2011 "Large Ship" Cruise Line Rankings

[TitanBrett]

How many ships did RCI already have in 1997.

less than they have now. Are you trying to say that since DCL was brand new its a bad comparison? because we all know the story of how DCL was started by some guy in his garage with barely enough money to build his first boat....oh, wait, DCL was/is part of the largest entertainment company in the world so DCL had massive backing and a built in client base.

You think I am putting down DCL for only building 4 ships in 15 years. I am not, I am just pointing out the lack of logic in your thinking that they will one day "dominate" the cruise industry. For them to do that they would first have to TRY. It's not something they aspire to becuase to do so would tarnish the brand. They are filling a niche that suits them perfectly, too many ships would ruin their margins and their ROI.

 

[NancyIL]

I suspect at some point in my life I too be become an old curmudgeon and not want to be around children.....but not yet. I still love to see the little one shriek with joy when Belle comes into the Lumier's and love seeing them lined up to shake hands with Tarzan and get their pictures taken with Pocohantas. These are memories I have of when my children were younger and I never tire of them.

I've been to WDW more times than I can count but I keep going back! Why? I just love the atmosphere. I've seen the Carrosel of Progress so many times I can quote you the whole song....but I still go back.

Preferring an adult-oriented cruise doesn't make me an "old curmudgeon"! For the record - I also love going to WDW and keep going back...twice more in 2011.

 

[Edd]

If you will look at the Disney P&L for 2011 you will note that the DCL profit were down in the first half of the year. They contributed that to the launching of the Dream and the dry-docks the other two ships had to use to get back in shape. Looks to me like the older ships are starting to cost more to maintain. I couldn't find much as the DCL income is embedded in the regular income of the Disney Corporation.

 

[Rogillio]

Preferring an adult-oriented cruise doesn't make me an "old curmudgeon"! For the record - I also love going to WDW and keep going back...twice more in 2011.

No offence intended Nancy. I just can’t imagine myself ever not wanting to have kids around. Maybe when I’m older I’ll just want to be around old people…but I seriously doubt it. I’ve always been somewhat of an overgrown kid! When our kids were young and we’d go Christmas shopping at Toys R Us by wife was shocked and said I was ‘just like a kid’ with all the toys. I said she was right with one difference…I was a ‘kid with a credit card’!

 

[TXDCLfan]

If you will look at the Disney P&L for 2011 you will note that the DCL profit were down in the first half of the year. They contributed that to the launching of the Dream and the dry-docks the other two ships had to use to get back in shape. Looks to me like the older ships are starting to cost more to maintain. I couldn't find much as the DCL income is embedded in the regular income of the Disney Corporation.

Disney said its profit declined 1 percent to $942 million during its fiscal second quarter, which ended April 2, compared with the same period a year ago. Those earnings amounted to 49 cents a share, missing stock analysts' consensus forecast of 57 cents a share.

Taken from the Orlando news paper

 

[Rogillio]

If you will look at the Disney P&L for 2011 you will note that the DCL profit were down in the first half of the year. They contributed that to the launching of the Dream and the dry-docks the other two ships had to use to get back in shape. Looks to me like the older ships are starting to cost more to maintain. I couldn't find much as the DCL income is embedded in the regular income of the Disney Corporation.

Costing more is pretty vague. It cost me more to maintain my car and my house now than it did when it was new but that does not mean I’m ready to scrap it.

I’m sure there is a point where repair and maintenance costs for an aging ship get pretty high but since Disney commands MORE money per passenger than many of the competitors (or so I’m frequently told) they would be able to hold on to their ships longer than other cruise lines whose profit margins are much less.

 

[NancyIL]

No offence intended Nancy. I just can’t imagine myself ever not wanting to have kids around. Maybe when I’m older I’ll just want to be around old people…but I seriously doubt it.

My exact quote was, "As an adult cruiser, I prefer to cruise on ships that aren't 'overloaded with kids' - as Edd said." Nor did I imply that I just want to be around old people!

 

[Rogillio]

My exact quote was, "As an adult cruiser, I prefer to cruise on ships that aren't 'overloaded with kids' - as Edd said." Nor did I imply that I just want to be around old people!

45 cruise-days on DCL and would not say there are overcrowded with kids. I think the average number of children in households with kids is like 2.1. So, given that there are many grandparents traveling along with families and some traveling w/o kids, I'd say kids make up about 30% of passengers...or less. And many of these 'kids' are actually young adults aged 16+. So the implication that Disney is running amok with little children is just wrong. The demographis is seems pretty representative of most things in life.....that is, about the same number of kids running around the ship as there are kids running around chuch on Sunday morning or at the mall or movie theater.

Probably not many kids on some cruise lines but that is more the anomalous than the Disney demographic.

 

[Edd]

I disagree with you. I have had 14 cruise days on DCL and I would estimate that 30 % of the passengers are kids below the age of 10. There is usually about 5% of kids over the age of 10. There are a lot of kids on the DCL ship. I have heard total of 800 kids out of the 2800 passengers carried on a full ship, Magic or Wonder.

 

[izzinmac]

You think I am putting down DCL for only building 4 ships in 15 years. I am not, I am just pointing out the lack of logic in your thinking that they will one day "dominate" the cruise industry. For them to do that they would first have to TRY. It's not something they aspire to becuase to do so would tarnish the brand. They are filling a niche that suits them perfectly, too many ships would ruin their margins and their ROI.

I agree.
I think what both sides of this debate are missing is that DCL is not a cruise line company, it is an entertainment company- part of the most brand unique entertainment company in the world. The rest of the cruise lines we are comparing them to are commodity products competing for the generic cruise business. Disney is competing for a specific niche customer. While their world class marketing has created a large and fanatic following, it by no means is interested in competing in the commodity branded cruise industry. They are much like Apple computers. Apple has created a niche, and a fanatical following, in the otherwise commodity based computer business. There are many more PCs than Macs, just like there are many more cruise ships than DCL. That is not the point for either company. Sure, they want to increase their market share, but not at the expense of losing brand differentiation. Uniqueness, whether real or just perceived by customers, is the mechanism that allows both companies to have robust sales at premium price points. It is probably that perception that also results in higher satisfaction ratings than the generic competition for these companies in surveys like the ones cited here. I don't think you will ever see Disney give up their uniqueness in an effort to match Carnival or RCL in fleet size

 

[Rogillio]

I disagree with you. I have had 14 cruise days on DCL and I would estimate that 30 % of the passengers are kids below the age of 10. There is usually about 5% of kids over the age of 10. There are a lot of kids on the DCL ship. I have heard total of 800 kids out of the 2800 passengers carried on a full ship, Magic or Wonder.

Your post contradicts itself. You estimate 30% of passenger are below age 10 then you cite that your heard 800 of 2800 (28.5%) are kids. This would mean there were no kids aged 10 to 18 and that all the kids were below age 10. And we know that is not the case.

I should point out that we took the Med and Baltic cruises and there very few under age 10 kids on either of those. There were some, but not many and not nearly as many are there are on the 3 and 4 days cruises....that basically just go to the beach.

BTW, the beach is another location like chuch, the mall and the movies that typically has about 30% kids. DCL is more like life than the HAL cruise we took that had a disproportioate number of senior citizens. Again, rather be around kids than seniors. Not that I don't like seniors.....but given a choice.....I'll take the kids!

 

[Rogillio]

I agree.
I think what both sides of this debate are missing is that DCL is not a cruise line company, it is an entertainment company- part of the most brand unique entertainment company in the world. The rest of the cruise lines we are comparing them to are commodity products competing for the generic cruise business. Disney is competing for a specific niche customer. While their world class marketing has created a large and fanatic following, it by no means is interested in competing in the commodity branded cruise industry. They are much like Apple computers. Apple has created a niche, and a fanatical following, in the otherwise commodity based computer business. There are many more PCs than Macs, just like there are many more cruise ships than DCL. That is not the point for either company. Sure, they want to increase their market share, but not at the expense of losing brand differentiation. Uniqueness, whether real or just perceived by customers, is the mechanism that allows both companies to have robust sales at premium price points. It is probably that perception that also results in higher satisfaction ratings than the generic competition for these companies in surveys like the ones cited here. I don't think you will ever see Disney give up their uniqueness in an effort to match Carnival or RCL in fleet size

Very thoughtful analysis and this makes a lot sense. I like the Apple analogy! I don't think DCL is going to take over the cruise industry in the next 10 years or even 20....but eventually I think they will have secured and come to epotomize 'family cruising'...much the way their name is associated with theme parks. They will probably never capture the Alaskan cruise or Med cruise market but those are not big "family cruise" markets. I think they will continue to grow and eventually dominate the shorter Bahaman and Carribean cruises.

Then again, I'm an engineer and know very little about business and marketing.