A kid's violin - how important is quality?

[Magpie]

I sat in on my 12yo son's violin lesson, and he's doing great. But something his teacher said got me wondering...

I know less than nothing about music. We paid about 200 dollars Canadian for his violin. Bought it on sale at the big musical instrument place here in town. We could have gone a little cheaper, but those violins were painted and the guy said that sometimes they paint them to hide the flaws in the wood. So we got the next violin up.

His teacher, on the other hand, asked where we bought it while she was tuning it at the beginning of the class. And when I told her she kind of pursed her lips and made a little disapproving noise. Is he likely to have problems learning with this one?

I was hoping we'd get a few years out of the instrument, at least!

(Oy, I can only imagine her reaction if my son had arrived for his first lesson holding the bright red lacquered violin we saw in the shop! It was so pretty and cheap...)

 

[newMrs.Robinson]

We were told the same thing for our daughters violin. Our teacher actually said it was better to rent then have a cheap instrument. We were about to go that route when Grandma stepped in and got what the teacher wanted.

 

[Magpie]

We were told the same thing for our daughters violin. Our teacher actually said it was better to rent then have a cheap instrument. We were about to go that route when Grandma stepped in and got what the teacher wanted.

That's not reassuring... And the problem is, renting is SO much more expensive long term.

Well, maybe we'll put some money aside and look at buying another one next year, if he continues to do well. How much did the one your teacher wanted cost?

(Either that, or next summer I'll ask my dad if the kid can borrow one of his many, many fiddles that he's got stashed away in his house.)

 

[Janet Hill]

I bought a cheap on ~$200 from Shar Music. I asked a friend what she thought about it and she replied that's the type her kids had for the first 3 years.... and where are they now? One is currently attending the Boston Conservatory and the other graduated from Julliard.

So...I'm ok with her cheap instrument for now.

 

[golfgal]

You can find an inexpensive instrument that still has an ok sound quality for a kid. You can by a cheep one that sounds terrible too. If your son really starts taking off on the violin I would anticipate upgrading soon. In the long run you probably are paying more buy spending the $200 now and not being able to trade it in then you would have been renting and being able to use what you paid in rent to upgrade to a better quality violin in high school or so. Plan on that upgrade being $3000+ depending on how good he is. If you had rented and paid $1500, half of that would have been covered and he would have had a better instrument to start on.

 

[Pigeon]

I'd listen to the teacher. You are paying for her expertise.

Renting really is the way to go. Our rental fees can be applied to an instrument purchase.

 

[Magpie]

I'd listen to the teacher. You are paying for her expertise.

Renting really is the way to go. Our rental fees can be applied to an instrument purchase.

Well, she didn't actually SAY anything. Just sort of shook her head. So I'm hoping that means it isn't an *awful* violin, just clearly not a great one.

Right now the main focus seems to be getting him to keep his wrist straight. "This is not your saxophone!"

 

[Magpie]

You can find an inexpensive instrument that still has an ok sound quality for a kid. You can by a cheep one that sounds terrible too. If your son really starts taking off on the violin I would anticipate upgrading soon. In the long run you probably are paying more buy spending the $200 now and not being able to trade it in then you would have been renting and being able to use what you paid in rent to upgrade to a better quality violin in high school or so. Plan on that upgrade being $3000+ depending on how good he is. If you had rented and paid $1500, half of that would have been covered and he would have had a better instrument to start on.

I'm hoping that's what we've got now - inexpensive, with okay sound quality for a beginner.

I'm thinking if it sounded terrible, she would have said something right out, right? Also, she had my son identifying the notes he was playing, as well as correcting himself when he went flat or too sharp, and I'd guess he wouldn't be able to hear all that if it was a bad instrument.

But yikes! 3000? Really? What level of violin playing requires that?

My son needed to be studying a string instrument to go to the high school of his choice. He started in private lessons in September, and the deal was that once he gets accepted into the high school, he can drop strings. But... he's actually really focussed and he's progressing quickly. He's taking what he knows from playing sax and applying it to a totally different instrument (which surprised his teacher). As his teacher puts it, "He doesn't show enthusiasm, but once he starts playing, then he is enthusiastic." And I saw that for myself. So, I think he might stick with it long term.

 

[newMrs.Robinson]

DD violin was 600. She will need to upgrade in high school or possibly middle school if she joins the children's symphony but we were happy with this as a start. So far she is apparently very good, we got the call about children's symphony last week.

 

[Pigeon]

But yikes! 3000? Really? What level of violin playing requires that?

I've got a 13 yo who is pretty good. She plays in a regional, highly competitive orchestra, as well as the various school groups. Her teacher wants us to shell out $5K for a violin, but she thinks if we spend $5K, she can probably get us one that's worth $8K.

 

[donaldduck352]

The tuning of the instrument is the key.It's like a guitar,if it's not in tune it will sound horrible.

 

[jlima]

she thinks if we spend $5K, she can probably get us one that's worth $8K.

She probably can. My SIL used my niece's band director's friend's Yamaha connection to get a piccolo that they were very happy with. Hopefully the instructor has the industry connections to do this for you; it's an advantage of working with a good teacher.

 

[clh2]

Are there any GOOD, really good music instrument stores near you?

When DD needed a better flute - we purchased a used flute, that had been the back-up flute for a professional flute player. (The pro upgraded her main instrument, and her former main instrument became the new back-up.)

We got a great deal on this flute. We would have spent about $800 for "the next level up" flute. We got a $3000 flute for about $1200. That particular store sold instruments on consignment. And...the best part, we were able to taket he flute home, and have DD's band teacher look at it.

So yes - we could have spent $800 for a better flute, we opted for the $1200 for the great flute.

Just want to toss out another option...instead of buying a new instrument.

 

[Pigeon]

She probably can. My SIL used my niece's band director's friend's Yamaha connection to get a piccolo that they were very happy with. Hopefully the instructor has the industry connections to do this for you; it's an advantage of working with a good teacher.

Oh, I'm sure she can. She's amazing--used to teach at one of the finest conservatories in North America and has played with many famous folks.

It's the coming up with $5K for a violin to begin with that has me DD is a very good violinist, and I hope she sticks with it through high school, but I highly doubt it's going to be her career. We have college to save for.

 

[golfgal]

I'm hoping that's what we've got now - inexpensive, with okay sound quality for a beginner.

I'm thinking if it sounded terrible, she would have said something right out, right? Also, she had my son identifying the notes he was playing, as well as correcting himself when he went flat or too sharp, and I'd guess he wouldn't be able to hear all that if it was a bad instrument.

But yikes! 3000? Really? What level of violin playing requires that?

My son needed to be studying a string instrument to go to the high school of his choice. He started in private lessons in September, and the deal was that once he gets accepted into the high school, he can drop strings. But... he's actually really focussed and he's progressing quickly. He's taking what he knows from playing sax and applying it to a totally different instrument (which surprised his teacher). As his teacher puts it, "He doesn't show enthusiasm, but once he starts playing, then he is enthusiastic." And I saw that for myself. So, I think he might stick with it long term.

It isn't so much that he can be "in tune" it is the overall sound quality from the violin itself that makes the difference. If you went into a music store and heard someone play, even without knowing the difference, I would bet you would be able to pick out the better quality violin without looking at the price tag.

Cheep violins usually have a tinny/canny/whinny sound where as a better quality one will have more of a rich, true sound. If your finger is placed correctly an A will sound like an A but it the overall tone will be better on a nicer instrument. If he is going to a musically inclined high school and continues to play the violin, chances are he will need to upgrade as a freshman or sophomore. Even in a regular high school orchestra the better players will upgrade around then. When I was in high school it wasn't uncommon to spend $5K+ around your sophomore year on a good violin. We had an outstanding high school orchestra so that did make a difference. Three of my classmates are playing in professional orchestras (Boston, Cincinnati (I think) and Minnesota).

 

[Tinijocaro]

I'm a string teacher for 4th and 5th graders and have taught all the way through high school and years past. The teacher probably won't tell you if her instrument isn't good-the reason is parents often ignore when we, the experts, offer advice.

Our goal is not to make you shell out money. It is simply to be sure your child's instrument is not holding your child's learning back. I can't tell you how many parents dismiss my advice to not buy (on ebay, at a crappy music store in town) without having me check it out first.

There are so many things that can be wrong even with a brand new instrument. I won't go into all of them, but suffice it to say that you can really frustrate your child by going cheap on them. If you don't have expertise in string instruments, you should be getting advice from someone who does. A store in our town sells these adorable, shiny brand new instruments with all the accessories and they cost the same to buy as to rent! They are absolute garbage! Will not stay in tune (how frustrating for the student), bridge slides around, bow loses hair at alarming rates and the wood of the bow warps within months-plus, they sound like a trumpet!

A couple hundred dollars sounds like a lot and is probably a good amount to spend on a beginner but they will need to upgrade before too long. As a string student gets better, they need an instrument that will support their sound. The goal is to continue to make a fuller and richer sound, most beginner or cheap instruments can not give that kind of sound.

I've had parents buy violins off ebay or at Sears and end up having to pay for repairs before it is even playable! Even then, it is still a crappy instrument. You can tune a crappy instrument all you want and it will still sound crappy.

For the parent whose child was told to spend $5,000. I'd say unless your child is going into music for a career, forget it. A very accomplished and serious hs student could spend $2000 and be fine. Of course if you have the money and want to, go ahead.

$400-$800 dollars is not unreasonable for a middle or high school student to spend on an instrument. If you are in a wealthy area, there will be a push to spend more, and peer pressure too.

 

[mjkacmom]

I would never buy an instrument for a beginner. DH plays the guitar (and we have thousands of dollars worth in our house). He insists that one needs to start out with a good instrument, or else it gets out of tune quickly, and can be frustrating.

 

[golfgal]

I'm a string teacher for 4th and 5th graders and have taught all the way through high school and years past. The teacher probably won't tell you if her instrument isn't good-the reason is parents often ignore when we, the experts, offer advice.

Our goal is not to make you shell out money. It is simply to be sure your child's instrument is not holding your child's learning back. I can't tell you how many parents dismiss my advice to not buy (on ebay, at a crappy music store in town) without having me check it out first.

There are so many things that can be wrong even with a brand new instrument. I won't go into all of them, but suffice it to say that you can really frustrate your child by going cheap on them. If you don't have expertise in string instruments, you should be getting advice from someone who does. A store in our town sells these adorable, shiny brand new instruments with all the accessories and they cost the same to buy as to rent! They are absolute garbage! Will not stay in tune (how frustrating for the student), bridge slides around, bow loses hair at alarming rates and the wood of the bow warps within months-plus, they sound like a trumpet!

A couple hundred dollars sounds like a lot and is probably a good amount to spend on a beginner but they will need to upgrade before too long. As a string student gets better, they need an instrument that will support their sound. The goal is to continue to make a fuller and richer sound, most beginner or cheap instruments can not give that kind of sound.

I've had parents buy violins off ebay or at Sears and end up having to pay for repairs before it is even playable! Even then, it is still a crappy instrument. You can tune a crappy instrument all you want and it will still sound crappy.

For the parent whose child was told to spend $5,000. I'd say unless your child is going into music for a career, forget it. A very accomplished and serious hs student could spend $2000 and be fine. Of course if you have the money and want to, go ahead.

$400-$800 dollars is not unreasonable for a middle or high school student to spend on an instrument. If you are in a wealthy area, there will be a push to spend more, and peer pressure too.

I wasn't the parent, I was the child. The classmates I have that did get violins in this price range ARE professional musicians. Most of the rest of us spent a couple thousand on an upgrade.

Magpie-don't forget he will need to upgrade his saxophone as well. Your poor checkbook

 

[Magpie]

I'm a string teacher for 4th and 5th graders and have taught all the way through high school and years past. The teacher probably won't tell you if her instrument isn't good-the reason is parents often ignore when we, the experts, offer advice.

Our goal is not to make you shell out money. It is simply to be sure your child's instrument is not holding your child's learning back. I can't tell you how many parents dismiss my advice to not buy (on ebay, at a crappy music store in town) without having me check it out first.

There are so many things that can be wrong even with a brand new instrument. I won't go into all of them, but suffice it to say that you can really frustrate your child by going cheap on them. If you don't have expertise in string instruments, you should be getting advice from someone who does. A store in our town sells these adorable, shiny brand new instruments with all the accessories and they cost the same to buy as to rent! They are absolute garbage! Will not stay in tune (how frustrating for the student), bridge slides around, bow loses hair at alarming rates and the wood of the bow warps within months-plus, they sound like a trumpet!

A couple hundred dollars sounds like a lot and is probably a good amount to spend on a beginner but they will need to upgrade before too long. As a string student gets better, they need an instrument that will support their sound. The goal is to continue to make a fuller and richer sound, most beginner or cheap instruments can not give that kind of sound.

I've had parents buy violins off ebay or at Sears and end up having to pay for repairs before it is even playable! Even then, it is still a crappy instrument. You can tune a crappy instrument all you want and it will still sound crappy.

For the parent whose child was told to spend $5,000. I'd say unless your child is going into music for a career, forget it. A very accomplished and serious hs student could spend $2000 and be fine. Of course if you have the money and want to, go ahead.

$400-$800 dollars is not unreasonable for a middle or high school student to spend on an instrument. If you are in a wealthy area, there will be a push to spend more, and peer pressure too.

Thank you! This is exactly what I needed to know. I'm going to presume that the instrument he's got now will do him for his first year of learning, but that if he goes into the string theory program in high school we'll have to upgrade.

We'll put money aside now and at the end of the year, I'll ask the teacher what she recommends that we buy for him - and where!

We did buy it at a real music store, not Sears. And it wasn't the cheapest.

I wasn't the parent, I was the child. The classmates I have that did get violins in this price range ARE professional musicians. Most of the rest of us spent a couple thousand on an upgrade.

Magpie-don't forget he will need to upgrade his saxophone as well. Your poor checkbook

Oh, lordy... don't tell me that! His saxophone cost 800 dollars, and he's finally got all the keys striking right, no more leaks and a good sound coming out of it.

I've been blissfully assuming this instrument will be good for years to come. (It will, right? Right???)

 

[golfgal]

Thank you! This is exactly what I needed to know. I'm going to presume that the instrument he's got now will do him for his first year of learning, but that if he goes into the string theory program in high school we'll have to upgrade.

We'll put money aside now and at the end of the year, I'll ask the teacher what she recommends that we buy for him - and where!

We did buy it at a real music store, not Sears.



Oh, lordy... don't tell me that! His saxophone cost 800 dollars, and he's finally got all the keys striking right, no more leaks and a good sound coming out of it.

I've been blissfully assuming this instrument will be good for years to come. (It will, right? Right???)

I guess it is the same as the violin-had you rented one you would have gotten a better quality instrument, not had to pay for repairs and would have had the money spent to help pay for an upgrade. Our twins both play the saxophone. Their saxes cost $1500 each-which we paid for by renting over time (a little over 2 years). They have upgraded ligatures but their instruments will carry them all through high school. If they were more serious about playing we would probably be upgrading about now-BUT instead of paying $3000 for the upgrade, we would only pay $1500.

The marching band got caught in the rain during a performance and DS' sax needed several pads replaced and I don't know what else done. DD's needed a few pads replaced. We paid ZERO to get that done because we had rented through the music store program (they are paid off now though). Sure, you might have started out paying $800 but how much have you put into it sense. Our band directors pretty much tell the kids which instruments they want them to rent. They know a lot more about it then we do so I trust their opinions.