2008 DDP discussion, questions, rants and vents

[LexPlayer]

As for the servers suffering, I do not agree. Will some people "stiff" servers or tip inappropriately, sure, but I would bet most people will tip as they should. The servers will be fine since they now will be getting the automatic 18% from all DDE participants. It will all even out in the long run.

I don't think that menu service servers will suffer as people are accustomed to 15-20%. But if there is no auto-gratuity-tip-service charge for buffet service, these servers may be getting tips in the 10% range as this is the "norm" in traditional buffet food service. [Please, don't argue with me over the appropriate tip amount for buffets, I am merely noting that many people are offended by leaving 18% at buffets.] As a result, I think buffet servers may be wishing for the "good 'ol days" when the 18% was included in the DDP.

That's really it, in a nutshell. While some folks might not like the changes, they appear to have been made with deliberate intent.

True, but it appears Disney may not have been prepared for the unintended consequences.

 

[apostolic4life]

True, but it appears Disney may not have been prepared for the unintended consequences.

What consequences??

 

[hematite153]

What consequences??

That people who spent years saving for a Disney vacation are leaving with a bad feeling and may never return.

 

[kaytieeldr]

But (a) people who spent years saving for a Disney vacation very likely started saving LONG before the existence of the Disney Dining Plan, and (b) strange as it may sound to us - some people actually think a single trip to Walt Disney World is 'enough'!

 

[reeeoga]

But (a) people who spent years saving for a Disney vacation very likely started saving LONG before the existence of the Disney Dining Plan, and (b) strange as it may sound to us - some people actually think a single trip to Walt Disney World is 'enough'!

Blastphemor!!!!!

 

[LexPlayer]

What consequences??

Oh yeah, there has been a smooth transaction implementing all the changes to the DDP! Unhappy visitors, unhappy servers, unhappy management!

The only thing "magical" about Disney is how it makes your ENTIRE wallet disappear!

 

[apostolic4life]

Oh yeah, there has been a smooth transaction implementing all the changes to the DDP! Unhappy visitors, unhappy servers, unhappy management!

The only thing "magical" about Disney is how it makes your ENTIRE wallet disappear!

The DDP is not forced on anyone.......you purchase it voluntarily, so I am not sure why the visitors who willingly purchased the plan would be unhappy.

Now, the servers would only be unhappy because they will now have to work for the 18% they got in the past for doing as little as possible for the customer. Funny how when a person is actually expected to do the job they are paid for, they get upset.

Management is one that really makes me scratch my head though. Why would they be upset because you no longer get an appetizer?? I bet the management would only be unhappy if the customers, who voluntarily bought the DDP, want to complain after the fact.

I would be willing to bet the "consequences" you reference were considered thoroughly by Disney before the changes for 2008 came about. Seems they think the "consequences" were deemed not too severe. My reaction to the changes: I will still use the DDP, heck we may even use DDDP and go to lots of signature restaurants. I bet this is the type of reaction WDW is banking on too.

 

[Linus Van Pelt]

The DDP is not forced on anyone.......you purchase it voluntarily, so I am not sure why the visitors who willingly purchased the plan would be unhappy.

Now, the servers would only be unhappy because they will now have to work for the 18% they got in the past for doing as little as possible for the customer. Funny how when a person is actually expected to do the job they are paid for, they get upset.

Management is one that really makes me scratch my head though. Why would they be upset because you no longer get an appetizer?? I bet the management would only be unhappy if the customers, who voluntarily bought the DDP, want to complain after the fact.

I would be willing to bet the "consequences" you reference were considered thoroughly by Disney before the changes for 2008 came about. Seems they think the "consequences" were deemed not too severe. My reaction to the changes: I will still use the DDP, heck we may even use DDDP and go to lots of signature restaurants. I bet this is the type of reaction WDW is banking on too.

That is exactly what we did. We always wanted to try the dining plan, but knew that when we eventually did, we'd still be paying OOP for whole meals occasionally, as we're not too keen on counter service meals. And we were stoked that each person was allowed one appetizer, one entree, and one dessert per table service meal, because we adore appetizers, even to the point of skipping desserts in favor of apps most meals. When we heard that Disney was modifying the dining plan, but also adding a deluxe option with the opportunity to eat more TS meals and have it covered, it was pretty much a no-brainer for us to go deluxe.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I would be willing to bet the "consequences" you reference were considered thoroughly by Disney before the changes for 2008 came about. Seems they think the "consequences" were deemed not too severe. My reaction to the changes: I will still use the DDP, heck we may even use DDDP and go to lots of signature restaurants. I bet this is the type of reaction WDW is banking on too.

We used the regular dining plan for the first time in 2005. Prior to that we only did 1 or 2 table service meals during our trip. The rest were CS or stuff in the room.

After using the plan, I have no desire to return to WDW without it. We're using the deluxe plan during our next trip.

 

[LexPlayer]

The DDP is not forced on anyone.......you purchase it voluntarily, so I am not sure why the visitors who willingly purchased the plan would be unhappy.

Now, the servers would only be unhappy because they will now have to work for the 18% they got in the past for doing as little as possible for the customer. Funny how when a person is actually expected to do the job they are paid for, they get upset.

Management is one that really makes me scratch my head though. Why would they be upset because you no longer get an appetizer?? I bet the management would only be unhappy if the customers, who voluntarily bought the DDP, want to complain after the fact.

I would be willing to bet the "consequences" you reference were considered thoroughly by Disney before the changes for 2008 came about. Seems they think the "consequences" were deemed not too severe. My reaction to the changes: I will still use the DDP, heck we may even use DDDP and go to lots of signature restaurants. I bet this is the type of reaction WDW is banking on too.

Things not going well with the DDP changes

It's hard to speculate as to what Disney thought or didn't think, but the reality is that there have been problems. There's the thread with info above, as well as numerous other posts by servers indicating various problems/altercations with patrons. There are also various threads discussing whether Disney sufficiently made the public aware of the DDP changes.

Again, IMO, Disney did not anticipate the level of negative reaction it has received. I don't see how anyone can ignore the fact that the changes have not been implemented smoothly.

 

[sdenis]

Did it last year and seemed well worth the value. Now, though with the tip and app taken off, it doesn't make a lot of sense. We have a family of 5, 2DD's 9 + 8 and DS 4.7. They still don't eat quite a lot so we'll be working on breakfast on our own, snacks we bring throughout the day and maybe one or two TS meals. Actually, since we get the DVC discount we've got ADR's at Chefs de France (20% off for lunch) and romantic Valentine's Dinner at Artist Point for Mom and Dad. 'Course, that ADR isn't till 8:50 PM. We'll try and show up a bit before that too!

I hope Disney at least puts the tip back in and gives a choice of dessert or appetizer. Then I would prob'ly do it.

 

[Lori S.]

I'm trying to decide if this will be a value or a headache for us. How do you know how much you've used? Will your receipt show what credits you used and what's left? I think I may do it just for the enjoyment of not worrying about what all we are ordering, being able to say, sure - order that dessert, etc. I do wish they allowed an appetizer option, however, with a toddler, I think we'll try to hit buffets so we'll be eating quicker anyway.

 

[GreatLakes5]

I want to clarify different things I'm reading on different threads....

ONLY in relation to the 2008 DDP - basic....

I will be there 9 days with my family. 3 adults, 2 children - I figure that x the 9 to determine that I have 27 credits per day for TS, CS, snack for the length of stay per person.

I can use these over the course of the 9 days as I see fit. We could have TS for breakfast and dinner on any given day - using 2 credits in one day. Another day may find us having 2 CS on that day.

Worked last time - will it work this time? I'm reading conflicted opinions....

 

[kaytieeldr]

Most likely, GreatLakes - but to clarify one thing: You say you'll be there nine days. Dining Plan credits are allotted per night of your stay - so nine days for some people might be nine nights (i.e. arriving very very late or leaving very very early), while for other people it's only eight nights.

But yes, you can use them any way you want (including, if you're solo, going through a counter service line seven times the day you leave, so you can use all the CS credits you didn't during the week, NOT that anybody I know would have done that or would know that the EoS BLT travels pretty well...)

 

[englishrose47]

I have to agree that Disney went to far to quickly with the ddp changes! I had mostly great service with the 18% and I will tip well this time I do like being able to give less for poor service, last year I frequently tipped extra for really good service and I agree the lousy servers will see the erroe of their ways in tips, but without it being included many people just wont tip and that is where Disney is going to be hurt because no one will do the job!!I too would have been happy to see the choice of appie or dessert, A few times I will buy an appie but not often. This does make the buffets an even better choiceand tip need not be as high soooo the servers loose again. Management is who will be dealing with irate customersso they wont be happy. I think Disney will rethink this I would rather have seen an increase and leave it alone

 

[sandym718]

I would rather have just seen an increase too. It was such a GREAT deal before, as someone else has said - it just wasn't really sustainable. I'd rather it have just gone up $10 per adult and maybe a couple bucks for the kids, and still be the same.

 

[Lori S.]

Where is a list of which restaurants are TS and which are CS?

 

[TLSnell1981]

I have to agree that Disney went to far to quickly with the ddp changes! I had mostly great service with the 18% and I will tip well this time I do like being able to give less for poor service, last year I frequently tipped extra for really good service and I agree the lousy servers will see the erroe of their ways in tips, but without it being included many people just wont tip and that is where Disney is going to be hurt because no one will do the job!!I too would have been happy to see the choice of appie or dessert, A few times I will buy an appie but not often. This does make the buffets an even better choiceand tip need not be as high soooo the servers loose again. Management is who will be dealing with irate customersso they wont be happy. I think Disney will rethink this I would rather have seen an increase and leave it alone

Disney can not arbitrarily make changes that are a result of the latest union contract. The restaurant division was losing a lot of money. Guests were making out like bandits and Disney was paying 18% gratuity on the actual cost of the meal. People may say Disney is making a lot of money overall, but they are running a buisness and have stockholders to answer to.

The restaurant managers are the ones who wanted the changes. The union could have voted this down. The first contract was voted down (before auto grat was added to DDE and "large" parties.) The servers need to accept their share of responsiblity for this mess.

 

[LexPlayer]

Disney can not arbitrarily make changes that are a result of the latest union contract. The restaurant division was losing a lot of money. Guests were making out like bandits and Disney was paying 18% gratuity on the actual cost of the meal. People may say Disney is making a lot of money overall, but they are running a buisness and have stockholders to answer to.

Well it didn't stop Walt Disney Co President and Chief Executive Robert Iger from earning $27.7 million this year!

 

[tjkraz]

Well it didn't stop Walt Disney Co President and Chief Executive Robert Iger from earning $27.7 million this year!

Nevertheless, even in large companies you'll rarely see one division tolerate a financial loss (or even abnormally low profitability) at the expense of other divisions. Each unit is expected to pull its own weight.

You've also got upper managers in each division whose careers are tied to their individual success or failure. They are expected to meet their own financial goals within the corporate structure, regardless of the hand they have been dealt (which, in this case, is a dining plan designed to boost hotel occupancy at the expense its own division's revenue.)

The dining plan has been a blight on Walt Disney World since it was first introduced. It has DIRECTLY lead to things like smaller restaurant menus, smaller portion sizes and elimination of carry-out at many locations. The waitstaff at non-Disney restaurants suffered all along because while the tip was "included" with the meal for guests, the staff did not receive anything approaching 18%. And I can't see how the overall quality of service has been maintained, much less improved-upon when the amount of the gratuity is determined even before the guest is seated.

Hopefully this is the first nail in the coffin of the dining plan. Yes, menu prices are high. But I certainly don't mind paying high prices when the quality and quantity still makes for an acceptable value. Sadly that value disappeared over the last 3 years as Disney used cost cutting measures to fight the terrible economics of the dining plan.