7K for kindergarten

[allison443]

Wow as I read these posts, I am amazed at the number of people who refer to public education as free.

Nothing provided by the government is free, somebody pays and pays a lot.

I'm pretty sure everyone knows that. When people say "free", don't you think they are referring to no out of pocket cost for tuition, as opposed to private schools where tuition is paid?

 

[nchulka]

I have been shocked reading this also. I had no idea some public schools could charge money!!! I do know that where I live (MO) children are not required to attend school until 7 so that would mean that K is not mandatory. I actually had a friend who kept her kids home, taught them to read herself and started them in first. I've never heard of any schools charging for K though!

Ours was half day until this year. I am so glad that my youngest was in K last year and still got to go half day. I believe K should be what it used to be, an intro to school. My kids were with me 24/7 until K and 3 hours a day for a year was a great transition. I don't like the idea of all day K, I feel the parents who push for it are working parents who are just looking for free childcare so they don't have to pay someone to watch their kids for half a day for another year. As for how much kids learn, it totally varies depending on where they started. My kids did learn basically nothing in K, DD started K already reading full chapter books independently. Still it was great for her because she learned how a school and classroom work, what it is like to be away from mom, have a teacher, and make friends. Exactly what K should be for!

 

[cdsulhoff]

Wow as I read these posts, I am amazed at the number of people who refer to public education as free.

Nothing provided by the government is free, somebody pays and pays a lot.

Maybe, who say free are referring it not coming straight out of their pocket, money that they see in their bank account!
I know MY HIGH TAX is helping paying for school system.

I don't mind paying taxes to schools all my money could go to the schools! What I hate is knowing my tax money goes to worthless ppl who suck on the government money bottle for free money and food stamp, and don't even try to better them self! I don't mind my taxes going to FAMILES WHO are trying to make it in life but felt a little short and needs that extra push to help keep them afloat for a short time till they get back on their feet. Not those who abuse the system! They need to revamp the system! Cause some of these ppl who I KNOW don't have no job and wont look to get a job cause they know if they get a job they would lose their benefits! of free money and food! UGH! Why work when Uncle Sam is giving you money to sit on your butt!I know I went way of topic~Sorry! But in the long run that could of been money for schools!!! To better our kids of our future!

 

[princesspeach]

I would be researching other options or if possible home school. I think the idea of charging for K is only going to hurt the school in the long run. What will they do with the kids who don't know their ABC's and can't count when they get them in 1st grade? Those kids will just have to repeat the grade and that isn't going to help their budget at all.

If a kid cannot count or do their abcs by 1st grade. I hink that is more of a problem with the parents.

 

[vicki_c]

I'm pretty sure everyone knows that. When people say "free", don't you think they are referring to no out of pocket cost for tuition, as opposed to private schools where tuition is paid?

Right, I used the word "free" - as in meaning I'm not writing a check every month as the OP's post was discussing. Paying tuition for public school. Why does everyone have to pick everything apart?

 

[neatokimmo]

Add me to the group that didn't know K wasn't full day and free.

OP - I don't know what your income is. 7K is a lot for some, not so much for others. I would look at the starting salary for nurses. Then think of the 7K as a way to not get behind and lose a year of income. I'd use the child free time to overload on classes and try to reduce the amount of time you are in school.

For us, we have property in Tn and VA and according to their rules, can send DD to either state's schools.

TN City Schools
Preschool free for low income
K full day free for everyone - kid has to be 5 by Sept 30th.

VA County Schools
Preschool free for everyone if the funding is in place. They are 90% sure they'll have it this fall. Ages 4+
Kindergarten - free full day for 4 or 5 year olds. If preschool funding doesn't come through, most people will send their kids to K twice but change schools. There are 3 elementary schools very close to each other.

 

[bartleby1]

To the OP - that is a ton of money for Kindergarten and I can totally understand why you are concerned. I'm not sure what other options are available in your area, but I would also not worry too much until it is a done deal. Hopefully the school district will find another option, since many/most people will not be able to pay that kind of money for kindergarten.


Also, I don't want to get political since I know that everyone has strong views on politics, however, I do urge ALL New Jersey parents to do some research into the governors plans for public education and his plans for charter and private schools. Educate yourself and get involved. From speaking with parents in my town, I know that most of them don't have any idea what the true issues are that we are facing related to our public school funding in NJ. Our governor has done a great job at creating tons of animosity between the tax payers and our teachers/school systems but everyone should do their own research to find out the facts so they can form their own opinion. Find out the facts, get involved, and speak out. The majority of NJ public schools are working and doing a fantastic job with the cards they are dealt. We have some of the highest test scores in the country. However, the schools cannot continue to provide programs for our children without the proper funds. Most districts cut the fat, so to speak, as a result of the $1 billion cut in state aid this year. Most districts will have a really hard time if they must face another huge cut in state aid for next year.

 

[juliebean]

Thanks for all the information and suggestions. There must have been a serious expression of public outrage, because I did receive an amended proposal that is being sent through the PTA's that would include a half day option. Whether it will be free (well except for the very high property taxes we pay...) or if we'll pay $3,500 for the half day is undetermined until the budget process is completed. But, at least we'll have some option besides $7k for full day.

It's clear there is a huge variation in what is provided and even what people think is acceptable for preschool and kindergarten throughout the country. We may look at private options just in case, my husband and I were talking about it last night. I have tried very carefully to plan out returning to school so that I could stay at home with my younger children until they were in school full time and still be making a good wage by the time my oldest goes to college in a few years. This really throws a wrench into those attempts toward being a responsible parent and citizen.

Part of my frustration with this whole situation is that our school board is sueing the state to allow them to pay our superintendent about $50,000 more than the $175,000 salary cap. Plus, I don't even know how much is being spent on lawyers. Everything parents asked about the budget or the lawsuit at the meeting last week had to be referred to the BOE lawyer. So, I'm not feeling too warm and fuzzy about the board or superintendent. I feel like how can you talk about cutting kindergarten and middle school writing classes when you are suing to pay the superintendent more than the cap? I certainly won't be voting to re elect any of the board members.

Thanks again for the info and suggestions! Now, although it would be more fun to waste time on the computer - I have a microbiology test on Friday I should turn my attention to!

 

[lisalis]

In Iowa kindergarten is not required, but almost all schools offer full day kindergarten. In fact, many want to go to public preschool as well. With the economy the way it is, I'm sure it won't pass and I really would rather choose and pay for the preschool I want and not be taxed more.

The thing that concerns me about the OP is what the district is doing with the money it receives from the state for each child. Here, the school districts receive about $7000 for each child enrolled in their school, extra for special needs children. It seems like they would be shooting themselves in the foot and lose enrollment, which means less money from the state. I wonder if it is all a ploy to get a property tax hike to help their budget. That's what they do here - give a doomsday scenario, then ask for a bond or tax hike.

 

[bartleby1]

Thanks for all the information and suggestions. There must have been a serious expression of public outrage, because I did receive an amended proposal that is being sent through the PTA's that would include a half day option. Whether it will be free (well except for the very high property taxes we pay...) or if we'll pay $3,500 for the half day is undetermined until the budget process is completed. But, at least we'll have some option besides $7k for full day.

It's clear there is a huge variation in what is provided and even what people think is acceptable for preschool and kindergarten throughout the country. We may look at private options just in case, my husband and I were talking about it last night. I have tried very carefully to plan out returning to school so that I could stay at home with my younger children until they were in school full time and still be making a good wage by the time my oldest goes to college in a few years. This really throws a wrench into those attempts.

Part of my frustration with this whole situation is that our school board is sueing the state to allow them to pay our superintendent about $50,000 more than the $175,000 salary cap. Plus, I don't even know how much is being spent on lawyers. Everything parents asked about the budget or the lawsuit at the meeting last week had to be referred to the BOE lawyer. So, I'm not feeling too warm and fuzzy about the board or superintendent. I feel like how can you talk about cutting kindergarten and middle school writing classes when you are suing to pay the superintendent more than the cap? I certainly won't be voting to re elect any of the board members.

Thanks again for the info and suggestions! Now, although it would be more fun to waste time on the computer - I have a microbiology test on Friday I should turn my attention to!

This is so unfortunate. What a mess and a huge waste of money. I feel very mixed on the whole superintendent cap that was put in place. I do agree that our administration salaries are too high. However, I don't agree with our governor just deciding who has the right to make a given amount. What if he decided that teachers could only make $25,000 a year? Or police? Or other public employees? That just sounds too much like a dictatorship to me.

It is a shame that more money needs to be wasted on lawyers though when it could be going to the kids.

 

[juliebean]

In Iowa kindergarten is not required, but almost all schools offer full day kindergarten. In fact, many want to go to public preschool as well. With the economy the way it is, I'm sure it won't pass and I really would rather choose and pay for the preschool I want and not be taxed more.

The thing that concerns me about the OP is what the district is doing with the money it receives from the state for each child. Here, the school districts receive about $7000 for each child enrolled in their school, extra for special needs children. It seems like they would be shooting themselves in the foot and lose enrollment, which means less money from the state. I wonder if it is all a ploy to get a property tax hike to help their budget. That's what they do here - give a doomsday scenario, then ask for a bond or tax hike.

Unfortunately in NJ the "wealthy" districts do not receive any funds for general students (there is some for special ed) from the state. It's why our property taxes are so high. It also means there is no incentive to try and keep enrollments up. We pay more in state income taxes than federal and really see hardly anything back in our community at the school, police or public level.

 

[NMW]

We moved from NJ 10 years ago and currently live in PA. Like NJ, kindergarten is not mandatory in the state of PA. In our district we have 1/2 day kindergarten that is free and covered by our very expensive school taxes. Our district buses kindergarten students both ways. Depending on where you live, you are either AM or PM kindergarten.

My friend lives in another county and her district does have free 1/2 day kindergarten, however the kids are only bused 1 way. So, if you're AM kindergarten, you get bused in the morning, but need to be picked up at 11:25 (or whatever time it is). You can pay for busing to an after school program at the YMCA. If you are PM kindergarten, you need to drive your kid to school, but they can take the bus home.

Our district (and really all of the districts around us) had major cuts last year of programs and teachers. Our taxes went up as well. It was a constant teachers union vs. the administration with a he said/she said back and forth. In the end, A LOT of teachers were laid off because the union refused to open its contract. This year is going to be just as bad it seems. I'm sure more programs will be cut and more teachers will go.

We have friends and family in NJ and I know its bad there too. A lot of people have become very anti-teachers unions and things are ugly. Unfortunately, it seems like things are getting worse.

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

Yes, a free, public education is the right of all Americans.

Unfortunately, this is not true. It's only a right if your state guarantees it. It isn't guaranteed everywhere.

Part of my frustration with this whole situation is that our school board is sueing the state to allow them to pay our superintendent about $50,000 more than the $175,000 salary cap. Plus, I don't even know how much is being spent on lawyers. Everything parents asked about the budget or the lawsuit at the meeting last week had to be referred to the BOE lawyer. So, I'm not feeling too warm and fuzzy about the board or superintendent. I feel like how can you talk about cutting kindergarten and middle school writing classes when you are suing to pay the superintendent more than the cap? I certainly won't be voting to re elect any of the board members.

And this is exactly the problem! I'm a product of NJ public schools. I'm very grateful for the education I received. It was excellent. But the administrative bloat is crippling the system.

Take Stafford Township, for example. They have to support two different school districts: an elementary district AND a middle/high school district. Between the two districts, those taxpayers are supporting 2 superintendents, 1 (possibly 2) assistant superintendents, 9 principals, and 5 assistant principals -- all for the low, low cost of about $1.9 million.

NJ school districts need to consolidate and cut administrative costs. How many teachers and supplies could be paid for if you could cut some of the administrative bloat?

So, OP, you have every right to be ticked.

 

[lurkernj]

I'm also in NJ. Our Governor really has it in for the education programs in this state. A bloodbath is a very good description. I'm not saying some cuts didn't need to be made, but WOW, I pay almost $10K in property taxes (and thats pretty low in our area), and am just disgusted with what we get in return. I actually have to supply papertowels and tissues to the classroom, among many other supplies (I'm waiting for the request for toilet paper any day now, I'll tell them my son doesn't use it). Once our kids are done with school in a few years, we're planning on gettin out.

I did send my younger son to private all day kindergarten (8a-3p) several years ago and it was in the $4500 range. That was about 7 years ago. If they are mandating the $7k for you, I would just look into a private program, just on principle alone! I would imagine it would be less than $7k, and would probably be a better program anyway.

 

[dsanner106]

If , as you say, she is one of the oldest kids in her grade level, you might think about skipping kindergarden and putting her in first grade, she would just be one of the younger ones at that level, we did that and after a week saw no difficulties at all. Many kids homeschool for kindergarden and were also new to public schools for 1st grade, so she would not be out of place.

D

 

[juliebean]

I wish we could - she was ready for K this last fall - but there is absolutely no exceptions to the cutoff ages for grades in our district. She spends all her free time writing, drawing and coloring - and just reads words out of the blue off signs and books.

The last few posts have made some really good points about things though (so weird that a Republican gov is regulating any salaries, seems philosphically strange...although I think $175K is plenty) - there is way too much money being spent not on instruction in the schools and I feel it is really at the kid's (and teacher's) expense. At the same time, my older kids in 9th and 3rd are getting excellent educations and have wonderful opportunities. I just am concerned I'm not going to be able to say the same thing for the preschooler.

 

[labdogs42]

Considering that I pay $3300 for full day kindergarten at a Catholic school in PA, I think $7K is outrageous for K. My son would have gone to the public K if it wasn't 1/2 day (it was cheaper to go to the Catholic school full day than pay for daycare). How close are you to PA? Can you look across the border into PA for private K options?

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

This is so interesting! I have never heard of charging for K in states where K is not mandatory.

As far as I know, K is not mandatory in TX. Dallas ISD is the 14th largest district in the nation. The lovely state is slashing $253 million from DISD's budget for the next school year. Out of 21,000 employees, 4000 will lose their jobs. 3000 of those folks will be teachers. They are saying middle and high school classes will swell to 35 kids, with some classes potentially growing to FIFTY kids.

DS goes to the Arts magnet high school. I am terrified that the district will close the magnet schools even though they have said their CURRENT plan is not to close any campuses. I would pay whatever they asked in tuition to keep him there, but I am betting that won't be a choice.

I have heard rumblings about cutting pre-K, which is only available to economically disadvantaged kids. I have not heard any discussion about cutting K, but I wonder if it will come up eventually?

 

[JoiseyMom]

Thanks for all the information and suggestions. There must have been a serious expression of public outrage, because I did receive an amended proposal that is being sent through the PTA's that would include a half day option. Whether it will be free (well except for the very high property taxes we pay...) or if we'll pay $3,500 for the half day is undetermined until the budget process is completed. But, at least we'll have some option besides $7k for full day.

It's clear there is a huge variation in what is provided and even what people think is acceptable for preschool and kindergarten throughout the country. We may look at private options just in case, my husband and I were talking about it last night. I have tried very carefully to plan out returning to school so that I could stay at home with my younger children until they were in school full time and still be making a good wage by the time my oldest goes to college in a few years. This really throws a wrench into those attempts toward being a responsible parent and citizen.

Part of my frustration with this whole situation is that our school board is sueing the state to allow them to pay our superintendent about $50,000 more than the $175,000 salary cap. Plus, I don't even know how much is being spent on lawyers. Everything parents asked about the budget or the lawsuit at the meeting last week had to be referred to the BOE lawyer. So, I'm not feeling too warm and fuzzy about the board or superintendent. I feel like how can you talk about cutting kindergarten and middle school writing classes when you are suing to pay the superintendent more than the cap? I certainly won't be voting to re elect any of the board members.

Thanks again for the info and suggestions! Now, although it would be more fun to waste time on the computer - I have a microbiology test on Friday I should turn my attention to!

The way to fight this is to go to meetings, get all the parents you know to go to the meetings. LEt the BOE, that the super doesn't need 50k more. 175k is an awesome salary. Tell the BOE, that if they don't do what you want them to do, then in April at the school board elections you will vote them OUT!

There are other things they can cut first! Out Gov is not going to give in to pay the super more moeny, and even though I am not his party, I agree with him.

Good luck.

 

[Jaklackus]

My goodness....here in FL the kids went to free half day pre-k through local day care centers(available to anybody) and full day kindergarten is free in the schools. And they are nuts in my school district...so focused on academics they didn't have time for recess or play time in kindergarten.

If you are a SAHM mom or can finagle an opposite shift from your spouse..I would strongly consider a home school program and save that 7k for a college savings plan...or price out the private options if you are going to be paying for child care anyway. If you are on flex time is it possible to find 1 or 2 other parents on flex time and trade child care and split a home study program?