$350 million going to WDW road improvements

[rteetz]

I thought they'd had an occasional issue where they'd had to direct guests to park at Epcot and take the monorail over because MK park capacity is now greater than parking capacity.

Yes but that's only on days like New Years and Christmas it's not common.

 

[Eoghann]

Yes but that's only on days like New Years and Christmas it's not common.

Ah, but that assumes that MK attendance doesn't continue to increase...

 

[rteetz]

Ah, but that assumes that MK attendance doesn't continue to increase...

That's very true, I just think there is more to this than increased attendance. DVC is likely the answer.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Whats a flyover?

An overpass or ramp...flyover is the popular engineering slang for it

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Ah, but that assumes that MK attendance doesn't continue to increase...

They're not rerouting traffic for Christmas and New Years.

Disney's mentally on that is probably very similar to mine:
"Why are you hear on dec. 25th? This is the price you pay - make the best of it"

 

[HopperFan]

Whats a flyover?

Google image "road flyover" or "flyover" to see lots of examples. It's basically elevated bridges to move traffic ..... a very expensive option simply to reduce perceived issues with the toll booth and cars going to resorts. You don't spend this kind of money for other's convenience, you spend it because its part of a bigger plan that can make money.

 

[Andrew015]

My point is that there is really no issue at the magic kingdom toll plaza as it stands...the attendance and hotel rooms have tripled in the area since 1971 and there still is no noticeable effect.

Something else is behind this.

To this point, even adding say another 1,000 DVC rooms, IMHO, won't have much impact on traffic flow. Considering that 50% will come by the Magical Greyhound, the remaining half will have a car. It's not like all 500 come through the gates all at once. I have no idea what the actual impact is in terms of additional traffic volume, but I can't imagine that it translates to more than 10 cars an hour. I'm not a traffic engineer, but my gut says that's not enough to justify a $10 million dollar elevated overpass.

I think either your initial hunch (class warfare) or my hunch (eliminating a dangerous intersection) would be the prevailing theory.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Google image "road flyover" or "flyover" to see lots of examples. It's basically elevated bridges to move traffic ..... a very expensive option simply to reduce perceived issues with the toll booth and cars going to resorts. You don't spend this kind of money for other's convenience, you spend it because its part of a bigger plan that can make money.

Exactly...and no flow issues at the toll plaza has warranted this... Even on the worst of days.

Remember that "reedy creek" is Disney... And these will be paid for by bonds that will ultimately be paid by Disney whether by taxes collected or investment write offs...so there is a profit motive that is bigger than shaving 18.5 seconds off the route of magical express to wilderness lodge.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

To this point, even adding say another 1,000 DVC rooms, IMHO, won't have much impact on traffic flow. Considering that 50% will come by the Magical Greyhound, the remaining half will have a car. It's not like all 500 come through the gates all at once. I have no idea what the actual impact is in terms of additional traffic volume, but I can't imagine that it translates to more than 10 cars an hour. I'm not a traffic engineer, but my gut says that's not enough to justify a $10 million dollar elevated overpass.

I think either your initial hunch (class warfare) or my hunch (eliminating a dangerous intersection) would be the prevailing theory.

I'm going with option 3: massive timeshare increases.

If this is part of the larger plan to open up the north and convert the south of the seven seas to more fertile timeshare space...it makes sense there.

And it can't be because they expect 125,000 people 365 days a year. People are dumb, Disney knows they're dumb, but nobody would strategically plan based on that kind of a ridiculous premise. Wdw parks will decline long before they see that type of attendance at the price.

By the way...$10,000,000 for the bridge?
Is that for the first 50 feet?

Remind me not to drive on any of your bridges

 

[HopperFan]

Exactly...and no flow issues at the toll plaza has warranted this... Even on the worst of days.

Remember that "reedy creek" is Disney... And these will be paid for by bonds that will ultimately be paid by Disney whether by taxes collected or investment write offs...so there is a profit motive that is bigger than shaving 18.5 seconds off the route of magical express to wilderness lodge.

Haha, yup the little town that Disney created, hand picked it's residents, they work for Disney and live in a little village .... and vote on some really big things .... the way they are supposed to vote.

 

[gdrj]

They finally put a light at the intersection headed towards the hotels which is a good thing. Not sure why they are building the flyover and really don't care but I don't think it has anything to do with class warfare, no offense but that just doesn't make any sense.

It could be any of the following or NONE of the following. Also realize that Disney doesn't share a lot of info.
1- Safety
2- Redesign of Parking Lot and Toll Plaza to coordinate with 2nd new entrance that is potentially being built
3- Preparing for future expansion. Add'l Resort, Add'l DVC units. (Capacity at Wilderness Lodge is NOT changing much) Poly increased by 20 bungalows.
4- Increased Bus Traffic, the bus lane during peak times does back up.
5- Park attendance has increased with expanded Fantasy Land, preparing for potential Frontierland expansion and its increased attendance.
6- With redesign eliminating ability to avoid parking fees.
7- Improved traffic control

 

[HopperFan]

They finally put a light at the intersection headed towards the hotels which is a good thing. Not sure why they are building the flyover and really don't care but I don't think it has anything to do with class warfare, no offense but that just doesn't make any sense.

It could be any of the following or NONE of the following. Also realize that Disney doesn't share a lot of info.
1- Safety
2- Redesign of Parking Lot and Toll Plaza to coordinate with 2nd new entrance that is potentially being built
3- Preparing for future expansion. Add'l Resort, Add'l DVC units. (Capacity at Wilderness Lodge is NOT changing much) Poly increased by 20 bungalows.
4- Increased Bus Traffic, the bus lane during peak times does back up.
5- Park attendance has increased with expanded Fantasy Land, preparing for potential Frontierland expansion and its increased attendance.
6- With redesign eliminating ability to avoid parking fees.
7- Improved traffic control

Or it could be ALL of the following. If nothing else it will be fun to watch where this thing goes.

 

[Josh Hendy]

350 mill ... R U kidding ?

Inclined to think this is about massive, multi-billion dollar condo development on the lagoon and probably Bay Lake too ... maybe also MK-view towers to the north. It's hard to see how anything else could justify that big an investment.

I just saw a headline that someone at the Fed is basically advocating negative interest rates ... 'cause you know, the best solution for too much debt is more debt. If zirp and nirp rule the day then Disney can keep borrowing money for condo construction and lending it to DVC customers for several more years at least.

An alternative or perhaps related explanation is that the monorail is going to be scrapped or reduced and that the road work is to feed into a bus system or ring road which will replace it.

 

[rteetz]

350 mill ... R U kidding ?

Well it is reedy creek money not Disney.

 

[Eoghann]

Well it is reedy creek money not Disney.

I thought the difference between the two was mostly a legal technicality.

 

[rteetz]

I thought the difference between the two was mostly a legal technicality.

Yes that's true but reedy creek paying for it means the money can come from tax money and government grants etc. because it's a "city" of sorts.

 

[Josh Hendy]

Yes that's true but reedy creek paying for it means the money can come from tax money and government grants etc. because it's a "city" of sorts.

As I understand it, Disney is the only taxpayer in Reedy Creek. Maybe the federal govt is throwing around "infrastructure" grants or something. Reedy Creek is an oddball municipality though so it's hard to see how they could qualify for the kind of grants that say, the city of Orlando would be eligible for.

 

[Tigger's ally]

I live in between Chicago, St. Louis and Indianapolis. I kind of chuckle when I see people complain about forward thinking infrastructure. Chicago and St. Louis have none and traffic stinks. Indy has been bad in the past, but the new infrastructure they put up in and around their airport wasn't built for today's needs, it was built for today's needs plus the next three decades needs. Forward thinking meant 6 lanes now rather than 3 now and add a lane every 5 years. It meant moving the entrance 3 miles west and putting their new terminal at the far end of property instead of close to the city. But, it made the flow ten times better getting there.

I love forward thinking, especially in infrastructure.

 

[rteetz]

As I understand it, Disney is the only taxpayer in Reedy Creek. Maybe the federal govt is throwing around "infrastructure" grants or something. Reedy Creek is an oddball municipality though so it's hard to see how they could qualify for the kind of grants that say, the city of Orlando would be eligible for.

Well the town of Bay Lake and Lake Buena Vista are within Reedy Creek improvement district. Both of those town have residents. I would think those people have to pay some sort of taxes. While I'd assume a good amount is Disney's money I don't think all of it is.

 

[DanBoris]

I thought the difference between the two was mostly a legal technicality.

Reedy Creek can fund this with a bond issue whereas Disney cannot. According to the article that is where the $350 million is coming from.