTRAGEOUS!!!!! WHy is he even breathing!!!!!!! We got Saddam, why can't we get bin Laden?????

There is a lot of indication that we haven't weakened al Qaeda much at all:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-07-11-us-terror-threat_N.htm


Failure. Utter, unequivocal, total FAILURE.

 

[akhenaten]

He was dealt with??? How???? He got off because of he illegal wiretapping by the FBI at the time, after being involved in over 30 bombings. His wife served time in jail. As late as Sept 10th, 2001, he said that he "didn't do enough" as he stood on the American flag.
He and Obama sat on the Chicago Annenberg Challenge and used funds in an attempt to radicalized the Chicago school system because they sure as heck weren't interested in improving test grades. Anyone that applied for funding for math or academic skills were turned down. Schools did not improve. He and Obama were students of Saul Alinsky, "Rules for Radicals". The premise is to use the system to beat the system. Did Ayers change? I dont' think so, he just found another way to promote his leftist ideas and make a living at it.

I don't know the details of the ayers case...and i really have no need to know them...
but he was arrested , i presume , and if he did not serve time because the FBI did not follow the law.... then they are responsible for his lack of punishment....

I have served on boards with a couple of men who were arrested for trying to get together with underage girls on the internet... they are scum and I had nothing to do with it....

again ..i abhor guilt by association....

 

[LotsOfQuestions]

You don't need to kill anyone to be a terrorist.

Main Entry: ter·ror·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈter-ər-ˌi-zəm\
Function: noun
Date: 1795
: the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion

If you want to get into stupid semantics, then one could say that the Bush administration were terrorists during the years that they bumped up to code orange every time something was not going their way.

That can be looked at as creating fear as a means of coercion of the American public.