Australia/NZ Cruises

[CarolynFH]

Management can’t do anything about it really unless they make tipping compulsory next season?

Or include the tips in the base fare? (Which makes it compulsory, but hides it too.)

 

[Geomom]

Just got off the Wonder in Vancouver.

It appears that many new-to-DCL? passengers in Australia were not familiar with the custom/requirements of tipping on (American) cruises.

Over multiple cruises, those ignorant (cheap)? chose to delete their standard tips and simply accepted services from their Cabin Stewards and Servers without compensating them. Almost half of passengers == $0 gratuities?

Rumor corroborated by many Stewards and Servers. Many simply quit as DCL management hasn't done anything.

Not good at all.

Sounds like they need to change the auto gratuities to 'service fees', especially when departing from countries without a tipping culture. I feel bad for the CMs though, they work so hard.

 

[bcwife76]

Or include the tips in the base fare? (Which makes it compulsory, but hides it too.)

That's what DCL should have done and they really should have anticipated this. I feel awful for the staff that were short changed.

 

[Mags2002]

Sounds like they need to change the auto gratuities to 'service fees', especially when departing from countries without a tipping culture. I feel bad for the CMs though, they work so hard.

They work SO hard, and mostly rely on those tips to actually receive decent pay for their work. I understand some countries don’t have that culture of tipping, but they are aware that it is like that in the US so should really think about that when they are onboard

 

[Halfbrit]

I was very surprised that DCL didn't change their policy for Australia and simply include tips in the fare price. As an Australian I get that people here, unless they'd travelled to places such as USA or Canada, probably wouldn't have ever tipped. I'd been on 8 trips to USA and 2 to Canada including two prior cruises on the Fantasy and I still found tipping difficult and confusing (eg when to tip, how much to tip) this time around. It just isn't something we're experienced or knowledgeable in doing.

I totally get how first time Aussie DCL cruisers with no prior real life experience of American culture would think tipping unnecessary. To my knowledge regular Aussie cruise lines don't require tipping. It's on Disney to set up their pricing to reflect the market they're in.

What this does explain is why staff in some of the bars would make a beeline for my wife and I as soon as we walked in and serve us before people who were already there. I thought I might've been over tipping (I still don't get tipping), but it may have been that we were amongst the few who did tip.

 

[Lesverts]

I was very surprised that DCL didn't change their policy for Australia and simply include tips in the fare price. As an Australian I get that people here, unless they'd travelled to places such as USA or Canada, probably wouldn't have ever tipped. I'd been on 8 trips to USA and 2 to Canada including two prior cruises on the Fantasy and I still found tipping difficult and confusing (eg when to tip, how much to tip) this time around. It just isn't something we're experienced or knowledgeable in doing.

I totally get how first time Aussie DCL cruisers with no prior real life experience of American culture would think tipping unnecessary. To my knowledge regular Aussie cruise lines don't require tipping. It's on Disney to set up their pricing to reflect the market they're in.

What this does explain is why staff in some of the bars would make a beeline for my wife and I as soon as we walked in and serve us before people who were already there. I thought I might've been over tipping (I still don't get tipping), but it may have been that we were amongst the few who did tip.

There are differences in Canadian and American tipping culture too. Tipping housekeeping is extremely rare up here, common in the USA for instance. In Canada the tip suggestions are calculated on the total taxed amount, in the USA it is on the pre-tax amount.

Not sure what Australian sailing you were on, but I know by the time I got onboard they had rolled the auto gratuity into the price. So the prices listed were price plus tax and tip. So if a Alaskan sailing was 8 dollars for something, it was listed as 11.

They hadn't updated the App menus completely on my sailing so there was some confusion.

I know for P and O out of Britain they include the tips in the price. Britain has a similar non tipping culture. Though not nearly as 'no tips' as Australia and New Zealand. I always felt super guilty not tipping while down there.

 

[Flea]

Just got off the Wonder in Vancouver.

It appears that many new-to-DCL? passengers in Australia were not familiar with the custom/requirements of tipping on (American) cruises.

Over multiple cruises, those ignorant (cheap)? chose to delete their standard tips and simply accepted services from their Cabin Stewards and Servers without compensating them. Almost half of passengers == $0 gratuities?

Rumor corroborated by many Stewards and Servers. Many simply quit as DCL management hasn't done anything.

Not good at all.

Unfortunately that is how it is and why most other cruiselines that travel to Australia include the gratuities into their fees after their first sailing. This was also advised to Disney when they did their market research but Disney do as they please.

We tipped plus extra - but saw many people removing tips from their room the night before disembarkation etc.

 

[Flea]

There are differences in Canadian and American tipping culture too. Tipping housekeeping is extremely rare up here, common in the USA for instance. In Canada the tip suggestions are calculated on the total taxed amount, in the USA it is on the pre-tax amount.

Not sure what Australian sailing you were on, but I know by the time I got onboard they had rolled the auto gratuity into the price. So the prices listed were price plus tax and tip. So if a Alaskan sailing was 8 dollars for something, it was listed as 11.

They hadn't updated the App menus completely on my sailing so there was some confusion.

I know for P and O out of Britain they include the tips in the price. Britain has a similar non tipping culture. Though not nearly as 'no tips' as Australia and New Zealand. I always felt super guilty not tipping while down there.

Yes the drinks had the tip included, we added extra. But I saw so many people removing the $14.50usd per day.


The amount of times I was attacked in groups for saying that when you book you agree to tip and should be considered part of your cruise costing was insane, and generally admin/mods never stepped in to calm the situation. It isn't Disney you are screwing over, it's the hard working staff.

I really hope that in the future it is included in the fare so that staff continue coming down under (it's not like they got lots of shore time to make it worth their while either).

 

[Lesverts]

Yes the drinks had the tip included, we added extra. But I saw so many people removing the $14.50usd per day.


The amount of times I was attacked in groups for saying that when you book you agree to tip and should be considered part of your cruise costing was insane, and generally admin/mods never stepped in to calm the situation. It isn't Disney you are screwing over, it's the hard working staff.

I really hope that in the future it is included in the fare so that staff continue coming down under (it's not like they got lots of shore time to make it worth their while either).

Yea, it sucks because of the compensation model for ship employees. I did not remove and gave extra because I knew they were not doing well tip-wise. I am not super thrilled about the model and would rather everyone just went towards the Virgin Voyages structure. But think that if you go into a situation, even if you disagree with it, you kinda have to play by those rules. I know many people removed the tips on my cruise. But I also didn't get into that discussion with anyone because I was the weird foreigner Down Under and did not want to be 'that guy'. I did see many follow the tips and did get a few questions about the envelopes (which truthfully both confused and made me uncomfortable).

 

[Halfbrit]

There are differences in Canadian and American tipping culture too. Tipping housekeeping is extremely rare up here, common in the USA for instance. In Canada the tip suggestions are calculated on the total taxed amount, in the USA it is on the pre-tax amount.

Not sure what Australian sailing you were on, but I know by the time I got onboard they had rolled the auto gratuity into the price. So the prices listed were price plus tax and tip. So if a Alaskan sailing was 8 dollars for something, it was listed as 11.

They hadn't updated the App menus completely on my sailing so there was some confusion.

I know for P and O out of Britain they include the tips in the price. Britain has a similar non tipping culture. Though not nearly as 'no tips' as Australia and New Zealand. I always felt super guilty not tipping while down there.

I was on the 6 day Sydney-Noumea-Sydney sailing on 14th January. There was no indication on any of the menus that tips had been added. Tax would not apply as we left Australian waters. It would have been a whole lot easier if tips had been included though. I'm sure I paid way more on tips than I needed to. We had great service (mostly) so I'm not complaining.

 

[Halfbrit]

Yes the drinks had the tip included, we added extra. But I saw so many people removing the $14.50usd per day.


The amount of times I was attacked in groups for saying that when you book you agree to tip and should be considered part of your cruise costing was insane, and generally admin/mods never stepped in to calm the situation. It isn't Disney you are screwing over, it's the hard working staff.

I really hope that in the future it is included in the fare so that staff continue coming down under (it's not like they got lots of shore time to make it worth their while either).

It disappoints me that you were attacked like that. You are absolutely right that the tips are expected to be paid as part of the cruise. It says as much on the DCL website. DCL had obviously wizened up by the time I got onto my sailing and moved to charging the tips automatically to room accounts well before the last day. I had to go to guest services to increase the tips.

One thing I will add is that culturally, it's unlikely Aussies would see withholding tips as screwing over the staff. Their perspective is entirely different to the US perspective.

 

[Agent 86]

It appears that many new-to-DCL? passengers in Australia were not familiar with the custom/requirements of tipping on (American) cruises.

That was my experience on the Wonder down under in December. I overheard many people talking about cancelling the tips while waiting in line for character meets and every single time I lined up at Guest Services (to get a paper copy of the daily itinerary), there were people in line waiting to cancel their tips.

The topic of the "optional" tips was also hotly and repeatedly debated in the FB cruise groups.

Tips just aren't a part of Australian culture. DCL should have bundled the tips into the cost of the cruise. For many cruisers, the cruise was already very expensive (especially considering the exchange rate) and became more so onboard when they realised that everything was charged in USD, not AUD.

I'm not excusing those who cancelled their tips (or sought to return merchandise to the store once they realised they'd been charged USD), but DCL could have done better and should do better for future down under itineraries to ensure their staff are appropriately compensated. Again, the simplest way to do this is to just bundle the tips into the cost of the cruise.

That typed, the service in the restaurants was probably the worst of any of our cruises. Not awful, but relatively slow, things were forgotten (e.g. drink orders) and the food was almost always cold. I'm not sure whether the lack of financial compensation impacted the effort expended by some servers. Our Assistant Server always did her best, but we didn't see the other two servers. Again, it's somewhat understandable that Aussies may seek to cancel the tips if the service wasn't extraordinary as locally we only tip in limited circumstances where the service really goes above and beyond.

 

[Halfbrit]

Yea, it sucks because of the compensation model for ship employees. I did not remove and gave extra because I knew they were not doing well tip-wise. I am not super thrilled about the model and would rather everyone just went towards the Virgin Voyages structure. But think that if you go into a situation, even if you disagree with it, you kinda have to play by those rules. I know many people removed the tips on my cruise. But I also didn't get into that discussion with anyone because I was the weird foreigner Down Under and did not want to be 'that guy'. I did see many follow the tips and did get a few questions about the envelopes (which truthfully both confused and made me uncomfortable).

Interesting that you said "if you go into a situation, even if you disagree with it, you kinda have to play by those rules". I couldn't agree more. Had Disney done their research they'd have known that they were going into a country with a culture where staff are paid a fair wage, tipping does not occur, and where asking a patron for a tip can be deemed offensive. Disney should not have put their hardworking staff in that situation.

 

[European]

So what do you think is the difference with European cruises (on DCL)? It’s the same custom in Europe that sometimes people give tips, but it’s not expected. Probably way more Americans onboard as the itineraries in Europe are longer and more interesting than the Australian itineraries?

 

[Royal Consort]

They work SO hard, and mostly rely on those tips to actually receive decent pay for their work. I understand some countries don’t have that culture of tipping, but they are aware that it is like that in the US so should really think about that when they are onboard

When an American company attempts to break into another culture's market, it behooves them to respect and understand the culture in which they are operating. Disney could have easily avoided this by tailoring their cruises and pricing to include wages at the time of booking. They didn't. Unfortunately, it is Disney who let their staff down here.

Interesting that you said "if you go into a situation, even if you disagree with it, you kinda have to play by those rules". I couldn't agree more. Had Disney done their research they'd have known that they were going into a country with a culture where staff are paid a fair wage, tipping does not occur, and where asking a patron for a tip can be deemed offensive. Disney should not have put their hardworking staff in that situation.

100%

Just got off the Wonder in Vancouver.

It appears that many new-to-DCL? passengers in Australia were not familiar with the custom/requirements of tipping on (American) cruises.

Over multiple cruises, those ignorant (cheap)? chose to delete their standard tips and simply accepted services from their Cabin Stewards and Servers without compensating them. Almost half of passengers == $0 gratuities?

Rumor corroborated by many Stewards and Servers. Many simply quit as DCL management hasn't done anything.

Not good at all.

And nor should we in our country with due respect. Comments about being "ignorant and cheap" lacks an understanding of context and culture and demonstrates the very imposition of "American exeptionalism" that Australians reject. This is an American line, wanting to do business in Australia. Disney could have adopted the same policies that other US operators have adopted here and removed this issue.

Now, if I sailed DCL here in Aus would I tip? Yes. Because I know how the overseas custom works but it is not the responsibility of the Australian public to adopt an American custom that is antithetical to our values.

Australians are steadfastly against tipping. We hate it and we are conscious of any business that attempts to "Americanise" services and hospitality here. We view it as a slippery slope and there is no way Australians want this custom increasingly normalised. Disney could have catered to the market but chose hubris.

No Australian wants employees shafted and would be perfectly happy to pay a fare that includes crew wages packed in. Understand. Your. Market.

 

[Lesverts]

I have looked at other cruise lines and it does not appear that they include tips in the fare either. So this isn’t just a Disney problem. P&O Australia looks to though but they’d obviously know the market better.

The one crew member I did talk to about the tipping (he was not in a position where I was expected to tip him) he did say tips were down. But he was also South African and knew what he was getting into when the ship went to Australia. I ended up tipping him anyways cause he always made sure my table didn’t disappear when I was at the buffet (I was solo).

Also I don’t necessarily believe ‘lots’ of crew quit and left the ship early. For two big reasons. Breaking your contract would incur lots of expenses that these people probably can’t easily absorb. Namely the flight home. And if you break your contract you become unhirable to Disney and to many other lines. So your job prospects to stay in the industry are very slim.

 

[DisneyConvert]

Unfortunately that is how it is and why most other cruiselines that travel to Australia include the gratuities into their fees after their first sailing. This was also advised to Disney when they did their market research but Disney do as they please.

We tipped plus extra - but saw many people removing tips from their room the night before disembarkation etc.

Good explanation. Still, sad for the staff. And shame on any of the Officers or Executives who ignore the result.
.
Brits who don't tip much at home, have gotten the hang of tipping at Disney (most have done it a few times).
Just like we Americans get used to paying higher list prices in restaurants and the V.A.T. when in Europe.

 

[scroogie]

I have looked at other cruise lines and it does not appear that they include tips in the fare either. So this isn’t just a Disney problem. P&O Australia looks to though but they’d obviously know the market better.

It depends on where you are based. If you book an Australian-based Princess cruise from Australia, for example, tips are included in the fare. If you attempt to book the exact same cruise from overseas, tips are additional.

 

[Dreams&wishes]

So what do you think is the difference with European cruises (on DCL)? It’s the same custom in Europe that sometimes people give tips, but it’s not expected. Probably way more Americans onboard as the itineraries in Europe are longer and more interesting than the Australian itineraries?

The majority of customers on the European cruises are Americans. Anyway there was the option to include your gratuities at the time of booking that was quite cleat I thought.

 

[Flossbolna]

So what do you think is the difference with European cruises (on DCL)? It’s the same custom in Europe that sometimes people give tips, but it’s not expected. Probably way more Americans onboard as the itineraries in Europe are longer and more interesting than the Australian itineraries?

I think we Europeans are still used to some level of tipping being common in some countries, so they would not be totally against tipping. They might be inclined to reduce tips though. But yes, plenty of well off Americans on those European sailings which will buffer European stinginess.

But that’s why Princess for example only sells „all inclusive“ fares on the German market with a drink package and included tips. I think it’s sold as „no tips necessary“. Also the two cruise lines for the German market (Aida and Mein Schiff), both subsidiaries of American lines, have no tips on board.