A kid's violin - how important is quality?

[tlbwriter]

That's not reassuring... And the problem is, renting is SO much more expensive long term.

No kidding. We found a good reconditioned used clarinet for $300. Renting a lesser quality (but brand new) clarinet through the school's approved vendor would have cost $50 a month.

 

[Magpie]

I guess it is the same as the violin-had you rented one you would have gotten a better quality instrument, not had to pay for repairs and would have had the money spent to help pay for an upgrade. Our twins both play the saxophone. Their saxes cost $1500 each-which we paid for by renting over time (a little over 2 years). They have upgraded ligatures but their instruments will carry them all through high school. If they were more serious about playing we would probably be upgrading about now-BUT instead of paying $3000 for the upgrade, we would only pay $1500.

The marching band got caught in the rain during a performance and DS' sax needed several pads replaced and I don't know what else done. DD's needed a few pads replaced. We paid ZERO to get that done because we had rented through the music store program (they are paid off now though). Sure, you might have started out paying $800 but how much have you put into it sense. Our band directors pretty much tell the kids which instruments they want them to rent. They know a lot more about it then we do so I trust their opinions.

We haven't put ANY money into it since, beyond reeds.

The pads weren't sitting right, but we took it back to the store and they adjusted it for us, for free. And they showed my son what to do... he had taped one down, which wasn't good, but his teacher corrected that.

I think his band director worked on it a bit, too. One of the keys needed to be bent a little, to sit right.

One of the problems is that renting is outrageously expensive around here (think around 2000 dollars a year) and we were reluctant to sink that into a used instrument that we wouldn't even get to keep when the year was over. Rent to own is even more expensive. I've also been told by other parents that the company doesn't always rent good instruments - some have been damaged.

For us, considering that we had no idea if the boy would stick with the instrument, it seemed far more practical to just buy it for him.

He's surprised us... he wasn't the "musical" one in the family. His singing is tone deaf, and he doesn't like music (except for the Beatles). He's always after his sister to turn her music down, or off, or stop singing, etc... So I figured he wouldn't be enthusiastic about learning an instrument, either. After all, he's got "borderline" hearing, and part of his learning disability is auditory (he can't understand oral instructions in sequence). But he's intensely focussed about playing, and he's actually pretty good - FAR better than he should be for the short length of time he's been playing (a year and a half). And he enjoys it! It's the last thing any of us expected.

 

[golfgal]

We haven't put ANY money into it since, beyond reeds.

The pads weren't sitting right, but we took it back to the store and they adjusted it for us, for free. And they showed my son what to do... he had taped one down, which wasn't good, but his teacher corrected that.

I think his band director worked on it a bit, too. One of the keys needed to be bent a little, to sit right.

One of the problems is that renting is outrageously expensive around here (think around 2000 dollars a year) and we were reluctant to sink that into a used instrument that we wouldn't even get to keep when the year was over. Rent to own is even more expensive. I've also been told by other parents that the company doesn't always rent good instruments - some have been damaged.

For us, considering that we had no idea if the boy would stick with the instrument, it seemed far more practical to just buy it for him.

He's surprised us... he wasn't the "musical" one in the family. His singing is tone deaf, and he doesn't like music (except for the Beatles). He's always after his sister to turn her music down, or off, or stop singing, etc... So I figured he wouldn't be enthusiastic about learning an instrument, either. After all, he's got "borderline" hearing, and part of his learning disability is auditory (he can't understand oral instructions in sequence). But he's intensely focussed about playing, and he's actually pretty good - FAR better than he should be for the short length of time he's been playing (a year and a half). And he enjoys it! It's the last thing any of us expected.

For that price I would go to Woodwinds/Brasswinds and sign up for their rental program. Our rental program was $45/month, each, for the kids' saxophones. They were new when we got them and they are Yamaha YAS-62whatevers, which is what the band directors recommend for their beginning instruments.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

I don't know about violins specifically, but in general, it is not worth it to buy a high/professional quality instrument for a child who is just beginning to learn an instrument. Buying something decent quality which is used or renting is a better option.

Example: you don't buy a 5th grader a four thousand dollar Conn, Bach, or Yamaha French Horn. But you don't buy him or her a 300 dollar horn from China, either.

Buying off of eBay is probably a bad idea unless you know what you are doing.

If your child's teacher does not like the instrument, and you are able to return it, get a recommendation from him and/or from online reviews or a online community dedicated to string instrumentalists.

 

[Kat77]

We haven't put ANY money into it since, beyond reeds.

The pads weren't sitting right, but we took it back to the store and they adjusted it for us, for free. And they showed my son what to do... he had taped one down, which wasn't good, but his teacher corrected that.

I think his band director worked on it a bit, too. One of the keys needed to be bent a little, to sit right.

One of the problems is that renting is outrageously expensive around here (think around 2000 dollars a year) and we were reluctant to sink that into a used instrument that we wouldn't even get to keep when the year was over. Rent to own is even more expensive. I've also been told by other parents that the company doesn't always rent good instruments - some have been damaged.

For us, considering that we had no idea if the boy would stick with the instrument, it seemed far more practical to just buy it for him.

He's surprised us... he wasn't the "musical" one in the family. His singing is tone deaf, and he doesn't like music (except for the Beatles). He's always after his sister to turn her music down, or off, or stop singing, etc... So I figured he wouldn't be enthusiastic about learning an instrument, either. After all, he's got "borderline" hearing, and part of his learning disability is auditory (he can't understand oral instructions in sequence). But he's intensely focussed about playing, and he's actually pretty good - FAR better than he should be for the short length of time he's been playing (a year and a half). And he enjoys it! It's the last thing any of us expected.

You will most likely need to upgrade the sax. When you're ready, let the HS director know you're looking to buy. Sometimes students going off to college will sell their instruments to incoming students. You can get a good price that way. Keep the old sax for marching with! Damage happens while marching, good instruments are for competitions and class .
Two of my kids are in Honors Band and the beginner is first chair. This is what I have learned in the past three years. We always end up purchasing better mouthpieces than what came with the instrument within the first year. That alone can make a huge difference in sound. And I'd have the sax repadded and keys adjusted over a school break. This is cheap and helpful. Kids get frustrated trying to get the right sounds out of beginner instruments. Sometimes the difference in chairs at this age is the instument and not the students ability .

 

[WheresFigment?]

Instead of a "musical instrument" shop, you might see if there is a "stringed instrument workshop" in your local area.

If not, I highly recommend you contact Stamell Stringed Instruments. They are local to me and they deal primarily in violins, though also do violas and cellos, and they deal both nationally and internationally.

They ship, their rental rates for a $1500-$2000 instrument are $500/yr, and you can apply that rate towards the purchase of a new instrument.

I was recently speaking to them in regards to repairing the very vintage violin that I learned on (though I no longer play). They are very knowledgeable and they offer some excellent handmade instruments in the $1500-$2500 price range that are really excellent tonally and quality-wise. They also have some excellent Romanian-made instruments in the $850ish range.

Their phone number is 1-800-766-0936. They allow you to try an instrument you rent or purchase from them for a week so you can have your instructor look at it, as well.

 

[Magpie]

You will most likely need to upgrade the sax. When you're ready, let the HS director know you're looking to buy. Sometimes students going off to college will sell their instruments to incoming students. You can get a good price that way. Keep the old sax for marching with! Damage happens while marching, good instruments are for competitions and class .
Two of my kids are in Honors Band and the beginner is first chair. This is what I have learned in the past three years. We always end up purchasing better mouthpieces than what came with the instrument within the first year. That alone can make a huge difference in sound. And I'd have the sax repadded and keys adjusted over a school break. This is cheap and helpful. Kids get frustrated trying to get the right sounds out of beginner instruments. Sometimes the difference in chairs at this age is the instument and not the students ability .

Okay, I'll see if we can get that done over Christmas!

My son had mentioned the need for a new mouthpiece over summer, and we were going to get him one, but then he told us no, he didn't need one after all, he was mistaken. I think maybe I should drop in on his next sax lesson and ask his teacher what he thinks.

 

[Magpie]

Instead of a "musical instrument" shop, you might see if there is a "stringed instrument workshop" in your local area.

If not, I highly recommend you contact Stamell Stringed Instruments. They are local to me and they deal primarily in violins, though also do violas and cellos, and they deal both nationally and internationally.

They ship, their rental rates for a $1500-$2000 instrument are $500/yr, and you can apply that rate towards the purchase of a new instrument.

I was recently speaking to them in regards to repairing the very vintage violin that I learned on (though I no longer play). They are very knowledgeable and they offer some excellent handmade instruments in the $1500-$2500 price range that are really excellent tonally and quality-wise. They also have some excellent Romanian-made instruments in the $850ish range.

Their phone number is 1-800-766-0936. They allow you to try an instrument you rent or purchase from them for a week so you can have your instructor look at it, as well.

Thanks! I've made a note.

 

[HM]

I wouldn't worry about it too much at this stage. If your child continues to enjoy violin and wants to keep playing in a year or so, then you can invest in a better instrument. My son used a hand-me-down for four years and did fine. If he had continued longer than that we would have invested more.

The rental store that we used for my daughter's Cello, only let us use a portion of the rental funds we'd paid toward a new instrument after three years of use. It was not a very good deal. Though the one good thing (which I forgot about) was that she moved from a 3/4 to a full size instrument in those years and it would be been pretty expensive to buy two.

 

[golfgal]

I wouldn't worry about it too much at this stage. If your child continues to enjoy violin and wants to keep playing in a year or so, then you can invest in a better instrument. My son used a hand-me-down for four years and did fine. If he had continued longer than that we would have invested more.

The rental store that we used for my daughter's Cello, only let us use a portion of the rental funds we'd paid toward a new instrument after three years of use. It was not a very good deal.

A hand me down doesn't necessarily mean bad quality, ESPECIALLY for a violin. I was asked to let my niece use my violin-a $2000 violin-that would have been a nice hand me down for a 4th grader (her mom didn't realize that my full size would NOT have worked for her tiny, tiny DD who started on an 1/8 size ).

 

[Kat77]

A hand me down doesn't necessarily mean bad quality, ESPECIALLY for a violin. I was asked to let my niece use my violin-a $2000 violin-that would have been a nice hand me down for a 4th grader (her mom didn't realize that my full size would NOT have worked for her tiny, tiny DD who started on an 1/8 size ).

Hand me downs are sometimes better quality than what you can buy. Its all about the wood. We ran into this with clarinets. Bought the sweetest sounding vintage R13 over the summer from a collage kid. Her dad made us promise if we ever decided to sell we'd give them a call for first dibs.

 

[Kat77]

Okay, I'll see if we can get that done over Christmas!

My son had mentioned the need for a new mouthpiece over summer, and we were going to get him one, but then he told us no, he didn't need one after all, he was mistaken. I think maybe I should drop in on his next sax lesson and ask his teacher what he thinks.

We ordered several mouthpieces to test out and let directors/tutors listen to them. The mouthpiece chosen for DD's clarinet ended up being a suprise.

 

[Kimberle]

Unless your son is the size of a full grown adult, you really need to rent. Violins are SIZED to the child. My dd has been playing since 3rd grade, (she's now in 6th). We've had to exchange the size every single year. If it is to big or to small, he simply will not be able to play it correctly and it will strain his back/arms. Also, our rental insurance is included. If it is lost, stolen, or damaged, we're covered.

Quality is important. If they can't hear the correct tone, they won't be able to play it.

 

[Magpie]

Unless your son is the size of a full grown adult, you really need to rent. Violins are SIZED to the child. My dd has been playing since 3rd grade, (she's now in 6th). We've had to exchange the size every single year. If it is to big or to small, he simply will not be able to play it correctly and it will strain his back/arms. Also, our rental insurance is included. If it is lost, stolen, or damaged, we're covered.

Quality is important. If they can't hear the correct tone, they won't be able to play it.

Actually he is the size of a full grown adult - he's taller than me, and I'm 5'7''! Since he's only 12, he's probably not done growing yet. But as far as I know, a 5'8'' boy and a 6' plus man would use the same size violin.

 

[Help Please!]

Quality is EXTREMELY important, even for a beginner! The quality of the violin can mean the difference between a student's continued success on an instrument, or a student who wants to quit after a few months! I've seen it happen!!!

I teach elementary music, including 5th and 6th grade strings. Our 5th graders mostly rent instruments from our school, and our 6th grade parents purchase instruments for their students or rent from local music stores. We had one parent (language barrier, which made it difficult to communicate) who went on ebay and purchased her daughter a green violin for $50...daughter brought it to school (this was about a month ago) and the strings were awful, 2 snapped, pegs slipped repeatedly, bridge was not fitted to instrument...I could go on and on and on. This student had only been playing for a year, but I can tell you that this instrument was setting her up for FAILURE. Around here, kids move to middle school in 7th grade, and a middle school teacher would just laugh if a student came in with a painted violin...I know that may sound harsh, but I'd rather have 2 students share a rented violin than 1 play on a piece of garbage like that...seriously!

Long story short...quality matters, ESPECIALLY on a sensitive and technical instrument like the violin. I do not claim to be a string expert, but we have a string consultant who works with our students, and she IS an expert! I (with her guidance) have purchased Keith, Curtis, Clifton violins that we really like for beginners...many of our students have purchased these or renting them....actually from this store:

atlanticstrings.com (and search for Keith, Curtis, Clifton- the basic violin with bow, case, etc. is less than $400, but they have a great rent to own program)

No, I don't work for them, LOL! But we just had a parent ask about a purchase (grandma is buying her granddaughter a violin for Christmas), and our string teacher recommended the following when purchasing a violin:

1. Purchase from a store (or website) that gives you a trial period in which you can take the instrument home, try it out, and have it LOOKED AT BY YOUR CHILD's TEACHER so they can make sure your money is well spent before you make a purchase.

2. Purchase from a store that will guarantee to "buy back" your son's instrument if and when he needs to upgrade (say, in high school?)

3. NO PAINTED INSTRUMENTS, EVER!!

Hope that all helps a bit!

 

[Magpie]

Quality is EXTREMELY important, even for a beginner! The quality of the violin can mean the difference between a student's continued success on an instrument, or a student who wants to quit after a few months! I've seen it happen!!!

I teach elementary music, including 5th and 6th grade strings. Our 5th graders mostly rent instruments from our school, and our 6th grade parents purchase instruments for their students or rent from local music stores. We had one parent (language barrier, which made it difficult to communicate) who went on ebay and purchased her daughter a green violin for $50...daughter brought it to school (this was about a month ago) and the strings were awful, 2 snapped, pegs slipped repeatedly, bridge was not fitted to instrument...I could go on and on and on. This student had only been playing for a year, but I can tell you that this instrument was setting her up for FAILURE. Around here, kids move to middle school in 7th grade, and a middle school teacher would just laugh if a student came in with a painted violin...I know that may sound harsh, but I'd rather have 2 students share a rented violin than 1 play on a piece of garbage like that...seriously!

Long story short...quality matters, ESPECIALLY on a sensitive and technical instrument like the violin. I do not claim to be a string expert, but we have a string consultant who works with our students, and she IS an expert! I (with her guidance) have purchased Keith, Curtis, Clifton violins that we really like for beginners...many of our students have purchased these or renting them....actually from this store:

atlanticstrings.com (and search for Keith, Curtis, Clifton- the basic violin with bow, case, etc. is less than $400, but they have a great rent to own program)

No, I don't work for them, LOL! But we just had a parent ask about a purchase (grandma is buying her granddaughter a violin for Christmas), and our string teacher recommended the following when purchasing a violin:

1. Purchase from a store (or website) that gives you a trial period in which you can take the instrument home, try it out, and have it LOOKED AT BY YOUR CHILD's TEACHER so they can make sure your money is well spent before you make a purchase.

2. Purchase from a store that will guarantee to "buy back" your son's instrument if and when he needs to upgrade (say, in high school?)

3. NO PAINTED INSTRUMENTS, EVER!!

Hope that all helps a bit!

Yes, thank you!

My son's violin is a Stentor Student. It's not painted, thank goodness!

I'll definitely ask about trial periods when the time comes to upgrade his violin. I didn't know that was possible.

 

[Tinijocaro]

Instead of a "musical instrument" shop, you might see if there is a "stringed instrument workshop" in your local area.

VERY good advice.

 

[Tinijocaro]

A hand me down doesn't necessarily mean bad quality, ESPECIALLY for a violin. I was asked to let my niece use my violin-a $2000 violin-that would have been a nice hand me down for a 4th grader (her mom didn't realize that my full size would NOT have worked for her tiny, tiny DD who started on an 1/8 size ).

I have parents all the time who go out and buy their average sized or tiny 4th graders full size violins. I explain to them that they don't have a full size child yet, but they figure it's like buying a pair of jeans- Buy them a little big so there's room to grow! Doesn't work that way!

 

[Tinijocaro]

Unless your son is the size of a full grown adult, you really need to rent. Violins are SIZED to the child. My dd has been playing since 3rd grade, (she's now in 6th). We've had to exchange the size every single year. If it is to big or to small, he simply will not be able to play it correctly and it will strain his back/arms. Also, our rental insurance is included. If it is lost, stolen, or damaged, we're covered.

Quality is important. If they can't hear the correct tone, they won't be able to play it.

Typically, for an average size child a 4th grader will use a 1/2 size, a 5th grader a 3/4, and anywhere from 6th - 8th grade, a full size, depending on growth. If a child is between sizes (almost ready for a larger size) it is better to stay with the too small instrument rather than too large.