13 Year old gir declared brain dead has now officially died

[hereyago]

What I want to know is: are facilities really telling this woman, yes we will take your child. Surely they have to know she is brain dead. I don't see how that could go over well if she had to "room" with someone.

If they are talking to her, I could see where a "we cannot accommodate you" would not be making them the bad guy as sure, let's try to get the hospital to do unethical stuff we know they won't do so we won't look bad when we say no.

She has raised a little over 21,000 so far. She had a comment about the last facility backing out because the hospital "interfered" again.

 

[*Fantasia*]

It's time to let go. Whether they are on denial or not, the Lord had called her home. I think the family is being selfish.. it's not about them, it's about their deceased child that needs to rest in peace with the Lord in heaven.

 

[bcla]

My understanding is that the court was not deciding on the feeding tube. They will not force that. They were only extending the time the family had to find alternate care, which is tomorrow at 5. The family has the right to appeal, but without a care facility willing to take her nor a doctor to place the permanent items, that is unlikely to go anywhere. Per the court order, the hospital may remove the ventilator tomorrow at 5pm unless the family appeals.

I understand they've put in a last ditch effort to get a federal judge to order that Children's staff insert the feeding tube. I doubt it works. Their legal strategy seems to be rooted in their faith that God will work a miracle and that they just have to wait it out until that happens. In the meanwhile the ICU is taking up space for Jahi's body and they've set up a room for her family to stay overnight. It's pretty clear that this is medically ridiculous, but they feel they have to do this because of all the publicity.

I'd just point out that Children's Hospital in Oakland has a superb reputation for care. When I was a kid and needed an X-ray, the doctor specifically sent me to Children's for it. I remember serving on jury duty with a clinical nurse and when a discussion was about hospitals I asked about Children's. She called it the "Mecca" for that kind of care in Northern California, with a better reputation than the children's hospitals at UCSF or Stanford. When my wife and I attended a parental class at a local hospital, the instructor recommended that if we had any emergency requirements for a child, go straight there unless it was immediately life threatening (and of course go there in any case if it were the closest). We did take our child there, and the quality and expertise was excellent.

I just hope that this sad turn of events doesn't sully their reputation. While they are a world-class children's hospital, the majority of their patients are from families who are indigent or on Medi-Cal.

 

[pat fan]

This is so sad....and I in no way want to detract from it, but I just wanted to comment on something.

As for the OP getting all upset about "the rule", what I can't understand is how they could be a member here for nearly 5 years and NOT know "the rule."

I have been here since '99 I think and I never knew there was such a rule! Learn something new every day! I hope I'll remember, but no guarantee!

 

[*Fantasia*]

I have been here since '99 I think and I never knew there was such a rule! Learn something new every day! I hope I'll remember, but no guarantee!

I've been here since June '00 and they didn't have that rule. I think this is just recently or maybe just in recent years. I guess some OPs edit their original post after everyone have responded which THEN won't correlate to the edited original post. This is my first time learning this. I have been gone for some years and just recently been coming back off and on. I can almost assure myself that I won't have this problem for I certainly won't be the first one to response to the OP because I am not here enough. But this rule is good to know and I can see why they have this rule.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I understand they've put in a last ditch effort to get a federal judge to order that Children's staff insert the feeding tube. I doubt it works. Their legal strategy seems to be rooted in their faith that God will work a miracle and that they just have to wait it out until that happens. In the meanwhile the ICU is taking up space for Jahi's body and they've set up a room for her family to stay overnight. It's pretty clear that this is medically ridiculous, but they feel they have to do this because of all the publicity.

I don't think it's just about the publicity. I've been involved in a case like this with no publicity at all and decisions were made in support of the family, which is what Children's has said they are doing as well. I mean, there has to be an end point but everyone respects that it's an incredibly difficult thing to go through, and accept - especially when it's a child - and a hospital will do what it can, within reason, to support the family's wishes.

 

[LilyWDW]

Until we can get information from ALL sides, I will not blame the hospital one bit. As I learned with my mother being hospitalized quite a bit before she passed, family often will exaggerate what happened. Why? Because they are scared and do not know what is going on. That is why I am taking the family's explanation with a grain of salt. Personal experience.

Also, ANY surgery can lead to complications. This was more then a routine tonsil removal from what has been explained. The child had previous medical conditions that increased the possibility of complications. The family would have been warned about this. They would have had to sign paperwork about this. As much as I hate to say it... these things can happen. You don't expect them to... but they can.

As for the trach and feeding tube... any facility is going to require these for long term care AND require they be placed before accepting the patient. I do NOT seeing the hospital allowing these surgeries unless a court order is made. Which I also do not see happening since the court has statements from multiple medical professionals who have declared her dead by the medical and legal definition. It would also NOT be in the best interest of the child and the court also has to look at that. It would also not be in the best interest of the hospital (or any hospital) to do it without the order as there has already been a threat of lawsuit from the family.

IF there was malpractice (which is not always the case when people die even from routine surgeries AND is not always cut and dry), then the hospital needs to know and I would not be against a suit (though I do think there should be limits and the family should not receive compensation for any after care expenses as those were only due to the FAMILY). However, if there is no malpractice found (which is very possible) then I honestly believe the family should be made to pay back the hospital and a statement from at least the lawyer should be made to the media about dragging the name of the hospital through the mud.

Again though... malpractice is not always cut and dry. Sometimes you may think ARE malpractice are not and sometimes things that you would think are NOT really are. Healthcare law and ethics can be a murky place.

 

[LiveYourLife]

Am I reading/understanding correctly that this sweet little girl was declared brain dead on 12/12? If so, I cannot wrap my mind around the fact that her Family is still in denial that she has died. I don't mean to sound so harsh and unsympathetic, but my god this didn't happen yesterday. I agree with Fantasia. She has been called home. It was her time. Her Family, by now, especially with their deep rooted faith should realize this and should let her go (really they should have let her go a while ago).

Such a sad story.

 

[sonnyjane]

Am I reading/understanding correctly that this sweet little girl was declared brain dead on 12/12? If so, I cannot wrap my mind around the fact that her Family is still in denial that she has died. I don't mean to sound so harsh and unsympathetic, but my god this didn't happen yesterday. I agree with Fantasia. She has been called home. It was her time. Her Family, by now, especially with their deep rooted faith should realize this and should let her go (really they should have let her go a while ago). Such a sad story.

I do wonder if there is a family priest or something that can step in and counsel them? They aren't listening to medical or legal advice....

 

[momrek06]

I've been here since June '00 and they didn't have that rule. I think this is just recently or maybe just in recent years. I guess some OPs edit their original post after everyone have responded which THEN won't correlate to the edited original post. This is my first time learning this. I have been gone for some years and just recently been coming back off and on. I can almost assure myself that I won't have this problem for I certainly won't be the first one to response to the OP because I am not here enough. But this rule is good to know and I can see why they have this rule.

<--------- See my 'tag'!

I have probably had that for at least 4 years.





About the little girl, how absolutely sad for the family. I will keep them in my prayers as they make a decision.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

I do wonder if there is a family priest or something that can step in and counsel them? They aren't listening to medical or legal advice....

From what I caught of the interview with their pastor (and in the article on the local ABC website), he is the one leading the fundraising for them. The event that was supposed to happen tonight has been canceled and he instead asked the parish to pray, but it doesn't sound like he is the one who will get through to them.

 

[bcla]

I was listening to a discussion on this topic this morning, and I heard the best description of what the family is looking for - that at this point they're not looking for a recovery but a resurrection.

 

[phorsenuf]

The "rule" was just a joke thread I started one day and it morphed from there. It's not an official rule of the boards or anything.

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1982917&highlight=new+rule

 

[skylizard]

According to CNN, the family still hasn't found a facility that would take the girl as of yesterday. It's a tragic situation to be in, but the family needs to come to terms with her death and let her rest in peace.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

Sad case of the tonsillectomy gone bad. Wonder what are people's thoughts about whether she should be kept on ventilator or not?

She isn't my child, so it's none of my business.

 

[superme80]

The "rule" was just a joke thread I started one day and it morphed from there. It's not an official rule of the boards or anything.

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1982917&highlight=new+rule

AH! So YOU are to blame! Off my Christmas card list!


Seriously this is such a tragic situation. I really feel for the parents. I have no idea how I would react. I hope I would be rational about it, but I can't say I honestly would.

 

[U2_rocks!]

I have no idea how I would react.

It's a bit freaky that a good friend of mine's 13 year old DD had a tonsillectomy on December 12th ..... she's fine, thank goodness!

 

[bdcp]

The "rule" was just a joke thread I started one day and it morphed from there. It's not an official rule of the boards or anything.

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1982917&highlight=new+rule

I and a couple of others posted that it wasn't a real rule back the first couple of pages. I always knew it was just a made up rule (it makes sense actually). It just became a bigger deal that it was because the explanation didn't seem to satisfy...

 

[bdcp]

I have no idea how I would react.

It's a bit freaky that a good friend of mine's 13 year old DD had a tonsillectomy on December 12th ..... she's fine, thank goodness!

For the vast majority, it's routine, minor surgery, but there apparently pre-existing issues for this girl.

 

[Handbag Lady]

So, at 5 pm today they are taking her off the ventilator? I take it that her family will be there, so that they can see...maybe it will help with their closure in some small way.

I just can't imagine what they are going through.