2020 Point Charts

[DVC92]

There's one that advertises called Finn Law Group, that specialises in timeshare they say, albeit I'd like to research and see who has won these before.
You may find that if a case is presented to them and they think it has some legs, they may consider a group litigation action on a contingency basis.

Before retaining a lawyer, you may want to file a complaint with the DIVISION OF FLORIDA CONDOMINIUMS, TIMESHARES, AND MOBILE HOMES:

http://myfloridalicense.custhelp.co...da-condominiums,-timeshares,-and-mobile-homes

 

[Dean]

Before retaining a lawyer, you may want to file a complaint with the DIVISION OF FLORIDA CONDOMINIUMS, TIMESHARES, AND MOBILE HOMES:

http://myfloridalicense.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2220/~/division-of-florida-condominiums,-timeshares,-and-mobile-homes

I've talked to that office on other matters, personally I think it's a waste of time and best case scenario it'll take months to years. I wouldn't wait on this but I likely wouldn't go to the expense of a lawyer quite yet. As I've suggested before, I'd make an appointment and trip to Orlando and sit down with DVC corporate, I've found them quite accommodating when I've done this. I doubt any lawyer is going to take this on contingency but on an hourly basis, it'll add up quickly. But just getting a lawyer to write a letter and asking for specific info won't be that much and might yield results.

 

[Fantasia79]

Just awful news. Dues going up along with this is just purely mean spirited.

 

[E2ME2]

Agree the aggressive push for profit performance feels distasteful. Sorry to all the owners badly hit by the point chart changes! (We got off easy, PVB is only 1/3 of our points)

Not saying there can't be any ulterior motive on Disney's part. It's a timeshare -inveiglement and obfuscation are standard package inclusions. But I doubt they're doing anything outright illegal. If pressed, Disney should be able to offer defendable explanations that deters attempts at legal challenge.

The flexibility in a flexible point system cuts both ways.

I agree with pressing DVC to at least give us an explanation.
& I'm impressed with your use of inveiglement & obfuscation !

 

[Fantasia79]

Sent in my complaint email. Doubt it will do anything. Seeing what they’re doing in 2020, it makes me sad to think of what “reallocation 2045” will look like.

We basically lost a night every year off of what we planned on.

 

[SL6827]

Agree the aggressive push for profit performance feels distasteful. Sorry to all the owners badly hit by the point chart changes! (We got off easy, PVB is only 1/3 of our points)

No doubt 2020 is predicted to be a bumper year for hotel and DVC villa occupancy. A much higher than normal percentage of owners will be banking 2019 points to use in 2020 for SWGE. Those points have to be absorbed in 2020/2021/2022 (with people unable to secure bookings banking 2020 points to use into 2021 and so on). Availability will be tight for a few years.

Also, how quickly a room category books up doesn't equal how many rooms ultimately end up going to breakage. 1BRs may book last, but any stray days/last minute cancellations still have a better chance of being snapped up than 2BRs due to the lower point cost for 1BRs.

Not saying there can't be any ulterior motive on Disney's part. It's a timeshare -inveiglement and obfuscation are standard package inclusions. But I doubt they're doing anything outright illegal. If pressed, Disney should be able to offer defendable explanations that deters attempts at legal challenge.

The flexibility in a flexible point system cuts both ways.

I am sure its not illegal, but more so unethical. Which just makes me wonder what will be the next unethical thing they will do to get a dollar? Right now I am combining a night or two on onto my stays with either a Disney resort, or renting out a few more points and I plan to keep doing that because I am just so unsure of how much longer I will be in love with the mouse.

 

[Madame]

I am sure its not illegal, but more so unethical. Which just makes me wonder what will be the next unethical thing they will do to get a dollar? Right now I am combining a night or two on onto my stays with either a Disney resort, or renting out a few more points and I plan to keep doing that because I am just so unsure of how much longer I will be in love with the mouse.

That’s the rub isn’t it... any time Disney/DVC does something like this the response seems to overwhelming be that Disney is not a charity, they’re a business after all.

Then when members/visitors have legitimate complaints about rooms/staff etc, the answer is well we’re just happy to be in Disney when there.

This is not directed to anyone specific, just general observation.

 

[glamdring269]

That’s the rub isn’t it... any time Disney/DVC does something like this the response seems to overwhelming be that Disney is not a charity, they’re a business after all.

Then when members/visitors have legitimate complaints about rooms/staff etc, the answer is well we’re just happy to be in Disney when there.

This is not directed to anyone specific, just general observation.

Disney is an interesting case in brand power. They could probably tell some folks that a week of points is now worth a day and they would be ok because... pixie dust and stuff.

In this case, Disney probably has the right to do what they did but it's possible they don't. I will always assume that a corporation will do everything they can to squeeze as much from a willing consumer as possible, while pushing the boundaries of what is actually legal (and potentially crossing that boundary), until that consumer finally screams "uncle!".

Will be interesting to see where this one ends up. We bought at the bottom of the market a few years back so still feel like we're somewhat dealing with house money. We may simply decide after our trip next October to sell while the market is still relatively high and go back to booking direct until the next opportunity presents itself.

 

[SL6827]

Well this is just one of many things Disney has done. And believe me, when I am there and have an issue, I voice it, I let it be known.

 

[Madame]

Well this is just one of many things Disney has done. And believe me, when I am there and have an issue, I voice it, I let it be known.

Absolutely & my comment was not directed at you, more of a thought that popped up when I read your post.

It’s hard for members to dig deep & find out the truth because amongst many members (FB is full of them) Disney can do no wrong & I think it would take an act of God for them to believe otherwise.

In the meantime, those of us who are dissatisfied are often shouted down or stonewalled. Then we have two choices: accept that we might be getting taken advantage of, or walk away.

 

[freediverdude]

Yes, that is a possible counter-argument, but how far does it go. For example, BWV has both standard and preferred units with a studio, 1BR and 2BR. Those standard units have fewer total points applicable to them than the preferred units with the same room make-up. If, as has happened at BWV, you see all the standard room points per night go up throughout the year, and the only thing that goes down is preferred 2BRs, you can probably bet heavily the standard view units now have higher point totals, i.e., DVC raised the points needed per night for almost every night of the year for all the standard studios, 1BRs and 2BRs.

That is also why at least two of the prior reallocations are questionable. In 2013, DVC raised the points needed for Treehouses at SSR by about 15% for every night of the year and lowered points for all other rooms a tad. Those treehouses were their own groups of units, i.e., they were in units that consisted of only treehouses, which resulted mainly from the fact that the treehouses were not built until after all other SSR units had already been completely declared. Thus, the total points applicable to those Treehouse units necessarily increased by 15% from the total that was originally created (and the latest change made at SSR raises those Treehouses another 10% with no decreases in any season). The other questionable reallocation is the change at SSR into standard and preferred areas. That reallocation necessarily decreased the total points for all the units in all the buildings that were changed to standard and increased them for all the units in all the buildings that were changed to preferred, neither of which action should be allowed if the total points applicable to the units needs to remain the same.

I have not done enough to see how the issue applies to the other resorts as a result of the new point charts, but one that appears obvious is Poly. The bungalows are units separate from any of the studios. The change there was to shift bungalow points to studios, lowering the total points applicable to bungalow units and raising them for units having studios in them.

Yes my paperwork for the Poly indicated that 1 or 2 of the bungalows was each a unit, and 4-6 of the studios were grouped into each unit in the longhouse buildings, so yes the bungalows and studios are separate units there. So that definitely raises the question at the Poly if the same language is in those contracts. Sigh, do I want to spend the afternoon skimming all that again to find it...

 

[SL6827]

Absolutely & my comment was not directed at you, more of a thought that popped up when I read your post.

It’s hard for members to dig deep & find out the truth because amongst many members (FB is full of them) Disney can do no wrong & I think it would take an act of God for them to believe otherwise.

In the meantime, those of us who are dissatisfied are often shouted down or stonewalled. Then we have two choices: accept that we might be getting taken advantage of, or walk away.

Yes, one of the main reasons Disney has been able to do anything they pretty much want to is because we keep going back. Ughhhhh.

 

[BillPA]

Maybe a social media blast is needed to let the masses know what DVC is all about, that it's NOT the Disney of old.

 

[Madame]

Yes, one of the main reasons Disney has been able to do anything they pretty much want to is because we keep going back. Ughhhhh.

I posted this on a thread of a member getting bashed for questioning how DVC is changing. Look at the sole response. These people don’t want to know!! It’s like a cult!

 

[Madame]

Maybe a social media blast is needed to let the masses know what DVC is all about, that it's NOT the Disney of old.

See my post above. Seriously this is the majority of the stuff on Disney/DVC FB groups. I don’t think we’d make much of an impact.

 

[glamdring269]

I posted this on a thread of a member getting bashed for questioning how DVC is changing. Look at the sole response. These people don’t want to know!! It’s like a cult!
View attachment 371806

Ironic that the person believes themselves to be sane.

 

[Madame]

Ironic that the person believes themselves to be sane.

IKR?!? I love Disney too, but when you’ve forked over 10s of 1000s of dollars & committed yourself to spending thousands more on tickets, dining etc.... Well, I want a little honesty.

I’m not a timeshare person, but I’m a Disney person & I thought (based on research) that Disney was reputable. Recent questionable moves on the part of DVC management make me feel a bit of an idiot for buying in. I don’t like to feel like an idiot.

 

[bobbiwoz]

IKR?!? I love Disney too, but when you’ve forked over 10s of 1000s of dollars & committed yourself to spending thousands more on tickets, dining etc.... Well, I want a little honesty.

I’m not a timeshare person, but I’m a Disney person & I thought (based on research) that Disney was reputable. Recent questionable moves on the part of DVC management make me feel a bit of an idiot for buying in. I don’t like to feel like an idiot.

This.

 

[Candlelady]

IKR?!? I love Disney too, but when you’ve forked over 10s of 1000s of dollars & committed yourself to spending thousands more on tickets, dining etc.... Well, I want a little honesty.

I’m not a timeshare person, but I’m a Disney person & I thought (based on research) that Disney was reputable. Recent questionable moves on the part of DVC management make me feel a bit of an idiot for buying in. I don’t like to feel like an idiot.

Ditto

 

[SL6827]

IKR?!? I love Disney too, but when you’ve forked over 10s of 1000s of dollars & committed yourself to spending thousands more on tickets, dining etc.... Well, I want a little honest

Right this is what I am getting at. With all the things Disney has come up with recently such as parking fees, flexible ticket fees, 5th sleeper room category and many more, this one just seems shady. Like these three examples, the DVC change is a money grab as well. But the others seem very much in your face, somewhat expected and a smart business decision on Disney's part. But this DVC play by Disney just seems desperate. Like they are hoping not that many people will notice and it will just be swept under the rug, thus being shady.

It makes me really think what will they do next to earn a buck? As if they are losing the last bit of conscience they have.