WWYD- Vehicle Maintenance

[Dsnyfireman]

As a former deal tech I will tell you that you should never go more than 12 months between oil changes. It is what the manufactures recommend . Like you I don't put many miles on a car. Short trips are worse for cars than long highway drive. Moisture can build in oil from condenstation due to getting hot then cold and so on. So it is best to have it done every 12 months. I do not say this just because I was a tech at a dealer and want people to spend money like that it is really just good maintenance. Rather you go to a dealer or do it yourself or what ever. Moisture in oil will harm components and break oil down some. You can get away without synthetic if you like, not enough miles a year to bother unless you want. I like synthetic but that's just me. Most engine manufactures will say not to exceed a certain miles/hours and time intervals. Hope that helps. Good luck.

 

[bcla]

As a former deal tech I will tell you that you should never go more than 12 months between oil changes. It is what the manufactures recommend . Like you I don't put many miles on a car. Short trips are worse for cars than long highway drive. Moisture can build in oil from condenstation due to getting hot then cold and so on. So it is best to have it done every 12 months. I do not say this just because I was a tech at a dealer and want people to spend money like that it is really just good maintenance. Rather you go to a dealer or do it yourself or what ever. Moisture in oil will harm components and break oil down some. You can get away without synthetic if you like, not enough miles a year to bother unless you want. I like synthetic but that's just me. Most engine manufactures will say not to exceed a certain miles/hours and time intervals. Hope that helps. Good luck.

Understood. However, many still cling to the notion that they're doing something better for their cars by having 3000 mile/3 month oil changes. The motor oil marketers and quickie-lube shops of course have an incentive to perpetuate this tradition. Certainly for a car seeing 90% freeway miles (like mine), it's still perfectly fine and could probably go up to the manufacturer's recommended interval for "normal service" without any degradation in engine life. And probably even then some on top of that. Of course now there are oil life monitors which are supposed to take out the guesswork of whether or not the oil is still good and bridge the difference between "normal" and "severe".

I understand the issue with moisture affecting the life of oil. However, this is less an issue with modern fuel injected cars. A reasonably long drive every other week should do the trick. My wife uses her car as a grocery getter with fairly short trips. I'm not even sure that they're short enough to worry about moisture buildup, but we take her car out on weekends anyways.

And there are a host of new car requirements that mandate some sort of oil that would probably be labelled as "synthetic" - like GM's DexOS or Honda/Toyota/Subaru requiring 0W-20. I know some people now freak out because they bought what they thought was an economy car, but the dealer or even a quick-lube shop charges $50-75 for an oil change and won't include these as part of the specials. Even if you do it yourself, the 5 quart jug of Mobil 1 0W-20 is going to be $25 at Wal-Mart.

http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2013/08/expensive-oil-changes-are-here-to-stay.html

 

[DVC-Don]

I do not drive my Florida car very much (WDW and back home maybe once a week) and have the car serviced once a year. It's a 2005 with only 28,000 miles on it. I use synthetic oil.

 

[SharonZ]

I take my car to the dealership for oil changes, they are free for the life of the car

 

[JanaDee]

My vehicle is 5 years old. I get the oil changed when my oil life monitor gets to about 20%. Other than new tires and tire rotations, we haven't had to do any maintenance on the car.

I do have to schedule the 100,000 mile maintenance though.

 

[Squirlz]

For my cars the recommendation is X amount of miles or 1 year between oil changes.

 

[daughtersrus]

I'd love to see what your bills look like if you have regular maintenance done through a dealership. Find yourself a reputable local garage to do this. You won't void your warranty as long as the maintenance is performed according to schedule. And take a look at the maintenance book in your glove compartment. Your maintenance schedule should be in there.

I put very little mileage on my vehicle, but it still gets into the garage twice yearly.

You might be surprised but the labor rate at the dealer DH works at is exactly the same as the local Meinike and Firestone. The difference is that techs at dealers like DH have to be certified by the manufacturer and the others do not.

 

[tigercat]

My van is 6 yrs old and has 28500 miles on it. I have a sensor in it that tells me it needs an oil change. I don't even come close to the mile mark for changing it.
tigercat

 

[bcla]

You might be surprised but the labor rate at the dealer DH works at is exactly the same as the local Meinike and Firestone. The difference is that techs at dealers like DH have to be certified by the manufacturer and the others do not.

Not everything at a dealer is charged at the posted labor rate. I know oil changes aren't. They often have trainees doing the oil changes making minimum wage. If they charged at a posted labor rate of $100/hr, an oil change with inspection would probably be about $75 at a half hour labor and the price of the oil and an OEM filter.

The thing that bothers me about dealer services are the "standard service" packages. Often they'll barely tell you what goes into them. I remember having a few done before I wised up and learned to read the maintenance schedule. I saw the work order, and all it said was "15K service" without a breakdown. Once I asked what they did, and it was stuff that wasn't scheduled by the manufacturer. Sometimes it's just an oil change and brake inspection and it's $200 for that. I can change the oil myself, and I know of a shop that will perform a thorough brake inspection (putting it on the lift and taking off the wheels) for $50. Dealers really would rather not be doing major repair work as it doesn't really make them much more compared to what an outside shop will charge.

Confessions From the Dealership Service Department
How Consumers Are Often Overcharged for Repairs
http://www.edmunds.com/car-care/confessions-from-the-dealership-service-department.html

The Dangers of "Upselling"

Let's say that someone comes into the dealership for a simple oil change. They immediately become a target for the service department to "upsell" them as much additional work as possible. First of all, the advisor will ask how many miles are on the car. If there is close to, for example, 20,000 miles, they will say, "Well, you're just about ready for your 20,000-mile service. Here's what we recommend." They then whip out a sheet with a laundry list of services that are offered for a package price. But if you look at what is actually done to the car, it is just inspections or fluid checks and fills.

When you start getting more miles, the service writer will say, "We're going to do all services recommended for that mileage, but we'll also check for other problems." So you agree to a "full inspection," which is one of the biggest scams. Later in the day the service writer will call and say, "Everything looks OK but we recommend you have some other work done: transmission fluid, air-conditioning, differential fluid." By the way, most manufacturers don't recommend ever changing the diff fluid. So you go in for an oil change and end up dropping $600.

Dealerships don't profit on extensive operations like replacing engine blocks, transmissions or other large components. These require expensive parts, and the mechanics take longer to finish them. So while you pay a lot for these operations, the service department doesn't make much off them. With the smaller operations, on the other hand, you don't pay as much, but they're making a very high percentage of profit.

In one case, I looked at the dealer-recommended service and compared it to the owner's manual — it had almost doubled the service frequency from the manual. That's true of parts, too. The prices of most parts you buy through a dealership are doubled.

The other thing is that I like to take my work to some place that has some ethics about charging reasonably for the amount of work done. Most dealers (and mechanics) will charge for the the "book rate" as if each service was done independently. I've taken my car to an independent shop that doesn't do that. If the car is already on the lift for a transmission fluid drain, that's 10 minutes that they're not spending taking the car up and back down when they're looking to service the brakes.

 

[bcla]

My van is 6 yrs old and has 28500 miles on it. I have a sensor in it that tells me it needs an oil change. I don't even come close to the mile mark for changing it.
tigercat

They'll time out and tell you that you have to change because it's been there too long. I'm not a huge believer that there's really a time limit at one year, but a lot of manufacturers program just about that into the oil life monitors.

 

[aprilgail2]

Right now, I am 1,700 miles from the 5,000 mark. It could legitimately be 2015 before I hit that mark. I mean I know 5,000 miles is 5,000 miles, whether it takes 2 weeks or 2 years. But...would you feel comfortable with your car going nearly 2 years without having maintenance done on it?

?

My old 1999 station car has less than 60,000 miles on it, gets driven less than 3,000 miles a year but I get the oil changed twice a year.

\

Yes, one of my co-workers said she usually goes at least 7,500 miles for her vehicle. My car is...oh my gosh, I cannot believe this...almost 7 years old. I will have had it for 5 in May. Only has 40,000 miles on it. It really is a great car, and it runs as good as it did off the lot. (Knock on wood) So, in my mind, it is new. But, I guess it isn't so new after all!

My van that I use all the time I change the oil about every 7,500 miles.

 

[Kathryn Merteuil]

I don't put a lot of miles on a car b/c I live close enough to everything I need I guess. Long story short. I took mine in to have the oil changed because I figured it had been like several months (I am thinking about 5 months). They didn't want to change it, they said we WILL if I insist, but there is no need to do it that the oil sticker said it had like 1500 miles on it. They said the time was OK and come back later when I got closer to the 3000 mile mark. I dunno, am not a car expert or anything but I don't think I want to let it go longer than a year w/o changing it.

 

[bcla]

My old 1999 station car has less than 60,000 miles on it, gets driven less than 3,000 miles a year but I get the oil changed twice a year.

Around that vintage most manufacturers were recommending a "normal" interval of 7500 miles or 6 months.

However, a lot of manufacturers had been steadily going up, like Honda. Part of it would be that motor oil technology is better - especially the additives that stabilize the condition of the oil and reduce wear.

The oil life monitors really were meant to take out the guesswork. A lot of owners had to figure out if they were severe/normal drivers and/or whether not they were in between and needed to bridge the difference. And if there was a 7500 mile recommendation but someone is on a cross-country trip driving 400 miles a day - that's ridiculously easy on the motor oil - even though that put a car in the same service category as someone with a 25 mile one-way commute every day. Those numbers were suppose to make it simple. Few people wanted to follow a formula based on trip length, ambient temperature, time between cold starts, etc. However, the oil life monitor calculates all this for the owner.

 

[DebbieB]

I drive about 5,000 miles a year (work is only 7 miles away), I get oil changes every 6 months. If the car is under warranty, I take it to the dealer. If not, I take it to a local garage. The dealer usually has a coupon.

 

[bcla]

I don't put a lot of miles on a car b/c I live close enough to everything I need I guess. Long story short. I took mine in to have the oil changed because I figured it had been like several months (I am thinking about 5 months). They didn't want to change it, they said we WILL if I insist, but there is no need to do it that the oil sticker said it had like 1500 miles on it. They said the time was OK and come back later when I got closer to the 3000 mile mark. I dunno, am not a car expert or anything but I don't think I want to let it go longer than a year w/o changing it.

They're probably right. All these numbers were sort of made up to simplify things. The time limit was from an era where motor oil technology wasn't as advanced, and used motor oil had substantial degradation just based on being exposed to various combustion byproducts that inevitably get into the engine. There's still some of that, but nowhere near what it was then. And you're probably using a recently manufactured motor oil. Auto manufacturers almost never revisit their oil recommendations for older cars given new technology. I've only heard of a few cases, like Honda backdating their recommendations for 5W-20 or 0W-20 motor oil to model years where they didn't originally recommend them. But they haven't modified their recommended oil change interval given that it's now API SN motor oil.

We always had the severe (i.e. short trip) recommendation for 3000/3750 miles or 3 months. Honda changed that to 5000 miles/6 months. However, you'd often find that a new car on the lot with 6 miles on the odometer, has probably never been driven more than 2 miles at a time, and has been sitting in the lot for 8 months. Yet it hasn't gotten an oil change and often the manufacturer specifically recommended that its special factory fill oil stay in the engine for a certain period after the owner takes delivery. The fact is that it's not going bad after that period of time. It was only an oversimplification for those who drive hundreds of short trips that do affect the degradation of the oil to a high degree.

 

[Phil'sFrontier]

I would pop the hood and check the oil, if it looks black and dirty then change it. If it looks ok then dont change it.

 

[bcla]

I would pop the hood and check the oil, if it looks black and dirty then change it. If it looks ok then dont change it.

Color says nothing about the condition of motor oil. It quickly oxidizes within a few hundred miles of use, which may indicate that the antiwear additives are properly activated.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Car_Care/AskMobil/Should_Darkened_Oil_be_Changed.aspx

Question:
Should Synthetic Oil Darkening in Color be Changed?
I own a 5.4 liter Ford engine with 90,000 miles. I purchased it with 87,000 miles and at that time chose to use Mobil 1. I've run the Mobil 1 in this engine for 3,000 miles and my oil appears to be "black" in color. I have a few thoughts as to why this is occurring but thought I would ask the experts. This particular product is supposed to have a life of 15,000 miles or 1 year if my memory serves me correctly, but the way it looks I'm tempted to change it and put in fresh Mobil 1. Do you have a recommendation? I'm curious as to what's taking place here and willing to correct it if necessary, Thank You

Answer:
We would never use color alone as an indication to gauge whether or not you should change your motor oil. Without oil analysis you can reach the wrong conclusion about oil quality and in many cases darker engine oil is not a sign of any issue or problem. Some additives used in modern oils can produce a dark color over time and this is normal. It is best to change your oil based on time in months or miles. Of course, the number of miles and months depends on many things like service, climate, engine condition, etc. It may be possible in your case that the color could be indicating that since this is the first time the engine may have seen Mobil 1™ synthetic oil, that the strong additive package is doing some clean-up in your engine. Do you know what kind of service this engine received? To be safe we would use a shorter drain interval in your vehicle for a couple of Mobil 1 oil changes, and gradually extend the drain interval as you go to the drain interval you feel most comfortable with.

 

[SkaGoat]

Yet it hasn't gotten an oil change and often the manufacturer specifically recommended that its special factory fill oil stay in the engine for a certain period after the owner takes delivery. The fact is that it's not going bad after that period of time.

The factory oil fill on a new car has a special additive package to help seat the rings, and coat oil channels, and cylinder linings. These additive don't expire, they're not the same as a regular oil change. It's one of the reason most manufacturers suggest 6 months no matter what for your first oil change. Personally on both our vehicles we don't usually go any longer than 6 months between oil changes, It won't hurt the engine, and oil changes aren't sooo expensive that waiting a year just seems too long. We go to the dealer because it costs the same, and is just down the street from our home so I can walk home while service is being done.

 

[bcla]

The factory oil fill on a new car has a special additive package to help seat the rings, and coat oil channels, and cylinder linings. These additive don't expire, they're not the same as a regular oil change. It's one of the reason most manufacturers suggest 6 months no matter what for your first oil change. Personally on both our vehicles we don't usually go any longer than 6 months between oil changes, It won't hurt the engine, and oil changes aren't sooo expensive that waiting a year just seems too long. We go to the dealer because it costs the same, and is just down the street from our home so I can walk home while service is being done.

Not all do. However, that's probably a special case because a brand new engine probably hasn't had enough time to build up a "load" of contaminants that the oil has to neutralize.

Still - the time limit is a simplification. If I were to go on an extended temporary job site overseas (let's say two years) I wouldn't hesitate to simply change the oil before I left and then drive my car again for whatever the normal oil change interval was for my style of driving. But if I had a friend take care of it and drive it once a month (a few hundred miles tops over those two years), I'd probably have the oil changed when I got back.

 

[PeterPanic]

Your owners manual is your friend. It will tell you exactly when the manufacturer recommends that you change your oil and why. You cannot trust the service people to care about that. My owners manual calls for oil changes (and filter) every 10K. I usually do it at 8K and have for the last 100K miles. My service center always sends me notices that I should change it at 3000 miles. Yea, that's going to happen.