DD in trouble WWYD?

Discussion in 'Disney for Families' started by bankgirl05, Sep 15, 2012.

  1. Tiger926

    Tiger926 DIS Veteran

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    Excellent advice!

    My concern would be that she has adequate supervision and will not be having a party or such in my home while I am away.

    She has issues that she needs to handle. At my school, students are suspended for multiple days for drug possession, so she is lucky she isn't with us. She would also have mandatory drug counselling as well.

    Best of luck. I hang with teens all day long, and I can tell you that most of them are a uniques species all to themselves.

    Have a wonderful trip! Tiger
     
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  3. Ccann

    Ccann Mouseketeer

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    My heart goes out to you. I have young children but I know I put my mom through a lot as a teenager nothing that would land me in jail but I did walk over her. Mom would never leave me at home while everyone else went on a cruise. Just who she was! Our first cruise was when I was 24, I learned a lot going away to college. I have a older brother that doesn't learn from his mistakes because my mom is always there to catch him. Sometimes you just need to let your kids FALL and learn from their mistakes.
    It took me moving away to college before I respected my mom the way she should be respected and she is the most caring person I know.
    My brother 35 still walks over her, he hasn't learned or hasn't fallen on his butt yet and he needs to.

    I think you have a little time where if your daughter wants to go then she has to show you she has learned from her mistakes. But after talking win her and she doesn't even want to try then don't feel guilty leaving her behind. Tough love is needed, and your other two children can't suffer because their older sister. Not fair to them and you have to protect them as well.

    If she came wih you on cruise would she try to make the trip a good trip or cause more problems???

    It's a hard hard decision, but you also can't let her keep walking over you, best of luck hopefully this is a phase and she will grow up. I know it's heart breaking!
     
  4. MSSANDRA

    MSSANDRA DIS Veteran

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    It would break my heart, but I would leave her at home. Certainly not fair to the rest of the family to not go and even though your kids are young, they would soon realize what is happening and you have to send the right message. I would remind her that you love her dearly, and you will miss her terribly on the trip but she made the bad choice that resulted in her not being able to go. I would tell her, that if she can get her act together, and finish the year with out issue, you will plan another trip (either the whole family, or just you and her) when she can go. Only issue is to be sure that her dad will handle things well while you are gone. Prayers for all of you.
     
  5. LuvMyEAR

    LuvMyEAR Mouseketeer

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    Hello Bankgirl05,

    You certainly sparked the best in the Dis-ers' when you asked for support on this one! What a wonderful array of articulate and sensible responses.

    While never having experienced something of the sort, I have stood by a lot of friends who have been through very similar situations. Too many times, the best intentions of a birth parent just end up inflicting hardships on the rest of the family. While this decision may not make an immediate impact, I hope your DD begins to understand that her choices will always have consequences...and starts to make better ones. It is a harder lesson for some, and definitely made harder when all parents won't stand together.

    Glad that you are going, and hope you get excited as can be...sounds like MY kind of trip (have always wanted to do MNSSHP and MVMCP in one stay!!!) :cheer2: Have a fabulous trip.
     
  6. luvmesometigger

    luvmesometigger Mouseketeer

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    I have 3 kids but none as old as yours.

    I would still go on vacation without her....both in November and the one you had scheduled for your 40th. She is very close to being an adult. She has made adult decisions...for better or for worse. She made your last trip miserable. Let her stay home with her father and you go and enjoy yourself.
     
  7. Rylee

    Rylee DIS Veteran

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    This is a hard situation, some thoughts...

    Many kids make some foolish mistakes along the way, but your DD seems to be quite troubled. What she did was criminal, and that makes it more serious than some dumb prank or simply goofing off because of "senioritis." Also, since she is 17, time seems to be critical, as you might lose what little control you do have when she turns 18.

    I am all for tough love and suffer the consequences, really I am, but I feel when someone is acting out for attention, you need to pay attention, and give them exactly that... your attention.

    Now is the time to make sure your actions are the same as your words, and the message should be clear... I love and care about you too much to allow you to throw away your future. She'll act as those she doesn't hear, she'll act as if she doesn't need you or want your help, but trust me, she's listening and somewhere deep down inside, she knows you're right and only want the best for her.

    Your trip was scheduled for Feb., which you canceled. Now you have rescheduled a different trip for Nov. Going or not going on the trip doesn't concern me, since if she can't miss more school... she can't miss school, her actions made that decision for her. However, the timing of the trip could be a problem since you don't know what her punishment will involve, community service, probation, etc.

    She is in need of some serious guidance right now, from a responsible parent. Taking a trip while she needs your attention may add to her imagined perception that you care more about your "new family" than you do about her. Not the message I would want my daughter to get and I wouldn't want to give her another twisted excuse she can use for her poor choices.

    I agree she needs to understand that the needs and desires of all family members are important, so if you take this trip without her, make sure she understands she was definitely included in the original plans, but she blew that, and make sure your have a strong support system in place and strict supervision for her while you are gone.

    FWIW - I'm just putting this out here so you know I'm not coming at this as a big "softy." I AM one of those "MEAN" Mommies... I actually expect my kids to behave, to be respectful of others' rights and considerate of their feelings, to follow rules in place for safety of everyone, to learn and perform well, to help out where there is a need, and to choose to do the right thing, even if at times, it's only so you never have to answer to anyone for your actions, etc. When our kids were small, I rarely did "time out." I chose to do "time in." I liked to send the message... can't behave, can't get along and make the right choices... then apparently you can't be trusted and need to be watched and treated like an infant. I made them spend time with me, joined at the hip. Whatever I was doing... dish, laundry, cleaning the bathroom, they had to do with me. They would act like they weren't happy about it at first, (too bad) but I actually think they really ended up enjoying the one on one attention. We would talk about what happened while we worked.
     
  8. TZMOM

    TZMOM DIS Veteran

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    I'm on Team Leave Behind. It's also my opinion that your ex-husband needs to forego his insecurities and become a proper parent. There's no winner in the 'She Loves Me More' contest. He's supposed to be helping to raise a responsible woman and sounds to me like he's been letting her do whatever, whenever. I used to have that problem with my son when he went to visit his dad. It would take about 2 wks. to undo the behavior after a visit.

    You only get one life, and unfortunately, your daughter will learn (hopefully sooner rather than later) that bad choices will most definitely lead to unpleasant circumstances.

    I can only imagine the heartache you've been through and are going through. Enjoy your vacation with your DH and the kids - you ALL deserve it. Your oldest will survive - all you can do is try to nurture and love as best you can - it's impossible to keep her in the 'protective' bubble.

    God bless
    TZ
     
  9. bankgirl05

    bankgirl05 DIS Veteran

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    Thank you for your insight. This definately has given me more to think about. She is always included in our plans, even though she balks at anything "Disney" anymore, except the cruise, because she knew it would be an itinerary/ship she hadn't seen, also she was excited to take her little brother (not her sister though-jealousy and all) on the Aqua Duck!!!

    I also told my ex about our trip, and he absolutely agreed that the reason she can't go, whether it be in Nov. or Feb. is because of her own actions, and he does not expect me to cancel, postpone or rearrange. He actually told me that I was always the one being the bad guy/fall guy, trying to steer her in the proper direction, while he tried the "let's be friends" approach and he now realizes he has to step up to the plate and stop that!!!:cool1: Score one for me finally...

    Thanks to everyone else who has posted replied also. As I said, I don't like airing my dirty laundry on the internet,:laundy: but in this case, I really felt that I had no one to turn to, to sound things out with. I do have to say I was fearful of that thrashing I was sure to get for "being a bad parent" that I have seen often on here, but I am so happy to have only recieved kindness and support, even in differing opinions. Thank you so much!!!
     
  10. CatNipRules

    CatNipRules <font color=royalblue>Overplanner Extraordinaire..

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    You're never going to hear the "you're being a bad parent speech from me." Parents need to realize that being a "friend" to your kids isn't in their best interest. Sure, you can be friends with them, but when they do something wrong they need discipline.

    When my son was little he would tell me that he wasn't my friend anymore. I would always tell him that was okay, that he didn't have to be my friend because being my son was better and that I would love him anyways. Even if he wasn't my friend. When he realized that I was his mom first and friend second it helped a lot.

    I'm really glad that your ex is trying to see things your way now. Unfortunately it sometimes takes things like this to make someone wake up and realize that they aren't helping their children by not disciplining them.

    Keep up the great work. You sound like a wonderful parent in a tough situation. :thumbsup2
     
  11. Claudine877

    Claudine877 Mouseketeer

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    Oddly enough, I'm in a very similiar situation to yours. My DSS16 was making very poor choices in friends/school etc and knew that we had a trip planned for Oct for our whole family; which includes my DS3/DD3 as well as another DSS12. Not only did we tell him that he had to clean up his act and do better/leave the antics behind, but went so far as to arrange an alternate to take his place if he wasn't able to come with us. He was told that all of his siblings would be coming, but if he couldn't come then he would be at home with his mom and attending school. The right to come with us had to be earned back and we would revisit with him monthly on behavior until the 45 day mark where we would confirm. We also cautioned him that if he gave us difficulty within the 45 day window we would bring the alternate (my sister) and pay the difference for changing. It's been months since he last gave us/his mom any difficulty and we've spent the 'check in' time with him discussing all the things we want to do while at the park. I think the fact that we were so serious about it and arranged the alternate let him know that it was completely up to him whether he came with us or stayed home. I would have missed him on the trip, but the other 3 children's needs as well as my overworked husband and myself all deserved to continue with the vacation.
     
  12. tianna26

    tianna26 Mouseketeer

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    I am not a parent so take this with a grain of salt. I can tell you from experience of rough teen yrs & fighting with my own mom. the situations reversed my father married & had a son a week b4 I turned 16. I was feeling inadequate and left out and still do to this day I feel like its my fathers family but i am not included. even when i am around them it feels like i'm a visitor. this is how it feels to me I have no idea what my father or his wife feels. now with that being said this may or may not be how she feels. to find out you and your daughter need to go to counseling with or without the dad (preferably with) maybe even with your husband down the road. you and the father need to be on the same page and consistent with rules and expectations etc... It sounds like he .like to play the good guy and the friend which is enabling your daughter. the adults in the situation needs to sit down and come to an agreement.

    as far as the vacation goes idk if its appropriate or not the rest of the family deserves to go and in my opinion should go. the daughter is the one breaking the rules and should receive an appropriate punishment. however if she feels like I felt it would add fuel to the fire and further in her mind that she is the outsider. Again I have no idea if this is how your daughter feels. I really hope it works out for your family.
     
  13. clutter

    clutter <font color=FF66FF>Princess's Mom<br><font color=b

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    I Really think this is spot-on. Thanks to your lenient ex- she is testing whether you really love her. Clearly he doesn't love her enough to set boundaries, and you have that 'other' family.

    Tough as it is, I'd re-schedule for a time when she can go for part of it (long weekend, spring break). (Why would she need 5 days off from school for a 4 night cruise? Can't that be over a weekend?) Give her some goals and expectations to meet to come on the trip. Nothing too tough, but enough to let her know that she is in charge. Get the ex to back you up. Sure, she may fail. But at least you'd be giving her advance warning, telling her AHEAD of time that she controls her destiny. If your dh really really needs to get away, send him with the younger kids. She's pushing you to choose them over her to prove that she doesn't mean as much to you. Teens are weird. They want to grow up, but they don't. She really wants to be 4 again, when life was good.

    You've really got the worst of all worlds going. Over indulgent dad, mom that has to do all the bad guy stuff, who is re-married to stressed guy with young (cute) kids, criminal conviction AND a sleazy boyfriend. I mean, could you find a worse mix?

    Worst case, if she ends up going to PR after graduation to be with the sleazy boyfriend, will you still have happy memories of your trip?

    (Sorry, my original accidentally deleted, so I had to rush thru this. Gotta get back to my own teen, who's not dealing with all that yours is, but is still pretty much crazy and mixed up!)
     
  14. kellyg403

    kellyg403 <font color=green>She changes friends like she cha

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    OP, I was glad to see the update re: your dd's dad and him backing your decision. Honestly, once the two of YOU are on the same page, things will improve. My ex was not a great husband but as a parent, he did very well in making sure that whatever rules were reinforced with him/stepmom. No matter what. If they were on restriction at home they were on restriction at his house, no tv etc. I distinctly remember a time when my ds at 12 thought he knew more than his teachers and decided homework wasn't his thing. When his dad came to get him for his weekend, he pulled both ds and I aside and clearly to ds made sure he understood that he and I were 100% in this together and both of us wanted him to understand that. Ds is 18 now and turned into a great young man. My dd, who by far was the hardest, is now a mom with two young sons and doing very very well. This time is a blip on the radar as long as you and the ex are together in making her understand illegal activity is not gonna fly.

    Kids can be a bit manipulative when they want to be. Especially when there are separate households and different parenting styles. A wonderful counselor that my dd and I were seeing at the height of her problems assured me that divorce can either be used as an excuse for everything wrong in their life or children can learn to accept changes when parents make it clear its about their marriage, not about being their parents.

    Good luck! Hopefully you are able to get her to a counselor and have a few family sessions with the ex involved so that you are able to get things on the same page. Once she has the same rules everywhere in her life, you may see some changes for the better!

    Kelly
     
  15. Pesky

    Pesky "Who's the monkey?!"

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    Ditto completely. I would explain that since she did this, she lost her 5 days at school and can't be out for the vacation. I think this is a small price to pay at this point in life to recognize that consequences aren't just immediate but can ripple for a while.
     
  16. bankgirl05

    bankgirl05 DIS Veteran

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    I am just so torn up about this, and I feel like I am being ripped into two.

    I hear EVERYTHING that everyone is telling me, even the stuff my Disney Brain doesn't want to hear, which is that my daughter is going to use this as emotional blackmail over me forever if I go without her, even though: A) she created these circumstances/set of consequences, and B) even without the recent trouble, she has stated emphatically that she hates Disney, never going back, yada yada blahblah yada...

    I am going, I am cancelling, I am going, I am cancelling... I am DRIVING my DH crazy I'm sure, :drive: (he doesn't say that though) even though he insists, that whatever decision I make he supports fully and completely. I wish someone would just make it for me. (Now who has issues right?):confused3

    The last thing on EARTH that I want is to ever add fuel to the teen drama and give her any reason to say "you love them more" etc. I have always gone out of my way to do EXTRA for her just to prevent that. But I feel like at this point I just need to tell her, "suck it up, nothing could be further from the truth, but YOU made your bed, now you have to sleep in it. I love you, I will always love you and I will always be here for you, but I am not going to allow myself or anyone else suffer because of your poor decisions. Grow up, be responsible and then you will get to enjoy things in life that responsible people get to enjoy. Act like a 6 year old, and that is how I am going to treat you, and if that means taking away your toys, and putting you on time out than so be it...":thumbsup2 But actually saying the words, and backing them up without feeling guilt and anxiety is easy said than done:sad:

    Grrrr, I know this is my payback for my torturous teenage years. I call my Mom weekly and tell her how sorry I am... That Karma, she's a real witch isn't she???:scared:
     
  17. kellyg403

    kellyg403 <font color=green>She changes friends like she cha

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    OP there is always going to be guilt because you love her, and honestly that is what mom's do. We rationalize and everything else trying to figure out why. The reality is you are not the person who should be stressing and feeling guilty. Your dd should be coming to and honestly looking for ways to make this right and to change her behavior.

    As for your dh and children..again, resentment is a funny thing. It kinda creeps up on people. Right now they may say its ok I understand, but when nothing at all changes and its change after change for them, who have done nothing, there will be resentment and it will be too late. You are feeling guilty wondering what you could have changed and done differently, your family is willing to change/cancel their vacation plans. What exactly is your dd, at age 16, willing to do and sacrifice in this situation. The person who made the choice?

    If you can not work through the guilt now, you may have to work more difficult things later. I am going to be honest and say you have to get a handle on this guilt you feel. If you do not hold her accountable at this time and make her understand this was HER choice, HER consequences you will be in for a very long haul and the bad choices will get bigger. And the consequences are going to be the kind you CAN'T help her with.

    The right thing is never the easiest thing. I can empathize. A few years of my life with my dd were like waiting every day for the other shoe to fall because I was guilty feeling andi n denial. I could find a thousand excuses for why she did what she did, and usually they were never her fault. While she was sleeping peacefully in her bed, I was up all night stressing and crying and wondering how to fix things. But she never changed until I did and she HAD to feel what consequences were like.

    I will be thinking of you OP and wishing you much strength!

    Kelly
     
  18. RedHeadedFairy

    RedHeadedFairy DIS Veteran

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    Oh my, I'm torn FOR you! What a difficult situation!

    I definitely agree that she needs to face the consequences of her decisions.... I think that much is a given. (And yay that your ex seems to see this now - I hope he sticks to it!)

    But I also think it's unfair for your DH & other children to have to make such a huge sacrifice in order for her to learn her lesson. It really seems unfair to 4 out of 5 of the people involved.

    I'm trying to think outside of the box here - is there any way she can EARN the vacation back? Get a job to cover part of the expenses, work off her share in chores & babysitting, etc? Something more specific to the charges, like community service? If she earned it back, you could all go & enjoy & maybe even stop the resentments on all sides for a little magical while. (And dump the mommy-guilt :thumbsup2)
     
  19. Pesky

    Pesky "Who's the monkey?!"

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    No one said being a parent was easy. :) Look, I've denied my kids things when they don't deserve it. I'm not here to win a popularity contest, I'm here to raise good and productive people. I think the lesson for your daughter is this has a ripple effect. Not only is this potentially on your record, not only have you missed 5 days of school, but now you can't make the trip because you can't miss more. Consequences aren't one and done. They can go on. Small price to pay.

    And this is where pp has a great idea to kind of meet in the middle. Not for this trip, sounds like that is not doable. But you could sit down with her (and her father) and talk to her about what she thinks she can do to make her believe she is ready for the next trip. Good grades? Do some chores or work? What about volunteer work to understand how good she has it? Maybe she has to contribute X amount. Who knows. But as she is part of the problem, make her part of the solution. That feeling of trust, respect, responsibility and control over this element might help her grow up a little bit. GL!
     
  20. runsandjumps

    runsandjumps DIS Veteran

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    I always tell my young kids that I don't reward bad behavior. If she already says she doesn't like Disney why put yourself through the misery of z moody teen. Perhaps you could take a separate small trip somewhere else if she proves herself.
     
  21. bankgirl05

    bankgirl05 DIS Veteran

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    I am dumping the Mommy Guilt!!!:cool1: Well, at least as much as any of us ever really can, and at least over this trip.

    I told her today that Feb's Cruise was cancelled due to the fact that she was not going to be able to go, and it was a trip that I had envisioned for our whole family. We had a long talk about that "ripple" effect, and I told her that at some point in the future she is going to feel more consequences, and that I will be in her ear for a LONG time reminding her that bad things happen when you make bad decisions. I told her that we were, instead going to WDW without her, not that it was my origianal plan or desire, but that is just the way it is going to be. Her only comment??? "well we would have just been at each other's throats all week any way." :rotfl:

    Well all righty then:cool1::banana: I'll bring you back a souvenier!!!;)

    Thanks everyone for all of your caring and kindness!!!:love:

    Let the (happy) planning begin!!!:rotfl:
     

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